Morgan Yu Profile Creation (Prey 2017)

[Deceived3596]

eeh, I really don't think it should be done but it's not a big deal ig. You still have to unbold stuff like commas and "limited" between P&A though, only the links should be bolded.

Can you provide me the rule which states i need to unbold shit like commas and prefixes like "limited" between abilities? since i've checked the bolding rules and nothing states this. So a receipt of this would be appreciated.

It's obvious dude, literally every human profile on the wiki would have it otherwise. Human teeth aren't even built to give us a dangerous bite, actually they're about as useless as it gets, even more herbivores have better bites.

Already addressed this argument, appealing to some form of common sense isn't an argument against what i'm asserting. And the "dangerousness" or lethality of a human's bite quite literally doesn't matter with it being apart of Bodily Weaponry or not.

Re-read the Bodily Weaponry page and tell me where it says the strength and leathality of your bite is a part of things like teeth qualifying under the ability.

Throwing force would be rough since I'd need to find the heaviest object in the game. I can do a calculation for KB but it wouldn't scale ot guns, I already linked a log of characters complaining about their guns being very weak, I don't have a clip on hand but Cargo Bay survivors say that the pistol is useless as some of their random lines too.

KB would scale to Morgan's guns since those guns can damage people who can tank Morgan's KB .

Already addressed that point in my previous post, re-read it again.

No, it's literally just immobilizing them with sheer adhesivity, by this same logic restraining someone with LS is "Paralysis Inducement". It doesn't deprive them from moving at all, it just prevents those movements from happening.

No it isn't, they're two completely different things, the action of using adhesive manipulation to hold something down compared to the action of using your own physical LS to hold something down isn't comparable in this context at all.

The reason why this would be PI while physically holding someone down wouldn't is because one is facilitated through an ability (which in this case would be Adhesive Manipulation) while the other would be through pure brute strength.

You're just wrong on this point.

You're also asserting an explanation that's not ever implied, not to mention that random chipsets being capable of warping probability like that makes no sense in the setting. It's way safer to assume they're just landing better shots every once in a while, which is something that actually happens in real life, rather than just gaining an abstract boost in damage for absolutely no reason.

I'm not asserting an explanation, i'm going purely off what's given to us by the text of the chipsets and using that text in conjunction with the powers and abilities granted by VSBW so i can apply abilities onto Morgan's profile. What Morgan's chipsets say directly falls under Probability Manipulation, so i'm assuming it to be Probability Manipulation. That's it.

Imo it wouldn't be a "way safer" assumption since you're actually asserting an explanation behind the ability which is never shown, stated or implied while i'm using purely the text, which is stated. Thus making my asserting have less assumption than your assertion which assumes an explanation while i don't.

Occam's Razor isn't helping you in this case, it's helping me.

 

[Deceived3596]

I've been asked to address this as the one who wrote the page, so I'm going to say that normal humans don't indeed qualify for this power.
The first type refers to irl weapons and teeth have to be sharp or made in a way that makes them functional as weapons.
The structure of the human mouth and teeth is meant to chew food and their ability to rip is very limited, as well as the fact they aren't neither sharp, durable or fixed in the proper way, unlike those of dogs, lions, crocodiles etc...

The second type, referring to unconventional weapons, includes only parts of the human body that sport unnatural properties, making them efficient for combat, so it already implies a degree of superhumanity.

Then you should've added a note which states Humans don't naturally qualify for this ability since the explanation given on the page would cause humans to fall under the "Conventional" aspect of the ability since humans have Teeth/Claws and both can be used as weapons, just not to the same effectiveness as other animals like Tigers or Lions.

If this is the case then i'm fine with removing the ability from Morgan's profile, i'll do it here in a little bit or someone else could do that if they want to.

 

[Shmooply]

Then you should've added a note which states Humans don't naturally qualify for this ability since the explanation given on the page would cause humans to fall under the "Conventional" aspect of the ability since humans have Teeth/Claws and both can be used as weapons.

Y'know what? Sounds like a good idea, making a CRT about it right now.

 

[Deceived3596]

Y'know what? Sounds like a good idea, making a CRT about it right now.

-

 

[Armorchompy]

Can you provide me the rule which states i need to unbold shit like commas and prefixes like "limited" between abilities? since i've checked the bolding rules and nothing states this. So a receipt of this would be appreciated.

