[Naruto] Juubito Update

[NeoKingOfLight]

So this “should” be very straightforward…

Proposal: Obito with full Mastery of the Ten-Tails should be listed as, “At Least Large Country Level [400Tt], Likely Higher.”

Reasoning: Right now, Juubi’s Charged TBB is scaling to 100Tt because it is unquantifiably higher than its previous TBB in its weaker form (98.35Tt). Juubito currently is scaling to 200Tt for being unquantifiably higher than Edo SM Hashirama, whom is 190+Tt (Forgot the exact figure) — Sword of Nunoboku is a separate thing. I was surprised because Obito’s profile “does” reference the once feat (Which I am using here) that actually can be used to scale him “better” but its not being used to scale him.

Feat: Obito casually creates 4 Charged TBB and creates a barrier that tanks the combined explosion. [Ref: Chapter 643]

Even if we lowballed it to just 4x the Previous TBB (98.35Tt), Mastered Ten-Tails Obito would still be “At Least Large Country Level [393.4Tt], Likely Higher”, but tbh, if we did that, we might as well not even round Juubi up to 100Tt. As far as the 200Tt rating goes, if this is accepted, that can just be replaced by this.

Agree: MinatoSparkle (ST), XSOULOFCINDERX (ST)

Nuetral:

Disagree:

 

[MinatoSparkle]

I think 400 TT with Quad Juubidamas would be better than just flat out replacing his regular AP with that technique's power

 

[NeoKingOfLight]

I think 400 TT with Quad Juubidamas would be better than just flat out replacing his regular AP with that technique's power

Eh… how do you square that thought with the barrier tanking them? Wouldn’t that imply it can be more than just the Quad Juubidamas?

 

[MinatoSparkle]

Eh… how do you square that thought with the barrier tanking them? Wouldn’t that imply it can be more than just the Quad Juubidamas?

With Six Crimson Rays Formation sure, that is also a special jutsu I'd say

 

[NeoKingOfLight]

With Six Crimson Rays Formation sure, that is also a special jutsu I'd say

Alright. Shall I add you to agree?

 

[MinatoSparkle]

Alright. Shall I add you to agree?

Agree with specific techniques

 

[XSOULOFCINDERX]

I agree with Sparkle fra.

Edit: Madara should be able to use these techniques as well since it comes from the same source that he also has.

 

[karo_senpaii]

So this “should” be very straightforward…

Proposal: Obito with full Mastery of the Ten-Tails should be listed as, “At Least Large Country Level [400Tt], Likely Higher.”

Reasoning: Right now, Juubi’s Charged TBB is scaling to 100Tt because it is unquantifiably higher than its previous TBB in its weaker form (98.35Tt). Juubito currently is scaling to 200Tt for being unquantifiably higher than Edo SM Hashirama, whom is 190+Tt (Forgot the exact figure) — Sword of Nunoboku is a separate thing. I was surprised because Obito’s profile “does” reference the once feat (Which I am using here) that actually can be used to scale him “better” but its not being used to scale him.

Feat: Obito casually creates 4 Charged TBB and creates a barrier that tanks the combined explosion. [Ref: Chapter 643]

Even if we lowballed it to just 4x the Previous TBB (98.35Tt), Mastered Ten-Tails Obito would still be “At Least Large Country Level [393.4Tt], Likely Higher”, but tbh, if we did that, we might as well not even round Juubi up to 100Tt. As far as the 200Tt rating goes, if this is accepted, that can just be replaced by this.

Agree: MinatoSparkle (ST), XSOULOFCINDERX (ST)

Nuetral:

Disagree:

I don't really agree with this. Obito had to use the tso to save himself from the explosion tbh. He didn't think he could physically take all 4. At best he can have this ap attached to his tso since it tanked the explosion successfully and he should be able to dish out with his tso as much as it could take. In a separate scene even if it was unstable juubito he still got destroyed by his own tso. It is very clear the tso are much higher than he himself is in obito case

 

[NeoKingOfLight]

I don't really agree with this. Obito had to use the tso to save himself from the explosion tbh. He didn't think he could physically take all 4. At best he can have this ap attached to his tso since it tanked the explosion successfully and he should be able to dish out with his tso as much as it could take. In a separate scene even if it was unstable juubito he still got destroyed by his own tso. It is very clear the tso are much higher than he himself is in obito case

I mean, it was already established that Naruto Characters don’t “physically” scale to their Jutsu AP, outside of legitimate showings. So that wasn’t in question. All that is being presented here is acknowledgement that Obito produced 4 Charged TBB (When 1 is already at 100Tt) and that he also produced a Shield thankt tanked their combined explosion.

Obito shielding himself makes sense as even regular Biju get hurt by their STANDARD TBB, let alone charged ones, as shown with Gyuuki. The TSB scaling to this is a given, but idk why you’re using Unstable Juubito as an argument when we’re talking about the stronger version and not talking about Physicals… At least I wasn’t referring to physicals.

I was just bringing up Juubito’s output via his Jutsu. Other extrapolations, if any, can be done another time.

 

[Testarossa002]

Nah
Creating 4 of the same attack at once doesn't mean your AP is 4x.
Same way characters AP gets divided if the feat is done with multiple attacks
AP is measured by the output of a single attack
From our AP page

The attack potency depends on the energy output of a single attack, not the area of effect of the attack.

