Cirno tries to school the Scout in math class

[JoshDoshMosh]

another matchup based on a memes, these being them:


(Disintegration weapons are restricted for scout if need be, speed is equalized)

Cirno:

Scout:

Incon:

 

[Imaginym]

Hunh. Makes me wonder what their in-character moves are.
Scout is a Player Character in an.... Arena Third-Person Shooter, & Cirno is a.... Well, I'm not sure what she has, but she has Danmaku. Dodging lots of projectiles probably isn't a new experience for Scout.

That said, I haven't even viewed their profiles, nor checked their statistics or abilities.
So I wonder what will mix up this match?

 

[TheGatememer]

What can scout do about the Type 8?

 

[BeautifulDuwanged]

Does Cirno's type 8 stop incapacitation? Assuming she doesn't deal with Scout before he's able to incap, anyways.

 

[Pixy]

I like this match why it dead ? anyway Bumpapo

 

[Shmooply]

necro
Because Scout straight up can't do anything here. He's being showered by a swarm of danmaku by a flying opponent that he can't put down for good. Sure, Cirno's danmaku is ridiculously easy to dodge, but nothing is stopping her from flying to him and encasing his entire body in ice.

 

[DaReaperMan]

Scout is like, 500x her stats soooooooo...

 

[Shmooply]

Scout is like, 500x her stats soooooooo...

Doesn't matter when Cirno still has ways to beat him without relying on AP. He can't put her down for good due to her immortality and because his pistols are the only weapons that excel at long range combat, since Cirno won't ever get close enough for him to use his scatterguns or melee weapons, and once Cirno realizes he doesn't have any danmaku at all, nothing is stopping her from just making her ice-cold danmaku home in on him, or encase him in ice, or use Freeze Sign "Minus K" on him (Absolute Zero ability).

 

[FantaRin_The_First]

Cirno's things of being able to regenerate instantly when she dies and her own high-mid regeneration puts a damper on Scout's stat advantage, plus, speed is equal - eventually, Cirno will just outlast and freeze scout into an ice cube... although, she is an idiot, and I think Scout can actually out smart her if it comes down to that.

 

[Pixy]

necro
Because Scout straight up can't do anything here. He's being showered by a swarm of danmaku by a flying opponent that he can't put down for good. Sure, Cirno's danmaku is ridiculously easy to dodge, but nothing is stopping her from flying to him and encasing his entire body in ice.

Well I forget to mention Unfly characters vs Flyable character is a bit not fair Also what scout will do ? run and keep dodging danmaku and use pistol to hit her ? Cuz Scatter gun is SUCK above 10 - 20 M and will not hit anything above that range

l'll wait to see how this'll going

 

[Psychomaster35]

Pretty sure even with an AP disadvantage, Cirno would be hard to hit due to getting used to dodging high level danmaku, so the only way Scout wins is if he knocks her out or incapacitates her, which would be hard to do if he keeps oneshot killing her.

 

[FantaRin_The_First]

Hmm, I imagine Scout being given info about Cirno's full capabilities and the distance between them being set to one-to-three meters (give or take) might be enough to make this match fair for him, plus, giving him the info that he needs to knock her out or incap her as well. A bit wee disadvantageous for Cirno, maybe, but she still is good dodger and can screw over Scout with her ice manip.

 

[DaReaperMan]

Is it really possible to hold back by 500x? Cause off the top of my head I don't recall any of the mercs holding back that much

 

[FantaRin_The_First]

IDK, I'm just throwing out ideas, more or less.

 

[OnsokunoSonic]

Ice hax.

 

[Shmooply]

Scout has no way of holding back, since he's using weapons instead of his fists. The only way he could hold back is if he felt bad about killing something that looks like a little girl but is like two decades older than his mom over and over again.

 

[Imaginym]

So, does Scout have NO way of Incapacitation?

Also, regarding Cirno, how adept is she at flying? I know her being reputed as a baka... an idiot.... Well, quoting her profile:
Weaknesses: Cirno is stupid and naive and can get discouraged easily.

Also, from her summary:
Her personality is childish and she is sometimes considered stupid.

