- 17,356
- 11,631
(Before I begin, a big thanks to @ProfectusInfinity for all his help!)
THE TIME HAS COME. After eight months of work, over 238,000 bytes typed, and over 500 issues read, my Marvel Magic page is basically done (outside of a few minor clean ups needed) ...but before that, we're gonna discuss some character-specific revisions for some magic characters!
Voting Staff Agreements: @Planck69, @DarkDragonMedeus, @Damage3245
THE TIME HAS COME. After eight months of work, over 238,000 bytes typed, and over 500 issues read, my Marvel Magic page is basically done (outside of a few minor clean ups needed) ...but before that, we're gonna discuss some character-specific revisions for some magic characters!
- Passive Statistics Reduction: Should be far superior to the power which he granted Sligguth, whose mere evil aura was enough to heavily weaken Doctor Strange's magic powers.
- Higher-Dimensional Existence: At least High 1-B, possibly higher. Shuma-Gorath resides in a dimension "where space hangs in tatters like an old sock" and where pan-dimensional demons such as Mephisto or Satannish would be "like mice in a great temple". When an amplified Doctor Strange battled Shuma-Gorath in the latter's realm, it took place even above Limbo, which is pan-dimensional and is described as a realm that transcends all realities and all planes of existence, and interfaces with all of creation, as well as a plane where all times are one. The Old Ones exist on the same level of reality as the Abstracts, and can fight on multiple planes of existence at once.
- He should also get Immeasurable Lifting Strength for having HDE.
- Acausality (Types 1 and 4): Existed before time itself, from Mighty Avengers Vol. 2 #2. The Old Ones exist on the same level of reality as the Abstracts.
- Beyond-Dimensional Existence (Type 1): Existed before time itself, from Mighty Avengers Vol. 2 #2, and resides in a dimension "where space hangs in tatters like an old sock".
- Conceptual Manipulation (Type 1)/Law Manipulation/Information Manipulation (Type 2)/Reality Warping, and enhanced Non-Physical Interaction (Nonexistence-Nature 1): Shuma-Gorath is one of the Old Ones, who can overthrow the fundamental laws of all possible universes, such as life and death as well as being and unbeing, allowing them to rewrite and remake the basic language with which reality is composed.
- Further Mind Manipulation: The Old Ones can unleash a wave of Psionic energy. Shuma-Gorath gave Doctor Strange a telepathic vision.
- Non-Physical Interaction: The Old Ones can kill Abstracts, who are Incorporeal beings that reside above the physical universe, and are stated to be "too abstract to fight in anything remotely resembling a physical manner". Nightmare was terrified of Shuma-Gorath, as currently noted on Shuma's profile, indicating that Shuma could kill him.
- Causality Manipulation: Shuma-Gorath created a mystic image of Earth, and anything he did to the mystic image happens to the real Earth as well.
- Resistance to Death Manipulation & Soul Manipulation: Was unaffected by being in his own realm, which was killing Kaluu just from him being there, and he implied it was also threatening his very spirit.
- Immortality (Types 1, 2, & 3): Even Agamotto, a member of the Vishanti, was unable to kill Shuma-Gorath.
- Possible Immortality (Type 9): His physical body cannot be truly destroyed without killing his Astral Body, with Astral forms being higher-dimensional in nature.
- Transmutation/Biological Manipulation and Fire Manipulation: Arioch, Shuma-Gorath's lieutenant and a fellow Old One, grotesquely mutated Doctor Strange's face with a wave of his hand, before setting it on fire.
- Nightmare:
- Evidence for being Low 1-A:
- Compared to Eternity and Death
- His realm is in the Astral Plane, which is Low 1-A in dimensionality.
- Evidence for a High 1-B minimum:
- After training Cyrus Black to be his servant, Black stated that his power rivalled the Vishanti.
- One of the most powerful beings in the Splinter Realms.
- Exists on a higher plane than Liveworld, which is itself a higher dimension beyond the realms of humankind and a Splinter Realm adjacent to Limbo/Otherplace, which is a pan-dimensional world that encompasses all of space-time and all planes of existence, transcending all realities with Earth-616 comprising an infinite number of such higher dimensions.
- Portrayed as comparable to Mephisto and Dormammu, from Doctor Strange Vol. 1 #389.
- Higher-Dimensional Existence: See above.
