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Demon king Vs demon king representative

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SemiRaedi

SemiRaedi

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Post schnee hajime (> 300 megatons) Vs base Zeldris (> 4.3 gigatons), Zeldris has less than a 14.3x Ap advantage

The value for hajime may be wrong since I don't know much about his verse, this is what I got from using all the multipliers present from 2.4 megatons (where the city level scaling starts I think). If any supporters know the correct value (if I'm wrong) then feel free to correct me.

Speed is equal
 
SemiRaedi said:
Post schnee hajime (> 300 megatons) Vs base Zeldris (> 4.3 gigatons), Zeldris has less than a 14.3x Ap advantage

The value for hajime may be wrong since I don't know much about his verse, this is what I got from using all the multipliers present from 2.4 megatons (where the city level scaling starts I think). If any supporters know the correct value (if I'm wrong) then feel free to correct me.

Speed is equal
Click to expand...
At least equalize energies and use a different character
 
Well, gonna give my input:
Post-Schnee key: City level (Superior to before, can fight Apostles of God without even using Limit Break [Which mean he currently scale massively above 36 Megatons]), Mountain level with Limit Break, Overload, Schlagen, and Pile Bunker (3x stronger with Limit Break [108 Megatons]. 5x stronger with Overload [180 Megatons]. Schlagen is 5-6x stronger than Donner [180-216 Megatons]. His Pile Bunker is even stronger than Schlagen), Mountain level+ up to Large Mountain level with Schlagen and Pile Bunker strengthened with Limit Break and Overload (Limit Break make Schlagen and Pile Bunker 3x stronger [540-648 Megatons], while Overload make them 5x stronger [900-1080 Megatons]), Can ignore conventional durability with various attacks
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So at most Hajime physically can reach 216 metagons while his strongest physical attack at most reach 1 Gigatons, so it's quite obvious who have the AP advantage. I Hajime side however he have the fact that one of his first moves is Riftwalk which is a 10x speed amp, this can futher increase with Limit Break and Overload reaching an 36-60x speed amp, and since he can sense power levels on top of have instincts that tell him about things before they happen and Foreshight which, is quite probable that he directly go and use Overload.

AP gap aside he can also ignore durability which several artifacts, like using poison with the Needle Gun, grenades, Arachne golems or Alvus, with spatial manipulation via spatial grenades (which distort space), Pile Bunker-Gatling Pile Bunker (the stakes are coated with spatial magic to pierce through anything), Cross Bits-Cross Velts (can crreate spatial barries by isolating space, self-explode with spatial explosions and I'm not sure of this but they maybe can even fire normal bullets with spatial magic though I'm not sure of this part), Orestes (they are portals that can shrinke cutting everything caught in the middle of them), Bolas (they don't ignore durability but grap space around the target to prevent them from free) and I sort of remember Schlagen ending enhanced with spatial magic though I need to reread to confirm, Grenzen is an artifact that blow away magic power with the shots so though it don't do actual damage it can potentially consume all the energy of the other side, the sound grenade use ultrasonic waves to attack the opponent. He himself also have powers able to ignore durability outside of his artifacts like his shockwaves which can damage the internal organs of the enemy, his fear and madness manip which have various layers, and his conceptual (Type 2) EE via info manip.
Noneless21 said:
Can this br on hold for now? Hajime got some accepted CRTs that haven't been applied to th profiles yet and me and @Expectro2000xxx are working slowly to applying the revisions to the profiles
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This is also true which would probably give him various more things to this.
 
Expectro2000xxx said:
Well, gonna give my input:

So at most Hajime physically can reach 216 metagons while his strongest physical attack at most reach 1 Gigatons, so it's quite obvious who have the AP advantage. I Hajime side however he have the fact that one of his first moves is Riftwalk which is a 10x speed amp, this can futher increase with Limit Break and Overload reaching an 36-60x speed amp, and since he can sense power levels on top of have instincts that tell him about things before they happen and Foreshight which, is quite probable that he directly go and use Overload.

AP gap aside he can also ignore durability which several artifacts, like using poison with the Needle Gun, grenades, Arachne golems or Alvus, with spatial manipulation via spatial grenades (which distort space), Pile Bunker-Gatling Pile Bunker (the stakes are coated with spatial magic to pierce through anything), Cross Bits-Cross Velts (can crreate spatial barries by isolating space, self-explode with spatial explosions and I'm not sure of this but they maybe can even fire normal bullets with spatial magic though I'm not sure of this part), Orestes (they are portals that can shrinke cutting everything caught in the middle of them), Bolas (they don't ignore durability but grap space around the target to prevent them from free) and I sort of remember Schlagen ending enhanced with spatial magic though I need to reread to confirm, Grenzen is an artifact that blow away magic power with the shots so though it don't do actual damage it can potentially consume all the energy of the other side, the sound grenade use ultrasonic waves to attack the opponent. He himself also have powers able to ignore durability outside of his artifacts like his shockwaves which can damage the internal organs of the enemy, his fear and madness manip which have various layers, and his conceptual (Type 2) EE via info manip.

