- 1,664
- 275
Cobra Kai Additions & Mild Content Revision
So recently got back into Cobra Kai and I think there should be some type of revision to Cobra Kai.
Minor Additions/Removals:
- It's shown in the skills matchup in the second All-Valley that Demetri has skills with a Scythe, Sam has skills with Sai's, and Tory has skills with a Katana. This should mean that this would pass onto Miyagi, Kreese, Sliver, and Daniel who passed on these teachings with likely mastery of them.
- Removing the feat that Miguel bent a small part of a metal bar of a railing with a kick. It was said behind the scenes that the actor did that accidentally and shouldn't qualify for something even ahead of Athlete level. He also only broke it off its hinges.
- Removal of some details of characters being tired in their fights. Originally I had written Kreese being "Weakened" in his fight with Daniel after fighting Johnny, though he shows no signs of tiring. Terry in his fight with Daniel the second time also shows no signs of tiring and just seems to be something to nitpick (However you could add the fact that Terry's outbursts and the fact he was losing control meant he was off-balance).
- Adding the feat of Johnny and Daniel fighting in Season 4 in a point match (With the notable fact both were able to hurt each, tie, and knock each other out temporarily)
- Removing the comparison of Mike Barnes and Johnny and possibly being superior. Mikes Barnes was randomly brought into the Valley to beat Daniel and only went under Cobra Kai to enter under their name for success. So Kreese wouldn't consider Barnes a student
- With Season 4, adding the fact that both Johnny and Daniel learned their latters style to "Standard Tactics."
With Season 5 adds to Johnny's durability, higher with Whiskey and White Claw. Notably in Episode 10 where Johnny notes how the Senseis couldn't hurt him with their attacks (Until about mid-way into the fight till their strikes actually started hurting). These same senseis being the one who could take down a sober Johnny Lawrence in a few critical strikes. Sub for stamina- Being drunk should be removed from being notable "Setbacks" to certain fights unless clearly shown. It is noted in the finale fight that they are drunk but barely shows signs of slowing down. Johnny and Chozen put up a better fight against all the Senseis than they were sober against one. Johnny's first fight with Kreese's setbacks was not because he was "Slightly drunk" but because Kreese notes how he taught him everything. There are also no signs of him being drunk or slowing down.
- Kreese was not being more exhausted throughout his fight in S3 with Johnny with no visuals shown of this (Other than nitpicks). Johnny just managed to counter and get the drop on him.
- Possible pressure point addition to Terry Sliver. The "Sliver Bullet" technique is a specific strike, like a counter to Chozen's pressure point that could "Take your breath away." This could relate to the definition on the VS Battles Wiki page for "Referring to special parts of the body, that, when struck, can cause intense pain."
- With the obviousness that Kreese cares about Johnny and his Cobra Kai philosophy, there are two changes here. Removing the "Unknown if this is a lie" to Kreese unintentionally trying to kill him. Then adding his weakness being Johnny and sometimes exempting him from the Cobra Kai philosophy (Also adding that he's arrogant due to Cobra Kai philosophy).
- Adding Pressure Points to Chozen for obvious reasons and adding a "Precise and focused" like for Miyagi and Daniel.
- Adding more detail to sections on Chozen's and Terry's page
- Adding to Kreese's fighting style of his dirty fighting nature like Sliver (ie, striking to the throat), and his flashback version style (With Turners fight, Prison Fight showing an interpretation, and spar with Terry it's safe enough to make his own category for fighting style)
- Addition to skill and AP for Terry that Hyan Woo (The one that beat up Johnny in Ouroboros and stood his ground against Chozen) says to Johnny that he believed "it wasn't possible" to beat Sliver because he believed Johnny couldn't even beat him. Which shows that he believes Terry is superior.
- Miyagi's technique of healing should be a reverse pressure point. Since it's just putting pressure on a certain point of the body and fixing the point of the body like that. It's not magic, it's just like Chozen's pressure point, except instead of disabling, it's enabling.
- Better keys for Kreese.
Flashbacks should be Post-Training Turner, aka after training with Turner. Scales from Turner, being a Military Karate Champion, makes him easily stronger than any adult that are able to hurt Johnny, that are just some regular adults. Post-Training Kim, which is basically 1980s and Karate Kid. Then Post-Time Skip, which stays the same.Keep things simple with pre and post time skip.
Scaling and new calculations:
Now the scaling has been off with their support feats not really being consistent with the original of relying on Miyagi's reactions of catching an arrow and Chozen breaking stone all the way from the original Karate films. Now I could go on how it should be Street level+ possibly Wall level for mostly scaling to Johnny almost breaking the front of a car windscreen by throwing a man on it, though recently there's been a recalculation by the same person which brings the feat down to Street level.
