One-Punch Man: Low-Mid Tier Upgrades

[Kachon123]

Some calcs I made have been accepted.

Spoiler: Spring Mustachio

Spring Mustachio's Beginning of Series Key's speed will be upgraded to High Hypersonic+, and his Tomboy AP will be upgraded from >0.01389 tons to 0.0977509082 / Higher in Small Building Level

One-Punch Man: Spring Mustachio's "Tomboy"

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Spoiler: One Shotter

One Shotter's speed will be upgraded from Supersonic+ to Massively Hypersonic. People like Post-Training Rhino Wrestler scale for obvious reasons.

One-Punch Man: One Shotter blitzes a Monster

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Spoiler: Deep Sea King

Dry Deep Sea King's speed will be upgraded from Hypersonic to Massively Hypersonic.

One-Punch Man: Deep Sea King Blitzes Genos

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Spoiler: Beefcake

Beefcake will be upgraded from Small City Level to City Level

One-Punch Man: Beefcake Makes a Crater

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We can discuss who scales to all of these calcs here as well.

 

[Apeironaxim]

There was a comment on the discussion thread about the DSK one that I agree with:

Hm. I don't like this calculation.

I mean, he certainly covered that distance pretty fast but we don't know when he really turned back since Genos took his time tending to the civilians.

Also it doesn't make sense to call it "blitzing". Genos was not only distracted but clearly looking in the opposite direction (later on it was explicitly pointed out he let down his guard).

The calc is fine but the premise is shakier than a castle of sand.

These factors imo make the premise of the calc highly questionable at best. There is too much going on to definitively make it a proper blitz. Genos even pointing out he let down his guard and literally not even facing the right direction are especially damning for the premise of the calc.

 

[Kachon123]

There was a comment on the discussion thread about the DSK one that I agree with:

These factors imo make the premise of the calc highly questionable at best. There is too much going on to definitively make it a proper blitz. Genos even pointing out he let down his guard and literally not even facing the right direction are especially damning for the premise of the calc.

That's obvious. Of course the name of the calc is just the name. The reason I used the timeframe I did was due to the fact that the civilians didn't notice DSK at all.

 

[TheRustyOne]

That's obvious. Of course the name of the calc is just the name. The reason I used the timeframe I did was due to the fact that the civilians didn't notice DSK at all.

I highly doubt they can see him from over 1000 of meters away. He might only be visible to their line of sight from a closer distance.

What exactly is their line of sight? Also they're focus is on Genos, not on the Deep Sea King who they think is dead. There are many factors on why this still doesn't work. I highly doubt they had line of sight on him from 1866.7919 meters away. I really don't see this calc having anything to stand on.

Focus is a very big part of perception that I feel like people don't acknowledge. If someone isn't focused on something, you'll be surprised how easy it is for something to get right in your face while your staring at it.

Something that is 1 km away appearing right in front of your face in 0.5 seconds can feel instantaneous while you aren't expecting it. These 0.013 seconds perception speed is done in a environment where the person in question knows something quick is going to appear.

 

[Apeironaxim]

I highly doubt they can see him from over 1000 of meters away. He might only be visible to their line of sight from a closer distance.

What exactly is their line of sight? Also they're focus is on Genos, not on the Deep Sea King who they think is dead. There are many factors on why this still doesn't work. I highly doubt they had line of sight on him from 1866.7919 meters away. I really don't see this calc having anything to stand on.

Focus is a very big part of perception that I feel like people don't acknowledge. If someone isn't focused on something, you'll be surprised how easy it is for something to get right in your face while your staring at it.

Something that is 1 km away appearing right in front of your face in 0.5 seconds can feel instantaneous while you aren't expecting it. These 0.013 seconds perception speed is done in a environment where the person in question knows something quick is going to appear.

don't forget it's raining pretty hard, so visibility is likely lowered even more

 

[Kachon123]

don't forget it's raining pretty hard, so visibility is likely lowered even more

Visibility in fog is around 1km, which makes sense given we can't see DSK due to him being 1.8k km away.

 

[LordTracer]

Beefcake isn’t actually a Demon level, right? Wasn’t there something weird with his threat level?

 

[Kachon123]

Beefcake isn’t actually a Demon level, right? Wasn’t there something weird with his threat level?

He's demon level. It was just stated that if he was around longer it would've risen to dragon.

 

[TheRustyOne]

Beefcake will be upgraded from Small City Level to City Level

Wait a minute. Beefcake's feat was done with a initial stomp and multiple punches.

He did not preform this feat with one attack, so this doesn't scale to him fully. You need to divide by the number of attacks he threw.

Or is there a reason we don't that anymore?

 

[LordTracer]

Wait a minute. Beefcake's feat was done with a initial stomp and multiple punches.

He did not preform this feat with one attack, so this doesn't scale to him fully. You need to divide by the number of attacks he threw.

Or is there a reason we don't that anymore?

He did, he divided by eight at the end to account for the amount of strikes it took.

 

[TheRustyOne]

He did, he divided by eight at the end to account for the amount of strikes it took.

Oh... Never mind then.

