I assume you can only have one?
Yeah Pokemon in a vs thread can only have one.
I guess Magnet Pull then
Huh, seriously? From the move list, there's a decent amount of non-electric damaging moves that they have
Magnemite only has like 3 damaging steel type moves akaik.
I'm not 100% sure a Magnemite alone would be smart enough to work with prior knowledge.
There are also a bunch of support moves that can help as well
Huh, I kinda just thought in a world where type effectivity is a thing, they'd at least somewhat know when to stop using ineffective moves
Iirc in the games wild Pokémon will still use moves even though they're ineffective.
Dang that's... bad. To think I just made this match thinking to exploit Penny's weakness to magnets
I mean, in theory, based on the Intelligence section, Pokemon might have some sense of intelligence.
I'm not sure it would find out cause The Pokémon wiki says wild Magnemite only really use non-damaging moves to retaliate against attackers so it might not even realize its electric attacks are being absorbed before Penny takes them out.
That may be referencing 1: How wild Pokemon in the games use moves at random (Whether or not that aligns with their described behaviour in say, the Pokedex.) & 2. In the Johto games, wild Magnemite (Among other Pokemon) had a 10% chance to flee from battles.
| Sapphire | Magnemite floats in the air by emitting electromagnetic waves from the units at its sides. These waves block gravity. This Pokémon becomes incapable of flight if its internal electrical supply is depleted. |
|---|---|
| Emerald | The units at its sides are extremely powerful magnets. They generate enough magnetism to draw in iron objects from over 300 feet away. |
| FireRed | It moves while constantly hovering. It discharges Thunder Wave and so on from the units at its sides. |
| LeafGreen | Uses antigravity to stay suspended. Appears without warning and uses Thunder Wave and similar moves. |
| Platinum | The faster the units at its sides rotate, the greater the magnetic force they generate. |
|---|
| Sun | They gather in places where electricity is available. They can be found clinging to the steel towers used to support power lines. |
|---|---|
| Moon | It sends out electromagnetic waves, which let it float through the air. Touching it while it's eating electricity will give you a full-body shock. |
| Ultra Sun | It's frequently the cause of power outages, which is why some power plants send out electrical signals that it can't stand. |
| Ultra Moon | Perhaps because electrical lines are often buried these days, the number of Magnemite attacks on power plants has increased. |
| Sword | At times, Magnemite runs out of electricity and ends up on the ground. If you give batteries to a grounded Magnemite, it'll start moving again. |
|---|
| Legends: Arceus | A bizarre Pokémon with but a single eye embedded in an iron sphere. I suspect this creature levitates due to the magnetism it emits from its arms, which resemble horseshoe-shaped magnets. |
|---|
The wiki specifically notes how wild Magnemite tend to use non-damaging moves, the wiki wouldn't note this if it was not a unique trait of wild Magnemite.
Ngl I don't think Magnemite's magnetism is gonna help much here. It's LS on profile is class K and should have unknown LS rn which means Penny can probably resist the pull with her higher LS and attack from a range to work around it.
What's the source on this claim, then?
She has LS against magnetism?
Her higher LS means she can overpower the force of Magnemite's magnetism.
The Pokedex entries listed above do state that it appears and uses Thunder Wave, and it does have a lot of non-damaging moves (T-Wave, Supersonic, Lock-On). Meanwhile its goofy sonic boom move isn't much use.
Why would we take the AI at face value, though? Wild Pokemon AI is the same for every species (Use moves at Random.), including Legendary species, & Pokemon which should have Intelligence feats or other reasons to act differently than picking moves at random.
Wild Pokemon generally don't switch, yes, because they don't have trainers nor Poke Balls to return to, yes.
Source on that the success rates of their moves get modified in that? I've seen & read a bit, & for the most part, the AI just gets lucky across multiple attempts, often holds items like Brightpowder or Razor Claw, & in some games, does start picking teams favorable against whatever the player is using that's on a streak.
No, but the Pokedex does directly say that it appears, uses T-Wave and leaves. And actually, not all wild AI is random; in GSC and HGSS the legendary beasts frequently choose to use roar to make it harder to catch them. In fact it's usually their next move after they immediately try to flee.
Obviously, but they do usually use random moves. Magnemite is notable for having a pretty limited move pool. Magneton mostly got used because its typing and Magnet Pull made it a solid counter to Pokémon like Skarmory, who was arguably the best physical wall several gens running (hence the infamous Skarmory/Blissey defensive core designed to stall forever), was the premier spiker, and heavily competed with Pokémon like Suicune for the title of best phazer. Can't ignore the power of Metagross either. To support this, Magneton wasn't good until it got Magnet Pull.
Trainers generally choose moves based on damage calculations, but they don't switch. You can use Perish Song, switch out, and then wait for them to run down the clock even though they could switch.