Scout is known for his mobility, & double-jumping. SBA says there's trees & such. If she's flying, could he try approaching by jumping on scenery?
What are the instances of Cirno getting discouraged? I'm wondering if such could come up here.

& if Scout treid to use his mobility to approach, how good is she at flying, & would Cirno be liable to fall prone to her naivety so as to not retreat effectively? Ex: Thinking the dumb human who couldn't even approach nor hit her all fight isn't a threat to the strongest fairy in Gensokyo?

How does she act when foes, especially those who can not fly, approach her when she's flying?

necro
Because Scout straight up can't do anything here. He's being showered by a swarm of danmaku by a flying opponent that he can't put down for good.

He's being showered by a swarm of danmaku?

Sure, Cirno's danmaku is ridiculously easy to dodge, but nothing is stopping her from flying to him and encasing his entire body in ice.

....He's being showered by it, but it's ridiculously easy to dodge?
Ridiculousy easy to dodge.... How so, dare I ask?

 

[OnsokunoSonic]

...He's being showered by it, but it's ridiculously easy to dodge?
Ridiculousy easy to dodge.... How so, dare I ask?

Compared to normal 2hu danmakus, it is easy to dodge. It's still hard to dodge depending on the enemy's experience.

 

[Imaginym]

Compared to normal 2hu danmakus,

I barely know how those are to begin with. I think I may have seen like memes or such months ago, more or less time ago

it is easy to dodge. It's still hard to dodge depending on the enemy's experience.

I'd assume Scout has good experience, due to regularly fighting in battles involving multiple combatants, including several with projectiles. (Heavy, Demoman, Soldier, Sniper, maybe other Scouts, maybe Medic, Spy, Pyro, maybe Engineer. Sentries are a thing, too. Though, obviously, not all of them are likely to have much influence on how much Scout has to dodge, & I don't know the specific instances like in official videos or comics very well.)

Any experts on Scout's experience?

 

[DaReaperMan]

Let's just say: not enough to deal with Touhou Danmaku. At all.

 

[FantaRin_The_First]

Honestly, I am of the opinion that Scout is potentially capable of dodging Cirno's danmaku partly due to his own skill and experiences with bullshit and partly cuz Cirno is genuinely such a dumbass at times, however, well... Cirno will, in character, go up close and fight Scout at close range if we take into account the time that Cirno was apart of a Touhou Fighting Game and does have a tendency to spam her ice hax so she might just freeze Scout alive as soon as she can unless Scout has decently strong ice resistance.

 

[Imaginym]

Let's just say: not enough to deal with Touhou Danmaku. At all.

I doubt you'd be willing to provide me with evidence of why this is the case? No offense meant.

 

[DaReaperMan]

I doubt you'd be willing to provide me with evidence of why this is the case? No offense meant.

Well let's see, gets shot killing some bots, dies and is resurrected. That alone disproves him capable of dodging touhou danmaku. It's being speedy that lets him dodge without bonk, and he doesn't have that advantage here.

Also Scout can't cover a like 500x gap to hold back to beat Cirno, just not happening.

 

[Pixy]

I doubt you'd be willing to provide me with evidence of why this is the case? No offense meant.

Well compare to other fairies which there only 3 fairies that were important character and have show Danmaku pattern now
Cirno will be 2nd from Clownpiece and compare to pattern it easy to dodge but the other problem her close quarter fighting that strong enough to make her survived and win against the Nuclear Birb even she fight against okuu inside Okuu's Fusion Reactor core

and it's should have 2 notes
1. this nuke birb never hold back to anyone who dare enter her nest and she will nuke them on sight
2. Cirno vs Okuu is basically Idiot Fairy vs Birb Brain

So I leave it to you guys how this'll end then

 

[Imaginym]

So Scout would fail to dodge because he normally only dodges through Speed, not Skill?