This is also true which would probably give him various more things to this.
Click to expand...
Zeldris has god, ON, passive fear aura, soul manipulation and mid regen and etc
 
speedster352 said:
Zeldris has god, ON, passive fear aura, soul manipulation and mid regen and etc
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Hajime resist those things though, with various layers. The mid regen can be deal with some of his hax and since he apparently get weaker after regen he can realistically just do a lot of damage with the hax until Zeldris can't do anything, one of the main things that Hajime do against super regen users is use Grenzen to blow all the enemy energy which in practical effects don't only make someone useless an incan but also sort of neg others regeneration since in that state the target don't even have the energy to regen.
 
Expectro2000xxx said:
Hajime resist those things though, with various layers. The mid regen can be deal with some of his hax and since he apparently get weaker after regen he can realistically just do a lot of damage with the hax until Zeldris can't do anything, one of the main things that Hajime do against super regen users is use Grenzen to blow all the enemy energy which in practical effects don't only make someone useless an incan but also sort of neg others regeneration since in that state the target don't even have the energy to regen.
Click to expand...
But Zeldris has the extreme Ap advantage and he can just face tank it god too. Ominous nebula and bind are very dangerous since Zeldris has the LS advantage and piety. Also Zeldris never holds back at all so he will just kill him and be done with it. Zeldris also has sealing
 
speedster352 said:
But Zeldris has the extreme Ap advantage and he can just face tank it god too. Ominous nebula and bind are very dangerous since Zeldris has the LS advantage and piety. Also Zeldris never holds back at all so he will just kill him and be done with it. Zeldris also has sealing
Click to expand...
I know that Zeldris have the massive AP advantage, that's why I was talking purely about things that directly ignore durability.

The LS don't really matter because it would need to touch Hajime which is honestly near impossible considering his speed amps, instincts, Foresight and that he teleport way, he also is capable to directly reflect back Zeldris attacks with Orestes portals but that's less likely since with the speed amp Zeldris isn't gonna be able to do actually do something.

Piety is mind manip no? Hajime have more around 10 layers of mind manip resistance in this key ( said layers also apply to soul manip, curse manip, powernull and others things).

Hajime is quite wild and don't hold back, the moment something become his enemy he go for the kill faster than what the other side can think, this is the key in which his bloodlust is also at his peak because in this key his lover was stealed and he entered in complete war mode (the reason of why he have a conceptual EE is because his bloodlust literally reached conceptual levels and began to negate all existences).
 
Expectro2000xxx said:
I know that Zeldris have the massive AP advantage, that's why I was talking purely about things that directly ignore durability.

The LS don't really matter because it would need to touch Hajime which is honestly near impossible considering his speed amps, instincts, Foresight and that he teleport way, he also is capable to directly reflect back Zeldris attacks with Orestes portals but that's less likely since with the speed amp Zeldris isn't gonna be able to do actually do something.

Piety is mind manip no? Hajime have more around 10 layers of mind manip resistance in this key ( said layers also apply to soul manip, curse manip, powernull and others things).

Hajime is quite wild and don't hold back, the moment something become his enemy he go for the kill faster than what the other side can think, this is the key in which his bloodlust is also at his peak because in this key his lover was stealed and he entered in complete war mode (the reason of why he have a conceptual EE is because his bloodlust literally reached conceptual levels and began to negate all existences).
Click to expand...
Omnious nebula and his transformations boost his speed exponentially including the night and rage amp. You need to resist fear hax to resist fear hax. Omnious bind just requires a hand gesture. And god face tanks all magical attacks.
 
speedster352 said:
Omnious nebula and his transformations boost his speed exponentially including the night and rage amp. You need to resist fear hax to resist fear hax. Omnious bind just requires a hand gesture. And god face tanks all magical attacks.
Click to expand...
Ok but, just Riftwalk would give Hajime an 12x speed amp and that basically one of his first moves, considering that he can sense and see the power Zeldris on top of feel his danger with his instincts is quite probably that Hajime go Overload Riftwalk which would be a 60x speed amp, so without actual big multipliers can't be assumed that Zeldris could even get close to Hajime speed.

