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Hence inconclysive maybe joestar can do an ass pull and win.RapidMotorcycle19 said:
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Joseph Joestar vs Dio Brando
- Thread starter RapidMotorcycle19
- Start date
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You're making a difference between "fresh" vampires and non "fresh" vampires when there are none, they are literally just vampires. This was never said in the show, not once. Dio wasn't only wall level, he had just performed a wall level feat. Straizo wasn't building level, he had just performed a building level feat.TheJ-ManRequiem said:
No he didn't stop doing it, he kept doing it in part 3, when he accepted Jotaro's challenge to see which stand was stronger, which ultimately snowballed into his death. Dio can hear the train, but in a bloodlusted state he would not be able to differentiate all the sounds within a city enviornment, he has good hearing, but that doesn't necessarily means he is good at determining what he's hearing. And how would he run out of the way if he had leaped at Joseph?
Obviously the train wouldn't kill him, I had used it as an example of ways he could outwit him. If anything it would probably just be buying Joseph more time to come up with a way to kill him. How would Dio fair against the clacker boomerang? He knows people can conduct hamon, but does he know Joseph can retain hamon in the clackers once he's thrown them? If Joseph made Dio chase him into a lake, what would he do? Joseph conducts hamon there and it's GG for Dio.
**** what you and another person have supposedly told me, the profile has them both listed as 8-B.
Too many opportunites where Dio can lose IMO, that's why I vote for Joseph.
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The literal narrator gives specific and exact quatifiable amount of power to straizo. And makes a clear note that strauzo is only that powerful currently. Hed get more powerful. And it was mentioned dio got far more powerful than he was at the joestar manor .
Yeah so when he gimped jonathan at the first chance he got because he couldnt underestimate jonathan. Explicitky said he probably shouldnt get into the range of platinum despite jotaro being apparently defeated and kept caution or the stop and knife trick or the multiple times he mentioned he cant underestimate a joestar than proceeds to do a genre savy technique proving he didnt?. Excluding the fact that dio not only can hear and diffentiate while bloodlusted and claiming he cant is a completely unfounded claim... The match not bloodlusted man .And man. Also >cant differentiate a train from the city. He fought jonathan and was aware of hamon conducting through metal. Jonathan and the sword. The frozen rose dire and the chandelure straizo kicked down .
Also pretraining joestar cant melt a vampire in one hit. A direct hit on straizo with hamon couldnt damage him that much .
Man like it or not that was agreed upon. And accepted. Although me arigamy or jsw didnt update the profile . Ya want me to update the profile now or ask maybe arigamy or jsw ?.
Yeah so when he gimped jonathan at the first chance he got because he couldnt underestimate jonathan. Explicitky said he probably shouldnt get into the range of platinum despite jotaro being apparently defeated and kept caution or the stop and knife trick or the multiple times he mentioned he cant underestimate a joestar than proceeds to do a genre savy technique proving he didnt?. Excluding the fact that dio not only can hear and diffentiate while bloodlusted and claiming he cant is a completely unfounded claim... The match not bloodlusted man .And man. Also >cant differentiate a train from the city. He fought jonathan and was aware of hamon conducting through metal. Jonathan and the sword. The frozen rose dire and the chandelure straizo kicked down .
Also pretraining joestar cant melt a vampire in one hit. A direct hit on straizo with hamon couldnt damage him that much .
Man like it or not that was agreed upon. And accepted. Although me arigamy or jsw didnt update the profile . Ya want me to update the profile now or ask maybe arigamy or jsw ?.
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Hamon point blanck on straizo and only the area punched melted and the full body was fine .
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It should be noted that it's pretty heavily implied that Dio is a god among vampires for whatever reason. Zeppeli was preparing for fighting Dio his whole life, and he still got stomped, not just by Dio himself, but even by one of his servants. JoJo stomped that servant and was still weaker than Dio. He invented vampiric techniques no one had ever heard of, and was basically immune to Hamon thanks to his ice techniques. In Part 3, he makes Vanilla Ice look like a jobber even without using his Stand. On top of that, Tarkus is just outright massive, like 4 meters tall of solid zombie muscle, and Dio still outmatches him. I think it's pretty obvious that Straights /=/ Dio.
While it's true that JoJo has MFTL feats, I think it's frankly ridiculous to claim that between the 1800s and the 1900s, humans got hundreds of billions of times faster. If Part 2's characters are casually MFTL, then obviously Part 1 characters scale. Of course, that's irrelevant since speed is equalized, but one way or another, I think it's clear how this goes.