I disagree with the number of hits, since I have a feeling he threw way more offscreen. But I'll admit that it's completely understandable to think otherwise

I'll go back underground.

 

[LordTracer]

So Beefcake being a Demon that would eventually be upgraded to Dragon makes me think we could scale the Dragon levels above him.

Although I would like some other opinions before actually going through with that.

 

[Kachon123]

So Beefcake being a Demon that would eventually be upgraded to Dragon makes me think we could scale the Dragon levels above him.

Although I would like some other opinions before actually going through with that.

I agree with this. The HA saw his feats and still decided to assign him as a demon level threat, which means that dragon level threats are logically above this.

Also, this made me think.. Would Beefcake have an 'At least 7-B' rating due to his potential being higher than what he showed?

 

[LordTracer]

Also, this made me think.. Would Beefcake have an 'At least 7-B' rating due to his potential being higher than what he showed?

Nah, being able to cause more destruction over time doesn’t mean his AP is higher.

 

[TheRustyOne]

I agree with this. The HA saw his feats and still decided to assign him as a demon level threat, which means that dragon level threats are logically above this.

I can agree with this as well.

 

[LordTracer]

So Beefcake being a Demon that would eventually be upgraded to Dragon makes me think we could scale the Dragon levels above him.

Although I would like some other opinions before actually going through with that.

@Emirp sumitpo @Maverick_Zero_X @ByAsura Your thoughts on this would be appreciated.

 

[Maverick_Zero_X]

The line of reasoning for scaling Dragons above Beefcake looks solid to me.

 

[Kachon123]

Can what's been accepted (everything other than the Deep Sea King stuff) be applied?

 

[Qawsedf234]

Beefcake isn’t actually a Demon level, right? Wasn’t there something weird with his threat level?

ONE has stated that Beefcake would have been changed to Dragon level if it wasn't for Saitama. The rating is probably more reflective of the rating system not being ironed out so early in the series more than anything.

For One Shotter I don't fully agree with the calc here. One Shotter did not cover the distance in the blink of an eye which is exactly what the calc assumes, he reacted to the bullet being fired and then intercepted it. He does not need to move at mach 226 to preform the feat, he just needs the reaction speed to notice the bullet and set up the shot.

Although I would like some other opinions before actually going through with that.

I'm sorta 50/50 on it. If nothing else I think just mentioning the possibility of scaling should be fine.

 

[LordTracer]

ONE has stated that Beefcake would have been changed to Dragon level if it wasn't for Saitama. The rating is probably more reflective of the rating system not being ironed out so early in the series more than anything.

Might just be my interpretation, but based on ONE’s statement, everything Beefcake did while he was alive was only Demon level, like the HA ranked him at. But if Saitama hadn’t killed him, and he continued causing destruction, then he’d have been elevated to Dragon level.

That’s how I see it, at least.

 

[Kachon123]

For One Shotter I don't fully agree with the calc here. One Shotter did not cover the distance in the blink of an eye which is exactly what the calc assumes, he reacted to the bullet being fired and then intercepted it. He does not need to move at mach 226 to preform the feat, he just needs the reaction speed to notice the bullet and set up the shot.

The sniper monster couldn't react to the bullet at any point, which is why I used that timeframe.

 

[LordTracer]

And either way, a Demon that would only become a Dragon over time still seems like someone that should scale below definitive Dragons.

 

[Kachon123]

Might just be my interpretation, but based on ONE’s statement, everything Beefcake did while he was alive was only Demon level, like the HA ranked him at. But if Saitama hadn’t killed him, and he continued causing destruction, then he’d have been elevated to Dragon level.

That’s how I see it, at least.

I interpreted it the same way.

 

[Qawsedf234]

The sniper monster couldn't react to the bullet at any point, which is why I used that timeframe.

The thing is that One Shotter is using a bullet and isn't physically blitzing the monster. While he uses a magic super gun, his magic supergun moving at like 2,000 or 3,000 m/s can accomplish everything that happened in that scene as long as the monster has human-ish reaction speed.

There's just not enough evidence in my view to support that the bullet travelled that distance in 0.013 seconds (which by the way isn't even reaction speed but the speed the brain can maybe store an image it sees and even then the article mentions a clear bias).

The researchers expected they might see a dramatic decline in performance around 50 milliseconds, because other studies have suggested that it takes at least 50 milliseconds for visual information to flow from the retina to the “top” of the visual processing chain in the brain and then back down again for further processing by so-called “re-entrant loops.” These processing loops were believed necessary to confirm identification of a particular scene or object.

However, the MIT team found that although overall performance declined, subjects continued to perform better than chance as the researchers dropped the image exposure time from 80 milliseconds to 53 milliseconds, then 40 milliseconds, then 27, and finally 13 — the fastest possible rate with the computer monitor being used.

“This didn’t really fit with the scientific literature we were familiar with, or with some common assumptions my colleagues and I have had for what you can see,” Potter says.

Potter believes one reason for the subjects’ better performance in this study may be that they were able to practice fast detection as the images were presented progressively faster, even though each image was unfamiliar. The subjects also received feedback on their performance after each trial, allowing them to adapt to this incredibly fast presentation. At the highest rate, subjects were seeing new images more than 20 times as fast as vision typically absorbs information.

