Jericho Swain vs Utsuho Reiuji

[WeeklyBattles]

A Demon Raven vs a Hell Raven, the Grand General of Noxus vs the Regulator of the Hell of Blazing Fires. In character, no prior knowledge or prep time, Swain is at full power, both have all of their equipment, victory by KO, death, or incapacitation. Who wins?

 

[Yamatohime]

Swain can compete with Chernobyl-chan... But there is one problem. As far as I remember his Raven form is not as powerful as his real form.

 

[ThePerpetual]

Swain and Utsuho have basically the same stats across the board, but Swain has three advantages over his opponent: He seems to be far more intelligent and cunning, he has a wider array of powers to select from, and has the ability to restore his life force with Ravenous Flock and the like. Quite the close fight, but I'd have to give it to Swain.

 

[Yamatohime]

Well, my vote is inconclusive since Chernobyl-chan is always airborne while Swain need to transform to fly (and I can't find any evidence that his AP is the same during transformation).

 

[ThePerpetual]

It's an improvement to his power, of course it's the same. Even if that were a problem, he could, you know, just untransform and go without, he doesn't really need flight when his opponent's range is so poor. (Only several meters? Something sounds off about that.)

 

[Yamatohime]

It's an improvement to his power, of course it's the same. Even if that were a problem, he could, you know, just untransform and go without, he doesn't really need flight when his opponent's range is so poor. (Only several meters? Something sounds off about that.)

Several meters is the size of her artifical suns.

 

[Czuczian11]

During transformation Sawin posses all abilities and powers that he have without it, so i guess he cannot lose any power in raven form.

 

[WeeklyBattles]

Bump

 

[Pocket-Chu]

I vote for Swain cause he's one of the best mid champs ever! he's also a pretty damn good support.

As for the actual reason....it's pretty much what Perpet had to said.

 

[Aurugermil]

Quite agreed with ThePerpetual.

 

[Alice_Liddel_in_WikiLand]

As others said. Swain has the big advantage of his intelligence. Which is for me the reason he wins. In the old lore he was basically unbeatable on the battlefield not because of his power but because of his intellect. I think there was even a quote where it was stated that he never lose a single battle.

 

[Ciruno_Fortes_(COB)]

Both gets killed by Town-Levelling Dart from Teemo :^ )

Anyway intelligence, how would that exactly help? It's not as if either are given prep-time before hand and no tactic would be effective against such an character who's entire motto is nuke everything and destroy the surface.

And can't Okuu just fly up the sky and nuke everything repeatedly? There's also the issue with nuclear radiation and fallout that none of the League Champs have dealt with before. Compared to current League Champs, I can't compare Nuclear Energy with anything. Or maybe I'm just being suspicious since a Laser Beam that barely took out a pile of rocks was enough to harm Swain. *shrug*

 

[ThePerpetual]

Or maybe I'm just being suspicious since a Laser Beam that barely took out a pile of rocks was enough to harm Swain. *shrug*

Actually, he sort of walked that off like it was nothing after a second or two, if you'll recall. Also, that depicted Base Swain, which is currently listed as only Country level.

 

[Ciruno_Fortes_(COB)]

Remember his apparent teleporation ability? Could've used that considering he was standing several meters from where he was earlier. And even then the ability was a miss.

Anyway what's stopping Okuu frum nuking everything down from high heaven? Magic and typical poison is different from radiation so that's going to be a hassle. And Country level Lux then huh. Good thing she wasn't using it full force otherwise that would've wiped out the map.

 

[ThePerpetual]

Well, we're not really sure she successfully damaged him even, he just got blown away right as he was about to wreck Jarvan, and when he's visible again he looks irritated.

 

[Ciruno_Fortes_(COB)]

And we're not sure she fully reached him with that attack. Since if he does have Speed of Light Reactions that shouldn't have touched him.

And I find it doubtful that he has any SoL attacks and any ranged attack he may possess can be overwhelmed by pure energy or gravity. Okuu can do it danmaku style and play keep away and dodge everything else.

Call me doubtful but I think the girls with the sun could take this over the guy whose word is the bird and energy bolts.

And you guys still kept the Galaxy Rumble scaling? That was a skin. Wasn't it deduced that Skins are technically non-canon? Or at least Alternate Canon? And would Lux's Final Spark really show light speed reactions when it shows a marker first before anyone else could react? It's like aim dodging

Edit - Also... Has Swain actually flew? Because I don't remember him doing that. Ever

 

[Alice_Liddel_in_WikiLand]

Is the Swain profile using old canon information?

 

[Ciruno_Fortes_(COB)]

I want to argue that actually. He scales off of scaling to Lissandra and Brand despite canonically never meting them. He might be considered 'powerful' but that could also be based on his influence and how he controls an army. Hell a lot of League of Legends Characters can rely on over scaling, not as bad as before though

But I remember Lissandra and Brand being capable of freezing/burning continents... IF given time

And League champions getting relativistic feats have always been questionable. I should've said something when they were being revised but I don't have a say in the situation if I'm not avaialble

 

[Alice_Liddel_in_WikiLand]

Aurelion Sol considers Bard his equal. Nobody apart from Aurelion himself gets called from Bard.