However, there has been another Wall level calculation however not accepted (Due to splitting the cylinder block in the middle and some percentage problems), so it is to be re-evaluated.
Despite this Street level should be able to be reached.
- Johnny almost breaks part of a Windscreen by throwing a man onto it
- Chozen's recalc feat of breaking part of a stone statue (9-C)
- Johnny fragmenting/violently fragmenting the middle portion of two cylinders blocks twice (Needs to be recalculated)
- Johnny fighting with a professional MMA fighter and being able to hurt and stun him
- Johnny fragmenting the middle portion of five bricks in half in a single strike
- Chris pulverising the middle portion of five bricks in half in a single strike
- Kyler doing the same thing
- Mike Barnes pulverizes the middle portion bricks in half
- Kreese shattering two old car windows individually in a single strike
- Johnny doing the same thing
- Tory punching through the center part of solid stone
- Bikers with crowbars and bats are able to shatter car windows and windscreen. Johnny also easily beats up these guys in the same scene.
- Hawk throws Bert through a window hard enough to shatter glass and unhinge the wood
- Johnny splits a sign with a kick
- Demetri breaks a glass case by kicking Hawk into it
- Kreese crashes Daniel through a large window
In terms of who it scales to it depends on the feat, however all the characters scale to each other in the show.
The teens are shown to be roughly comparable to the adults but notably weaker.
- The very start of the series is Kyler's gang vs Johnny who are able to take blows from Johnny and get up while also hurting Johnny enough for him to scream briefly in agony when hit 3 times. Miguel, later on, was able to beat these guys.
- I don't think I need to show all the characters, but everyone is able to block blows from the adults. Robby and Miguel can block blows in sparring with Daniel and Johnny. Daniel was able to with a Miyagi.
- Robby being able to hurt the adults that could get up from hits from Johnny.
- Miguel quickly dispatches of a fully grown man
- Robby's old affiliates are able to take a few blows from Daniel before going down. Robby even when barely trained was able to hurt these guys.
- Robby being able to take two blows from Terry Sliver, albeit unknown to what extent Terry wanted to harm him.
- Both Tory and Sam took hits from Kim Da-Eun
- Managed to hurt Sensei Odell who should be comparable to the other Sensei who beat up Johnny (Also he himself fought Johnny).
- Kenny taking hits from Sensei Odell
- Miyagi-Do and Eagle Fang students were able to hold off Chozen. Hawk blocks an attack from Chozen who has a bow staff. Meanwhile, both Robby and Hawk could take a kick from him. Briefly, Sam and Miguel are able to block blows and briefly keep up with him. Robby and Hawk simultaneously kick and overpower Chozen who blocked it.
- Possible Snake and Denis fight Terry Sliver before being overwhelmed, and take some blows from him (Though they are in protective gear). Daniel beats up Denis quickly, and Barnes also does the same. (I've heard they are Snake and Denis, it's hard to tell since the videos show it in a poorer quality to see their faces after they take after their gear)
- Karate Kid 2. Likely students (Since they accompany and do Karate) of Sato's dojo and Chozen are able to take strikes and get up, a young Chozen taking the strikes pretty good by getting up quickly after one strike from Miyagi and taking 2 more strikes then getting up. Also Chozen hurting Miyagi by striking him to the back with a weapon. Daniel who is a teen also scales to this by his fight with Chozen for obvious reasons, and Daniel briefly KO's this same guy who took strikes from Miyagi. Miyagi if not obvious already, scales from a physically Prime Kreese and Silver.
- Chozen quickly dispatches of multiple military police in-training, who are obviously adults.
- Robby hurts Johnny, although he shrugs it off quite easily. The narrative is that Johnny NEEDS to block Robby's attacks, cause he'll get hurt otherwise. Also add that Johnny in the same fight was also able to shrug off Kreese's blows.
- Students are able to spar with Daniel and Johnny, notably Miguel is able to redirect Johnny's movement and take a kick while kiai'ing (This is supposed to make an attack stronger). Meanwhile, Bert and Demetri can take a hit from them. It's not that strong on its own, but with all the evidence above it should make sense.
In terms of the Karate Kid Teen characters, they'd scale to Modern day teens that did the above and Mike Barnes breaking bricks.
I think that clears it enough that a comparison at least rough should be made. For all characters, the rating should be at least 9-C, assuming that the Wall level downgrade is completely accepted.
