Hoopa vs Janempa: Battle of the Djinns....Sorta

[Keeweed]

Because it comes from his reality warping. Its the same as his portal creation (for what I’m trying to refer to I think there is a gif of it on Janemba’s page). Edit: Rewatching the gif, I explain it slightly wrong, but not in a way that matters much to my point. I just need to reword it.

 

[Garchomp777]

It isn't from reality warping its just teleporting

 

[Keeweed]

Teleportation has a cause that isn’t just sheer teleport. Last I checked most teleportation is just limited spatial manipulation. As shown with his portal creation he does it with his reality warping, and his teleport works the same. Though personal I’m not sure if I’m properly explaining it. I need to work soon for a few hours so I’ll be back later.

 

[Arcker123]

Bumps.

 

[Keeweed]

I’m eating with my dad right now, afterwards I’ll say why I think Janemba wins even if his teleportation doesn’t have 4km range (though I believe it should have enough range to cover SBA)

 

[Keeweed]

Ok so first off both of these characters are MFTL+ so they are going to cover 4 km in less than a second. So the distance is going to become moot really fast. Not it’s up to what Hoopa does in the second or two he has until Janemba reaches him (assuming Janemba really can’t just teleport right too him). Since we’ve actually seen Hoopa go for BFR I’m assuming that’s what he do here, but his BFR requires portals. Which Janemba can teleport out of. Both can BFR each other’s attacks, but I don’t think either make portals large enough to block their attacks. Hoopa could block some ki blast, but the dimension swords attack is hundreds of feet tall or wide. If Janemba gets even a single hit in he wins and once he gets in range (assuming he doesn’t start in range) he can teleport spam.

If Hoopa opens with mind manipulation he could win, but if he goes for anything else Janemba can close the distance in one way or another and even the slightest poke completely wrecks Hoopa. Since we don’t really know how Hoopa fights, and what we were shown was BFR. I find it very likely Janemba dodges the BFR with teleportation and can either overwhelm Hoopa with the dimension sword or teleport right next to Hoopa for the one shot while within range.

 

[Ned_the_outer_god]

Actually, the dimension sword might be a bad thing since if it uses anything ranged, Hoopa can just Uno reverse card it with his rings (like he did with Kyogre and Groudon)

 

[Garchomp777]

Hoopa would start with mindhax since its a psychic type

 

[Ned_the_outer_god]

He never used Mind hax on his opponents, like ever. And what makes you think every psychic type starts with mind hax?

 

[Garchomp777]

The hoopa in the movie didnt have all the moves, in this battle he has all moves also pokemon usually start with same type attacks. He could probably start with it, but usually summoning

 

[Ned_the_outer_god]

Actually, in combat, he used BFR and attack reflection

 

[Keeweed]

Actually, the dimension sword might be a bad thing since if it uses anything ranged, Hoopa can just Uno reverse card it with his rings (like he did with Kyogre and Groudon)

The dimension swords swipe would be larger or longer than Hoopa’s portal. Also Janemba can also BFR attacks and he has high-mid regen so he can easily tank his own attack.

 

[Garchomp777]

Change my vote to janemba FRA
If only if the pokemon profiles weren't downplayed then i could argue hoopa solos lol

 

[Keeweed]

Hoopa’s problem sheerly comes from how messy his character is. We’ve seen him fight, but it’s either when he’s evil, or when he was messing around badly. If you throw someone like Mewtwo against Janemba I would definitely lean towards Mewtwo (though Janemba’s ap advantage over Pokémon’s 3-C is always going to be monstrous and I believe Mewtwo leads with tk for the first attack).

 

[Garchomp777]

Even Gastly or Drowzee with speed equal would have a far higher chance of beating janemba or vegito or broly than Hoopa lol

 

[ProfessorKukui4Life]

About Hoopa and his rings, what would actually just stop Hoopa from pulling Janempa through his rings from where he is?

Hoopa’s problem sheerly comes from how messy his character is. We’ve seen him fight, but it’s either when he’s evil, or when he was messing around badly. If you throw someone like Mewtwo against Janemba I would definitely lean towards Mewtwo (though Janemba’s ap advantage over Pokémon’s 3-C is always going to be monstrous and I believe Mewtwo leads with tk for the first attack).

^This kinda.

Most of Hoopa's portrayal comes from a false clone of him that's specifically a berserker more than anything else, while we've seen very little of True Hoopa who's character is kinda up in the air.

Hence why, for instance, Hoopa not mind haxing opponents. Outside of the Prison Bottle anyway.

 

[Garchomp777]

I think hoopa has some fights in the arcade game storyline, I'll see how he fights

 

[Keeweed]

“About Hoopa and his rings, what would actually just stop Hoopa from pulling Janempa through his rings from where he is?” Janemba’s own teleportation and flight. If he’s getting pulled through a ring he’s going to teleport, he teleports to dodge attacks all the time throughout the movie.

 

[Garchomp777]

He can grab janemba while he's teleporting since he takes time to TP

Does hoopa have enhanced senses or extrasensory perception in the profile? He could tell how strong janemba is and mindhax him instead

 

[Keeweed]

Base beginning series Goku has class G lifting strength. Janemba slightly upscales from ss3 Goku. He’s going to break out of the hold literally instantly. Also Janemba becomes so small that you can’t even see him while he deconstructs himself, Hoopa isn’t going to be able to properly grab him at all.

“Does hoopa have enhanced senses or extrasensory perception in the profile?”

Neither of those powers tell you how strong someone is. That would be information analysis.

