MHA: Verse Wide Revisions

[Damage3245]

I think that the issue is that this "hundreds of times less" figure comes about mostly just from the results of our calc. I agree that narratively, and likely from Horikoshi's point of view, just because he is using explosions ten times smaller than he's drawn otherwise, that doesn't mean in his head that they should be hundreds or thousands of times less powerful - but that doesn't mean I think that the smallest explosions Bakugo uses has to be comparable to the biggest one he's using either.

Bakugo making an 8-C explosion when he's 14 and the Sludge Villain is controlling him, and Bakugo making a 9-B explosion in fight with Deku during the Battle Trial arc aren't contradictory to me. From a VSBW standpoint, they have to be because we boil everything down to its simplest components. If a character withstands or survives an attack at one point then their durability is "X joules" and if they get so much as scratched or are in pain from a different attack then that attack is also "X joules" but we all know it isn't really as simple as that.

When we look at things through that simplistic of a lens, then you get characters who - narratively - should be little different than ordinary humans like Ochaco or Shinso having punches that are comparable to this feat in theoretical potency. (Not saying they should only be as strong as IRL humans)

 

[TheRustyOne]

And I don't believe there is anything we can do about it. @Metalballrun: The slash through my statement meant I was being sarcastic, I understood what you meant. I did question if I should post that but I decided to leave it. Apologies if that was very vague, I do understand what you're getting at. And I get what you mean about the rest.

Power creep is the bane for verses like these.

I wish things could be better. I personally dislike most RPG verses, but I know they barely have any feats to work with as is. Bakugo has his durability feats which are clear, and his smaller explosions can harm people like him and comparable to him.

I'd go on more, but at this point I think it'd be slightly derailing.

 

[Metalballrun]

I think that the issue is that this "hundreds of times less" figure comes about mostly just from the results of our calc. I agree that narratively, and likely from Horikoshi's point of view, just because he is using explosions ten times smaller than he's drawn otherwise, that doesn't mean in his head that they should be hundreds or thousands of times less powerful - but that doesn't mean I think that the smallest explosions Bakugo uses has to be comparable to the biggest one he's using either.

I failed to put it into words eloquently, but I agree hard with this.

We can say without a shadow of doubt that Horikoshi never thought of scaling Bakugo's explosions with scientific formulas, much less intended the audience to think that way. He simply conveyed how smaller explosions are weaker and larger explosions are stronger, and as for by how much, that's for Horikoshi to know and for us to twist our brains around to find out. And he doesn't strictly follow that rule either, despite making it a significant aspect for Bakugo's power to learn how to condense explosions.

 

[Metalballrun]

The slash through my statement meant I was being sarcastic

Ah yeah that went over my head.

 

[Damage3245]

I failed to put it into words eloquently, but I agree hard with this.

We can say without a shadow of doubt that Horikoshi never thought of scaling Bakugo's explosions with scientific formulas, much less intended the audience to think that way. He simply conveyed how smaller explosions are weaker and larger explosions are stronger, and as for by how much, that's for Horikoshi to know and for us to twist our brains around to find out. And he doesn't strictly follow that rule either, despite making it a significant aspect for Bakugo's power to learn how to condense explosions.

Bakugo unlocking a new power of condensing his explosions with his Cluster attack signifies to me pretty strongly that we're not meant to interpret his earlier tiny explosions as having the power of his biggest explosions condensed into them.

 

[TheRustyOne]

Basically the issue is the gap between his explosions. Ignoring tiers, if Bakugo's big explosions were being rated much higher than his smaller blast, the problem wouldn't be that much of a problem? But we can't really do anything about, except for the worst possible thing and that is ignoring it because we don't know what to do. Since we can't also say for 100% certainty what an author is really thinking in the moment he wrote something. So we're left with no 100% right choice to make.

Unless we have evidence to support the opposite. Bakugo's small blast do hurt him and base Izuku, with current scaling putting that at High 8-C. His big blast don't scale to something that much higher. 8% being able to take Bakugo's big blast, or being able to harm Nine. He likely doesn't even think about how it back scales to something.

Monoma being several times weaker than 8% sounds right. And I doubt Horikoshi thought about more than that. Just that actually putting it down reveals Monoma is only several times weaker than this attack. Which he isn't portrayed as at all. Apologies, I said I'd stop but I just had to say that. I'll stop going on about this.

I say we accept outliers and make Bakugo's explosion 8-A+ from his movie feats, that'd fix everything.

 

[Damage3245]

Entrance Exam Arc Deku (with no Quirk power at all) being just 3 times weaker than 8% Deku in his fight with Bakugo is problematic to me, but I understand it's coming from a perspective of trying to make the most sense of the series with what we've got.

Monoma being several times weaker than 8% sounds right.

It really doesn't to me to be honest. All of this is coming from a feat of an off-guard Deku being struck in the face by an several-times-multiplied hit from Monoma when Monoma himself has no other noteworthy feats. Meanwhile we've got 5% Deku smashing boulders and walls and steel girders and we're supposed to believe that Monoma, with zero strength enhancements, is just a little bit less powerful than him?

I say we accept outliers and make Bakugo's explosion 8-A+ from his movie feats, that'd fix everything.

Lets make separate profiles for the movies and stop scaling the manga characters to them. That'd also help fix everything.

 

[Mazdoesstuff]

It really doesn't to me to be honest. All of this is coming from a feat of an off-guard Deku being struck in the face by an several-times-multiplied hit from Monoma when Monoma himself has no other noteworthy feats. Meanwhile we've got 5% Deku smashing boulders and walls and steel girders and we're supposed to believe that Monoma, with zero strength enhancements, is just a little bit less powerful than him?

I don’t like this argument; we’ve seen time and time again that MHA characters with no strength enhancements are capable of doing things that no human could even THINK to accomplish

- Aizawa is capable of throwing large chunks of concrete and picking up dozens of people and throwing them at once with binding tape

- Star and Stripe can survive a portion of the Tiamat Missiles without her strength enhancing quirk

- Shigaraki with no physical enhancements is capable of tanking massive explosions from Re-Destro that can blow up city blocks

 

[TheRustyOne]

I think we're done talking about this.

Should this thread be closed, or have I missed something?

 

[Mazdoesstuff]

I think we're done talking about this.

Should this thread be closed, or have I missed something?

Yes, are the changes in?

 

[TheRustyOne]

I believe we've changed everyone effected by this.

I'll Therefir have the final say, since he was changing the profiles as well.

 

[Therefir]

Yes, all the changes have been applied and this can be closed.