- Fear Lords such as Nightmare and the Dweller in Darkness are also indicated to be transcendent in nature, existing in a higher dimension while viewing standard universes as "lower". Fear Lords are transcendent beings who exist as and are composed of the very essence of their realms, which are universes beyond the mortal plane that hold an inconceivable number of spatial dimensions)
- He should also get Immeasurable Lifting Strength for having HDE.
- Immortality (Type 1, 7, & 8; Fear Lords like the Dweller look down on the eternal, and are said to be immortal, unliving, and consequently unkillable. Existing purely as concepts, they exist as long as their abstractions do)
- Absorption (Energy & Soul; Fear Lords treat fear as sustenance and life itself, and may siphon away the immense fear energy resulting from cataclysmic events or under certain circumstances, the terror produced by other Fear Lords to strengthen themselves. They can steal the very life forces along with the souls of those they kill and absorb)
- Accelerated Development & Empowerment (Fear Lords rapidly gain strength while fighting the more their opponents fear them,and seem to gain more power targeting stronger opponents like Gods or Sorcerers)
- Multilocation (Nightmare and Dweller manifested in multiple areas across the globe at once to harvest fears)
- Summoning & Life Manipulation (Fear Lords can summon armies of ghouls on a whim, and may spawn minions or create living subjects from latent energy, then summon them to their locations from across time and space)
- Matter Manipulation & Energy Manipulation (Fear Lords like Nightmare control every iota of matter and energy within their realms)
- Telepathy (Fear Lords have telepathic powers enabling thought projection and mental communication)
- Clairvoyance (Fear Lords can monitor other dimensions and specific entities in them)
- Energy Projection (All Fear Lords are capable of conjuring mysterious energy to attack with)
- Memory Manipulation & Resistance to Clairvoyance (The Fear Lords performed the Spell of Obviation to wipe Strange's memories of them, then hid themselves from the Orb of Agamotto)
- Fear Manipulation
- Energy Manipulation: Created chains of pure cosmic force to trap Eternity.
- Fire Manipulation: Nightmare attacked Doctor Strange's Astral Form with green fire that enveloped and trapped him.
- Incorporeality: He is an abstract conceptual entity composed of the very essence of his realm.
- Transmutation: Solidified Doctor Strange's Astral Form.
- Corruption: Used magic to corrupt the Eye of Agamotto and turn it against Doctor Strange.
- Abstract Existence (Type 1: Type 2 Concept):
- His realm is ephemeral-as much a state of mind as of existence.
- He is an abstract conceptual entity composed of the very essence of his realm.
- Nightmare is a conceptual entity, his existence is as much a part of all existence such as Eternity himself, as all dreams would lose their meaning without his existence.
- Nightmare is his own realm, the very concept of nightmare is nothing without him.
- Acausality (Type 4) and Beyond-Dimensional Existence (Type 1): Is beyond time and space.
- Immeasurable speed:
- Summoning: In his own realm, can summon demonic minions strong enough to restrain Doctor Strange. Can summon an entire army made of every nightmares of the existence
- Immortality (Type 1, 7, & 8; Fear Lords like the Dweller look down on the eternal, and are said to be immortal, unliving, and consequently unkillable. Existing purely as concepts, they exist as long as their abstractions do)
- Absorption (Energy & Soul; Fear Lords treat fear as sustenance and life itself, and may siphon away the immense fear energy resulting from cataclysmic events or under certain circumstances, the terror produced by other Fear Lords to strengthen themselves. They can steal the very life forces along with the souls of those they kill and absorb)
- Multilocation (Nightmare and Dweller manifested in multiple areas across the globe at once to harvest fears)
- Summoning & Life Manipulation (Fear Lords can summon armies of ghouls on a whim, and may spawn minions or create living subjects from latent energy, then summon them to their locations from across time and space)
- Matter Manipulation & Energy Manipulation (Fear Lords like Nightmare control every iota of matter and energy within their realms)
- Telepathy (Fear Lords have telepathic powers enabling thought projection and mental communication)
- Darkness Manipulation (The Fear Lords orchestrated a "Great Fear," shrouding the world in pitch blackness. Individual Fear Lords are able to induce night and darkness on a moment's notice. The Fear Lord D'Spayre was responsible for the creation of the heroes Cloak and Dagger, bestowing them with the lightforce and darkforce, which are fragments of his soul)
- Magic & Dimensional Travel (The Halls of Fear, which is a mystic realm and the base of operations for the Fear Lords, can usually just be accessed through magical means. Any individual Fear Lord could cross dimensions and cosmic storms to assemble the other Fear Lords for missions of conquest out of civic duty. They could perform magical spells in concert)
- Teleportation (All the Fear Lords are capable of materializing on earth)
- Aura (Fear-Inducing), Madness Manipulation, & Fear Manipulation (Fear Lords carry temperaments of pure evil and terror against which direct contact leads to pure madness and indescribable fear that chills the soul and mind)
- Telepathy: When Mikaboshi stole the Power of Nightmare, he destroyed the minds of all mortals on earth
- Shapeshifting: Took the form of Freddy Krueger
- Size Manipulation: Nightmare grew to the point of crushing planets
- Astral Form Physiology: Since his realm exists in the Astral Plane, he should have this physiology. Also, only Astral Forms can enter the Dream Dimension.
- Non-Physical Interaction: Nightmare can naturally affect minds, and even basic Dream Demons can affect and kill Astral Forms.
- As the ruler and complete controller of the Dream Dimension (which is part of the Astral Plane), Nightmare should possess the following:
- Resistance to Vector Manipulation: The Dream Dimension has no distance or direction and has no up or down, so any normal being who stumbles within it may aimlessly stumble in the air forever.
- Incorporeality and Abstract Existence (Type 1: Dream): To enter the Dream Dimension, you must be an insubstantial dream, and to leave the small branches of reality within the realm will turn you into only a dream. Beings in the Dream Dimension, particularly nightmare creatures, have no substance, as in this dimension nothing is material.
- Immortality (Type 1): To leave the small branches of reality within the realm will turn you into only a dream, and dreams cannot die.
- Resistance to Law Manipulation: Inhabitants of the Dream Dimension are unhampered by physical laws.
- Acausality (Type 4) and Resistance to Time Manipulation. The Dream Dimension is part of the Astral Plane, and is also described as timeless in nature.
- Memory Manipulation and Subjective Reality: In the Dream Dimension, all of mankind's fantasies, memories, and wishes become living reality.
- Evidence for being Low 1-A:
Doctor Strange:
- MFTL+ Speed scan as well as scan for his forcefields blocking a blast from Borgo, who is a perfect copy of the Silver Surfer: Here and here
- Scan for Telekinesis having Stellar Lifting Strength via throwing a black hole onto the Wheel of Change
- Also, change Doctor Strange's telekinesis LS to just Multi-Stellar
- Resistance to Fear Manipulation: A group of spirit-like aliens from an alternate dimension sensed that fear was "foreign" to Doctor Strange. Has resisted the nightmare-inducing magics of Nightmare many times.
- Resistance to Dream Manipulation: Has fought Nightmare in the latter's own dream realm many times and come out on top.
- Further justification for Superhuman Stamina: He once fought supernatural forces for days on end without sleep. He fought an army for Doombots for days alongside Clea and Isaac Newton.
- Immortality:
- Scan for current Type 1 justification
- Cut Type 3 (No reasoning)
- Further Mind Manipulation: Without even using magic, Doctor Strange hypnotized Nightmare.
- Further resistance to Soul Manipulation: Coughs up chunks of his own soul at least twice a day without issues.
- Further resistance to Mind Manipulation: His mind is protected against interdimensional mind maggots who feed on psychic energy. Even while sleeping, his mind and body are protected by over a dozen spells. Even when Umar used a spell of believability to make Strange believe her lies, Doctor Strange proved immune to it.
- Limited resistance to Biological Manipulation/Corruption: The magic parasites already within his body can kill any hostile invading parasites.
- Resistance to Empathic Manipulation: Fights off Amora the Enchantress's seduction magic.
- Resistance to Fire Manipulation: Here
- Resistance to Analytical Prediction: Apalla was unable to properly predict Strange's movements, stating that he had distorted her "time sense".
- Fear Manipulation: Caused a man to become scared of him with just a glance.
- Accelerated Development: Can mentally review a hundred spells and analyze dozens of new magical arts in mere instants.
- Further Resistance to Void Manipulation: He was fine while in the void that was the "precreation hesitation" which existed before time and space (with his magic likely also protecting Spider-Man after Strange had reassembled both of their bodies). He and Clea were fine while being in a realm of non-existence. He survived being trapped in a magical cube that was described as a void of pure nothingness and non-being, described as a "place that is not a place", and proceeded to escape from it.
- Supernatural Willpower: Held the shards of Galactus's shattered body together with sheer willpower. Doctor Doom compares Strange's willpower to his own.
- Further Resistance to Mind Manipulation: Low 1-A. Overcame the mental manipulation of the Mind Gem, and later utterly no-sold a man using the Mind Gem's power on him.
- Further Resistance to Reality Warping: Was unaffected by the reality-warping powers of the Infinity Gauntlet.
- Further Resistance to Soul Manipulation and to all the powers of affecting an astral form: Is repeatedly stated to lack part of, if not all of his soul.
- Resistance to Death Manipulation: Low 1-A. Death admitted that she cannot take his life by force.
- Resistance to Death Manipulation & Soul Manipulation. Was unaffected by being in the Realm of the Old Ones, which was killing Kaluu just from him being there, and he implied it was also threatening his very spirit.
- Reference for him resisting the Madness/Fear hax of D'spayre: Doctor Strange Vol. 2 #55
- As mentioned above, Fear Lords such as D'spayre are higher-dimensional in nature, which applies to the potency of their Madness/Fear Manipulation.
- Resistance to Underwater Pressure: As seen here
- Possibly Immeasurable Lifting Strength at peak: Using all of his strength, Strange's Astral Form resisted the pull of a weakened Dormammu and was even pulling him into the Earth Dimension
- This feat should still be Immeasurable due to Dormammu's higher-dimensional nature.
- No-Magic Base being High 8-C: Fought evenly with Morbius without magic.
- Held his own in a hand-to-hand fight against a demonically-possessed Wolverine, who is stated to have his power amplified by those demons
As of right now, Doctor Strange only goes up to Low 1-A with a few spells and items. However, his peak has consistently had scaling-based showings on the level of High 1-B/Low 1-A (both for his magic AP and his mystic forcefields), as well as Immeasurable Speed
Thus, his stats should be:
Additional Tier 1 Feats for Doctor Strange (along with feats for Immeasurable speed):
- Fought evenly with Nightmare, and could break his attack spell even while only in his astral form.
- Held his own against Dormammu even before becoming Sorcerer Supreme, and forced Dormammu to exert a large deal of energy during their battle despite being inferior in power.
- His most powerful sorcery could dispel a whirlwind which significantly drained Dormammu's power through its use.
- Blocked a blast from Dormammu, and could leave him reeling with a magic attack that forced Dormammu to use up most of his own mystic power in order to repel it.
- Nightmare views him as an equal in power, with Strange stating himself to be Nightmare's equal.
- The light of the Eye of Agamotto is powerful enough to repel and even briefly overpower Nightmare.
- Reflected a blast from Umar while she was in the Dark Dimension.
- Helped to seal the Fear Lord D'Spayre, who at the time had the combined power of both Nightmare and the Dweller in Darkness, the latter being roughly equal in power to Nightmare.
- Staggered an off-guard Arioch and took a blast from him, although he admitted he could not win in a fair fight.
- Note: Doctor Strange at the time had lost his magic talismans, with him later stating after getting them all back that he was far stronger with them in his possession.
- While inferior, held his own against Zom, who is stronger than Umar at her peak, Dormammu at his peak, or Eternity.
- While vastly inferior to the Living Tribunal, managed to break out of his enchantments twice and impress him to the point of having him implicitly compare Doctor Strange to Zom.
- Note: Strange by no means scales to the 1-A Living Tribunal, but this is very strong support for his peak being Low 1-A.
- Broke through the In-Betweener's bindings, with the In-Betweener even complementing him for doing so.
- When enraged, easily overpowered the mystic warlord Tiboro (even stating that he could easily kill Tiboro if he so wished) and was willing to take on Umar as well without issue, with Tiboro himself being portrayed as comparable to Umar and also being entirely unafraid of the Dweller in Darkness, who is comparable to Nightmare and Agamotto.
- Low 1-A forcefield durability: Strange's forcefields managed to shield him from the battle between Dormammu and Eternity, one which Strange said threatened to destroy both Dormammu and Eternity and was also stated to have caused a "transdimensional holocaust", with Dormammu confirming Strange's shields saving him from the clash. Also, he and Clea using magic forcefields managed to shield against Dormammu's attack which was further amplified by him drawing on the Dark Dimension for power, and they would've overpowered Dormammu together with their forcefields had Baron Mordo not sneak-attacked them. Barely blocked an attack from Shuma-Gorath. Blocked a direct blast from a Great Fear amped D'Spayre.
Higher Physical Durability Feats for Doctor Strange (not including Forcefields), and a possible striking strength feat:
- Withstood beatings from the Mindless Ones and blocked their beams with the Cloak of Levitation, and this was during a period in the comics when the Mindless Ones were still portrayed as a threat to Dormammu himself.
- Survived a psychic blow from Umar when she caught him off-guard after he momentarily put his magic shield down.
- Was able to stagger two Mindless Ones with a kick, and his Durability should be comparable to his Striking Strength.
Immeasurable speed feats for peak Doctor Strange:
- Fought evenly with Nightmare, who as mentioned above should be Immeasurable.
- Held his own against Dormammu in the Dark Dimension even before becoming Sorcerer Supreme, and forced Dormammu to exert a large deal of energy during their battle despite being inferior in power.
- Reflected a blast from Umar while she was in the Dark Dimension
- When he had the power of Lord Chaos and Master Order, overwhelmed The In-Betweener.
- While inferior, held his own against Zom, who is superior to Umar at her peak, Dormammu at his peak, and Eternity.
- While vastly inferior to the Living Tribunal, managed to break out of his enchantments twice and impress him to the point of having him implicitly compare Doctor Strange to Zom.
Thus, his stats should be:
- Tier/AP: "At least 5-A, up to Low 1-A at peak, higher with certain Artifacts at spells"
- Speed: "At least MFTL+, up to Immeasurable at peak"
- Striking Strength: Large Building Level (Fought on par with Morbius and a demonically-amplified Wolverine), far higher with Magic (Could stagger two Mindless Ones in the Dark Dimension with a kick)
- Durability: "At least Large Building Level", up to Low Outerverse level when using magic (Took a psychic blast from Umar, and withstood beatings from the Mindless Ones in the Dark Dimension during a time when they were still considered a threat to Dormammu), higher with Forcefields ([Some of the above feats])
- Clea
- Further justification for Superhuman Stamina: She fought an army for Doombots for days alongside Doctor Strange and Isaac Newton.
- Further Resistance to Void Manipulation: She and Strange were fine while being in a realm of non-existence.
- Support for High 1-B: Fought the Trinity of Ashes, who are equal to the Vishanti, and Slorioth, a pan-dimensional entity whose totality is vast beyond what any single dimensionality could hope to contain, extending over all higher dimensions, of which there is an infinite number.
- Abstract Existence (Type 1: Concept), Immortality and Regeneration (Types 1, 2, 3, 4, 6, & 8; Low-Godly) and Empowerment: Dormammu is a concept, a shared belief among all of his followers, and so long as there are those who worship him, energy shall form itself to become him, even if he is completely destroyed (with he himself implying that he'd been erased from existence, as he referred to actions done before his destruction as being done "in a previous existence"), and his body is made of raw extra-dimensional energy that comes from the belief and worship of his followers, and he is also made stronger from terror and hatred. Doctor Strange stated that Dormammu survived having his entire essence scattered across a dozen dimensions, allowing him to contact his minions and organize their attack on Earth. Dormammu also survived having his essence being shattered into psychic shards (with Dormammu also stating that his "very being" was shattered) and scattered across multiple realities/dimensions, managing even as a powerless essence devoid of form to attach himself to Doctor Strange until he found an opening to take over Strange's body while Strange's soul was outside of his body. As long as Dormammu's spirit survives, he can exist without a body.
- Incorporeality: His body is made of raw extra-dimensional energy that comes from the belief and worship of his followers.
- Higher-Dimensional Existence: Dormammu views time and space as "dirty little geometries" in comparison to the Dark Dimension. The writer of that issue, Anthony Oliveira, confirmed Dormammu is an interdimensional being that transcends realities and transcends several planes of existence.
- Dormammu is a Faltine, which exist on a dimension higher than that of the Dark Dimension, which is a Splinter Realm adjacent to Limbo/Otherplace, which is a pan-dimensional world that encompasses all of space-time and all planes of existence, transcending all realities with Earth-616 comprising an infinite number of such higher dimensions. As a matter of fact, the Dark Dimension is the largest of the Splinter Realms.
- Thus, his HDE would be High 1-B.
- Transmutation/Fusionism/Absorption: One of his Darkspells unleashed a "dimensional tidal wave" to melt and merge the Mhuruuks into a single miasmic mass which he then had the G'uranthic Guardian absorb in order to add their mystic essence to that of the Guardian's, a spell that not even Umar could reverse (from Doctor Strange: Sorcerer Supreme #24.
- Absorption: Absorbed Umar and Baron Mordo, taking their power for himself.
- Passive Perception Manipulation: Due to Dormammu's very nature, every person who views him sees him slightly differently, making it impossible for a group of enemies to attack him simultaneously as their attacks would "shriek in disharmony".
- Reality Warping and Dimensional Manipulation: Can warp the higher-dimensional Dark Dimension to fit his needs on a whim.
- Reality Warping, Chaos Manipulation, and further Conceptual Manipulation (Type 1): Dormammu is capable of warping both reality as well as Lord Chaos himself in a chess game against Odin, and should Dormammu have won the chess game, then Lord Chaos would've grown far more powerful than Master Order and overrun the universe as a result. The Dark Dimension is described as "chaos personified", and Dormammu can manipulate the Dark Dimension on a whim. Uses the essence of chaos to maintain the Dark Dimension's existence.
- Martial Arts: Dormammu is comparable in combat skill to Doctor Strange, barely losing while merely toying with him, forcing Strange to use trickery to prevail.
- Likely Social Influencing: Tricked his sister Umar into imprisonment through unknown means.
- Mind Manipulation: Took over Scarlet Witch's mind.
- Illusion Creation: Created a world full of illusions through which he planned to turn Ghost Rider into an enemy of Doctor Strange. Trapped Doctor Strange in an illusion where his life took a different course.
- Darkness Manipulation and Pain Manipulation: Through an illusionary Doctor Strange, surrounded Ghost Rider with a sphere of darkness that inflicted great agony with every moment he spent in it.
- Darkness Manipulation/Energy Manipulation/Air Manipulation/Regeneration (Low-Godly): Dormammu can extract and draw sustenance from the very darkness of the Dark Dimension, doing so even as a pale spirit to reform his body and empower himself, before using it to turn the sky black and turning the very air into a latticework of shade and shadow.
- Unlike the above regeneration, this is combat applicable.
- Darkness Manipulation/Energy Manipulation/Air Manipulation/Regeneration (Low-Godly): Dormammu can extract and draw sustenance from the very darkness of the Dark Dimension, doing so even as a pale spirit to reform his body and empower himself, before using it to turn the sky black and turning the very air into a latticework of shade and shadow.
- Energy Projection and Manipulation: Can fire beams and control their trajectory. Held Clea in a magic cage and ensnared Strange in magic chains
- Corrosion Inducement: Melted a substance that Strange surrounded him with
- Power Bestowal: Gave Mordo great power, albeit temporarily
- Summoning: Summoned a myriad of specters to hunt down Strange, and his power can even forcefully summon Umar
- Body Puppetry: Controlled Mordo's body as his mind went empty, and can do the same to unwilling subjects too
- Retrocognition and Clairvoyance: Can replay and witness any event that has happened in his dimension with the aid of a simple mystic spell.
- Telepathy: Can sense whether humans lie or not
- Illusion Negation: Erased Strange's illusion
- Passive Madness Manipulation: Absorbing or coming into contact with Dormammu's essence would drive one insane.
- Support for Immeasurable speed: His Crimson Bands of Cyttorak kept up with and eventually caught Doctor Strange's Astral Form despite it going at maximum speed to flee them, with Astral Forms at their peak (such as when used by a master of Astral Projection like Doctor Strange) being this fast.
- Infinite stamina: Here
- Resistance to Sealing: Dormammu stated that not even a group of some of the most powerful sorcerers out there (such as Doctor Voodoo, Scarlet Witch, Daimon Hellstrom, and Wong) could bind him with their magic, something which Voodoo did not dispute.
- Resistance to BFR: The Ancient One could not banish Dormammu, and neither could Umar.
- Resistance to Power Nullification: Was entirely unaffected by a bullet made from a unique substance that could nullify the magic power of any wizard or spell, despite those bullets having instantly nullified the magic powers of other sorcerers.
- Remove the "Classic" from the title of his page, the cosmology is composited and while his modern self has had some bad showings he has recently been portrayed as a top-level threat again, plus there is not enough to warrant a profile split and his "modern" self doesn't even have a profile.
- Eternity:
- Further justification for Type 5 Immortality: Was stated by Doctor Strange to be "deathless". The Ancient One, who at the time was one with Eternity himself, stated that death is simply irrelevant to him.
- Scan for Eternity being the personification of time itself, something stated multiple times on his current profile (this isn't changing anything, this is just adding a supporting scan)
- Mindless Ones:
- Immunity to Mind Manipulation and to all the powers from affecting an Astral Form: Are stated to completely lack a mind. The Mindful One, a Mindless One, stated that he has no soul, which means that he has no Astral Form.
- Infinite stamina
- Abstract Existence (Type 2): The Mindless Ones are an expression of magical energy, a vibrational pattern between magical dimensions.
- Low 1-A at their peak in the Dark Dimension: Dormammu was unable to kill them, only keep them at bay with his barrier, and upon becoming exhausted after his fight with Doctor Strange was unable to repel them until Strange granted him some of his own power. This is still noted even in modern comics, where Strange says that they would've overpowered and "taken" Dormammu had Strange not saved him, which even Dormammu doesn't deny. Strange stated that Umar even in the Dark Dimension would be unable to repel them on her own.
- Doctor Doom
- Enhanced Resistance to Mind Manipulation, Empathic Manipulation, Madness Manipulation, Soul Manipulation, Chaos Manipulation, Unholy Manipulation, and Conceptual Manipulation (Type 3): Withstood being in Chthon's realm without any issue, even though the realm's very nature was overwhelming Doctor Strange physically, spiritually, and emotionally, it's chaos and maleficence poisoning Strange and causing his thoughts to become maggots that ate at his sanity and were consuming "his very self", with the very energies of the dimension itself being described as "soul-devouring".
- Pressure Points: Killed a lion in a single blow by intentionally aiming his punch to hit the location where the brainstem connects to the spine. Killed a man with a controlled jab to the throat.
- Further Martial Arts: Fought and overpowered Taskmaster without his armor in a melee fight.
- Marksmanship: Even without his armor, can throw spears and grappling hooks with enough accuracy to hit moving targets.
- Further Electricity Manipulation: Using an electricity-shooting device in one of the fingers of his armor, Doom can fire electric bolts with enough precision to destroy a small object without affecting the person holding it or to accurately shoot various location's on Moon Knight's body until his armor had been "peeled like an orange".
- Further Air Manipulation: Can unleash a powerful gale with a wave of the hand.
- Resistance to Reality Warping & Existence Erasure: Although it left him burned, he survived his body being overloaded with the complete energy of the Life Force, which he himself described as the power to make and unmake reality and when used earlier by Scarlet Witch let her erase Hawkeye from existence without even intending to.
- Forcefield Negation: A Reed Richards in Doctor Doom's armor who was being mentally manipulated to act like Doom dissolved Susan Storm's forcefield using a modulated energy pulse.
- Further Stealth Mastery: Ironheart's radar cannot detect his armor even when it's right in front of her, from Infamous Iron Man #8
- High Tolerance to Pain: Acted and spoke in a casual manner despite having just been mutilated by Chthon and his army before having his entire body set on fire.
- Better scan for his Resistance to Sleep Manipulation: Here
- Supporting feat for his Magic being 5-A (and probably for the durability of his magic forcefields scaling far above his AP): Casually blocked the combined attacks of nearly a dozen Doombots at once, and proceeded to one-shot all of them at the same time with a magic attack.
- Remove feat of him resisting Selene's telepathy due to it not being canon to Earth-616
- Reorganizing his Social Influencing:
- Social Position: Viewed as a benevolent ruler by many of his Latverian subjects, with him also being recognized as a powerful leader by other nations and diplomats on Earth.
- Reputation and Instigating Fear: Is feared and respected by many superheroes, such as Doctor Strange, but especially by his fellow villains, including the likes of Loki, Kang the Conqueror, and Thanos.
- Deception: Easily deceived the Silver Surfer in their first meeting and hid his true intentions until he was able to drain the Silver Surfer of his Power Cosmic. Tricked the group known as Excalibur into helping him enter Limbo and get the Soulsword by feigning his true intentions.
