HELLSING - General Discussion

[Ruby_R_Dracula]

It isn't about levels of release from what we see. Alucard is shown struggling against Anderson in his Vlad form, then reverts to Red Coat to fight him. Later Red Coat fights Monster Anderson and gets completely overwhelmed. Then he changes to Straitjacket and overwhelms Anderson. All of this happened while he was at Level 0, and yet the forms clearly display different strength levels, so it's clearly the form that makes him stronger, not the levels.

And no, Seras should compare to Anderson, who was stronger than Red Coat, but Straitjacket was stronger than Anderson.

so what I'm getting at is

Straitjacket Alucard > MOG Anderson = True Vampire Seras > Red Coat Alucard = Alexander Anderson

 

[Phsccarvalho]

Man, I hate how Hellsing keeps everything short.

All the cool moments in Hellsing are short.

 

[Random-Helper323]

so what I'm getting at is

Straitjacket Alucard > MOG Anderson = True Vampire Seras > Red Coat Alucard = Alexander Anderson

That sounds reasonable. We can also place Walter higher than Straitjacket in sheer power. Girly card is also shown to be pretty much equal to Red Coat. I think his forms in general are comparable except Straitjacket which is stronger and clearly represents Alucard's true vampiric self, and Vlad which represents his humanity and regrets, hence its weakness.

 

[Ruby_R_Dracula]

That sounds reasonable. We can also place Walter higher than Straitjacket in sheer power. Girly card is also shown to be pretty much equal to Red Coat. I think his forms in general are comparable except Straitjacket which is stronger and clearly represents Alucard's true vampiric self, and Vlad which represents his humanity and regrets, hence its weakness.

ok.. hmm if The True Vampire Seras feats do infact become 8-B

If the Seras vs Captain feat ends up actually getting 8-B what will happen to the High 8-C calc

if we follow that scaling chain

Only Straitjacket, MOG Anderson, Seras (also ig the captain since both him and Seras fought) and Walter would scale to 8-B, with Walter and Alucard Upscaling,

while Red Coat, Rip Van Winkle's Bullets, Alhambra's Cards, Luke Valentine's Weapons (Unless Luke has a Feat of him harming Alucard on his own), and Anderson would scale to the High 8-C Feat since that was Preformed by Red Coat Alucard


does this sound good?

 

[Random-Helper323]

Man, I hate how Hellsing keeps everything short.

All the cool moments in Hellsing are short.

Sadly, Hellsing is set in a world that is ripe for exploring. Vampires exist and are capable of immense harm, but apparently only England and Italy have means to fight them, so if a vampire just goes to Asia he's already won.

Obviously that can't be true. We know the US repels the Millennium attack on them, and it's obvious that a world with such creatures would have agencies dedicated to dealing with them all over the world. We could have seen an American agency dedicated to vampire fighting with modern weapons and expensive research and development, a Japanese or Chinese force using Buddhist means to face them, and more.

Technically Integra committed an international offense when she ordered Alucard to massacre Rio's police force, and apparently no-one cares. The world has far too narrow of a scope, because it's really about war and is fixated on the European part of WWII. So the world almost feels less than half full.

 

[Random-Helper323]

ok.. hmm if The True Vampire Seras feats do infact become 8-B

if we follow that scaling chain

Only Straitjacket, MOG Anderson, Seras (also ig the captain since both him and Seras fought) and Walter would scale to 8-B, with Walter and Alucard Upscaling,

while Red Coat, Rip Van Winkle's Bullets, Alhambra's Cards, Luke Valentine's Weapons (Unless Luke has a Feat of him harming Alucard on his own), and Anderson would scale to the High 8-C Feat since that was Preformed by Red Coat Alucard


does this sound good?

Alucard briefly changed to Straitjacket to do the SR-71 feat, didn't he?

For scaling, a feat by Seras would scale like this.

Dark Walter > Straitjacket Alucard > MoG Anderson ~= True Vampire Seras ~= Captain > Red Coat Alucard ~=Base Anderson

So in short, yes. Seras' feat scales to Captain and Monster Anderson and Straitjacket Alucard upscales, while Dark Walter upscales from him in turn.

 

[Ruby_R_Dracula]

Alucard briefly changed to Straitjacket to do the SR-71 feat, didn't he?

I checked and uh no, the first panel we see him in after the crash was him in his red coat

 

[Random-Helper323]

I checked and uh no, the first panel we see him in after the crash was him in his red coat

I meant before the crash, we see him change to Straitjacket while he's in the air, when he rears up on the plane. He's changed back next time we see him.

