Harry and Marv vs Bob and Buck. Battle of the robber duos

[Frieza_force_soldier_100]

Harry and Marv have heard about the Twins and the items they have stolen. Harry suggested stealing from them. Marv was sent to check if the Twins were home at the time. The idiot failed to do a proper search, which led to him and Harry breaking in while the brothers were still home. Harry and Marv now have to deal with Bob and Buck.

Harry and Marv both have crowbars but not a gun. Bob has his mallet and Buck has his stun baton. Victory condition for Harry and Marv is incapacitating the Twins by breaking their limbs and tying them up. Victory conditions for Bob and Buck are killing the Wet/Sticky Bandits or incapacitating them so they can eat them later. Harry and Marv cannot permanently kill Bob and Buck due to their resurrective immortality, but they could still disable them. This is Extreme Mode for the Twins, so they are faster.

Note: Bob and Buck are stronger and faster, in addition to having the AP advantage with their weapons. Their resurrective immortality may also give them a bit of help if Harry and Marv kill them (either by accident or otherwise) while not knowing about it, which could work at least once before Harry and Marv decide to try beating them without killing them and activating it. On the other hand, Harry and Marv are much more durable and have far more stamina. The crowbars would also provide slightly better range, and Marv's resistance to electricity means that he would only be mildly bothered by Buck's baton. Intelligence is a 50/50, as Bob should be by far the dumbest of the four (as dumb as Marv is, I doubt even he would be foolish enough to drink coffee without noticing or questioning why it has suddenly turned a disgusting and rancid green color), yet Buck could build a plasma rifle and explosive laser traps, which are things that could never be created in real life and fall into science fiction territory. This means that Harry and Marv both have the brain advantage over Bob's brawn, while Buck has the advantage of both brains AND brawn over both of the Bandits. Harry and Marv have to incapacitate both Twins to win. If one Twin is restrained but the other one manages to finish the Bandits off, it counts as a win for the Twins. If both Twins are disabled but one of the bandits dies, it's a tie (inconclusive).

Harry and Marv

Bob and Buck

 

[CBslayeR]

Following

 

[Kyleb79]

When I get on my PC I’ll write down who I think would win.

 

[Kyleb79]

Though I think it’s important to note what Harv and Harry scale to in durability. For Bob and Buck, they can knock out The Player who can survive, albeit knocked out for an unknown amount of time (Possibly a day) a Dynamite stick is 1 Megajoule of Energy or 1,000,000 joules. Durability wise ehh… they’re comparable to someone who can get knocked out by huge shocks of electricity and getting rammed into a wall by a car, and get up after 15 seconds. So they seem low Street level. Though I think we need to establish what durability Harry and Marv have or they scale to low end Wall level which means one-shot.

 

[Frieza_force_soldier_100]

Well, since we are mentioning explosions, this is Harry's best durability feat. I don't know how much energy it yields.

 

[Kyleb79]

I’m not sure how to scale Gasoline explosions. Though from the feat, he easily withstood it and was only annoyed at best so if we are able to scale it, he should scale much above it.

 

[Frieza_force_soldier_100]

Want to ask the calculation thread?

 

[Frieza_force_soldier_100]

Also, Marv's best feat would be this. I don't know how much voltage or amp that is but it's clearly much more than what Buck's baton is capable of. Again, Marv would only be slightly bothered by Buck's baton.

 

[Kyleb79]

Want to ask the calculation thread?

Maybe. We need an exact calculation in order to determine their durability.

Also, Marv's best feat would be this. I don't know how much voltage or amp that is but it's clearly much more than what Buck's baton is capable of. Again, Marv would only be slightly bothered by Buck's baton.

From what I'm looking at, that's an arc welder. We can see where the switch goes so we actually can somewhat calculate it, and from closing upon an average arc welder. Marv seemed to be getting shocked for 9 seconds by it at 40, while being shocked at 90 for 10 seconds. I'm not sure where that goes on a durability scale.

 

[Frieza_force_soldier_100]

Someone made calculations for the Home Alone 2 traps. Not sure how reliable they are though. You can see The explosion one here. Shall we ask the calculation thread if it is acceptable? If it is, this may be a stomp for the Bandits. They gave Harry durability in the hundreds of megajoules.