Can you stop rules lawyering about everything? That's just how it's done, I was literally the guy who got the format accepted, I think I would know, I challenge you to find a single other profile that does it the way you intend, even both the profiles that the rules link to use the method I'm describing, yours is just a variation that nobody has considered, and given how much I and others had to fight to get this specific format to be accepted, I'm gonna go out on a limb and say your variation on it isn't gonna pass unless you're willing to make a staff thread to get it accepted.

KB would scale to Morgan's guns since those guns can damage people who can tank Morgan's KB .

Guns are commonly portrayed in fiction as harming beings far stronger than they are. This even applies to reality, where a 9-C gun can easily injure or kill animals that we would rate as 9-B. Even "elephant guns" (which were obviously used for killing elephants in a single shot) are only 9-C+.

Already addressed that point in my previous post, re-read it again.

I have shown you evidence of guns being considered weak, which goes against your claim of them being 9-B which would make them far superior to any hand-held firearm. I don't consider your counter-argument satisfactory.

No it isn't, they're two completely different things, the action of using adhesive manipulation to hold something down compared to the action of using your own physical LS to hold something down isn't comparable in this context at all.

The reason why this would be PI while physically holding someone down wouldn't is because one is facilitated through an ability (which in this case would be Adhesive Manipulation) while the other would be through pure brute strength.

The definition of Paralysis, according to Merriam-Webster is "complete or partial loss of function especially when involving the motion or sensation in a part of the body". When something is held still by the glue, their bodies function just as well as they did before, they are simply restrained from moving. It is, effectively, just brute strength, only applied through more effective means since it's adhesive.

I'm not asserting an explanation, i'm going purely off what's given to us by the text of the chipsets and using that text in conjunction with the powers and abilities granted by VSBW so i can apply abilities onto Morgan's profile. What Morgan's chipsets say directly falls under Probability Manipulation, so i'm assuming it to be Probability Manipulation. That's it.

Imo it wouldn't be a "way safer" assumption since you're actually asserting an explanation behind the ability which is never shown, stated or implied while i'm using purely the text, which is stated. Thus making my asserting have less assumption than your assertion which assumes an explanation while i don't.

Our P&A pages describe possible scenarios, they're not rulebooks (not to mention that many are severely outdated). The chipsets say nothing of the "probability manipulation" sort, they just say that crit chance is increased, which can very well be achieved in more mundane means that do not contrast with the established setting. You need way more evidence than "uh crits" to argue probability manipulation, again, look at basically any well-maintained RPG verse and tell me how often you see something along those lines (and if you do, it's probably due to additional context)

 

[Armorchompy]

Honestly I feel we can at least calc the phantoms ripping apart the steel doors. That'll give us a good AP value. As well as maybe a GPE calc for the Nightmare as well.

I'd need a video of the first, for the latter it's a bit awkward without a very good comparison shot.

I also think that we should list "higher with Neuromod upgrades" for Morgan, given that some Neuromods capabilities can straight up one shot enemies around the level of Morgan. That and Neuromods explicitly enhance his normal capabilities.

Sure

Morgan should also get Superhuman flight speed and reactions + combat speed given the Artax Propulsion System can move up to 16 m/s at its peak, and Morgan can manuever it through tight obstacles.

Sure

Also for better formatting, I prefer if we seperate the human neuromods abilities from the Typhon neuromods abilities and placing them in their own tabbers

Possibly, not necessary but it may improve things slightly.

 

[LIFE_OF_KING]

Quasiparticle Beam is capable to reach 75kW of power

This would be 8-C If It is usable for AP

 

[Emirp sumitpo]

Quasiparticle Beam is capable to reach 75kW of power

This would be 8-C If It is usable for AP

Oh that's neat. I don't think anyone would scale to this sadly

 

[Armorchompy]

It would be AP but I dunno if it'd scale to durability, since what it does is disrupt the target's composition rather than directly harm them.

 

[Emirp sumitpo]

It would be AP but I dunno if it'd scale to durability, since what it does is disrupt the target's composition rather than directly harm them.

