Clarification about Higher Dimensional Existence as well as Uni+ ap.

[Tyrone_Dawson]

If a character were able to control quantum physics, space-time, physics, quantum randomness, and entropy on an absolute scale within a 4-D universe would that grant the said character 4-D stand possibility Uni+ Ap? Or would the character need to affect the structure as a whole rather than just its foundations to be granted Uni+ Ap?

 

[StrikingMosquito245]

From what I know, they would need to affect the structure as a whole. The things you mentioned like physics, quantum randomness, and entropy are still just elements existing inside the structure, rather than the 4-D space-time fabric itself. Therefore, you cannot grant Uni+ AP based on that

 

[Tyrone_Dawson]

From what I know, they would need to affect the structure as a whole. The things you mentioned like physics, quantum randomness, and entropy are still just elements existing inside the structure, rather than the 4-D space-time fabric itself. Therefore, you cannot grant Uni+ AP based on that

The narrative mentions Space-Time as well and it says on an absolute scale within this universe which leads me to believe he can effect the space time as a whole.

 

[StrikingMosquito245]

The narrative mentions Space-Time as well and it says on an absolute scale within this universe which leads me to believe he can effect the space time as a whole.

Yeah, I don't think that helps your point. Sure, a character can affect space-time on a universal scale, but does the space-time continuum itself remain intact? If it does, this doesn't qualify for AP and is more likely just high-level Space-Time Manipulation. Another contention would be the word "absolute" we can't really infer from that word how much dimensional energy is released. It could just be a description of how effective or precise the power is in-universe. Lastly, you said it yourself: "within the universe". I think that in itself is a disqualifier, as you would need to destroy or create the 4-D structure as a whole, rather than just messing with things inside of it.

 

[Tyrone_Dawson]

Yeah, I don't think that helps your point. Sure, a character can affect space-time on a universal scale, but does the space-time continuum itself remain intact? If it does, this doesn't qualify for AP and is more likely just high-level Space-Time Manipulation. Another contention would be the word "absolute" we can't really infer from that word how much dimensional energy is released. It could just be a description of how effective or precise the power is in-universe. Lastly, you said it yourself: "within the universe". I think that in itself is a disqualifier, as you would need to destroy or create the 4-D structure as a whole, rather than just messing with things inside of it.

Well the universe itself isn’t 4-D but actually 12-D the Surface layer is 4-D but there are other layers that are more foundational. And within the tiering system it states that a character could qualify if they can “significantly affect” a 4-D structure. Changing the physics, laws, and nature of a 4-D structure would qualify for “Significantly Affecting”.

 

[StrikingMosquito245]

So question are you saying that the character affect a 12d universe or a 4d universe because if it's only the 4d universe and nothing else this seems irrelevant to the argument. And on that second point yes sure but again is said character affecting the structure in itself or are they using things within the structure to affect it? Cause if it's the latter that would again be a Hax and not AP.

 

[Tyrone_Dawson]

So question are you saying that the character affect a 12d universe or a 4d universe because if it's only the 4d universe and nothing else this seems irrelevant to the argument. And on that second point yes sure but again is said character affecting the structure in itself or are they using things within the structure to affect it? Cause if it's the latter that would again be a Hax and not AP.

They are affecting the structure using their own power.

 

[StrikingMosquito245]

So hmm seems like my points did not really come across so let me reframe myself a bit: the powers you listed don't automatically qualify for Uni+ AP. Having absolute control over physics, entropy, quantum randomness etc. are all impressive abilities but they speak to what the character can do not how much structural damage they output.
For Uni+ AP specifically you need showings that demonstrate the character is actually threatening the 4D structure itself, not just operating powerfully within it. The distinction matters because having control over space time is not destroying or creating it. Manipulating physics and entropy implies that it affects things inside the structure. An example: Imagine you have absolute control over everything inside a Room down to the atomic level, you still are not able to affect the walls of the room, the floor or the ceiling. Why? Because this power applies only inside the Room. Which is why I was asking you for structural showings these powers are still within the scope of the structure unless we have different showings (which you haven't shown yet). You'd need some more concrete showings like turning existence into a complete void, timeless and spaceless, literally erasing past or future rather just altering it through the AP or threatening the 4D continuum itself or creating it. Without it I just don't see Uni+ here.

 

[AyOgUyS]

Just controlling space and time on its own is only Space-Time Manipulation rather than any level of Attack Potency.