 

[Kyleb79]

Someone made calculations for the Home Alone 2 traps. Not sure how reliable they are though. You can see The explosion one here. Shall we ask the calculation thread if it is acceptable? If it is, this may be a stomp for the Bandits. They gave Harry durability in the hundreds of megajoules.

I recommend we do see where this goes. Though it’d be a curbstomp if it got accepted. Heck even the upgrade that I’m trying to get The Twins upgraded to, is 5 Megajoules. Which would make the gap abnormally huge. Easily putting Marv in 9-A if it got accepted.

 

[Kyleb79]

Alright, I checked what 895 megajoules are equal to. 0.21391 Tons of TNT, or Small Building Level+. So to say the least, it depends on how the calculation team views the calculation.

 

[Frieza_force_soldier_100]

Actually, now that I think about it, even if the Twins can't cause much harm to the Bandits with their weapons, they could still strangle them to death using their superior lifting strength. Of course, that's assuming the Bandits don't disable them first. Bob and Buck's durability would have to hold out long enough for them to realize that direct blows won't do it. Speaking of which, how much durability comes from tanking a supercharged stun gun or car hit and only being incapacitated for 15 seconds? If a car hit disables Granny for 15 seconds, how many crowbar hits would it take to incapacitate either of the Twins long enough for the Bandits to finish robbing the place?

 

[Kyleb79]

Actually, now that I think about it, even if the Twins can't cause much harm to the Bandits with their weapons, they could still strangle them to death using their superior lifting strength. Of course, that's assuming the Bandits don't disable them first. Bob and Buck's durability would have to hold out long enough for them to realize that direct blows won't do it. Speaking of which, how much durability comes from tanking a supercharged stun gun or car hit and only being incapacitated for 15 seconds? If a car hit disables Granny for 15 seconds, how many crowbar hits would it take to incapacitate either of the Twins long enough for the Bandits to finish robbing the place?

If it's in the content of 9-B, then here are my thoughts.

Crowbars should be able to do damage to The Twins as the feats don't seem to be that far into Street level, as Crowbars can easily injure humans. So if a Crowbar hit The Twins, they'd likely be at least be stunned or staggered, and at best knock them down. Though I'm going to point out who would win.

The fight takes place with Harry and Marv checking out the building they stick together, and they see the two brothers approaching them. They go to charge at the two brothers. Harry goes to hit Buck with a crowbar but Buck is stunned but easily picks up Harry, which he then overpowers him causing him to drop his weapon. Though Harry still seems to be conscious but is simply helpless with 10-B strength and Buck would continue to shock him. The same thing would happen with Bob and Marv. Bob picks up Marv overpowering him and dropping his weapon, though unlike Buck who would taser Harry until he's unconscious. Buck would simply hit him once and drop him which he assumes is knocked out. Though this gives Marv an advantage so when he is dropped, he grabs the Crowbar and proceeds to whack Bob in the leg to which he looks his balance a bit. Marv stands up and whacks him across the body 3 times causing him to stagger, then give a complete blow to the face then head. This then knocks out Bob. Buck looks over then tosses the incapacitated but still conscious Harry to the side. Buck tries to grab him but he is injured when Marv hits him over on the hand. Marv already gets the idea he's going to try and overpower him despite his stupidity and right when Buck charges in, Marv hits him on the head causing him to collapse but he quickly gets up. Assuming we are in the entrance room. Marv then starts swinging all around and Buck picks him up and pins him against the wall while shocking him, though Marv manages to break loose by hitting him with a Crowbar repeatedly which causes him to stagger a bit. Though Bob then is conscious now to which both of them overpower him, Bob hitting him on the head causing him to collapse, with Buck holding him on the ground and shocking him till he's incapacitated. Harry recovers a bit but Bob walks over and Harry in a weakened state is no match. Marv and Harry are either cooked or fed to a Giant Beetle.

Why did the outcome turn out this way?