Having beaten some post-game battle modes, and beaten the big console tournament challenges on higher difficulties and on higher levels, and been driven to near insanity watching the AI consistently rack up crits and land inaccurate attacks, while mine always missed and never landed a crit, and all other luck-based mechanics bending to benefit the AI, I'm telling you, that's how they up the difficulty, by skewing the RNG mechanics. It's easier than making smarter AI. Tvtropes talks about it in their "false difficulty" page too. It's infamous, and very hated. I'm getting angry just thinking about how frustrating that mechanic is. It's cheap. It's not the only cheating the NPC's do; in Gen 2 Lance's Aerodactyl famously had Rock Slide even though Aerodactyl couldn't learn Rock Slide until Gen 3. I think that was a mistake though, and that Aerodactyl was supposed to be able to learn Rock Slide, but some lazy butt forgot to make it one of Aerodactyl's learned moves.
But the majority is still random, with little regard to species, & the few times where they make exceptions (Like Johto's 3 Legendary Beasts Roar-ing if trapped to get out of the battle.) shouldn't give credit to all the wild Pokemon all having the same AI.
Relevance?
Yes. But obviously, those are also Pokemon Trainers, which aren't involved in this match. So, relevance?
Kudos to your experience & the claim about TV Tropes.
Pokedex states that they frequently use T-Wave as soon as they appear, as listed above.
Relevance is that Magneton is particularly notable for not having many moves available. Combine that with a Pokedex entry directly stating that it uses T-Wave first a lot, and that's likely its opening move, and it doesn't have a lot for follow up. Question is, what is its second move. We know Penny has a very hate-hate relationship with magnetism, and Magnemite certainly has that. I guess we need to see its canonical intelligence, if it will observe that T-Wave is useless and try something different.
You're talking about in-game AI, which is infamously basic, and tracks with the AI of the wild Pokémon. It's secondary info to the Pokedex entry, but it still exists.
They're not random. They generally attack with moves that do the best damage for the target, but no strategy beyond those simple calculations. Wild Pokémon are even worse, usually just using a random move.
I did indeed post those Pokedex entries.
I'd also like to know this, though I'm not sure.
Because you brought it up.
I do know that wild Pokemon, according to game mechanics at least, use moves at random, even when that's nonsensical.
It's actually the other way around. The Pokedex entry gives us this info, and the AI doesn't contradict it and in a way even supports it. Not that opening with T-Wave is actually a bad move normally; it's actually pretty common in competitive play, so it must have something going for it.
I guess we could, but isn't Magneton much smarter?
The reason for the AI being a concern is that we have a Pokédex entry saying Magnemite appears and uses T-Wave a lot, and other entries talking about it as its default electric move. This actually somewhat lines up with its paper-thin move pool. Throwing in the fact that most wild Pokémon AI basically throws everything at random with no rhyme or reason, it's hard to treat Magnemite as a strategist based on the games. We could search for intelligence and strategy feats in anime and manga. It's also worth noting that the ability Magnet Pull would passively restrict Penny's movements.
Pyrrha ripped her apart with it and she basically shut down.
Comparing trainer AI which actually calculates damage and then attacks with what it measures to be the best move, to wild AI which chooses its moves randomly. Clearly the devs deliberately implemented that almost counter-productive wild AI on purpose.
What's hilarious is when they use self-destruct or explosion against ghost-types.
So just in case, you voting Penny yet or are you still waiting for extra confirmation?
The battles are made for game balance, not lore establishment.
Maybe?
I wouldn't say "a lot". The entries say "Thunder Wave and so on" & "Thunder Wave and similar moves.".
As you know, I disagree with using the wild battles AI that's the same for the vast majority of species with few exceptions, & is an obvious abstraction.
Canon split says that while you could do that, it'd be irrelevant here.
@koopa3144 's previous argument against Magnemite's magnetism feat from the Pokedex has Penny ignore that via LS. She's Class M. Even if Magnemite is validly Class K, Penny could be dozens of times higher.
Most trainers, as mentioned, also have limited capacity for switching & behaviour that's homogenous among trainer classes who should vary in intelligence.
On this I agree.
Disagree on the basis of the previously mentioned LS.
It does have several in its movepool, so they're slightly likely.
What's Penny's travel/reaction speed?
vsbattles.fandom.com
Atlas Penny is her 2nd Key, & her LS says this:
Penny is about 1.85x times stronger in AP.
| Ruby | Magnemite attaches itself to power lines to feed on electricity. If your house has a power outage, check your circuit breakers. You may find a large number of this Pokémon clinging to the breaker box. |
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To Magnemite's credit, if Penny using metal stuff registered as Steel-type moves, Magnemite would 4x Resist it, taking 4x less damage.
Yeah, I notice we're talking about weaknesses without talking about resists. Technically if Penny was a Pokémon she'd be a steel-type, and every attack she has apart from her lasers would be either steel or normal.
I do apologize if I left anything out.
Problem is that Eevee is a very limited Pokemon without exolving, and I'm not sure Ralts can use telepathy on Penny given she's a machine.
I mean I wouldn't say Eevee is that limited in a VS Match. It does have things like its Social Influencing/Statistics Reduction moves and Power Mimicry with Copycat along with many other moves that could be useful.
Telepathy works on mechanical Pokémon so it should work on Penny.
The other thing to keep in-mind is, how exactly is the telepathy useful in combat? Considering changing to Ralts for this
Doesn't seem particularly problematic. Guess I'll change that