Might just be my interpretation, but based on ONE’s statement

While true we run into an issue of where like, Beefcake has done more total damage than almost any other monster in the series to humanity and the feat happened incredibly early in the series.

Though when even stuff like the HA guide mentions he's still only a Demon its a weird case. I guess mentioning it probably wouldn't hurt, but it still feels a bit off.

 

[Kachon123]

The thing is that One Shotter is using a bullet and isn't physically blitzing the monster. While he uses a magic super gun, his magic supergun moving at like 2,000 or 3,000 m/s can accomplish everything that happened in that scene as long as the monster has human-ish reaction speed.

I'm not sure I understand what you're trying to say here.

There's just not enough evidence in my view to support that the bullet travelled that distance in 0.013 seconds (which by the way isn't even reaction speed but the speed the brain can maybe store an image it sees).

Given that it was a monster that was blitzed, I feel like using the .013 end is reasonable.

 

[Qawsedf234]

I feel like using the .013 end is reasonable.

The 0.013 end is after they had given the test people enough time to get used to the test and progressively lowered it until they hit a wall. The monster does not have the same amount of time to ready itself. As before, if the bullet could move at 2,000+ m/s One Shotter could replicate it with supersonic or supersonic+ reaction speeds. He doesn't need to be MHS to accomplish this.

 

[Kachon123]

As before, if the bullet could move at 2,000+ m/s One Shotter could replicate it with supersonic or supersonic+ reaction speeds. He doesn't need to be MHS to accomplish this.

If the math I used to calc it got the result it did and is not wrong, then I don't really see the point in this comment.

The 0.013 end is after they had given the test people enough time to get used to the test and progressively lowered it until they hit a wall.

What end would you advise?

 

[Qawsedf234]

What end would you advise?

0.1 seconds, if even that since bullets are incredibly hard to track due to size and speed of the projectile.

 

[Kachon123]

0.1 seconds, if even that since bullets are incredibly hard to track due to size and speed of the projectile.

Why not .08 seconds? That's peak human reactions, and that would make sense considering becoming a monster in OPM has been described to make you beyond normal human capabilities many times.

 

[Emirp sumitpo]

So Beefcake being a Demon that would eventually be upgraded to Dragon makes me think we could scale the Dragon levels above him.

Although I would like some other opinions before actually going through with that.

I agree to this, especiall if the HA at the time considered beefcake did to be only demon level.

Would this makes any At least Low 7-B to At least 7-B or just 7-B? I think the latter is better

 

[Emirp sumitpo]

It also makes the gap between the lower dragons and the current 30 megaton dragons less... egregious I suppose

 

[Qawsedf234]

Why not .08 seconds?

Because that's for auditory stimulus

Many researchers have confirmed that reaction to sound is faster than reaction to light, with mean auditory reaction times being 140-160 msec and visual reaction times being 180-200 msec (Galton, 1899; Woodworth and Schlosberg, 1954; Fieandt et al., 1956; Welford, 1980; Brebner and Welford, 1980). Perhaps this is because an auditory stimulus only takes 8-10 msec to reach the brain (Kemp et al., 1973), but a visual stimulus takes 20-40 msec (Marshall et al., 1943). Reaction time to touch is intermediate, at 155 msec (Robinson, 1934). Differences in reaction time between these types of stimuli persist whether the subject is asked to make a simple response or a complex response (Sanders, 1998, p. 114).

Humans will process hearing something faster than seeing something.

For the 0.08 seconds, that was achieved by putting someone in a dark room with zero outside influence after prepping them about what is going to happen. Most humans are falling in the 180-250 millisecond range for most things.

 

[LordTracer]

I agree to this, especiall if the HA at the time considered beefcake did to be only demon level.

Would this makes any At least Low 7-B to At least 7-B or just 7-B? I think the latter is better

I would say just 7-B. Certain Dragons can get an At least if their feats warrant it (like Rover and Psykos, for example)

 

[Apeironaxim]

and now we've gone back to threat level scaling

how long did we last

 

[Emirp sumitpo]

and now we've gone back to threat level scaling

how long did we last

We still use threat level scaling, just not for stuff like speed or LS

 

[LordTracer]

We still use threat level scaling, just not for stuff like speed or LS

Yeah, we never stopped using them for AP.

 

[ByAsura]

Not sure about One-Shotter, but the other two seem good.

I assume Spring Mustachio would downscale from High Hypersonic+ Tomboy a little, since Kombu Infinity could barely avoid it from a distance?

 

[Kachon123]

Not sure about One-Shotter, but the other two seem good.

I assume Spring Mustachio would downscale from High Hypersonic+ Tomboy a little, since Kombu Infinity could barely avoid it from a distance?

The interesting thing is that the SM speed calc wasn't actually his Tomboy. It's him reeling it in. Tomboy was powered by the spring-like nature of his sword, so it would upscale from the HH+, not the other way around.

 

[ByAsura]

Ok.

 

[LordTracer]

It seems like we’re all in agreement here.