Simpler than you think. Weapons. Crowbars in general are pretty effective when dealing damage, but mediocre at dueling opponents that can take that damage. They are heavy, require you to have a grip on almost both ends, short-range, and simply are bad at dealing with a person with better weapons. Bob was pretty off-guard while being struck over and over and he only held his own against Buck for a bit due to the fact his Taser wasn't as effective due to his resistance to electricity and not being as damaging as Buck's hammer taking a few seconds to get the same amount of input damage, making it harder since Marv wasn't in his grasp. There's also The Twin's stamina from being able to get up even after being knocked out, only taking 15 seconds to half a minute, long enough for one of them to keep fighting. Harry isn't as lucky because Buck is smart enough to see if you're knocked out before dropping you.

What do Marv and Harry scale to?

I honestly don't know. But telling by how the explosions weren't an injury but rather just a painful annoyance. The explosion itself seems more explosive and bigger than a Dynamite stick, which the Twins are 5x that. So by my estimates. Marv and Harry would view their blows as something that would hurt them, but nothing too bad.

Do Marv and Harry have a wincon?

Yes, they do. This is based on how Buck deals with it. It would start off with both of them overpowering, but the tables could turn if Buck decided to assist Bob when he is being defeated by Marv. Harry would still be very much conscious and not even close to incapacitated. Harry could knock out Buck when he is distracted when focusing on Marv, then both of them knock out Bob together. How do you stop someone with resurrection? Simple they injure them to a state where they both are incapacitated and unable to fight back.

Scenario 1: The Twins win 10/10 times since I see Bob becoming conscious each time double-teaming Marv with Mid Difficulty.

Scenario 2: Harry and Marv win 8/10 times since I see Harry knocking out Buck when distracted, though I can see some scenarios where they take down Marv before Harry can catch up. This is done with Mid-High difficulty since they could get up and challenge them.

What is the average scenario?

In most average scenarios. I'm going with Scenario 1. Telling by how abusive Buck is to Bob, I don't see too much scenario's where Buck coming over to help him without finishing off Harry.

The Twins win 7.5/10 times, with Mid-High difficulty.

 

[Frieza_force_soldier_100]

It is worth noting that the teamwork ethics of each duo is important. As noted Buck often abuses Bob by hitting him when the player escapes. Bob however has no problem hitting back, unlike a lot of brain and brawn duos. In one ending, Bob smashes his mallet into Buck's face after he smacks him. In another ending, Buck shocks Bob with his taser and makes him fall off the roof. This shows that the Twins don't have a very good relationship. Harry, while he does get annoyed with Marv for his idiocy, has never abused Marv to the degree that Buck abuses Bob, and Marv has never snapped back at Harry, so they would have marginally better teamwork, as noted. As long as the Twins can endure a few blows from crowbars and are capable of choking the Bandits despite the durability gap, I can see the fight going as suggested. I don't think it's a stomp in either direction.

That's one vote for the Twins.

 

[Kyleb79]

Though count my vote for The Twins.

 

[Kyleb79]

Bump.

 

[CBslayeR]

Twins FRA

 

[Kyleb79]

Epic.

 

[Frieza_force_soldier_100]

Bump.

 

[Frieza_force_soldier_100]

Overall:

Harry and Marv: Slightly longer range, both have the intelligence advantage over Bob, Marv should only be slightly hurt by Buck's taser, better work dynamic due to Harry not being as abusive to Marv as Buck is to Bob and Marv never fighting back against Harry, far better durability and stamina.

Bob and Buck: Easier to swing weapons, stronger, faster, Buck has the intelligence advantage over both Harry and Marv, they both have the AP advantage, resurrective immortality may give them an extra chance if Harry and Marv kill them once either by accident or not knowing or their ability to revive.

Bump.

 

[DarkDragonMedeus]

Following this thread for now, but might give thoughts later.

 

[EliminatorVenom]

I like the analysis provided here so far.

My conclusion is similar. I find it easier for Harry and Marv to hurt Bob and Buck than the inverse, given the feats provided in the profiles. That being said, most of what has been said here is very much accurate, with Bob and Buck being much more ruthless and willing to kill than Harry and Marv do. Bob and Buck also have superior LS by having actual, good feats, which would make attempts at grappling with them to restrain them be quite fruitless.

I see Bob and Buck winning this more times than not, but with high difficulties.

 

[Roachman40]

Bob and Buck FRA

 

[Kyleb79]

4 for The Twins so far.