 

[Ruby_R_Dracula]

I checked and uh no, the first panel we see him in after the crash was him in his red coat

you must be confusing it with the moment he did turn into straitjacket, but he did that a few pages after he did the feat

 

[Random-Helper323]

This is important. If the feat is Straitjacket, then it doesn't scale to Rip or Tubalcain, only to Seras, Walter, Captain and Monster Anderson. If it was Red Coat however it also scales to Rip, Tubalcain, Luke and base Anderson.

 

[Ruby_R_Dracula]

so which one is it
straightjacket or red coat

decided to take another and uh oh ****, yeah Straitjacket... oof

 

[Ruby_R_Dracula]

yep, we need another feat for Red Coat, or else we getting 9-B Red Coat Alucard

 

[Random-Helper323]

9-B is a bit too low, I think. Also the Jackal was able to slightly harm Monster Anderson, so it downscales.

 

[Ruby_R_Dracula]

9-B is a bit too low, I think. Also the Jackal was able to slightly harm Monster Anderson, so it downscales.

would that just scale to the weapon then?

 

[Random-Helper323]

Something I do think needs to be done is clarifying Alucard's power buffs. Most people think it's the levels as you naturally would, so we should probably clarify in the pages that it's clearly the forms.

 

[Random-Helper323]

would that just scale to the weapon then?

Yes. Everyone shot with it either gets wrecked or practically tanks it, unless Tubalcain stands up to the Jackal during his fight with Alucard.

 

[Ruby_R_Dracula]

Grahh went thru Respect threads
Here's what I got.
Shooting The Captain's Hand off with a gun - Scales to Weapon

Pierces through The Priest with his Hand - Wall level if we crossscaling Him with other vampires we've seen

Clashing with Anderson

Punched Walter as Lolicard (However Walter has already regressed when he was punched so idk if we could scale that to Him stomping Straitjacket earlier)

Appearing Unharmed from Alhambra's Explosive Cards

 

[Random-Helper323]

We can probably measure Alhambra's cards, but for scaling, Straitjacket basically toys with Alhambra, and easily tears through him. The moment Straitjacket comes out all enemies crumble under the form's strikes except Dark Walter.

We do have one thing. Seras was unable to fully stop Anderson's blade (keep in mind it was burning her too and he clearly had more leverage than her) but when Alucard in his Red Coat form grabbed the blade they stopped it together.

This might result in some significant downscale from Seras for Red Coat, since he could have done that with only a tenth of her power since she was already doing most of the work, but it doesn't fit with him being 9-B.

 

[Ruby_R_Dracula]

Does anyone know if Alucard performed that mist creation feat through telekinesis or just weather control

probably weather control.

tho calcing the KE of the ship he's controling with Telekinesis could give give results

 

[Ruby_R_Dracula]

if UES gets re-accepted will he scale to it physically?

probably not, it seems weird to scale Telekinetic abilities to dura and physical ap because of a BLOOD ues.

 

[Robo432343]

probably not, it seems weird to scale Telekinetic abilities to dura and physical ap because of a BLOOD ues.

i mean

For scaling, we have the existing universal energy system, but specifically for telekinesis, Tubalcain was shown to move his cards telekinetically to attack, and those attacks were comparable to his physical attacks. Rip Van Winkle also attacked by moving her bullet telekinetically, and Alucard overwhelmed that telekinesis by catching the bullet in his teeth, and then afterwards he punched her and she was able to survive the punch.



All these powers come from a common power source, namely blood, with the same power source powering the physicals and the other powers as well, and Tubalcain and Rip are both lesser copies of Alucard, so these powers all fall under the same category of vampiric powers, which Alucard is literally the original creator of.


Therefore TK would scale to one's physicals in Hellsing, with TK simply offering more range and area of effect.

 

[Ruby_R_Dracula]

erm uh Guidebook stated that Rip Van Winkle's Bullet to be "Magic" and that they change trajectory on will...