I mean, obviously? Hajime have fear hax resistance since vol 1 (which you can see in his Post-Evolution key), he have some layers with it but since Divine Edict also apply fear hax the 10 layers previously mentioned could be even applied to the fear resistance. Additionally his willpower is quite literally at conceptual levels, reason of why he can create concepts like the one to go the desired place or the one to negate all existence, so I unless Zeldris fear hax can reach conceptual levels Hajime is unaffected.

The amps just need a thought, same with summon his artifacts and use his powers.

I mean, his spatial magic have some layers, his poisons, sonic wave and shockwaves weapons aren't actually magical, and in the case that god is supposed to tank magic do to powernull Hajime and his magic resist powernull (also with various layers, currently like two layers as how is the profile in this moment, after the recent revisions from the recent crts are applied the layers will become +10 like the soul resistance and such).
 
Expectro2000xxx said:
Ok but, just Riftwalk would give Hajime an 12x speed amp and that basically one of his first moves, considering that he can sense and see the power Zeldris on top of feel his danger with his instincts is quite probably that Hajime go Overload Riftwalk which would be a 60x speed amp, so without actual big multipliers can't be assumed that Zeldris could even get close to Hajime speed.

I mean, obviously? Hajime have fear hax resistance since vol 1 (which you can see in his Post-Evolution key), he have some layers with it but since Divine Edict also apply fear hax the 10 layers previously mentioned could be even applied to the fear resistance. Additionally his willpower is quite literally at conceptual levels, reason of why he can create concepts like the one to go the desired place or the one to negate all existence, so I unless Zeldris fear hax can reach conceptual levels Hajime is unaffected.

The amps just need a thought, same with summon his artifacts and use his powers.

I mean, his spatial magic have some layers, his poisons, sonic wave and shockwaves weapons aren't actually magical, and in the case that god is supposed to tank magic do to powernull Hajime and his magic resist powernull (also with various layers, currently like two layers as how is the profile in this moment, after the recent revisions from the recent crts are applied the layers will become +10 like the soul resistance and such).
Click to expand...
We only accept what's on the profiles and Omnious Nebula reacts for Zeldris and is a focefiled good like breaking that when your opponent is 10x stronger than you. Zeldris has spacial manipulation so those space hax are getting negged. Also Omnious bind requires a hand gesture then your are unable to move or use magic. As soon as ON land hajime is vaped since the ap advantage is way too large and Zeldris always starts of with it.
 
speedster352 said:
We only accept what's on the profiles and Omnious Nebula reacts for Zeldris and is a focefiled good like breaking that when your opponent is 10x stronger than you. Zeldris has spacial manipulation so those space hax are getting negged. Also Omnious bind requires a hand gesture then your are unable to move or use magic. As soon as ON land hajime is vaped since the ap advantage is way too large and Zeldris always starts of with it.
Click to expand...
I know, which is why I'm currently only arguing with the things in the profile, just mentioning in the powernull point that after a weak or two his layers of resistance to it will go from 2-3 to +10 (that crt was accepted more than a month ago so is literally just apply the things which could happen until now do to reasons), everything else is already in the profile.

Ominous Nebula: is a technique of extreme concentration were Zeldris rotates his darkness at immense speeds, creating a vortex that surrounds and attracts all living beings around him. This power makes the air flow and creates a vacuum and everything that comes in contact with it is sliced at a god-like speed by pure reflexes, making this technique a Full React.
Click to expand...
From the description don't actually sound like a passive forcefield though and even then it would be needed proof of be able to react and act against something 60x faster. Futhermore, I'm talking about just things that ignore durability so the AP don't matter to it. And while Zeldris have spatial manip he don't have spatial resistance so the spatial attacks of Hajime will affect him normally and do to his layers he also should be capable of pass through the spatial barriers and things of Zeldris (Hajime spatial layers are like 4: Vol 5 Hajime < Post Oscar Synergist "Battle" < Post Evolution Magic Hajime < Post Transcendence Hajime)

I mean, Zeldris isn't gonna have time to do so because of the speed amp, he probably will be even unable to know what happened do to the sheer speed difference. Additionally Hajime resist powernull so his magic will be usable like normal, with his willpower Hajime also broke free from Ehitorujue making him unable to move, Ehitorujue is High 6-B, have Class G and used Divine Edict which have around 10 layers in his case, so he absolutely would free even in the basically impossible scenary in which Zeldris accomplish affect him.

