Dragon Ball Baseline LS

[Detective_Blizzard]

From Lupin reviews to trying to give Dragon Ball characters lifting strength, yup, I'm definitely going insane

This is just a basic CRT to put "at least" on the dragon ball profiles since many, many, many, many of them are just listed as unknown and thus are treated as basically having actually no lifting strength. You know the deal with Dragon Ball, higher ki = higher strength, stats, ect, so while there's no concrete means of saying what stats each character should specifically have, putting them above a bare minimum at certain levels should be fine, akin to how everyone above Buu has the dimensional scream. (Unless the character specifically has stuff that would go against the norm). Other characters in the verse already have this type of scaling, this is just meant to give some baseline to the rest of them. I am aware that the verse can be notorious for some of the lifting feats, specifically early Z, but having characters go from one stat to practically 0 only to go to a another stat (which in some cases would be the same class of the initial power) feels disingenuous as it literally ignores everything prior and just leads to arguments where a stronger version of a character loses at something a weaker version can do.

There are 2 bare minimum options to be used, both for near the exact same reasonings. The only difference comes from the actual value given and how some very bottom tiers are treated.

Option A

Nice, simple, anyone considered stronger than Post Training Goku should have at least Class K with anyone on par having that value.

Option B

A recent CRT was made and accepted which put chapter 3 Kid Goku at Class M. Same as before anyone scaling to or above Kid Goku should have this (The only reason this is a separate option is because for some reason it hasn't been applied yet despite having 3 staff votes)


Agree with Option A: LuffyRuffy46307, Da3ggman

Agree with Option B: DarkDragonMedeus, LephyrTheRevanchist, KingTempest, Super_Ascended_Sean_Pazdera, Speedblitzer50, LuffyRuffy46307, Smokeychees, Killerdrone123, ProfectusInfinity, CelestialVortex01, ArcaneAbyss, Da3ggman, LegendariumOfLies

"No, I want Class 1 telekinesis to neg-diff this fodder verse" (Disagree):

Neutral:

 

[Detective_Blizzard]

Now if you excuse me I'm going to go jump back into Lupin revisions as I wait for arguments on why Kid Goku Colonel Silver is stronger than Zeno.

 

[DarkDragonMedeus]

Option B sounds pretty blatant.

 

[Super_Ascended_Sean_Pazdera]

Lord have mercy I thought LS was gonna mean Light Speed

Heavily agree with Option B.

 

[Speedblitzer50]

Agree with B

 

[LuffyRuffy46307]

It looks good on these things.

 

[Smokeychees]

Agree with option B

 

[Killerdrone123]

Yeah option B seems alright

 

[DavidTPPM]

"No, I want Class 1 telekinesis to neg-diff this fodder verse" (Disagree):

Now if you excuse me I'm going to go jump back into Lupin revisions as I wait for arguments on why Kid Goku Colonel Silver is stronger than Zeno.

Until I see Zeno outbench me he's going to average human level LS

 

[Detective_Blizzard]

Until I see Zeno outbench me he's going to average human level LS

Is that an actual vote lol

Also ironically not the lowest argument I herd for Zeno today, current winner is 10 kg

 

[DavidTPPM]

Is that an actual vote lol

No lmao I'm just bullshitting
No DB character could ever outbench me ofc

Also ironically not the lowest argument I herd for Zeno today, current winner is 10 kg

Damn bro can't even withstand the weight of his body

 

[ProfectusInfinity]

Option B looks pretty good

 

[CelestialVortex01]

Yeah option B sounds fitting.

 

[Damage3245]

Regarding the feat from Kid Goku in option B, I believe that it may be more fitting to classify it as Striking Strength rather than Lifting Strength.

Highlighting relevant parts of the definitions for the two:

Striking strength describes the power behind the character’s physical blows. Generally, anything that has to do with the character’s actions instead of passively holding up weights is about this category.

This isn't a feat of Goku passively holding the weight of the boulder (which has been calculated to be Class 5). This is Goku exerting effort to crush the rock by squeezing his arms together.

Lifting Strength is defined as the mass that an individual can lift on Earth. In other words, it measures the amount of upward force a character can produce. As such, pushing and pulling feats are also considered part of this statistic as long as they have proper calculations to account for the difference from lifting.

The calculation is not a measurement of the amount of upwards force Goku is producing. Nor is it just pulling or pushing or throwing the rock.