Considering it one shots any character in the game other than the apex typhon, I don't think it should scale to anyone at all

 

[Deceived3596]

Can you stop rules lawyering about everything? That's just how it's done, I was literally the guy who got the format accepted, I think I would know, I challenge you to find a single other profile that does it the way you intend, even both the profiles that the rules link to use the method I'm describing, yours is just a variation that nobody has considered, and given how much I and others had to fight to get this specific format to be accepted, I'm gonna go out on a limb and say your variation on it isn't gonna pass unless you're willing to make a staff thread to get it accepted.

I deadass don't care enough to argue about this ******* goofy point anymore so i'll unbold that shit.

Guns are commonly portrayed in fiction as harming beings far stronger than they are. This even applies to reality, where a 9-C gun can easily injure or kill animals that we would rate as 9-B. Even "elephant guns" (which were obviously used for killing elephants in a single shot) are only 9-C+.

Prove this is the case for Prey, i ain't arguing against this point until you fulfill this burden.

I have shown you evidence of guns being considered weak, which goes against your claim of them being 9-B which would make them far superior to any hand-held firearm. I don't consider your counter-argument satisfactory.

You showed BASE, NON-UPGRADED WEAPONS from people who aren't enhanced by Neuromods which increased their AP with weapons nor have fully upgraded weapons which Morgan has.

Not comparable situations at all.

My claim isn't that guns in general in Prey are 9-B, i'm claiming that guns that Morgan uses are 9-B given the evidence and explanation i provided above. Which you haven't correctly countered yet.

I don't consider your counter-argument to my counter-argument satisfactory either

The definition of Paralysis, according to Merriam-Webster is "complete or partial loss of function especially when involving the motion or sensation in a part of the body". When something is held still by the glue, their bodies function just as well as they did before, they are simply restrained from moving. It is, effectively, just brute strength, only applied through more effective means since it's adhesive.

........

Homie we don't abide by Merriam-Webster on this wiki, read the Paralysis Inducement page man. We're given what needs to happen for Paralysis Inducement to be given to someone, which is "preventing one's opponent from coordinating their movements or stopping their movements completely.", GLOO within Prey does exactly this, it locks the physical movements of others, that's text-book Paralysis Inducement. You appealing to Merriam-Webster quite literally doesn't debunk anything since we don't use that specific definition on the wiki.

Actually use what's stated on the wiki, not some rando ass definition which isn't used.

Our P&A pages describe possible scenarios, they're not rulebooks (not to mention that many are severely outdated). The chipsets say nothing of the "probability manipulation" sort, they just say that crit chance is increased, which can very well be achieved in more mundane means that do not contrast with the established setting. You need way more evidence than "uh crits" to argue probability manipulation, again, look at basically any well-maintained RPG verse and tell me how often you see something along those lines (and if you do, it's probably due to additional context)

After re-reading the Probability Manipulation page i'm fine with removing the ability and examples from Morgan's profile.

 

[SamanPatou]

humans have Teeth/Claws and both can be used as weapons, just not to the same effectiveness as other animals like Tigers or Lions.

That's the point, they aren't supposed to be weapons.
You can smash you face onto someone, or bash them with your butt, every part of your body can potentially hurt someone, but it isn't supposed to be used in that way.
I didn't put the note because it's self-explanatory, human teeth or nail aren't natural/bodily weaponry, they are simple body parts which abide to the laws of physics and thus have the potential to cause some damage like everything on this planet.

 

[Armorchompy]

You showed BASE, NON-UPGRADED WEAPONS from people who aren't enhanced by Neuromods which increased their AP with weapons nor have fully upgraded weapons which Morgan has.

Not comparable situations at all.
My claim isn't that guns in general in Prey are 9-B, i'm claiming that guns that Morgan uses are 9-B given the evidence and explanation i provided above. Which you haven't correctly countered yet.

The upgrades really don't make the guns that much stronger and you can (and will likely need to) still harm and kill Phantoms with baseline ones, it's not like you can only use them once they're upgraded. So scaling them to Phantoms is still wrong given that you can very well shoot near anything to death without a single upgrade/neuromod, you can't just say "oh yeah, that's invalid but suddenly once you upgrade them the exact same thing is perfectly fine".