So what about his Speed? From Optional Equipment:
Limited Flight (Can jump twice in mid-air with the Atomizer and five times with the Soda Popper), Statistics Amplification (Can temporarily increase his stats with certain weapons), Afterimage Creation with Bonk!
From Magic Spells and Power Ups:
Statistics Amplification and Size Manipulation (With Power Up)
Teleportation (with Shadow Leap), Invisibility (With Stealth), Explosion Manipulation (with Pumpkin MIRV), Summoning (with Skeleton Horde and Summon Monoculus)
From Upgrades:
Teleportation and Statistics Amplification with Teleport to Spawn Canteen (Teleports the user to spawn and gives a 5 second speed boost), Invulnerability with Become Ubercharged Canteen, Statistics Amplification with Become Crit Boosted Canteen

Could any of those help him dodge, or provide cover/distractions so he can approach?

& he can't hold back, so let's look at his other options.... & if he's so above Cirno, what about getting hit, but not getting frozen?

From Optional Equipment:
Status Effect Inducement with his Fan O'War and Sandman
From Magic Spells and Power Ups:
Damage Transferal with Reflect (80% of the damage dealt is reflected to the attacker), Disease Manipulation (Touching an enemy gives them the Plague), and Regeneration Negation (Block's King powerups regeneration), Status Effect Inducement (Supernova stuns all nearby players)
Regeneration (Unknown type) (With Regeneration, Vampire, and King),
Damage Reduction, Resistance to Disease Manipulation (With Resistance)
From Upgrades:
Regeneration (Unknown type), Self-Healing with Health on Kill, Statistics Reduction (Mad Milk can be upgraded to slow down covered Enemies)


Could ANY of those help Scout approach &/or Incapacitate Cirno? Plus, hasn't it been said in this thread Cirno's likely to go into close combat?
Is she as likely to go up close as she is attack from a distance? More? Less?

 

[Pixy]

Could ANY of those help Scout approach &/or Incapacitate Cirno? Plus, hasn't it been said in this thread Cirno's likely to go into close combat?
Is she as likely to go up close as she is attack from a distance? More? Less?

Yes, maybe quiet a bit but I think if he gonna outplay Cirno he has to know her pattern, skill and attack due to Cirno can fight in both close and far and he have to do it fast
but let's talk about this

Both in Char scenarios
Fairy never try to kill human they're child like everything they do that look like harm human is just prank, Most Dangerous Prank from fairy is create illusion that almost make someone fall off the cliff and that not from Cirno So Cirno will just playing around with scout even scout have a gun Cuz look from his profile he's not a big threat to her compare to Youkai if Scout smart enough maybe he'll try to use math question to use this chance to yeet her Cuz there report Regular Human escape from Cirno by waste her time with Regular Human Brain Question

Also Fairy never view Human as a threat or even enemy so Fairy try to kill human Scenario is a bit impossible
As long as You're human most dangerous think fairies will do to You is Trying to steal your item

that all I can say for inchar scenarios

 

[FantaRin_The_First]

To answer your question, Imaginyum...

In a fight that isn't considering characters, Scout can approach Cirno, which would cause her to go fight up-close, however... Incapacitation is extremely hard for Scout because he can quite possibly kill Cirno in a single hit, but, Cirno would be immediately come back and fight Scout right away since she is essentially a little kid who is extremely hard-headed but would be more prone to immediately abuse her hax since that is the norm due to her setting. Even if Scout gets to use all of the stuff you listed, he can't bypass the bullshit that is Touhou Fairy Immortality.

Like... The only way for Scout to obtain a victory here is if he can talk-no-justu Cirno into giving up and handing him the victory. If we disregard that, and what Pixy stated, Cirno will always win in the end due to her immortality and Scout's lack of resistance towards her hax means that he immediately dies once she decides she wants to kill him or cause an incap.

 

[Imaginym]

To answer your question, Imaginyum...

In a fight that isn't considering characters, Scout can approach Cirno, which would cause her to go fight up-close, however... Incapacitation is extremely hard for Scout because he can quite possibly kill Cirno in a single hit, but, Cirno would be immediately come back and fight Scout right away since she is essentially a little kid who is extremely hard-headed but would be more prone to immediately abuse her hax since that is the norm due to her setting. Even if Scout gets to use all of the stuff you listed, he can't bypass the bullshit that is Touhou Fairy Immortality.

Like... The only way for Scout to obtain a victory here is if he can talk-no-justu Cirno into giving up and handing him the victory. If we disregard that, and what Pixy stated, Cirno will always win in the end due to her immortality and Scout's lack of resistance towards her hax means that he immediately dies once she decides she wants to kill him or cause an incap.

