Lü Bu (Record of Ragnarok) Rework Part.1

[Sparkive]

I'll be direct, I was going to completely fix Lü Bu's profile, but for that I need several feats to be calculated, so I'll go with what I have while I wait for someone to show interest in the calc request theat (I hope the fact that this CTR exists affects that)
So...
Fun fact: Lü Bu has a prequel manga
And from there you can get several things
enough so that it is not the weakest 7-B and 2nd weakest 5-B on the page (I hope)

To put it simply, here is a sandbox, and here is the current page.

CHANGES I DID=

• New Summary (describing his main motivation in his spin off)
• Change the format of P&A to bullet points

• New abilities
• Expansion of Fear Manipulation

• Change stamina to one of the accepted types
• New Techinques (Are not described as such, but they are things he can do)

 

[LephyrTheRevanchist]

Looking good

 

[LordGinSama]

Sexy ass revision, good job!

 

[Sparkive]

I think this is considered a minor revision, so since Lephy is fine with it, I just have to wait 48 hours? or how does this work?

 

[LordGinSama]

I think this is considered a minor revision, so since Lephy is fine with it, I just have to wait 48 hours? or how does this work?

Get to get input more more users and at least another staff member.

 

[SamanPatou]

Nice to see someone working on RoR, it desperately needs help as a whole, especially for P&A and LS.

A few of Lu Bu's AP and LS feats should most likely be Class K to Class M (especially some AP ones), but calcs are still needed.
RoR in general has many, many feats that would require attention.

Anyway, for starters, remember to always link the last edit history of the sandbox in the OP, not the sandbox itself, which is subject to future changes and thus compromises the CRT on the long run.
Also, references for the scans would be great.

The profile looks good in general and I appreciate the work. I have only a few things to point out:

• He should have Immort 7 too, due to being a deceased soul
• Pain Tolerance is not an ability, and it's been getting removed from profiles.
• Dodging attacks from behind pertains more to ES rather than ESP
• I'd say hi aura doesn't exactly qualify as Fear manip, I'd see better a single link to Aura renamed "Intimidating Aura" or something like that
• The scans given for Resistance to Analytical Prediction aren't sufficient, and I'd say it's more of a case of him having his own AP ability rather than really resisting it, which he isn't doing.
• His resistance to Fear Manip should be limited, because looks like one of those cases where someone's intimidation aura has supernatural effects only on weaker opponents, pretty much like Lu Bu's own.
• Resistance to Electricity is good because of the first scan, but in his clash with Thor he just prevents the god from connecting his blow.
• Ok, Resistance to AP comes back, but it should stay together with the one to Skill Mimicry

Also, Lu Bu could have his own respect thread of stamina feats, but his biggest one should sufficie, even though it needs scans too.

 

[LephyrTheRevanchist]

Get to get input more more users and at least another staff member.

Minor revisions only need one, actually.

But with Saman's input, after fixing the things should be okay.

 

[Sparkive]

- A few of Lu Bu's AP and LS feats should most likely be Class K to Class M (especially some AP ones), but calcs are still needed.
RoR in general has many, many feats that would require attention.

- Also, Lu Bu could have his own respect thread of stamina feats, but his biggest one should sufficie, even though it needs scans too.

First of all:

Sparkive/Sandbox

vsbattles.fandom.com

This is another sandbox in which I'm working on the full profile, below everything is basically all the feats that I could find from the prequel manga
and yes, we need the calculations, that's why I haven't touched any of that yet

Anyway, for starters, remember to always link the last edit history of the sandbox in the OP, not the sandbox itself, which is subject to future changes and thus compromises the CRT on the long run.
Also, references for the scans would be great.

I have done the links part,
in the case of the references, I don't know how to do it

He should have Immort 7 too, due to being a deceased soul

This affects all humans in RoR.

• Pain Tolerance is not an ability, and it's been getting removed from profiles.
• Dodging attacks from behind pertains more to ES rather than ESP
• I'd say hi aura doesn't exactly qualify as Fear manip, I'd see better a single link to Aura renamed "Intimidating Aura" or something like that
• The scans given for Resistance to Analytical Prediction aren't sufficient, and I'd say it's more of a case of him having his own AP ability rather than really resisting it, which he isn't doing.
• His resistance to Fear Manip should be limited, because looks like one of those cases where someone's intimidation aura has supernatural effects only on weaker opponents, pretty much like Lu Bu's own.
• Resistance to Electricity is good because of the first scan, but in his clash with Thor he just prevents the god from connecting his blow.

Done

Ok, Resistance to AP comes back, but it should stay together with the one to Skill Mimicry

Put them together? ok

 

[AnonymousBlank]

Gonna point out that Lu Bu’s fear manip works on Sun Jian who Dong Zhuo (comparable to Lu Bu in stats) says is strong when Lu Bu asks for a challenge so there’s no reason for limited. If you wanna say the age manip aspect of Dong Zhuo’s fear hax is limited by strength, that’s another thing but making people scared is just what they do, regardless of strength.

