Classic and or Post-Flash point revision question

[The_2nd_Existential_Seed]

I am unsure which version of Swamp Thing this applies to . However , WoG said ( and before you say anything... I'm trying to find a scan now ) that God Swamp Thing could've easily surpassed the Presence if he choose to. Uhm... What the heck ? And also he is far superior to the Word, who was said to sing all of creation into being. Wouldn't this male him High 1-B to 1-A , because it seems in context the Word here was equal to the Presence, especially considering they said he would be equal or surpassing GOD, in which The Word was never recognized as GOD, rather a very poweeful entity comparable to the Presence.

And BTW, if he surpassed all of creation as said on the scans, wouldn't he be High 1-B to 1-A in DC terms, since All of Creation implies this much power ? The World Tree ( Yggdrassil ) was treated High 1-B, yet the classic version is rated High 2-A even though it says all of creation. May I ask what is the difference ?

 

[LephyrTheRevanchist]

I, too, want to know about this, so bump.

 

[Antvasima]

We generally do not accept WoG. We tend to go by the source material. However, you can ask Matthew to reply here if you wish.

 

[TheSandman31]

The Word isn't a High 1-B, he's only a 2-A

The Word also isn't the one who sang creation into being, you're thinking of The Voice.The Word was created when The Voice first open his mouth

No, The Word isn't equal to The Presence, The Word was created by The Voice which is just another aspect of the Presence.

The Logoz, which is similar or maybe even the same thing as The Voice was casually obliterated by Lucifer when he burned the highest tower in Heaven

Context matters, not just because it mentions Creation means it includes Higher Dimensions it could be just the universe or the multiverse for all we know

The World Tree is high 1-B not just because its roots stretches all across Creation

Its High 1-B because it brought back the Multiverse including its infinite higher dimensions, we know it did because Pralaya did not just destroyed the multiverse but also all of its dimensions (which is confirmed to be infinite)

Difference is Swamp Thing controls creation(no evidence of it including all higher dimensions) while The World Tree restored all of Creation (after all of its dimensions was destroyed by Pralaya)

 

[TheSandman31]

The classic version is only High 2-A because he is 5th dimensional (exist on the same level of existence as the Parliaments of Worlds who are 5-d beings), he transcends the 4-D multiverse but not the totality of creation.Also being beyond the Parliaments isnt enough for a 1-A rating

 

[Antvasima]

Thank you for helping to clear this up TheSandman31. Perhaps I should close this thread?

 

[LephyrTheRevanchist]

I found this. The Word states that ST's abilities rivalled that of the Voice himself.

 

[Antvasima]

Is he already scaled from this?

 

[LephyrTheRevanchist]

The profile doesn't mention it, so... No, I think? Ah, and BTW, that was when ST was in his incomplete God-Thing state (before adquiring control over the parliament of flames and beig one with the whole planet).

 

[Antvasima]

I will ask Matthew.

 

[The_2nd_Existential_Seed]

The voice has a high 1-B feat to 1-A if I remember correctly. Confirmed that The Voice Itself is what Sang all of creation by Phantom Stranger . So if the Green is far stronger than the Voice... Interesting implications indeed . ( I have a scan that says Universe means all of creation / totality of everything in Vertigo/DC via Author Statement ) . This is kinda important because Alan Scott ( WHo had the full Starheart , and the full extent of the Green's power ) was noselled & oneshotted by True Form Darkseid

Feats for swamp thing http://vk.com/topic-98774565_32754893?offset=0

Other bits and pieces of information i do not believe we have:

Other confirmation the Gren touches all realms and spaces in DC ( https://pp.userapi.com/c629209/v629209731/17ad0/UIVfXzjYFsI.jpg )

Implications that The Gree in and of itself is A LOT weaker than the Trinity of Sins ( Even with all the power of life, you cannot stop me. Confirmed when he says The Green WILL return, implying it was destroyed . ) , whomare an aspect of Pandora, who was effortlessly oneshotted by Manhattan .

Merlin can control all of time and space now ?

Mxy, despite having about 2 5-D feats, has supposedly A LOT of Outliers : Empoeror Joker effortlessly controlled Phantom Stranger and every member of the Quintessance , one which is PS, who can stalemate the current Spectre, who threatened all of creation once . He threateend everything that is, was , or ever will be [ This is Spectre saying it, so it's clearly a lot higher than High 2-A ] .

Proof Darkseid's power affected things well above that of just a 2-A rating . It basicallly released Mandrakk, a being of immense power.

The World Tree was apparently fully unlocked by the Green, and it was stated that the World Tree and The Green are interconnected [ Swamp Thing says it's a part of it, which makes sense considering he has a frction of it inside of him, which is presumably The Green ] .. So maybe it scales to it ? ( Images right here friends ) . Also, remember that in these exact scans it says that Swamp Thing was always connected to a fraction of the World Tree, and said fraction was enough to remake the High 1-B Multiverse. Dang. That scales to quite a few people whom are >>> The Green if that's the case.

[http:// http://static2.comicvine.com/uploads/original/11130/111302904/5567032-0098319778-16.jp.jpg Confirmation that The Green is a power inside of Vertigo, and connects DC & Vertigo together ]

You think Anti-Monitor being able to destroy Dark Multiverse is inconsistent hmm ? What about the Monitors of Smallville, who can cause High 1-B damage themselves using The Bleed .

I can't help but notice that in Grant Morrison's map of Multiversity he personally drew, Destiny , The Bleed , and Heaven are all outside the realm of the Source .

 

[Antvasima]

Darkseid has been firmly established as spatially 4-dimensional, and DC is very inconsistent. We cannot apply too much scaling between different writers with very different standards to set Alan Scott and Darkseid at High 1-B.

 

[Antvasima]

I would appreciate if you would stop making these types of "let's scale everybody to ridiculously high tiers, regardless whether or not it makes sense" posts. They are extremely tiresome, and won't ever lead anywhere.

 

[Antvasima]

Also, we are going by the final official map of the DC multiverse, not an early sketch.

 

[Matthew_Schroeder]

Swamp Thing is 2-A. The end. I was the one who actually read a ton of the comics.

 

[Antvasima]

Okay.

 

[The_2nd_Existential_Seed]

I was just mentioning a few feats in addition to the ones you had , Matthew . That is it.