 

[Flashlight237]

Someone made calculations for the Home Alone 2 traps. Not sure how reliable they are though. You can see The explosion one here. Shall we ask the calculation thread if it is acceptable? If it is, this may be a stomp for the Bandits. They gave Harry durability in the hundreds of megajoules.

You're talking about my calc for the kerosene toilet? That wasn't accepted.

 

[DarkDragonMedeus]

Well, the best durability feat appears to be a gasoline explosion; which is mostly heat and not much blunt force trauma tbh. I mean, there is still some BFT given it still breaks the toilet, but I do not think it would be quite as impressive as the Dynamite example. For example, plane crashes have been known to cause things that look like an 8-B explosion, but it's only 9-B at most due to the nature of how gas explosions work, and how heat/chemical based attacks are limited to damaging people based on thermal equilibrium.

I do agree Harry and Marv's biggest advantage is their durability, but resurrections is arguably better than that. And they're both idiots, but have at least some degree of common sense; like at least enough to the point where they're still considered human. In which Bob is basically just a mindless zombie, but Buck is the smartest of the 4 and the only decently intelligent one on the battlefield based on comments above. His modern weapons would probably terrorize the wet bandits. The crowbars do appear to be Harry and Marv's strongest weapon yeah, but they do have limited range. Also, Harry and Marv would probably be unaware of their ability to revive where as Buck at least would probably not consider a simple knock out evidence that they're dead and would try to take advantage of that.

And I think for the most part, Kyleb has a good summary. So going with Bob and Buck mid difficulty.

 

[Kyleb79]

5 for Bob and Buck.

 

[Frieza_force_soldier_100]

Bob is both the dumbest and strongest person on the battlefield, Buck is the smartest and second strongest, Harry is the second smartest,and Marv, well, he is more of a load than anything. I honestly wonder why Harry would work with him other than for reasons of friendship, as Marv definitely isn't the brains of the duo and not much use for brawn either given that he had trouble restraining Kevin by himself in the first film. To be fair, he does have the most range of the four people in the battle due to his long arms along with his crowbar. He's also much smarter than Bob.

As for Buck being the only decently intelligent person in the fight, is Harry really that stupid? I know he didn't pass fifth grade and he often falls for traps, but he did obtain information by impersonating an officer, and he did manage to anticipate a few of Kevin's strategies. The biggest idiot moments that I remember for him are not noticing the literally red=hot doorknob in the first film and standing next to a door with approaching noise coming from it in the second film. Harry may not have been a genius but Marv seemed like the real idiot. Anyway, Buck's intelligence is... quite bizarre. He built a plasma rifle and explosive laser tripwire, and along with Bob, created an underground area for their giant beetle. He also keeps the key to the sewer cage and searches a certain dark jail cell that Bob will not, but he seems to either be oblivious to his surroundings or suffering from bad eyesight. You escape the sewer cage by calling him over by rattling a tomato can and then literally taking the key from his pants while he's looking at you, which he fails to notice. Also, he has just as much trouble seeing through the Slendrina mask disguise as Bob, Granny, and Grandpa. Keep in mind that the disguise is literally just a mask of Slendrina's face. It takes him and the others 5 seconds of you standing right next to them to see through it. Also, he may be better at doing a spot check than Bob, but he still doesn't bother to check inside cabinets that you can hide in. He may be smart, but he doesn't have good eyesight and can't do a great spot check. Granted, some of these things can be chalked up to game mechanics. The villains in DVLOPER'S games in general seem gifted with security and sometimes technology, but they can't do spot checks to save their lives and what they have in security and technology related smarts, they seem to lack in eyesight. Granny built an instant portable freeze machine but can't find the player hiding in a closet with see=through holes. Bob is the only one of his villains who seems legitimately stupid, which is reflected in his moronic voice.

I suppose Harry and Marv could get lucky if they targeted their feet, but they won't know about the weakness of their feet.

 

[Frieza_force_soldier_100]

Bump.

 

[MistaClean]

How is H&M getting past Resurrection?

Anyways, Bob and Buck FRA

 

[Kyleb79]

How is H&M getting past Resurrection?

Anyways, Bob and Buck FRA

Incapacitating them.

But vote counted.

 

[Frieza_force_soldier_100]

One more needed.

 

[Sonicflare9]

bob and buckfra

 

[Frieza_force_soldier_100]

Grace.