Against pre-training Joseph, Dio wins almost as effortlessly as he did against the first JoJo and Zeppeli in their first fight. Joseph is definitely smarter than Dio, but the gap isn't nearly as wide as it is between him and Straights or Santana. He could outsmart Dio at first, but he'd be caught off-guard by a vampire far stronger than him, with more abilities than him, and able to nearly keep up with his mind. The clacker trick he used against Wham could insta-kill him, but only if Dio was dumb enough to fall for it, which he could theoretically be. After all, JoJo got past him with the "sword in the fire" trick, which was signifigantly more obtuse. I'm tempted to say "inconclusive," but ultimately if it's pre-training Joseph, my vote has to go for Dio.
While it's true that JoJo has MFTL feats, I think it's frankly ridiculous to claim that between the 1800s and the 1900s, humans got hundreds of billions of times faster. If Part 2's characters are casually MFTL, then obviously Part 1 characters scale. Of course, that's irrelevant since speed is equalized, but one way or another, I think it's clear how this goes.
Against pre-training Joseph, Dio wins almost as effortlessly as he did against the first JoJo and Zeppeli in their first fight. Joseph is definitely smarter than Dio, but the gap isn't nearly as wide as it is between him and Straights or Santana. He could outsmart Dio at first, but he'd be caught off-guard by a vampire far stronger than him, with more abilities than him, and able to nearly keep up with his mind. The clacker trick he used against Wham could insta-kill him, but only if Dio was dumb enough to fall for it, which he could theoretically be. After all, JoJo got past him with the "sword in the fire" trick, which was signifigantly more obtuse. I'm tempted to say "inconclusive," but ultimately if it's pre-training Joseph, my vote has to go for Dio.
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Dio 1 Jojo 1 Incon 1
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PIS, so Straizo could give a warning to Joseph.TheJ-ManRequiem said:
Do not update Straizo's profile without finding or creating a valid CRT, you can be banned. You can't say "oh well me and two other people agreed hurr durr" and expect that to fly.
I had to skip 90% of what you said because I just couldn't understand it.
Oh and Joseph having MTFL feats should definitely be an outlier, considering we never see it or anything remotely similar again. At most he should have hypersonic feats scaling from the pillar men. Same goes for most part 1 characters.
Edit: Must have been changed or I've been seeings things, no character (not including stands) has MTFL combat feats, only reaction.
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>pis.
Ya have an example of pretraining joseph doing a feat?.
No.
Then ya cant exactly claim his BEST feat a case of pis mate.
Also ya do realize the users that agreed we're admins? Or at least content moderators. And mate i did find one and linked the thread. Not my fault ya cant be assed to read. Hell jsw even called ya out on twisting the shit out the crt and what was claimed.
>Outlier.
>Joseph caesar and kars have a ftl feat and joseph gets backward scaling from part three.
Ya mean consistent? Because ftl any jojo oddly consistent man. Plus kars does have a ftl feat and wham also .
Ya have an example of pretraining joseph doing a feat?.
No.
Then ya cant exactly claim his BEST feat a case of pis mate.
Also ya do realize the users that agreed we're admins? Or at least content moderators. And mate i did find one and linked the thread. Not my fault ya cant be assed to read. Hell jsw even called ya out on twisting the shit out the crt and what was claimed.
>Outlier.
>Joseph caesar and kars have a ftl feat and joseph gets backward scaling from part three.
Ya mean consistent? Because ftl any jojo oddly consistent man. Plus kars does have a ftl feat and wham also .
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guys chill
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Damn I still can't read what you're trying to say for the life of me. but I'll try.
I don't need an example of Joseph doing a feat to know that Straizo getting punched with hamon and surviving to give a monologue is plot induced stupidity, he should have very clearly melted into a puddle then and there, we've seen it happen to Dio and the fodder zombies.
I don't give a shit who agrees you're a content moderator, you're clearly not. I have not seen you link a thread at all, and I don't know JSW and any discussions I've had with him? I've never twisted the shit out of what CRT now?
No, most Jojo characters are not FTL, at most they are hypersonic. They have FTL reactions, which is very different, just take a look at Joseph's and Kars profile.
When you finish your reply, take two or three minutes to edit so I can understand you better.
I don't need an example of Joseph doing a feat to know that Straizo getting punched with hamon and surviving to give a monologue is plot induced stupidity, he should have very clearly melted into a puddle then and there, we've seen it happen to Dio and the fodder zombies.
I don't give a shit who agrees you're a content moderator, you're clearly not. I have not seen you link a thread at all, and I don't know JSW and any discussions I've had with him? I've never twisted the shit out of what CRT now?
No, most Jojo characters are not FTL, at most they are hypersonic. They have FTL reactions, which is very different, just take a look at Joseph's and Kars profile.
When you finish your reply, take two or three minutes to edit so I can understand you better.
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Yeah except Joseph oretraining not once had melted a vampire. Claiming he can while he didnt prove he could use bullshit. He cant and his best feat is the one above. Post joseph obviously would anhilate a vampire on contact. Although the joseph fighting dio cant while also having his best hamon feat only melting a half a head from straizo at point blank contact .
Joseph vs big boss? Ya should probably go back and read it at least try and oay attetion and yeah. The crtbwas linked and ya twisted the shit out of the agreement and how gad and come and tell ya cut the shit out .
>Also ya do realize the users that agreed we're admins? Or at least content moderators.
Sorry meant "were". Autocorrect a pain. Although that should have been obvious mate.
Yeah? No shit man and joseph kars wham caesar have ftl reactions and combat speed?. Obviously for movement peak at hypersonic or ya get my point .
Joseph vs big boss? Ya should probably go back and read it at least try and oay attetion and yeah. The crtbwas linked and ya twisted the shit out of the agreement and how gad and come and tell ya cut the shit out .
>Also ya do realize the users that agreed we're admins? Or at least content moderators.
Sorry meant "were". Autocorrect a pain. Although that should have been obvious mate.
Yeah? No shit man and joseph kars wham caesar have ftl reactions and combat speed?. Obviously for movement peak at hypersonic or ya get my point .
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That's a really stupid reason for Joseph to not be able to melt a vampire. Melting a vampire just requires a decent amount of hamon to enter their system. Pre-Joseph was even strong enough to split Santana in half with his hamon. Granted he was inside him, but pillar men are just as weak to hamon as vampires, only reason they don't die from hamon on contact is because of their biological absorbption. The reason why Straizo didn't die right away was PIS, so he could give exposition about the pillar men. If you are arguing pre-Joseph cannot kill a vampire with his hamon, you are very wrong.
I've looked back and I haven't seen any CRT. Are you going to link it to me and specifically point it out, or are you just going to keep saying "hurr it exists somewhere".
You are not a content moderator, regardless of what people have told you. And "were" makes it a gramatically incorrect sentence, I understood the first time.
No, Kars, Whamu and Joseph all have Hypersonic speeds with Massively FTL reactions. Check their profile.
I've looked back and I haven't seen any CRT. Are you going to link it to me and specifically point it out, or are you just going to keep saying "hurr it exists somewhere".
You are not a content moderator, regardless of what people have told you. And "were" makes it a gramatically incorrect sentence, I understood the first time.
No, Kars, Whamu and Joseph all have Hypersonic speeds with Massively FTL reactions. Check their profile.
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Dunno about skilled, he was smarter in the sense that he wasn't toying around with Joseph, but at the same time he's kind of ******** seeing as how he spammed the same move over and over allowing Joseph to exploit him.DMB 1 said:
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Straizo outright and directly stated to be litterally NOT as skilled as dio as far as vampuric power goes by his own admission.DMB 1 said:
Lord yeah no. Joseph had to use his hamon from WITHIN santana because his hamon was far weaker and couldnt penetrate the skin yet later after training could on pillar men obviously excluding the fact joseph OVERDRIVED from WITHIN despite a fat as that santana only got torn in half. Which by your own words would mean he cant even harm a vampire as a vampire and a pillar men are equally susceptible to hamon and just as weak. Reminder joseph hit santana point blank with hamon plenty. Which leaves him not even vaporizing straizo as his best feat. Which ya claim is pis because ya dont want to accept the fact his best feat is ass at the point of ore training meaning with a lack of feats that contradict the low hamon feat or statements that would put him at a decent fraction above ya cant make a claim as unfounded as the claim ta making now with a excuse of plot device.
Clearly ya didnt of course i could link it again for the second (maybe third) though at this point ya obviously arent paying attention .https://vsbattles.com/vsbattles/784596?useskin=oasis Here the scaling off dio was decided probay not usable here. So unless ya think dire or will is city block straizo cant exactly scale (excluding the fact straizo city block mostly because of me putting him at that tier while completely forgetting about the old crt. That was my bad so why are ya so decidely debating my mistake as correct).
Are? Are ya kidding? When in the bloody hell did I even hint at the fact ? Not once and uf so ya best point out where because at the momnt im thinking ya arent even reading half the shit that had been typed at all over multiple threads at that man.
Yeah? Reactions are short burst combat speed? Kars doing a full body motion and arm when deflecting light. Joseph and caesar jumping a laser. Wham and caesar monoluging at relavistic speeds. Etc. Kars ckearly able punch ya at ftl speeds .
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You're repeating arguments so I will too.
"Straizo did not say he didn't trai , he said he did not want to explore the limits of his abilities , and that he would find all that shit out later once he killed Joseph. This is not him acknowledging he is weaker, it's him acknowledging that he isn't as knowledgeable when it comes to the limits of his vampiric power. Therefore, it cannot be used as an argument as to why Dio is stronger than Straizo."
Joseph and Ceaser couldn't punch through the pillar men's skin because their hamon (and everyones in general) is not strong enough to break the pillar men skin. The reason Joseph was able to do so later was because he was taught that hamon is more powerful when concentrated into a point (fingers, elbows, knees, etc.), once he discovered that, (and increased his proficency to consistently generate hamon) he was able to succesfully punch through the skin. Straizo didn't die immediately because he needed to provide exposition to Joseph, regardless, whether it vaporized him or not, Straizo was clearly incapacitated from a single direct hamon punch. The same would happen to Dio in this fight.
Funny, you said in the discussion that Straizo scaling to Dio should probably not be usable, and you're acting like it was general consensus. It was not included in the final revisions, therefore the CRT is invalid. Straizo no longer scaling as City Block+ from Dire and Zeppeli is valid, since Dire and Zeppeli should have both been downgraded. However Straizo still remains at 8-B because of him scaling from Lisa Lisa, Joseph, and being at least somewhat similar to PB Dio. Therefore, Joseph has won against an 8-B Straizo before, he has a good chance of winning against an 8-B Dio.
"Reaction speed is the speed at which a character can react to an event or action. This usually only grants a short movement upon reaction, whereas several movements at the same speed switch it to combat speed."
Kars is not able to fight at FTL speeds, though should be able to do one FTL movement, which includes punch.
"Straizo did not say he didn't trai , he said he did not want to explore the limits of his abilities , and that he would find all that shit out later once he killed Joseph. This is not him acknowledging he is weaker, it's him acknowledging that he isn't as knowledgeable when it comes to the limits of his vampiric power. Therefore, it cannot be used as an argument as to why Dio is stronger than Straizo."
Joseph and Ceaser couldn't punch through the pillar men's skin because their hamon (and everyones in general) is not strong enough to break the pillar men skin. The reason Joseph was able to do so later was because he was taught that hamon is more powerful when concentrated into a point (fingers, elbows, knees, etc.), once he discovered that, (and increased his proficency to consistently generate hamon) he was able to succesfully punch through the skin. Straizo didn't die immediately because he needed to provide exposition to Joseph, regardless, whether it vaporized him or not, Straizo was clearly incapacitated from a single direct hamon punch. The same would happen to Dio in this fight.
Funny, you said in the discussion that Straizo scaling to Dio should probably not be usable, and you're acting like it was general consensus. It was not included in the final revisions, therefore the CRT is invalid. Straizo no longer scaling as City Block+ from Dire and Zeppeli is valid, since Dire and Zeppeli should have both been downgraded. However Straizo still remains at 8-B because of him scaling from Lisa Lisa, Joseph, and being at least somewhat similar to PB Dio. Therefore, Joseph has won against an 8-B Straizo before, he has a good chance of winning against an 8-B Dio.
"Reaction speed is the speed at which a character can react to an event or action. This usually only grants a short movement upon reaction, whereas several movements at the same speed switch it to combat speed."
Kars is not able to fight at FTL speeds, though should be able to do one FTL movement, which includes punch.
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Ya missed the point where doing exactly what straizo did not do multiplied dios power mate. And straizo with a hilarious lack of decent feats aint putting him any above.
Yeah no shit? He lacked power and skill among focus capabilities while lacking a way for damging the pillar men. And even when Joseph did point blank he couldnt even melt santana while doing that WITHIN Santana only dud minor damage (for pillar man standards ). . Also ya keep claiming pis yet what feats would joseph have which would prove your claim as ya keep claiming that yet joseph lacks feats that would support your claim. Its unfounded and headcanon that joseph could melt a vampire at will when the closest that joestar got was a minor wound on the only vampire he fought straizo and a quick healabke wound on a pillar . Also contact would end him and joseph would look exactly the way the dire did. A pile of dust on the floor.
It was though. The only thing keeping any scaling was the dire scaling BUT the fact will dire and straizo was equal and will himself claimed a casual dio was fuve times as powerful as him and Jonathan combined mostly debunks that. Also Lisa Lisa was three times as powerful as post caesar joseph. Lisa may have got training from straizo but holy shit was Lisa far above him according wog bio from the kars and wham fights .
And even if straizo was 8-B that would still let joseph and dio almost a 6-7 power multiplier between joestar and dio .
Straizo scales off joseph which scales off straizo which scales at phantom blood off will and will was five or ten at least multipliers quite weaker than a casual phantom dio at base. Meaning? Dio would shit all over joseph for power and straizo also.
Yeah except dio can move and fight at mftl while obviousky ultimate kars would be quite faster than dio at minimum.
Yeah no shit? He lacked power and skill among focus capabilities while lacking a way for damging the pillar men. And even when Joseph did point blank he couldnt even melt santana while doing that WITHIN Santana only dud minor damage (for pillar man standards ). . Also ya keep claiming pis yet what feats would joseph have which would prove your claim as ya keep claiming that yet joseph lacks feats that would support your claim. Its unfounded and headcanon that joseph could melt a vampire at will when the closest that joestar got was a minor wound on the only vampire he fought straizo and a quick healabke wound on a pillar . Also contact would end him and joseph would look exactly the way the dire did. A pile of dust on the floor.
It was though. The only thing keeping any scaling was the dire scaling BUT the fact will dire and straizo was equal and will himself claimed a casual dio was fuve times as powerful as him and Jonathan combined mostly debunks that. Also Lisa Lisa was three times as powerful as post caesar joseph. Lisa may have got training from straizo but holy shit was Lisa far above him according wog bio from the kars and wham fights .
And even if straizo was 8-B that would still let joseph and dio almost a 6-7 power multiplier between joestar and dio .
Straizo scales off joseph which scales off straizo which scales at phantom blood off will and will was five or ten at least multipliers quite weaker than a casual phantom dio at base. Meaning? Dio would shit all over joseph for power and straizo also.
Yeah except dio can move and fight at mftl while obviousky ultimate kars would be quite faster than dio at minimum.
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Yeah, Dio was just a random dude.
Straizo was a hamon master with a far, far better physique than Dio.
Straizo was a hamon master with a far, far better physique than Dio.
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And? (Excluding the fact dio actually had a better physique. Being a 6'5 almost as muscled man encroaching on jonathan would probably do that).RapidMotorcycle19 said:
Also dio training while getting more powerful was claimed. He amped himself a few times over from the fire at the early ohantom blood .
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Everytime I read what you have to say, I feel like I'm having a stroke.
Give me a bit to debunk your arguments, again.
Give me a bit to debunk your arguments, again.
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Mate if ya claim that joseph can melt a vampire when he had zero feats that would even hint at that then cut the shit and dont. You're claiming a thing he cant and not once had proved he could while proving the opposite. Also i suggest picking up the manga. Straizo cant even come close to lisa and lisa was three times that then the post training joseph.
The five times more powerful quote cane from an equal with dire and straizo after experiencing a casual dio. Speedwagon aka exposistion claimed a multiplier for dio after the fire meaning dio amped himself. Meaning fresh dio was far weaker than current dio and the only way dio would have gotten more powerful may have been from training. Which dio explicitky had performed over a few days to weeks after want had warned him of jonathan from a nanga only scene.
The five times more powerful quote cane from an equal with dire and straizo after experiencing a casual dio. Speedwagon aka exposistion claimed a multiplier for dio after the fire meaning dio amped himself. Meaning fresh dio was far weaker than current dio and the only way dio would have gotten more powerful may have been from training. Which dio explicitky had performed over a few days to weeks after want had warned him of jonathan from a nanga only scene.
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A far more experienced jonathan lacked the ability of melting even zombies with anything excluding a overdrive.
A weaker far less focused joseph cant lord and claiming he can when no feats would exist. Ya actually CANT do that. His best deals ya claim are pis or exclude the fact he litterally had do that from within. Whike the feats also dont even come close to what ya claimed would come to pass from joseph (vaporization).
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Yeah, voting Joseph.
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