 

[Excellence616]

I agree

 

[Sparkive]

Also, references for the scans would be great.

in the case of the references, I don't know how to do it

Done
I managed to put references

 

[Sparkive]

Now all that remains is to wait 48 hours, and after that it will be done.

 

[SamanPatou]

This affects all humans in RoR.

Ik, I read the manga too, I just find it strange they don't have it on their files

Gonna point out that Lu Bu’s fear manip works on Sun Jian who Dong Zhuo (comparable to Lu Bu in stats) says is strong when Lu Bu asks for a challenge so there’s no reason for limited. If you wanna say the age manip aspect of Dong Zhuo’s fear hax is limited by strength, that’s another thing but making people scared is just what they do, regardless of strength.

Makes sense, what makes me always skeptical in this kind of things (since it's a common trope in fiction) is that it stops working the moment the narrative doesn't need to hype up the character (like Thor not giving a shit about the aura), but I'm fine with it not being limited.

Now all that remains is to wait 48 hours, and after that it will be done.

Yep

 

[Sparkive]

Gonna point out that Lu Bu’s fear manip works on Sun Jian who Dong Zhuo (comparable to Lu Bu in stats) says is strong when Lu Bu asks for a challenge so there’s no reason for limited. If you wanna say the age manip aspect of Dong Zhuo’s fear hax is limited by strength, that’s another thing but making people scared is just what they do, regardless of strength.

Makes sense, what makes me always skeptical in this kind of things (since it's a common trope in fiction) is that it stops working the moment the narrative doesn't need to hype up the character (like Thor not giving a shit about the aura), but I'm fine with it not being limited.

So "Fear Manipulation" is okay or not?
Do you mean that The Aura counts as fear manipulation or that LüBu's resistance should not be limited?

 

[Phsccarvalho]

Shouldn't Lu Bu's Air manipulation be limited? Since it's just an extreme gust of wind generated by the technique's power? He's not exactly manipulating the air, not the way he wants to be anyway.

But I don't know if this fits for the complete form or not. I didn't find something specific like that on the Air Manipulation page.

 

[SamanPatou]

So "Fear Manipulation" is okay or not?
Do you mean that The Aura counts as fear manipulation or that LüBu's resistance should not be limited?

The ability's ok, maybe I'd mention that Thor wasn't influenced, maybe to indicate that it's not an all-powerful or mind-haxing aura?
I see this kind of ability being overhyped too often in vs threads, so it's always better to be clear.

Shouldn't Lu Bu's Air manipulation be limited? Since it's just an extreme gust of wind generated by the technique's power? He's not exactly manipulating the air, not the way he wants to be anyway.

Agreed

 

[AnonymousBlank]

Makes sense, what makes me always skeptical in this kind of things (since it's a common trope in fiction) is that it stops working the moment the narrative doesn't need to hype up the character (like Thor not giving a shit about the aura), but I'm fine with it not being limited.

Thor is the same breed as Lu Bu, for lack of a better term, that being “the strongest” much like Dong Zhuo is as according to the narrator in the first chapter of Lu Bu’s spin off, the ability to in-still fear in others is part of what makes them “the strongest”. Thor himself has a fear hax feat against Brunhilde and Geir in the first chapter so these guys having fear hax and resisting each other’s is just par the course tbh rather than the story sidelining it for plot.

There are also given reasons in verse for people being able to ignore or push past it despite not being classified as “the strongest”. Both Sun Jian (who gets affected by it on multiple occasions) and Mu Shun both manage to bypass it because they are fighting for their men who are watching the fight.

Lu Bu should also get shockwave generation too tbh since he pushes people back several times just from standing there.

Also on the LS, this should be calced. Gryps as a kid was pulling that shit with his teeth for training and Lu Bu > him.

All his stamina and endurance feats too cuz I was bored.

 

[LordGinSama]

Thor best god tbh.



Out here putting in good work for norse mythology instead of a certain Greek wanking verse.

 

[AnonymousBlank]

Thor best god tbh.

He is. Never been not on the R1 wave as the goats Now we just need Odin to fight and be stated = Zeus so peeps can get off their copium for Adam and Zeus as the top of the verse.

Out here putting in good work for norse mythology instead of a certain Greek wanking verse.

Greeks suck. Just a train of Ls even when they got a dub

 

[Sparkive]

The ability's ok, maybe I'd mention that Thor wasn't influenced, maybe to indicate that it's not an all-powerful or mind-haxing aura?
I see this kind of ability being overhyped too often in vs threads, so it's always better to be clear.