Speed:
I feel there isn't really anything to solidify that they are peaked at human speed, though however, Johnny does keep up with a professional MMA fighter so perhaps staying at Peak human should be fine for now. Some support feats are Julie Pierce reacting and doing a move at point-blank range of a vehicle coming at her, along with Daniel and Miyagi catching a fly. However, their running speed has never shown to be through running and have no where near Usain Bolt speed. So Athletic Human, with Peak Human combat and reaction speeds is more fitting. The VS Battles Wiki does have Superhuman for Boxers so that can maybe apply to adults, the teens don't keep up to the same pace but still roughly do so. So backscaling to Peak Human is fine for them.
In terms of scaling the same thing for AP, Robby dodges attacks from Terry, Daniel reacts to attacks from Miyagi, Sam reacts to an attack from Kim Da-Eun, and Miguel attacks the adults, the same adults who could land blows on people like Johnny. The Miyagi-Do and Eagle-Fang students keep up with Chozen dodge and block attacks from him, notably Sam and Miguel. Denis and Snake keep up with Sliver, whom Daniel and Barnes can quickly overwhelm.
However, a thing that should be noted is Subsonic reaction speed scaling with Mr. Miyagi and why it should be removed from other profiles and turned into a possible for Miyagi.
The thing is this is a feat Miyagi did once in a later made movie for Karate Kid. However, the thing is Miyagi shouldn't be relatively far faster than the other characters. The point of Miyagi in the original Karate Kid movies was that his style was the right way and that he mastered it, not that he was so ungodly faster that no one could land a hit but that he was good at analyzing the room. So because of that, he SHOULD be on the same speed level as the other adults and relative to that speed. However, nothing really counters that other than the original intent for his feat of reacting to an arrow, so a possibly.
The original scaling was that Daniel was able to react to a fly that Miyagi had a hard time catching; however, the speed of a fly is not relevant to an arrow so no one should scale to this.
Untrained and Minor Character fighters should roughly scale to the major, main, and recurring characters.
Kyler and other high schoolers are able to get up from blows and even hurtPost-Time Skip Johnny at some points.In the same scene, Miguel can get up from a hit from Kyler with no karate experience, then later on when channelling his anger, hit him hard enough to send him to the ground along with another guy.Aisha can take a kick from Miguel who's had karate training for some time, then Aisha could knee him hard enough for him to be gasping for air. Miguel already pre-karate training was taking a hit from Kyler, who in turn can hurt Johnny.High schoolers specifically Kyler were able to take 7 blows before going down when Miguel was able to put his karate together.Normal adults while clearly inferior, were still able to press Johnny and his other buddies who were karate trained. One of them specifically has Johnny in a chokehold that he has a difficult time escaping, one of them takes a few hits from Johnny and even stuns Johnny with a hit to the face.Bikers are capable of taking a few blows from Johnny before going down.Demetri who basically couldn't do karate was able to take a hit from Hawk in Season 2Some minor characters were able to get up from a hit from Sam and RobbyWe see in the school fight minor characters are able to take hits from Hawk and one even staggers him in the fightBrucks is able to withstand 8 blows from an enraged Hawk and stand on his feet (albeit exhausting) before being beatenAt some points in the fight, adults were able to press Johnny and Daniel. One of them specifically takes 6 hits from both of them.In the house fight, minor characters are weaker but able to hurt Sam, Tory, Hawk, and recurring characters like Chris and Mitch. Mitch himself was able to spar with Eli.Other inmates accompanying Shawn were able to stun Robby with their hits. Second time one of them took 3 blows before going down.Daniel takes a hit from Johnny before training with MiyagiJessica is able to briefly knock out Dennis with a flowerpot who was competing with Terry Silver (With gear on though) and took a hard kick from Mike Barnes. She was gasping for air but was able to get up shortly afterwards.Kumiko is able to strangle Chozen which takes Chozen a bit to overpower her, although she is knocked out by a punch for the entire fightA prisoner is able to very briefly incapacitate Kreese with a punch
Far higher with Focused and Precise removal:
It should be noted that technically it's just them striking at their best so it should just be added to the normal AP. The reason they one-shot is a specific technique that is targeted towards the head. Kenny isn't far higher with Silver bullet purely because he hit the sternum.Karate Kid Page update:
Format the characters into what eras or generations (Modern Day, Vietnam, Late 1900s, WW2)Keep the dojos but have the characters show up in what dojo they've joined (So Hawk wouldn't show up thrice)Have them be identified as the first dojo they've joined- Karate Kid Series, Cobra Kai/Miyagi-verse, Remake categories.
Overall:
- Several additions and minors removals from profiles
- If wall level downgrade is accepted, then all characters get "At least 9-C."
- Characters have Athletic Human running speeds, with Peak Human combat and reaction speeds. However, their Subsonic reaction speed is removed, and Miyagi has his as a "possible."
- Reformat Karate Kid verse, although there needs to be discussion on what to do
- Remove focused and precise
- Several minor additions
Last edited:
