Kakashi CRT

[Testarossa002]

Kamui Raikiri is currently treated as being hax in its entirety with no AP implication.
Here’s the Databook entry for the jutsu

Kamui Raikiri (Kamui Lightning Cutter)*​

Ninjutsu, Kekkei Genkai

An enhanced version of Kakashi’s original Ninjutsu. It is a Raikiri imbued with the power of Kamui. A divine speed hit is performed, in conjunction with the intangibility effect. The part of the enemy’s body pierced by this Jutsu is immediately transported to the other dimension.

Here’s the raws in case anyone wants to crosscheck
Take note of the bolded part
For it to warp the target away, he needs to actually pierce the target.
Aka overcoming the target’s durability.
The jutsu is a combination of Kamui and Raikiri
Raikiri pierces the target like how it works normally and Kamui warps the cut off part away.

Conclusion
Kakashi in his 3rd key gets upgraded to 5-C, higher with Perfect Susanoo

 

[UchihaSlayer96]

I brought this up during the other Kakashi upgrade attempt.

I no longer think this works for Kamui Shuriken anymore, due to the reasons brought up by Sparkle on that thread, but I think it should still work for Kamui Raikiri.
The technique seemingly does conventional damage and then BFRs the cut portions, unless I'm missing something here.

So I'm fine with Kakashi scaling via Kamui Raikiri and the Perfect Susano'o.

 

[LordTracer]

I agree with 5-C Kamui Raikiri and Perfect Susano’o as well.

 

[UchihaSlayer96]

I will say it might not be a bad idea to get this translated by someone on-site, just to be safe.

 

[Testarossa002]

I brought this up during the other Kakashi upgrade attempt.

I no longer think this works for Kamui Shuriken anymore, due to the reasons brought up by Sparkle on that thread, but I think it should still work for Kamui Raikiri.
The technique seemingly does conventional damage and then BFRs the cut portions, unless I'm missing something here.

So I'm fine with Kakashi scaling via Kamui Raikiri and the Perfect Susano'o.

Yeah
The databook entry for the shuriken says it warps even with the smallest of contacts
So it doesn't need to pierce to warp
Unlike the Raikiri

 

[UchihaSlayer96]

Yeah
The databook entry for the shuriken says it warps even with the smallest of contacts
So it doesn't need to pierce to warp
Unlike the Raikiri

Yup, which is consistent with what we saw in the manga.

 

[Excellence616]

I agree with 5-C Kamui Raikiri and Perfect Susano too

 

[Testarossa002]

I will say it might not be a bad idea to get this translated by someone on-site, just to be safe.

Here's the text

血糖 限界

忍術

JC71巻P182

カムイ らい きり 神威雷切

5 ひろ カカシによる複合オリジナル ナル 忍術。神威」の力を宿した 「雷切」である。その神速の突 きは、抉り取った敵の部位を

時空へと飛ばしてしまう。

Can you tag someone like Arc or any translation mod to have a look?

 

[TauanVictor]

I agree.

 

[Damage3245]

A divine speed hit is performed, in conjunction with the intangibility effect.

This is the part that has me at neutral at the moment; the implication seems to be that an application of the Kamui's intangibility is what allows the hit to go straight through Kaguya and then warp away what is pierced. Which would make some sense considering how much stronger Kaguya should be than Kakashi.

Not enough for me to fully disagree with this thread, but it does make me hesitant.

 

[UchihaSlayer96]

This is the part that has me at neutral at the moment; the implication seems to be that an application of the Kamui's intangibility is what allows the hit to go straight through Kaguya and then warp away what is pierced. Which would make some sense considering how much stronger Kaguya should be than Kakashi.

Not enough for me to fully disagree with this thread, but it does make me hesitant.

Yeah, this is mainly why I want to have it translated, so we can fully discern the context here.

Here's the text

Can you tag someone like Arc or any translation mod to have a look?

@Arc7Kuroi hey sexy
Please help with this when you have the time.

 

[Testarossa002]

This is the part that has me at neutral at the moment; the implication seems to be that an application of the Kamui's intangibility is what allows the hit to go straight through Kaguya and then warp away what is pierced. Which would make some sense considering how much stronger Kaguya should be than Kakashi.

Not enough for me to fully disagree with this thread, but it does make me hesitant.

I believe the intangibility part was referring to when kakashi phased through Ash killing bones

Because we know that kamui users can't interact with stuffs when they're intangible which doesn't work here because we see him interact with her
If he was intangible in that sequence, he's not going to be piercing her in the first place

 

[Shadowbokunohero]

i think both parties make valid points. kakashi being this strong isnt entirely impossible either given the six paths juice.

id be willing to go with a Possibly 5-C

"神威の力" can mean both and the actual full sentence doesn't really give a ton of context

 

[That_moron2]

I was actually going to make a crt about this, so I think this works.

 

[KaydeeX]

i think both parties make valid points. kakashi being this strong isnt entirely impossible either given the six paths juice.

id be willing to go with a Possibly 5-C

"神威の力" can mean both and the actual full sentence doesn't really give a ton of context

That pfp of yours showing your disloyalty to Konan eh
"Possibly" works, I said something like that in Karo's thread.

 

[Apollonir.Scale]

I agree

 

[karo_senpaii]

Kamui Raikiri is currently treated as being hax in its entirety with no AP implication.
Here’s the Databook entry for the jutsu

Here’s the raws in case anyone wants to crosscheck
Take note of the bolded part
For it to warp the target away, he needs to actually pierce the target.
Aka overcoming the target’s durability.
The jutsu is a combination of Kamui and Raikiri
Raikiri pierces the target like how it works normally and Kamui warps the cut off part away.

Conclusion
Kakashi in his 3rd key gets upgraded to 5-C, higher with Perfect Susanoo

Considering I recently tried to get this upgraded I'm definitely in favour of the crt

 

[Arc7Kuroi]

 

[Testarossa002]

Thank you

.

Now that it's been translated, can you share your thoughts?
I don't think it changes anything
As gouging out something still requires one to breakthrough the exterior
Aka AP scaling

 

[Arc7Kuroi]

The sentence does use a more past tense for the gouged out in comparison to the more active present tense for the BFR portion. Which just from a grammatical standpoint does imply the gouging occurs prior to the BFRing. I guess you can debate how much that matters contextually with other kamui techniques seemingly being able to warp as they cut and then BFR

Edit: I’d prolly lean towards a likely rating given all that’s been said so far

 

[MinatoSparkle]

It would be gouged out regardless of whether it was AP or Kamui that severed it though, no?

 

[Arc7Kuroi]

Yeah

 

[Testarossa002]

It would be gouged out regardless of whether it was AP or Kamui that severed it though, no?

Given that the jutsu is supposed to be a combination of Kamui and Raikiri, it'll make little sense if kamui gouges out the opponent and also warps the affected part away

 

[MinatoSparkle]

Given that the jutsu is supposed to be a combination of Kamui and Raikiri, it'll make little sense if kamui gouges out the opponent and also warps the affected part away

The Kamui could be imbued into the shape of Raikiri, making it a Kamui that cuts in the same way that Raikiri would, but with dura neg

 

[UchihaSlayer96]

Hmmmmmmmmm

 

[Arc7Kuroi]

Between the two interpretations of he gouged it out with AP and then BFRd vs he gouged it out with dura neg and then BFRd, I think it’s kinda at an impasse of equal interpretation. On one hand Kakashi has precedence of applying the dura neg to his attacks and then BFRing (kamui shuriken). But on the other hand it seems (from what I read here) that kamui shuriken makes explicit or implicit reference to the fact that the shuriken themselves are utilizing the spatial manip of kamui to harm with dura neg. So a case can be made that if the same were true for Raikiri they’d have made that more clear. So I guess ima switch to a possibly rating being fine unless there’s other evidence or refutation I missed.

 

[Kachon123]

Yeah, like Arc said above, both interpretations are equally valid, so a possibly rating definitely works best

 

[UchihaSlayer96]

Between the two interpretations of he gouged it out with AP and then BFRd vs he gouged it out with dura neg and then BFRd, I think it’s kinda at an impasse of equal interpretation. On one hand Kakashi has precedence of applying the dura neg to his attacks and then BFRing (kamui shuriken). But on the other hand it seems (from what I read here) that kamui shuriken makes explicit or implicit reference to the fact that the shuriken themselves are utilizing the spatial manip of kamui to harm with dura neg. So a case can be made that if the same were true for Raikiri they’d have made that more clear. So I guess ima switch to a possibly rating being fine unless there’s other evidence or refutation I missed.

Yeah, that's kinda what I'm thinking here as well.

If we go with this then I guess on VS threads Kakashi will either have dura negging Kamui Raikiri or 5-C AP. The OP will have to specify which one he gets.

 

[Damage3245]

Seems fine to me. So he would be "At least Island level, possibly Moon level with Kamui Raikiri, higher with Perfect Susano'o"?

 

[UchihaSlayer96]

Seems fine to me. So he would be "At least Island level, possibly Moon level with Kamui Raikiri, higher with Perfect Susano'o"?

That seems acceptable to me.

 

[LordTracer]

Seems fine to me. So he would be "At least Island level, possibly Moon level with Kamui Raikiri, higher with Perfect Susano'o"?

Yeah, seems good.

 

[MinatoSparkle]

Best of both worlds fr

 

[That_moron2]

Yeah looks good to me.

 

[Testarossa002]

Seems fine to me. So he would be "At least Island level, possibly Moon level with Kamui Raikiri, higher with Perfect Susano'o"?

Sighs
That's fine

 

[ninjaking21]

I agree

 

[Testarossa002]

The changes have been applied.
This can be closed

 

[MinatoSparkle]

Maybe it could use a little polishing and links?

 

[Testarossa002]

Maybe it could use a little polishing and links?

Can you help with that?
Thanks

 

[UchihaSlayer96]

I can help, but I'm about to sleep, so it'd have to be later. If someone can/wants to handle it in the meantime, that'd be cool.

 

[MinatoSparkle]

I can help, but I'm about to sleep, so it'd have to be later. If someone can/wants to handle it in the meantime, that'd be cool.