Homie we don't abide by Merriam-Webster on this wiki, read the Paralysis Inducement page man. We're given what needs to happen for Paralysis Inducement to be given to someone, which is "preventing one's opponent from coordinating their movements or stopping their movements completely.", GLOO within Prey does exactly this, it locks the physical movements of others, that's text-book Paralysis Inducement. You appealing to Merriam-Webster quite literally doesn't debunk anything since we don't use that specific definition on the wiki.

Actually use what's stated on the wiki, not some rando ass definition which isn't used.

It's not "some rando ass definition" it's literally a dictionary, I am using it to show you that this is what paralysis means, what GLOO does does not fit the definition of paralysis, the power page is just giving a generic description, it should be obvious that yes, you need to induce paralysis to have Paralysis Inducement.

 

[Arc7Kuroi]

It's not "some rando ass definition" it's literally a dictionary, I am using it to show you that this is what paralysis means, what GLOO does does not fit the definition of paralysis, the power page is just giving a generic description, it should be obvious that yes, you need to induce paralysis to have Paralysis Inducement.

I'm sorry but no, I have zero stakes here but this argument is insanely disingenuous. When we assign abilities on wiki we refer to the ability pages on wiki, not an online dictionary that isn't affiliated with our wiki. I'm baffled that you're even making this argument, if perhaps you think our paralysis inducement page is too vague than by all means update it in a CRT. However, until then, if it satisfies our page then it awards the ability, simple as that.

 

[Armorchompy]

Is it so disingenuous to say that you need to induce paralysis to have Paralysis Inducement? Is it really? Deceived is misunderstanding what the page is actually communicating, I don't need to make any CRT to "update" it because it says what you need to do to have the ability right in the name, you need to actually paralyze people.

 

[Arcker123]

Is it so disingenuous to say that you need to induce paralysis to have Paralysis Inducement? Is it really? Deceived is misunderstanding what the page is actually communicating, I don't need to make any CRT to "update" it because it says what you need to do to have the ability right in the name, you need to actually paralyze people.

….

That’s what the ability is supposed to do tho. To my understanding, it’s a gel that prevents movement. That’s a form of paralysis, if only a limited form.

 

[Armorchompy]

It prevents it by immobilizing things, it's just really good glue. That's not paralysis.

 

[azontr]

Could just list it as adhesive manipulation.

 

[Rikimarox2]

I'm actually with Armor on this one. It really doesn't seem like Paralysis Inducement, as it isn't literally paralyzing them like poison or something, it's just really good glue.

Wouldn't mind buying it tbh fr fr.

 

[azontr]

Why can't we just list it as adhesive manipulation. It's clearly an adhesive being manipulated.

 

[Rikimarox2]

Legit forgot we even have this ability. Yeah, Adhesive manip seems like the best option here.

 

[Armorchompy]

I'm actually with Armor on this one. It really doesn't seem like Paralysis Inducement, as it isn't literally paralyzing them like poison or something, it's just really good glue.

Wouldn't mind buying it tbh fr fr.

lore-wise, it's pretty stinky, so buyers beware

Why can't we just list it as adhesive manipulation. It's clearly an adhesive being manipulated.

we also list it as adhesive, it's paralysis i wanted removed

 

[Rikimarox2]

lore-wise, it's pretty stinky, so buyers beware

And like that, my interest dwindled.

 

[azontr]

we also list it as adhesive, it's paralysis i wanted removed

K

 

[Emirp sumitpo]

Nightmers can also survive.

Can it? I remember it being able to one shot nightmares

 

[LIFE_OF_KING]

 

[Emirp sumitpo]

Bump

 

[Emirp sumitpo]

Honestly I feel we can at least calc the phantoms ripping apart the steel doors. That'll give us a good AP value. As well as maybe a GPE calc for the Nightmare as well.

I also think that we should list "higher with Neuromod upgrades" for Morgan, given that some Neuromods capabilities can straight up one shot enemies around the level of Morgan. That and Neuromods explicitly enhance his normal capabilities.

Morgan should also get Superhuman flight speed and reactions + combat speed given the Artax Propulsion System can move up to 16 m/s at its peak, and Morgan can manuever it through tight obstacles.

Bodily Weaponry is weird, like has Morgan ever used teeth in a combat scenario? I don't recall so.

Also for better formatting, I prefer if we seperate the human neuromods abilities from the Typhon neuromods abilities and placing them in their own tabbers

Bump?