The only things that can scale is the barrier and his shield
Both of which aren't AP.
It can be acknowledged on his page for VS matches reasons.

 

[NeoKingOfLight]

Nah
Creating 4 of the same attack at once doesn't mean your AP is 4x.

Sure, but if you read the chapter, that’s not the case here. The Charged TBB he created are stated and shown to be of the same caliber as the one the Juubi spammed. So yes, he produced 4 100Tt TBB and a Barrier to tank them at once.

Same way characters AP gets divided if the feat is done with multiple attacks

Read above.

AP is measured by the output of a single attack
From our AP page

Read above.

The only things that can scale is the barrier and his shield

Well if you read other people’s responses, you’d see that they are only agreeing but only for the TBB creation and Shield. Obviously TSB would also scale but I will remind you you that Obito is producing all this stuff via his chakra (Obviously). Imo, though I am not going to push the issue, suggesting ONLY the TBB scales to this and the shield and the TSB, when these things are created from his chakra and recreatable at any time, kinda flies in the face of how CC works in the verse. After all, that’s all a TBB is. Concentrating a lot of Chakra into a sphere at a specifc ratio. Now if you think he can do that but CC doesn’t allow him to do that for say, a fire ball, then that’s your prerogative, but it makes no sense to me when it’s so basic and not complex.

But I digress… As I said, i’m not pushing the issue on that.

Both of which aren't AP.
It can be acknowledged on his page for VS matches reasons.

Again, read above. Also, I’ll not that in addition to this not being context of the feat (Which is explained and you can read yourself), using the Juubi as a Cap to suggest this isn’t the case is faulty as the Juubi itself doesn’t have complete mastery of it’s own power. It literally spammed this same technique and this case, Obito simply created four the same one (at the same caliber) at the same time. You’re trying to imply it’s 25Tt each and that’s not the context here.

 

[Testarossa002]

Sure, but if you read the chapter, that’s not the case here. The Charged TBB he created are stated and shown to be of the same caliber as the one the Juubi spammed. So yes, he produced 4 100Tt TBB and a Barrier to tank them at once.

Not really sure what your point is here
I already said he's making 4 of the same attack
It doesn't mean his AP is 4x of that.
Naruto making a rasengan each on his arms doesn't mean his AP (VSBW wise) is doubled
I quoted the part of the tiering system stating this.
1 tbb is not going to be made 400TT

Well if you read other people’s responses, you’d see that they are only agreeing but only for the TBB creation and Shield. Obviously TSB would also scale but I will remind you you that Obito is producing all this stuff via his chakra (Obviously). Imo, though I am not going to push the issue, suggesting ONLY the TBB scales to this and the shield and the TSB, when these things are created from his chakra and recreatable at any time, kinda flies in the face of how CC works in the verse. After all, that’s all a TBB is. Concentrating a lot of Chakra into a sphere at a specifc ratio. Now if you think he can do that but CC doesn’t allow him to do that for say, a fire ball, then that’s your prerogative, but it makes no sense to me when it’s so basic and not complex.

This is more of a verse wide issue.
A regular rasengan made by KA Naruto isn't going to get the same rating as a charged bijuu bomb.

Again, read above. Also, I’ll not that in addition to this not being context of the feat (Which is explained and you can read yourself), using the Juubi as a Cap to suggest this isn’t the case is faulty as the Juubi itself doesn’t have complete mastery of it’s own power. It literally spammed this same technique and this case, Obito simply created four the same one (at the same caliber) at the same time. You’re trying to imply it’s 25Tt each and that’s not the context here.

How did I imply it to be a cap or even be 25TT?

 

[MinatoSparkle]

Nah
Creating 4 of the same attack at once doesn't mean your AP is 4x.
Same way characters AP gets divided if the feat is done with multiple attacks
AP is measured by the output of a single attack
From our AP page

The only things that can scale is the barrier and his shield
Both of which aren't AP.
It can be acknowledged on his page for VS matches reasons.

It's kinda different from just doing 4 attacks at the same time since it's an explosion, which means the energy is combining and forming one bigger explosion rather than being 4 separate explosions

 

[NeoKingOfLight]

Not really sure what your point is here
I already said he's making 4 of the same attack
It doesn't mean his AP is 4x of that.
Naruto making a rasengan each on his arms doesn't mean his AP (VSBW wise) is doubled
I quoted the part of the tiering system stating this.
1 tbb is not going to be made 400TT

For starters I never said he was doing that and was quite clear in what I said. And you can say whatever you want but the fact is, he is producing and condensing 400Tt of Chakra. It doesn’t matter if it’s 4 separate attacks, it’s built up simultaneously in one action, not 4 separate actions. Let me remind you how CC works in verse (Read the Chapter)

This is more of a verse wide issue.
A regular rasengan made by KA Naruto isn't going to get the same rating as a charged bijuu bomb.

Not in AoE, sure, but this is flat out false. Rasengan literally has the same mechanics as TBB (Produce Chakra > Condense Chakra into Sphere). The only differences between the two is Rasengan adds Rotation, TBB has a Ratio Mechanic, Rasengan is more focused, TBB explodes. Your argument is essentially saying, Naruto can’t produce the same amount of chakra for a Rasengan that he can for a TBB and that is just not how the verse works.

How did I imply it to be a cap or even be 25TT?

My apologies for misunderstanding your post.

Edit: My link isn’t working on “Read The Chapter”. For referenced I was trying to link edit Chapter 90 for that part.