Since Lifting Strength is more about overcoming the weight of the rock, but Striking Strength is more about the energy that can be unleashed in strikes, I think that Goku's applying compressive force to destroy the boulder makes more sense as a Striking Strength feat which is not limited to just punches or kicks but can include a sustained action like this that is way beyond just lifting or moving a certain weight.

Perhaps other staff members could double-check if this interpretation makes sense or not based on our pages.

 

[LephyrTheRevanchist]

Regarding the feat from Kid Goku in option B, I believe that it may be more fitting to classify it as Striking Strength rather than Lifting Strength.

Highlighting relevant parts of the definitions for the two:



This isn't a feat of Goku passively holding the weight of the boulder (which has been calculated to be Class 5). This is Goku exerting effort to crush the rock by squeezing his arms together.



The calculation is not a measurement of the amount of upwards force Goku is producing. Nor is it just pulling or pushing or throwing the rock.

Since Lifting Strength is more about overcoming the weight of the rock, but Striking Strength is more about the energy that can be unleashed in strikes, I think that Goku's applying compressive force to destroy the boulder makes more sense as a Striking Strength feat which is not limited to just punches or kicks but can include a sustained action like this that is way beyond just lifting or moving a certain weight.

Perhaps other staff members could double-check if this interpretation makes sense or not based on our pages.

We cite crushing as a seemingly valid way to gain lifting strength, as shown on the reference for common feats page

So I'd say this requires a calc group thread to settle.

 

[Damage3245]

We cite crushing as a seemingly valid way to gain lifting strength, as shown on the reference for common feats page

So I'd say this requires a calc group thread to settle.

Mmm, okay, I'll save any further comments for that.

 

[ArcaneAbyss]

Option B seems them pretty blatant option as it has been accepted

 

[Detective_Blizzard]

So I'd say this requires a calc group thread to settle.

Mmm, okay, I'll save any further comments for that.

Does this delay anything here or is it still good to go on account of the fact everything here is currently accepted?

 

[LephyrTheRevanchist]

Does this delay anything here or is it still good to go on account of the fact everything here is currently accepted?

I'd say is good to go

 

[Detective_Blizzard]

I'd say is good to go

May I ask for a vote then if you have any opinions?

 

[LephyrTheRevanchist]

I was literally the first vote of approval in the kid Goku thread

Option B is fine

 

[Detective_Blizzard]

I was literally the first vote of approval in the kid Goku thread

I know that's why I asked lol

Option B is fine

Counted, 1 staff vote remaining

 

[KingTempest]

I'm fine with that too. Wish there was a blog or something specifying higher ki = higher everything, but oh well

 

[Detective_Blizzard]

And with that we have the final staff vote, now it's just the waiting game for grace.

 

[Da3ggman]

Hell yeah, count me as agreeing

 

[LegendariumOfLies]

Oh shit I forgot. As OP of the Kid Goku Calc, I obv agree with Option B

 

[CastoriceTheFifth]

Blatant enough

 

[Damage3245]

Does this delay anything here or is it still good to go on account of the fact everything here is currently accepted?

Doesn't delay anything.

 

[CloverDragon03]

Regarding the feat from Kid Goku in option B, I believe that it may be more fitting to classify it as Striking Strength rather than Lifting Strength.

Highlighting relevant parts of the definitions for the two:



This isn't a feat of Goku passively holding the weight of the boulder (which has been calculated to be Class 5). This is Goku exerting effort to crush the rock by squeezing his arms together.



The calculation is not a measurement of the amount of upwards force Goku is producing. Nor is it just pulling or pushing or throwing the rock.

Since Lifting Strength is more about overcoming the weight of the rock, but Striking Strength is more about the energy that can be unleashed in strikes, I think that Goku's applying compressive force to destroy the boulder makes more sense as a Striking Strength feat which is not limited to just punches or kicks but can include a sustained action like this that is way beyond just lifting or moving a certain weight.

Perhaps other staff members could double-check if this interpretation makes sense or not based on our pages.

Going by precedent and what Lephyr has already brought up, this definitely seems valid for Lifting Strength

 

[Damage3245]

Going by precedent and what Lephyr has already brought up, this definitely seems valid for Lifting Strength

Sure thing - my problem may not necessarily be with the feat itself but the way our pages are currently written which isn't for this thread.