No attack from Zeldris will land as said before do to the speed difference, instincts of Hajime that tell him the things that will happen before they happen and Foresight which let him see what will happen.
 
Expectro2000xxx said:
I know, which is why I'm currently only arguing with the things in the profile, just mentioning in the powernull point that after a weak or two his layers of resistance to it will go from 2-3 to +10 (that crt was accepted more than a month ago so is literally just apply the things which could happen until now do to reasons), everything else is already in the profile.


From the description don't actually sound like a passive forcefield though and even then it would be needed proof of be able to react and act against something 60x faster. Futhermore, I'm talking about just things that ignore durability so the AP don't matter to it. And while Zeldris have spatial manip he don't have spatial resistance so the spatial attacks of Hajime will affect him normally and do to his layers he also should be capable of pass through the spatial barriers and things of Zeldris (Hajime spatial layers are like 4: Vol 5 Hajime < Post Oscar Synergist "Battle" < Post Evolution Magic Hajime < Post Transcendence Hajime)

I mean, Zeldris isn't gonna have time to do so because of the speed amp, he probably will be even unable to know what happened do to the sheer speed difference. Additionally Hajime resist powernull so his magic will be usable like normal, with his willpower Hajime also broke free from Ehitorujue making him unable to move, Ehitorujue is High 6-B, have Class G and used Divine Edict which have around 10 layers in his case, so he absolutely would free even in the basically impossible scenary in which Zeldris accomplish affect him.

No attack from Zeldris will land as said before do to the speed difference, instincts of Hajime that tell him the things that will happen before they happen and Foresight which let him see what will happen.
Click to expand...
Ominous Nebula is a forcefield he always starts off with it and hajime can counter it since it too fast and too strong and he will be vaped one ON lands. ON starts up instantly so good luck dodging it. On is limited instinctive reaction and is a forcefield so non of the attacks will work anyway since he will get vaped from a single hit from ON
 
ya know speed you also argue with things that in the middle of the CRTs, why the hell you ain't letting us using the CRTs that's already accepted then?
 
Expectro2000xxx said:
I know, which is why I'm currently only arguing with the things in the profile, just mentioning in the powernull point that after a weak or two his layers of resistance to it will go from 2-3 to +10 (that crt was accepted more than a month ago so is literally just apply the things which could happen until now do to reasons), everything else is already in the profile.


From the description don't actually sound like a passive forcefield though and even then it would be needed proof of be able to react and act against something 60x faster. Futhermore, I'm talking about just things that ignore durability so the AP don't matter to it. And while Zeldris have spatial manip he don't have spatial resistance so the spatial attacks of Hajime will affect him normally and do to his layers he also should be capable of pass through the spatial barriers and things of Zeldris (Hajime spatial layers are like 4: Vol 5 Hajime < Post Oscar Synergist "Battle" < Post Evolution Magic Hajime < Post Transcendence Hajime)

I mean, Zeldris isn't gonna have time to do so because of the speed amp, he probably will be even unable to know what happened do to the sheer speed difference. Additionally Hajime resist powernull so his magic will be usable like normal, with his willpower Hajime also broke free from Ehitorujue making him unable to move, Ehitorujue is High 6-B, have Class G and used Divine Edict which have around 10 layers in his case, so he absolutely would free even in the basically impossible scenary in which Zeldris accomplish affect him.

No attack from Zeldris will land as said before do to the speed difference, instincts of Hajime that tell him the things that will happen before they happen and Foresight which let him see what will happen.
Click to expand...
here
Noneless21 said:
ya know speed you also argue with things that in the middle of the CRTs, why the hell you ain't letting us using the CRTs that's already accepted then?
Click to expand...
 
fry-futurama.gif
 
Expectro2000xxx said:
I know, which is why I'm currently only arguing with the things in the profile, just mentioning in the powernull point that after a weak or two his layers of resistance to it will go from 2-3 to +10 (that crt was accepted more than a month ago so is literally just apply the things which could happen until now do to reasons), everything else is already in the profile.


From the description don't actually sound like a passive forcefield though and even then it would be needed proof of be able to react and act against something 60x faster. Futhermore, I'm talking about just things that ignore durability so the AP don't matter to it. And while Zeldris have spatial manip he don't have spatial resistance so the spatial attacks of Hajime will affect him normally and do to his layers he also should be capable of pass through the spatial barriers and things of Zeldris (Hajime spatial layers are like 4: Vol 5 Hajime < Post Oscar Synergist "Battle" < Post Evolution Magic Hajime < Post Transcendence Hajime)

I mean, Zeldris isn't gonna have time to do so because of the speed amp, he probably will be even unable to know what happened do to the sheer speed difference. Additionally Hajime resist powernull so his magic will be usable like normal, with his willpower Hajime also broke free from Ehitorujue making him unable to move, Ehitorujue is High 6-B, have Class G and used Divine Edict which have around 10 layers in his case, so he absolutely would free even in the basically impossible scenary in which Zeldris accomplish affect him.