 

[Ruby_R_Dracula]

《魔弾》

狙った獲物をどこまでも追い、

自在に軌道を変えて必ず的中する「魔弾」。逃れることは決してできない。

Magic Bullet

The Magic Bullet will pursue its target wherever it goes,

changing its trajectory at will to ensure it hits its target without fail. It cannot escape

 

[Ruby_R_Dracula]

why does it being magic mean it can't be done via telekinesis?

man idrk, I'm not really the person to argue this faulty UES with(nor is type that argues or debates at all), Phsccarvalho is probably better to argue this with, but I don't wanna drag em into this

 

[Ruby_R_Dracula]

btw why were we talking about 9-B red coat Alucard when we have 9-A stuff

9-A stuff is due to True Vampire Seras, which uh... maybe check the scaling chain that was uh I think on this thread or the High 8-C thread

 

[Ruby_R_Dracula]

isn't base Alucard stronger or at least equal to true vampire Seras?

idk ask random helper

It isn't about levels of release from what we see. Alucard is shown struggling against Anderson in his Vlad form, then reverts to Red Coat to fight him. Later Red Coat fights Monster Anderson and gets completely overwhelmed. Then he changes to Straitjacket and overwhelms Anderson. All of this happened while he was at Level 0, and yet the forms clearly display different strength levels, so it's clearly the form that makes him stronger, not the levels.

And no, Seras should compare to Anderson, who was stronger than Red Coat, but Straitjacket was stronger than Anderson

 

[Chariot190]

i didnt get pinged for a whole page and a half...

 

[Ruby_R_Dracula]

i didnt get pinged for a whole page and a half...

happens to me sometimes

 

[Chariot190]

chariot whats your opinion on blood being a UES

What's my opinion on Stand Energy, a far more fleshed out and elaborate energy system being a UES.
And if so, why don't I talk about like, High 3-A Star Platinum or High 3-A Justice, or even just 7-A to 6-C Plat.

Best I can give ya is mana pool-type slop I fear

 

[Ruby_R_Dracula]

smoking is bad

 

[Ruby_R_Dracula]

they should just scale to High 3-A physically

 

[Chariot190]

Uhm, BTD can blow up time and stuff but only has a B in power yet Plat is stated to be the strongest Stand in history and number 1 in power Post-BTD's inception, so even tho the B is talking about the actual mini Killer Queen's strength and not the blatant hax shit I feel like that's enough evidence to make Plat a uni buster coupled with the statements of being number 1.
This is supported by Justice's ability taking about the same amount of Stand power to control thousands as it does to stop time, and Plat > Justice's ability physically so like, that supports time-scale strength Plat.
Even at worst Plat is stated more powerful than Heavy Weather who can destroy the ozone and definitely not because he just has weather powers on a large scale and stated most powerful in Part 3 so we can scale above the Sun even tho The Sun's actual offensive ability is like puny ass 9-B beams.

 

[Robo432343]

Do we need to find new feats for Tubalcain and Rip? Because they don't scale to the High 8-C calc

 

[Random-Helper323]

isn't base Alucard stronger or at least equal to true vampire Seras?

Red Coat was evenly matched with base Anderson (probably stronger really), but basically useless against Monster Anderson. True Vampire Seras was comparable to Monster Anderson.

So no, Red Coat would not be as physically powerful as Seras. We even see Red Coat being overwhelmed by Tubalcain only for Straitjacket to come out and fold Tubalcain like a newspaper. The gap between the forms is pretty significant.

 

[Ruby_R_Dracula]

hold on
Tubalcain and Rip were both able to wound Anderson

but it was a weakened Anderson it looks like

Went and checked the chapter myself, indeed, that's regular Anderson which doesn't scale to the High 8-C.

 

[Robo432343]

ig we'll just have to use the feat of Rip tearing through helicopters with a single bullet
i think thats 9-A

 

[Ruby_R_Dracula]

ig we'll just have to use the feat of Rip tearing through helicopters with a single bullet
i think thats 9-A

depends on the type of helicopter, but I'm pretty sure we don't have that type on the wiki, so this probably needs a calc

 

[Ruby_R_Dracula]

Rip vs Tubalcain who do you guys think got it

let's see, Tubalcain has Explosive, and Regen negging Cards, while Rip has Bullets that can change trajectory towards their target


Prob Tubalcain since his has more variety

 

[XSOULOFCINDERX]

I'll give the Dandy Man this much, his card strike against Straightjacket Alucard didn't immediately get obliterated in contact, they clashed for like a solid five seconds before Alucard tore through it and his arm. Bro definitely upscales Base Alucard just off of that alone since there's a stomp gap between the two forms.

 

[Ruby_R_Dracula]

his card strike against Straightjacket Alucard didn't immediately get obliterated in contact, they clashed for like a solid five seconds before Alucard tore through it and his arm.

wdym lol
Alucard immediately tore thru Alhambra the moment they made contact