 

[Garchomp777]

Hoopa literally grabs higher dimensional concepts into his rings idk why its not in the profile

 

[Keeweed]

I was just watched the movie (some of it anyways), and while any part of Janemba that is already through the portal is definitely going to stay there, Janemba deconstructs himself to teleport. So most of him should be able to escape it and he can just heal any limps he lost.

Dialga and Palkia can’t just separate themselves apart last I checked so there’s a reason once their in the portals they would be stuck.

 

[ProfessorKukui4Life]

“About Hoopa and his rings, what would actually just stop Hoopa from pulling Janempa through his rings from where he is?” Janemba’s own teleportation and flight. If he’s getting pulled through a ring he’s going to teleport, he teleports to dodge attacks all the time throughout the movie.

The problem moreso though is that Hoopa's rings have the freaky effect of being able to appear from anywhere he wants to summon them.

Plus, would Janempa know beforehand that Hoopa's Rings would do this?

 

[Valiant_Abyss]

Non-canon demon antagonist FRA.

 

[Keeweed]

The problem moreso though is that Hoopa's rings have the freaky effect of being able to appear from anywhere he wants to summon them.

Plus, would Janempa know beforehand that Hoopa's Rings would do this?

I know they can appear anywhere, but if the scenes of the movie I watched are any indication they either don’t start being on instantly or can take time to suck you through. I remember one time it did work instantly, but Janemba can stop and change directions on a dime. As long as he didn’t shove his head through it, he should be able to escape.

regigigas seemed to understand what was happening practically as soon as the portal starting bfring him, so if Janemba starts getting dragged through the portal that’s a pretty good reason for him to deconstruct himself to dodge. Plus Hoopa immediately going for the BFR assumes Janemba is just flying straight towards him without attacking. With the dimension sword Janemba likes to constantly attack with it, so Hoopa also has to deal with the spatial slashes along with Janemba himself. Hoopa can definitely make multiple portals at a time so he’s not just a sitting duck, but he is going to be slightly distracted, and a single hit kills him here.

Finally Janemba can return from BFR if he sent anywhere on the planet, Hoopa has the range to BFR him somewhere he couldn’t return from, but Hoopa doesn’t immediately do that.

 

[ProfessorKukui4Life]

I see. And what does Janempa typically lead with?

We've all been so caught up on trying to figure out Hoopa's fighting style that we haven't dived much into what Janempa would do first. Unless I missed that somewhere in here.

 

[Keeweed]

Janemba with the dimension sword (since it is standard equipment I believe he has it he) he most constantly spatial slashes with it. He also spams teleportation, but he doesn’t do it offensively as much when he has the sword (though let me go rewatch some of the movie. In the fight against ss3 wants he gets the sword he doesn’t offensively teleport much, but it’s been a while since I’ve seen some of the other fight scenes). He still teleports and deconstructs himself defensively even with the sword.

 

[Keeweed]

I just rewatched some of the movie and now I know why I didn’t remember Janemba using the sword much after the ss3 fight. The sword just randomly broke soon after. So Janemba won’t have the sword for that long, which can be good and bad for Hoopa. Good because that’s swords attack is hundreds of feet tall so his portals can fail to properly block the attack, and Janemba likes to send out tons of those attacks in quick succession when he has the sword. But it could be bad because Janemba completely spams teleportation offensively when he lacks the sword.

 

[OwenVaunman]

Wait, do you think Hoopa would be able to stumble upon this, or even would? "Janemba takes physical damage from being insulted"

 

[Keeweed]

Pikkon tried to use that weakness against Janemba. It ended with Pikkon getting stomped, it’s a minor inconvenience at best. Janemba healed from the injuries seconds after he received them.

 

[Garchomp777]

Wait, do you think Hoopa would be able to stumble upon this, or even would? "Janemba takes physical damage from being insulted"

He actually would in character but no one is gonna use a portal to get to someone and throw insults at them. One shot of janemba is gonna slice hoopa in half

 

[theultimate5105]

Its either Hoopa 4-D Mindhaxes or 2-A BFRs or he gets one shotted

 

[Ned_the_outer_god]

Hoopa never used mind hax on anyone as far as I know, and it was on the summons (which was shadow hoopa actually, but that's where I think the mind hax comes from). He's never BFRed anyone across the universe, only to different parts of the planet, he could do it though

 

[LephyrTheRevanchist]

Janemba fra

 

[Waka1979]

Can someone briefly summarize the arguments for each character?

 

[Keeweed]

Hoopa’s win conditions are bfring Janemba very far away or mind manipulating him. We don’t know how often he’ll use mind manipulation, but we do know he uses BFR. Though he doesn’t BFR off planet at first, so Janemba may return if he gets bfr’d once.

Janemba’s win conditions are his massive ap, and teleportation to counter or at least keep up with Hoopa’s teleportation and BFR.

 

[Waka1979]

Hoopa’s win conditions are bfring Janemba very far away or mind manipulating him. We don’t know how often he’ll use mind manipulation, but we do know he uses BFR. Though he doesn’t BFR off planet at first, so Janemba may return if he gets bfr’d once.

Janemba’s win conditions are his massive ap, and teleportation to counter or at least keep up with Hoopa’s teleportation and BFR.

Thank you.
I'll go with Janemba then.

 

[SamanPatou]

I vote Janemba, he can counter the BFR (or at least return, in some cases) and reply with any attack which would oneshot Hoopa.

 

[Lord_JJJ]

Janemba FRA

 

[Ned_the_outer_god]

Janemba FRA. Not a stomp, but a decisive win