Status Effect Inducement with his Fan O'War and Sandman
Can't he status Cirno with those?
Damage Transferal with Reflect (80% of the damage dealt is reflected to the attacker), Disease Manipulation (Touching an enemy gives them the Plague), and Regeneration Negation (Block's King powerups regeneration), Status Effect Inducement (Supernova stuns all nearby players)
Can't he Reflect Cirno's attacks with those to damage her based on how much damage she does, ergo, her AP? Thus, not killing her, or not triggering her Regeneration? Or using the Regeneration Negation?
Or giving her the Plague?

Those ways would be means of defeating her without killing her, since killing her would cause her Regeneration to happen, right?

 

[DaReaperMan]

Those require Cirno to ya know, be hit. That's a touhou character. Cirno is a dodge God.

 

[Imaginym]

Those require Cirno to ya know, be hit. That's a touhou character. Cirno is a dodge God.

She is? Despite her childish-ness, naivety, tendency to underestimate humans, willingness to go close, & even if all those aren't true Scout likely being skilled in CQC himself, as well as having Equipment that can increase his stats, including Speed?
Basis/Feats?

 

[FantaRin_The_First]

Status Effect Inducement with his Fan O'War and Sandman
Can't he status Cirno with those?
Damage Transferal with Reflect (80% of the damage dealt is reflected to the attacker), Disease Manipulation (Touching an enemy gives them the Plague), and Regeneration Negation (Block's King powerups regeneration), Status Effect Inducement (Supernova stuns all nearby players)
Can't he Reflect Cirno's attacks with those to damage her based on how much damage she does, ergo, her AP? Thus, not killing her, or not triggering her Regeneration? Or using the Regeneration Negation?
Or giving her the Plague?

Those ways would be means of defeating her without killing her, since killing her would cause her Regeneration to happen, right?

... Actually, that could work. Cirno doesn't have any resistance towards damage transferal, disease manipulation, status effect inducement, or regeneration negation. None of Scout's weapons are restricted 'sides the Disintegration weapons. And to counter DaReaperMan's words, speed is equalized nor does Cirno have any noteworthy close-combat skill, so Scout could possibly hit her... if Cirno doesn't, y'know, stay airborne hundreds of meters in the sky and pepper Scout with ice danmaku. Shadow Leap might be able to help close the distance, but that would require it to teleport Scout near Cirno. Although there is still the chance Cirno might choose to engage in close-combat with scout, he has that going for him.

 

[Imaginym]

... Actually, that could work. Cirno doesn't have any resistance towards damage transferal, disease manipulation, status effect inducement, or regeneration negation.

Truthfully, I don't like playing Devil's Advocate, especially against my own arguments, but....

1. How does Reflect's Damage Transferal work?

2. Is Reflect's damage based on damage dealt to Scout, or the power of Cirno's attack?
How will Scout being much more durable than Cirno's AP influence things? Do ALL of her moves negate Durability?

3. What Status Effects CAN he inflict? I know he has Stuns, but those I know of are temporary, & IDK if he has any Statuses that hinder the victim for longer because IDK TF2 statuses at all; For all I know, it's only a few seconds because everyone in TF2 has resistance to stunning or something.

4. How does the Regeneration Negation work?

None of Scout's weapons are restricted 'sides the Disintegration weapons.

Well, yes, but no. What the opening post said:

another matchup based on a memes, these being them:


(Disintegration weapons are restricted for scout if need be, speed is equalized)

Cirno:

Scout:

Incon:

So some of Scout's weapons ARE restricted.
But also:

Standard Battle Assumptions

The following are the assumptions to be made for battles in versus threads, if no alternative assumptions are specified by the thread creator. Assumptions alternative to these ones can be freely used, are equally legitimate, and threads using different assumptions can be added to profiles just...

vsbattles.fandom.com

Preparation time: None. That means there is no time between the character knowing there is going to be some battle and the point they may start killing each other. They are, in a single instant, transported to the battlefield from their everyday activities, equipped with their equipment, transformed to the character version they battle in and given the correct state of mind. In the same instant the battle starts and they may attack each other. They are assumed to not be surprised or disorientated from the sudden start.

Equipment: Standard equipment.

So, @JoshDoshMosh : Optional Equipment allowed for Scout? & if so, what Equipment & if so, what does who get? Is any excluded?

And to counter DaReaperMan's words, speed is equalized nor does Cirno have any noteworthy close-combat skill, so Scout could possibly hit her...

She doesn't? Wasn't Cirno in like, a 2-D fighter?

if Cirno doesn't, y'know, stay airborne hundreds of meters in the sky and pepper Scout with ice danmaku.

Does she do that IC? I've also been told she'd go in close.

I guess she goes in close when conceited, thinking she's just against a weak human, & spams projectiles when she thinks she's being challenged or such?

Shadow Leap might be able to help close the distance, but that would require it to teleport Scout near Cirno.

Is the location teleported to random?

Although there is still the chance Cirno might choose to engage in close-combat with scout, he has that going for him.

Fair.

 

[DaReaperMan]

Except Cirno does like hax in-character, plus she dodge god'd ol bird brain over there unless it's a hilarious outlier, and Scout's status effects and disease manipulation require scout to not be a nice little ice cube by the time he even gets that close let alone lands a baseball, plus Scout here is more likely to just shoot and go "why the hell won't you stay dead numnut?" Then use... oh, wait, Scout doesn't have any optional equipment here. And can only have one power up at a time. You smell what I'm stepping chief?

And you are very, very, very, VERY much wanking scout's regeneration negation to the point where it makes a porno look like virgins at play if you think it'll get around Cirno's type 8.

 

[Imaginym]

Except Cirno does like hax in-character, plus she dodge god'd ol bird brain over there unless it's a hilarious outlier,

But that was against another fairy that was powerful, right? Would Cirno act that way with a human? How would she act?

Scout doesn't have any optional equipment here.

Yeah, I brought that up in my newest post. Hoping @JoshDoshMosh notices this & clarifies whether Optional Equipment is allowed, & if so, which.

And can only have one power up at a time.

But he has more types of Equipment than Power-Up, right? & so long as 1 of those is a win condition, he has a way to win, right?
Even if it's not likely, wouldn't it help in part that Cirno would be spending a lot of time Regenerating, giving Scout time to realize these weapons aren't working?

And you are very, very, very, VERY much wanking scout's regeneration negation to the point where it makes a porno look like virgins at play if you think it'll get around Cirno's type 8.

As far as I know, Scout's profile does not seem to specify the level of Regeneration Negation that... Plague gives the victim, if I'm reading his Powers & Abilities sections right?
For those concerned, this is the text I'm trying to interpret regarding what the Regeneration Negation comes from: Disease Manipulation (Touching an enemy gives them the Plague), and Regeneration Negation (Block's King powerups regeneration)

 

[Shmooply]

....He's being showered by it, but it's ridiculously easy to dodge?
Ridiculousy easy to dodge.... How so, dare I ask?

I should've specified. Cirno will probably use one of her spell cards at the start of the fight, some of which are pretty easy to dodge like Icicle Fall, whose counter is to literally just stand infront of Cirno, which will make her miss all of the danmaku she uses in that spell card. However, it's debatable if Scout could actually get in her face, because:

Also, regarding Cirno, how adept is she at flying?

Like every other character in the verse, Cirno excels at dogfights and has good self-momentum. Despite her stupidity, she has managed to dodge the danmaku of Marisa, a powerful and highly-experienced spell card duelist.

However, once Cirno realizes that Scout can't even fly, and that he doesn't have any fancy bullet hell himself, she'll immediately break the rules, and, like I've said before;

nothing is stopping her from just making her ice-cold danmaku home in on him, or encase him in ice, or use Freeze Sign "Minus K" on him (Absolute Zero ability).

 

[Imaginym]

I should've specified. Cirno will probably use one of her spell cards at the start of the fight, some of which are pretty easy to dodge like Icicle Fall (and for some reason, my phone's copy-paste won't work, so I'll awkwardly type the sources. Icicle Fall is a spellcard from EoSD) whose counter is to literally just stand infront of Cirno, which will make her miss all of the danmaku she uses in that spell card. However, it's debatable if Scout could actually get in her face, because:


Like every other character in the verse, Cirno excels at dogfights and has good self-momentum. Despite her stupidity, she has managed to dodge the danmaku of Marisa (Insert Marisa Kirisame's profile here), a powerful and highly-experienced spell card duelist, in her own spin-off game (Fairy Wars).