Thor is the same breed as Lu Bu, for lack of a better term, that being “the strongest” much like Dong Zhuo is as according to the narrator in the first chapter of Lu Bu’s spin off, the ability to in-still fear in others is part of what makes them “the strongest”. Thor himself has a fear hax feat against Brunhilde and Geir in the first chapter so these guys having fear hax and resisting each other’s is just par the course tbh rather than the story sidelining it for plot.

There are also given reasons in verse for people being able to ignore or push past it despite not being classified as “the strongest”. Both Sun Jian (who gets affected by it on multiple occasions) and Mu Shun both manage to bypass it because they are fighting for their men who are watching the fight.

I agree, Thor shouldn't count
Lübu's fear manipulation doesn't seem to affect people at his level, and can be easily overcome by force of will.
For the moment I left it as "intimidating aura" but intimidating linking to Fear manipulation

Lu Bu should also get shockwave generation too tbh since he pushes people back several times just from standing there.

The first example could be, because of the fourth panel, but it doesn't really seem to affect anyone, who in the fifth panel are just scared/surprised feeling the pressure of their gazes
The second example is very bad, they are just falling from fear
In fact I think there is a better example in the Red Hare chapter.

Also on the LS, this should be calced. Gryps as a kid was pulling that shit with his teeth for training and Lu Bu > him.

I doubt that the LS is scalable, although LüBu is clearly superior, that only scales in AP, at the end of the day their fight only consists of launching their best blow each (Lü Bu using his sky eater on him, which I am trying to separate from his physique)

 

[Sparkive]

Anyway, I remind you that this thread only goes to the P&A, summary and techniques, for things like the LS or Speed, we first need several of the feats to be calculated before even starting to format it

 

[Phsccarvalho]

Anyway, I remind you that this thread only goes to the P&A, summary and techniques, for things like the LS or Speed, we first need several of the feats to be calculated before even starting to format it

What do you think of limited air handling?

Also, shouldn't the "Volund" key have listed "all previous skills plus:"? Because the Volund key is not just for the weapon, but for all Lu bu from Record of Ragnarok.

 

[Sparkive]

What do you think of limited air handling?

Also, shouldn't the "Volund" key have listed "all previous skills plus:"? Because the Volund key is not just for the weapon, but for all Lu bu from Record of Ragnarok.

done

 

[Phsccarvalho]

done

Speaking of which, now that we have an entire Lu Bu manga, there should be two keys, one from him in the spin off and him in the original manga.

Even because it has two switches "Base (Vivo)" and "Volund". And I'm sure that while he was alive, he didn't have immortalities. If someone somewhere uses his "Base" key, it will be difficult for that person to know what powers that key has. Since the "Lu Bu" key in the P&A section is listing his powers and abilities while he's alive (base/spin off) and while he's dead (volund)

 

[Sparkive]

Speaking of which, now that we have an entire Lu Bu manga, there should be two keys, one from him in the spin off and him in the original manga.

I can change the names of the keys and add immortality to the second one, but we cannot separate the spin-off with the central manga, for the simple fact that currently the AP from when he was alive comes from RoR
Also in RoR we also have part of when he was alive (some changed by the spin-off, but hey), and the spin-off goes until the death of LüBu (epilogue)

Anyway, I already made the change in the sandbox, and considering that 48 hours have passed since it was accepted, I'm going to put them on the profile

Sparkive/Sandbox1

vsbattles.fandom.com

 

[Phsccarvalho]

I can change the names of the keys and add immortality to the second one, but we cannot separate the spin-off with the central manga, for the simple fact that currently the AP from when he was alive comes from RoR
Also in RoR we also have part of when he was alive (some changed by the spin-off, but hey), and the spin-off goes until the death of LüBu (epilogue)

Anyway, I already made the change in the sandbox, and considering that 48 hours have passed since it was accepted, I'm going to put them on the profile

Sparkive/Sandbox1

vsbattles.fandom.com

Not literally splitting RoR from the Spin off, it's more him alive and another participating in Ragnarok, the way you put it in your sandbox.

 

[Sparkive]

Not literally splitting RoR from the Spin off, it's more him alive and another participating in Ragnarok, the way you put it in your sandbox.

I just realized, The profile keys says "Base | With Volunt", that is, he does not talk about when he was alive, but about what strength he has without using the Volunt (remember that this strengthens the user)
When he's dead he still has the strength he had when he was alive, and if I did it the way I just sandboxed it would be creating a bit of a mess with the keys.
On top of that, this has not been accepted by any staff.
So I'll put it as it was before, in the next part (when we have the required calculations) I'll put that on topic as well

 

[Phsccarvalho]

I just realized, The profile keys says "Base | With Volunt", that is, he does not talk about when he was alive, but about what strength he has without using the Volunt (remember that this strengthens the user)
When he's dead he still has the strength he had when he was alive, and if I did it the way I just sandboxed it would be creating a bit of a mess with the keys.
On top of that, this has not been accepted by any staff.
So I'll put it as it was before, in the next part (when we have the required calculations) I'll put that on topic as well

OK. I don't think it makes sense to have a "Base" for him in Ragnarok, considering that when he appears, he instantly does Volund. I think "Alive" and "In Ragnarok" keys look better, but that's for another topic as you said.