- Leadership & Charisma: Rallied the people of Latveria and led them in a rebellion against the previous regime. Through words alone, convinced the Wakandan Panther Goddess Bast that he was pure of intent. When he was sent to Counter-Earth, managed to recruit multiple skilled metahumans as his generals, with Lancer in particular remaining loyal to Doom and leading his forces even after he went missing and her armies were being overwhelmed in battle.
- Hypothetical No-Armor Key
- Attack Potency: Wall level+ (Fought and overpowered Taskmaster in a melee fight. Fought and killed a lion)
- Durability: Wall level+ (Took hits off-screen from Taskmaster)
- Speed: Superhuman running speed (Stated that he was faster than a lion. Comparable to Taskmaster) with Hypersonic Combat & Reaction Speed (Fought and defeated Taskmaster)
- Scarlet Witch
- Enhanced Resistance to Mind Manipulation, Empathic Manipulation, Madness Manipulation, Soul Manipulation, Chaos Manipulation, Unholy Manipulation, and Conceptual Manipulation (Type 3): Withstood being in Chthon's realm without issue even though she had stated herself that just being in Chthon's realm will drive one mad, and it's very nature was overwhelming Doctor Strange physically, spiritually, and emotionally, it's chaos and maleficence poisoning Strange and causing his thoughts to become maggots that ate at his sanity and were consuming "his very self", with the very energies of the dimension itself being described as "soul-devouring".
- Mind Manipulation/Telepathy feat: Fought and defeated Livequeen in a telepathic battle.
- Extrasensory Perception: Her "witch's sight" allowed her to detect an invisible minotaur. Could sense the magic energy flowing all throughout Ireland.
- Power Nullification: Knows an ancient Egyptian spell of depowering.
- Sleep Manipulation: Uses a native American spell to make an army of gang members fall asleep.
- Life Force Key:
- Remove High 1-B low-end and make it simply Low 1-A: Scarlet Witch with the Life Force created the House of M reality, aka Earth 58163 which is a separate version of Universal Eternity and wove her spell into all existence. Depowered mutants all across the multiverse, in the process forming cracks along all realities, with each reality being an alternate version of Eternity.
- In short, her feats are consistent enough with Low 1-A that a High 1-B Low End is not needed.
- Creation, Reality Warping,Healing, and Biological Manipulation: Doctor Doom called the Life Force "the power of creation itself. The power to make and unmake reality", and was capable of both healing Cyclops's vision and turning Beast from his mutant form into a human one. He earlier described the Life Force as "reality-shaping".
- Resurrection: The Life Force grants the power to raise the dead.
- Remove High 1-B low-end and make it simply Low 1-A: Scarlet Witch with the Life Force created the House of M reality, aka Earth 58163 which is a separate version of Universal Eternity and wove her spell into all existence. Depowered mutants all across the multiverse, in the process forming cracks along all realities, with each reality being an alternate version of Eternity.
- Umar
- Higher-Dimensional Existence: While she is no longer a Faltine like Dormammu himself is, she is still physically a member of the main species which inhabits the Higher-Dimensional Splinter Realm that is the Dark Dimension, and thus should still have this.
- She should also get Immeasurable Lifting Strength for having HDE.
- Aura: Her very aura was filling up the entire Dark Dimension, from Strange Tales (1951) #152
- Higher-Dimensional Existence: While she is no longer a Faltine like Dormammu himself is, she is still physically a member of the main species which inhabits the Higher-Dimensional Splinter Realm that is the Dark Dimension, and thus should still have this.
- Magik
- BFR: As shown here. Magik also casually sent two students to Hell.
- As Hell is a High 1-B realm, the range of this BFR would thus also be High 1-B.
- Extrasensory Perception: Despair, a young demon from Limbo, can "see the dark, painful side of all things at all times". Despair also sensed that Zoe Laveau was a zombie.
- Power Nullification: Illyana Rasputin depowered Enchantress.
- Resistance to Fire Manipulation: The walls of Belasco's layer easily withstood the Human Torch's fire due to being coated in Belasco's magic, with Illyana being a fellow lord of Limbo just like Belasco.
- BFR: As shown here. Magik also casually sent two students to Hell.
Voting Staff Agreements: @Planck69, @DarkDragonMedeus, @Damage3245
Last edited:
agree