However, once Cirno realizes that Scout can't even fly, and that he doesn't have any fancy bullet hell himself, she'll immediately break the rules, and, like I've said before;


I'll edit the scans into my post in about three to four hours, since I'm busy with real world stuff.

Okay, good luck. I eagerly await the results.
Also, break the rules of.... Fairy Spell Card fights by going into close combat instead of spamming Danmaku?

 

[DaReaperMan]

But that was against another fairy that was powerful, right? Would Cirno act that way with a human? How would she act?

Yeah, I brought that up in my newest post. Hoping @JoshDoshMosh notices this & clarifies whether Optional Equipment is allowed, & if so, which.

But he has more types of Equipment than Power-Up, right? & so long as 1 of those is a win condition, he has a way to win, right?
Even if it's not likely, wouldn't it help in part that Cirno would be spending a lot of time Regenerating, giving Scout time to realize these weapons aren't working?

As far as I know, Scout's profile does not seem to specify the level of Regeneration Negation that... Plague gives the victim, if I'm reading his Powers & Abilities sections right?
For those concerned, this is the text I'm trying to interpret regarding what the Regeneration Negation comes from: Disease Manipulation (Touching an enemy gives them the Plague), and Regeneration Negation (Block's King powerups regeneration)

Unless I'm misremembering, what ordinary humans in Touhou? Guns are hardly a thing and the only thing close to my knowledge is wielded by a High 3-A/Low 2-C. So Cirno might just be 100% serious immediately especially if she gets so one-shot

Not really, since his own IC Bites him in the ass and has him just one-shot Cirno immediately and get her serious. Also her regen is instant.

That's cause the regen it nulls is literally of unknown type, and the disease requires Cirno to be touched. Cirno can fly and abuses the living cum out of that
"Regeneration (Unknown type) (With Regeneration, Vampire, and King)"

 

[OnsokunoSonic]

What's being questioned rn?

 

[Shmooply]

Also, break the rules of.... Fairy Spell Card fights by going into close combat instead of spamming Danmaku?

Spell Card Rules apply to basically anyone in Gensokyo, not just the fairies.

 

[Imaginym]

What's being questioned rn?

I inquired about Scout's optional stuff, which has various Powers/Abilities listed, such as Statistics Amplification, Statistics Reduction, Status Effects, Inducement.
Some of it may provide win conditions.
See here, in Post #25 of this thread that you are in right now.

Also, I'm not that familiar with their skill/behaviour, nor do I know the "Spell Card Rules" or whatever "rules" (That Shmooply brought up.) that Cirno would be breaking by doing whatever it is Shmooply implied she might. Sorry for my stupidity.

Unless I'm misremembering, what ordinary humans in Touhou? Guns are hardly a thing and the only thing close to my knowledge is wielded by a High 3-A/Low 2-C. So Cirno might just be 100% serious immediately especially if she gets so one-shot

But Cirno knows of humans, at least, doesn't she? Doesn't she speak of or underestimate them?
Similarly, does she not know what a gun is, assuming she knows of humans?

Not really, since his own IC Bites him in the ass and has him just one-shot Cirno immediately and get her serious.

Scout goes for shoot first, power-ups & such later? But of course, at some point, IC options would become less likely because Scout can shoot Cirno & she dies.

Also her regen is instant.

Apologies for asking, but basis?

That's cause the regen it nulls is literally of unknown type,

What are the feats of the Regeneration that's being negated in TF2, that is of Unknown type?

and the disease requires Cirno to be touched. Cirno can fly and abuses the living cum out of that

But would she know to do that? Can Scout only use it when he has obvious symptoms? Does he give any telltale signs of it?

"Regeneration (Unknown type) (With Regeneration, Vampire, and King)"

Just leaving this part of the post in to make it clear I noted you mentioning what things are the basis for the Regeneration, I just don't know its feats.