No attack from Zeldris will land as said before do to the speed difference, instincts of Hajime that tell him the things that will happen before they happen and Foresight which let him see what will happen.
Click to expand...
here
 
oh yeah? well tough luck since i can't open that ytb link so you need to provide other link unless other people can clarify how ominous nebula works
 
speedster352 said:
Ominous Nebula is a forcefield he always starts off with it and hajime can counter it since it too fast and too strong and he will be vaped one ON lands. ON starts up instantly so good luck dodging it. On is limited instinctive reaction and is a forcefield so non of the attacks will work anyway since he will get vaped from a single hit from ON
Click to expand...
Umm, you know that just something like a 2-3x speed difference is normally considered enough to blitz in vs threads right? In Hajime case it would be a 60x difference, so Zeldris is gonna be able to land any hit just by it, futhermore Riftwalk increase his perception to the point to make him see things that move at his speed as in slow motion so on top of the physical 60x speed gap there will also exist the speed gap with his perception.

... So not even full instinctive reaction? Because in Arifureta even low level characters are capable of dodge things that they can't perceive/sense before they happen with sheer instincts, so Hajime is literally more than accustomed to people with IR, his Foresight will also tell him about anything Zeldris will do before he do it. Additionally even with IR he would need to take action which with the speed difference isn't gonna happen. Also, I just remebered it but Hajime can easily null Zeldris magic by directly destroying the core of his attacks (to note the core of a magic in Arifureta is something that only Hajime can perceive with his eye so Zeldris isn't gonna know what happened to his attacks).

And you know what? Even ignoring the dura neg spatial attacks and other techniques Hajime can easily kill Zeldris with the concept of deny all existences, and just in case the erasure of said concept is so deep that not even time manip can bring back the things erased.
 
okay? so there's actually an interval to do so?

let's put aside how Hajime will just speed blitz him before he use ominous nebula, how long this technique can last?
 
Noneless21 said:
okay? so there's actually an interval to do so?

let's put aside how Hajime will just speed blitz him before he use ominous nebula, how long this technique can last?
Click to expand...
As long as Zeldris has stamina and ON will oneshot hajime into vapour because of the ap gap.
Expectro2000xxx said:
Umm, you know that just something like a 2-3x speed difference is normally considered enough to blitz in vs threads right? In Hajime case it would be a 60x difference, so Zeldris is gonna be able to land any hit just by it, futhermore Riftwalk increase his perception to the point to make him see things that move at his speed as in slow motion so on top of the physical 60x speed gap there will also exist the speed gap with his perception.

... So not even full instinctive reaction? Because in Arifureta even low level characters are capable of dodge things that they can't perceive/sense before they happen with sheer instincts, so Hajime is literally more than accustomed to people with IR, his Foresight will also tell him about anything Zeldris will do before he do it. Additionally even with IR he would need to take action which with the speed difference isn't gonna happen. Also, I just remebered it but Hajime can easily null Zeldris magic by directly destroying the core of his attacks (to note the core of a magic in Arifureta is something that only Hajime can perceive with his eye so Zeldris isn't gonna know what happened to his attacks).

And you know what? Even ignoring the dura neg spatial attacks and other techniques Hajime can easily kill Zeldris with the concept of deny all existences, and just in case the erasure of said concept is so deep that not even time manip can bring back the things erased.
Click to expand...
SBA has changed so that won't happen off the bat. Omnious nebula activates instantly and Zeldris starts off in base so he has god, 2nd demon mark and ON to amp his speed exponentially.
 
what do you mean SBA has changed? Hajime will literally use his buttload of amps right at the beginning as Hajime at this stage is bloodlusted as hell
 
Noneless21 said:
what do you mean SBA has changed? Hajime will literally use his buttload of amps right at the beginning as Hajime at this stage is bloodlusted as hell
Click to expand...
It doesn't matter Zeldris starts off with ON and amps which will vape hajime because of the ap gap
 
I dont really care for this nerd match, but how long does it take for Hajime to put all his amps on. Cuz if it takes too long Zeldris just uses ON. Unless you mean to tell me he uses all his amps, and then uses EE (how does that work might i ask) before Zeldris can attack.
 
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