 

[Sparkive]

.

Before this thread closes I want to ask permission to add Immortality type 7 to all humans:
All humans are in the same situation as LuBu, in fact the same explanation is used
and I ask here, because I'm not going to wait 48 hours just for this

 

[SamanPatou]

Yes, Lu should have two keys, one for his alive self and the other for when he's dead.

There's no point in having a "base dead", that key can just cover his volund'rd version.

Also, having different keys doesn't mean splitting the two mangas, which are set in the same continuity, but just the time periods.
It doesn't matter if his feats come from RoR, he can still scale to them since they are always from his "alive" period.

Before this thread closes I want to ask permission to add Immortality type 7 to all humans:
All humans are in the same situation as LuBu, in fact the same explanation is used
and I ask here, because I'm not going to wait 48 hours just for this

Yeah, totally.
Also, someone should fetch the scan where they say gods are immune to mortals' weapons and add it to all deities' files.
Iirc it's in one of the first chapters, so it shouldn't be difficult to find.

 

[Sparkive]

Yes, Lu should have two keys, one for his alive self and the other for when he's dead.

There's no point in having a "base dead", that key can just cover his volund'rd version.

Also, having different keys doesn't mean splitting the two mangas, which are set in the same continuity, but just the time periods.
It doesn't matter if his feats come from RoR, he can still scale to them since they are always from his "alive" period.

and what would they be called?
Alive | In the Ragnarok
This also goes for Sasaki Kojiro and Jack the Ripper (by the way, when their spinoff ends we also have to CTR them)
In the case of Qin Shi Huang it is more difficult, when his Base form scales to Ares "effortlessly hurled Ares without using his Völundr"
by the way, apparently the correct name of the Volunt is Völundr, shall we fix it?

Yeah, totally.

Done

 

[AnonymousBlank]

The first example could be, because of the fourth panel, but it doesn't really seem to affect anyone, who in the fifth panel are just scared/surprised feeling the pressure of their gazes

Those guys are really far away from Lu Bu and Sun Jian yet they are stumbling back.

The second example is very bad, they are just falling from fear

Look at the 3rd panel on the second example’s first page. Commodus is stood behind all of the guards with several feet between him and the ones at the front.Cue the 2nd panel on the second page where all of them are now behind him and the fourth panel where he is planted on the ground by himself with the guards (knocked behind him) nowhere to be seen. Lu Bu literally blasted them off their feet with a glare a la Jiren lol

In fact I think there is a better example in the Red Hare chapter.

I assume you mean this one? That’s just the force of their takeoff rather than them just standing there and producing shockwaves like I was referring to.

I doubt that the LS is scalable, although LüBu is clearly superior, that only scales in AP, at the end of the day their fight only consists of launching their best blow each (Lü Bu using his sky eater on him, which I am trying to separate from his physique)

Narrator states Lu Bu reached the summit of human potential when referring to him being bored of being >>> everyone else. Don’t see why Lu Bu wouldn’t be scaled above a child Gryps in the same series as the statement.

Also, someone should fetch the scan where they say gods are immune to mortals' weapons and add it to all deities' files.
Iirc it's in one of the first chapters, so it shouldn't be difficult to find.

Ooc, where does this idea of gods > human weapons by default come from? The only thing that talks about their superiority is specifically in regards to their Divine Weapons being of better quality and making them unbeatable.

In the case of Qin Shi Huang it is more difficult, when his Base form scales to Ares "effortlessly hurled Ares without using his Völundr

What if I told you the chinamen scale to the gods anyway?

 

[Sparkive]

Yes, Lu should have two keys, one for his alive self and the other for when he's dead.

There's no point in having a "base dead", that key can just cover his volund'rd version.

Also, having different keys doesn't mean splitting the two mangas, which are set in the same continuity, but just the time periods.
It doesn't matter if his feats come from RoR, he can still scale to them since they are always from his "alive" period.

So, what do you think about this:

and what would they be called?
Alive | In the Ragnarok
This also goes for Sasaki Kojiro and Jack the Ripper (by the way, when their spinoff ends we also have to CTR them)
In the case of Qin Shi Huang it is more difficult, when his Base form scales to Ares "effortlessly hurled Ares without using his Völundr"
by the way, apparently the correct name of the Volunt is Völundr, shall we fix it?

Done