 

[Ciruno_Fortes_(COB)]

Not referring to him. Strictly referring to the Multi-Continental scaling that seems to affect too many people

 

[Ciruno_Fortes_(COB)]

So can we nerf some champions that aren't deserving of Multi-Continental level buffs? We have a lot of players reporting them for being too unfair, carrying games too much, and lots of afkers

Basically, can we fix the issue with Brand and Lissandra?

 

[Andykhang]

Let see... Dura wise, not only can she (stated in here) have Multi-Continent, but her Youkai nature ensure her to regenerate pretty quickly (she's a hell raven eating a servant of heaven, that's pretty high rank for a youkai), and unless he know her weakness first-hand, he's not going to strike for mental damage for a while, which probably isn't going to do any good either (from Hell, remember? Though he could easily outsmart her, since you don't really need to be a genius to know that she's an idiot)

As for attack... yeah, even if he could avoid the many "fireball" Okuu could throw out. If he doesn't know the power before hand, there's no way he could escape the radiation from those sun alive. (It could be prevented by magic, as even Marisa demonstrate it when fighting her, though it could just be that Okuu restraining the power so that it doesn't emit deadly radiation, but Okuu is Okuu.)

 

[Ciruno_Fortes_(COB)]

There's also the issue about having a more versatile powerset isn't really useful against overwhelming power and that his lifesteal ravens could be eradicated by said nuclear power.

People are smarter than Okuu, but it doesn't save them from being eradicated.

And still siding with Okuu since Swain has yet to show any direct feats of pure raw power instead of relying on tricks. And that won't be useful against AOE miniature suns

 

[Andykhang]

^Yeah, the only way for him to win is to not fighting, and maybe trick her into a game of chess... or danmaku

 

[Ciruno_Fortes_(COB)]

Bump

 

[Andykhang]

Vote:

Jerico:5 (ThePerpeptual, Czuczian11,Pocket-Chu,Aurugermil,Alice Liddel in WikiLand)

Okuu:2 (Me, COB)

Inconclusive: 1 (Yamatohime)


Only do this because I'm out of opinion

 

[Aparajita]

Swain.

 

[Ciruno_Fortes_(COB)]

Didn't I just counter all the arguments for Swain above?....

Not to mention argued the unnecessary scaling and how even with that Okuu still triumphs via radiation and overwhelming AOE? At least put out an argument instead of a one line vote.

 

[Aparajita]

Okay. Fine. I see that Swain has handled enemies with atomic destruction before in the League, as he's one of the best champions in the League and has fought many victorious battles.

I don't know how much experience Utsuho has, but i'm going to assume it's not as much as a military leader of a military, war-driven country, where only "Strength" determines your station, where Swaim rules them all.

I don't see how she's going to defeat him when his expert Regenerationn in Raven Form literally does the exact opposite that her abilities do, let alone his ability / item based healing.

Furthermore, all the opinions that ThePerputual put are reasons why i saw Swain.

 

[Aparajita]

Anyway what's stopping Okuu frum nuking everything down from high heaven? Magic and typical poison is different from radiation so that's going to be a hassle. And Country level Lux then huh. Good thing she wasn't using it full force otherwise that would've wiped out the map.

Also, please understand, every time opponenets fight in the League of Legends, they are dampened by the League itself.

The League is supposed to be where Countries can fight out their issues and not destroy the world, because there *are* things capable of destroying the world and easily in LoL.

 

[Andykhang]

Also, please understand, every time opponenets fight in the League of Legends, they are dampened by the League itself.

The League is supposed to be where Countries can fight out their issues and not destroy the world, because there *are* things capable of destroying the world and easily in LoL.

Okuu's also played by the rule (Even though she's an idiot), so you can't exactly said what she showed is all she have, and she definitively could destroy the world (or at least burn the surface) just by her being there "playing" around.

 

[Ciruno_Fortes_(COB)]

With that kind of logic Teemo could tank stars exploding. They have never fully interacted in outside combat before in terms of molecular haxx and once again Swain shows himself to be one of the strategists and thinkers of the place. Even if you argue that, when they don't restricted and equalized by the league of legends you end up with what you see on the trailers and cinematics which are fairly unimpressive but decent. And don't pull that nerf card on me. That's the highly likely reason for them being equalized.

Experience is great but Swain has never dealt with nukes before and I countered your statement above with the fact that no one in Noxus has country level feats and beating the people of country one by one to show your might =/= country DC. Further more the one he did fought as a final enemy? He had to rely on tricks and was fairly unimpressive

She defeats Raven form by nuking all the birds Swain sends out unless they're arguably Continental which is to be honest, one of the most ridiculous use of scaling abuse I've seen. And what item based healing? And in game and in lore you need minions or an enemy team to life steal from. And again, vulnerable birds! Just because you can't harm then in game doesn't mean they're invulnerable

Countered

I agree. Which is why I can't really imagine that's the right way of tanking nuclear power or sub-atomic destruction. Fun fact, Touhou does that too with spellcard rules. Only this time they're more vague and all of them barely even tries or puts out their effort

Okuu can definitely destroy the world alongside many others. She had a direct showing of that feat. Meanwhile Swain relies on Lissandra and Brand whom he never fought!! And I'm quite sure I countered all of the above.

I know League of Legends. I love that game. I know. However some feats are just not right here. And due to inactivity and how things are different now... well Swain isn't even Relativistic anymore. He stands no chance against Okuu whatsoever.