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Chainsaw Man discussion thread

Soo I have a question about the matchups in Makima's Profile,

even tho Makima's Profile is now updated, The Matchups before the Update still hasn't been removed

for example Makima Vs Alucard
Cuz while Looking at the thread, I saw that this was back when makima was apparently High 8-C and 8-A while Alucard was 8-C

soo why are some of the old matchups still on her profile despite them using outdated scaling?
 
Eynooh said:
Soo I have a question about the matchups in Makima's Profile,

even tho Makima's Profile is now updated, The Matchups before the Update still hasn't been removed

for example Makima Vs Alucard
Cuz while Looking at the thread, I saw that this was back when makima was apparently High 8-C and 8-A while Alucard was 8-C

soo why are some of the old matchups still on her profile despite them using outdated scaling?
Click to expand...
If you see something like this, don't be afraid to remove them, I just didn't do it myself because I didn't have the time.
 
GunshyFever said:
If you see something like this, don't be afraid to remove them, I just didn't do it myself because I didn't have the time.
Click to expand...
I see..

I'd probably just removed the Makima vs Alucard one, cuz some of the matchups like "Vs Boa Hancock" is more hax based and not AP based and is also not that old, While Makima vs Alucard seems to be old af considering the very outdated Ap and they also accounted for ap

Actually, I should just do a Rematch for Both makima and Alucard since both have High 7-C Scaling now
 
I plan to add these 2 in the main page now, do you guys think they look clean now?

vsbattles.fandom.com

Eternity Devil

Eternity Devil (永えい遠えん の 悪あく魔ま, Eien no Akuma?) is a Devil embodying the fear of Eternity. It is the main antagonist of the Eternity Devil arc and the Dating Denji arc. Tier: Varies; 8-C physically | Varies; At least 9-A physically, possibly High 3-A via Pocket Reality Creation Key: Part 1 (w/...
vsbattles.fandom.com vsbattles.fandom.com
vsbattles.fandom.com

Fox Devil

Fox Devil (狐きつね の 悪あく魔ま, Kitsune no Akuma?) is a Devil embodying the fear of Foxes. It is a major contract devil that a lot of public safety Devil hunters made contract with. Tier: Varies; At least 9-A with paw strike, higher with head, at least 8-C with teeth Name: Fox Devil Origin: Chainsaw...
vsbattles.fandom.com vsbattles.fandom.com
 
Acertainbcplayer said:
I plan to add these 2 in the main page now, do you guys think they look clean now?

vsbattles.fandom.com

Eternity Devil

Eternity Devil (永えい遠えん の 悪あく魔ま, Eien no Akuma?) is a Devil embodying the fear of Eternity. It is the main antagonist of the Eternity Devil arc and the Dating Denji arc. Tier: Varies; 8-C physically | Varies; At least 9-A physically, possibly High 3-A via Pocket Reality Creation Key: Part 1 (w/...
vsbattles.fandom.com vsbattles.fandom.com
vsbattles.fandom.com

Fox Devil

Fox Devil (狐きつね の 悪あく魔ま, Kitsune no Akuma?) is a Devil embodying the fear of Foxes. It is a major contract devil that a lot of public safety Devil hunters made contract with. Tier: Varies; At least 9-A with paw strike, higher with head, at least 8-C with teeth Name: Fox Devil Origin: Chainsaw...
vsbattles.fandom.com vsbattles.fandom.com
Click to expand...
way better, the AP scaling for the eternity devil is inaccurate
 
Acertainbcplayer said:
Which? Gun flesh or part 2?
I see the darn thing now
Wait I don't see it, what's wrong again?
Ah dang I see it now, Eternity is supposed to scale from Denji's wrecking calc, I accidentally replaced it
Click to expand...
In the tier section there is High 3-A for his pocket reality creation, however, it is not enlisted in his AP section, either remove it, or add it
 
GunshyFever said:
In the tier section there is High 3-A for his pocket reality creation, however, it is not enlisted in his AP section, either remove it, or add it
Click to expand...
But that doesn't really scales to his Stats though? Couldn't we list it on the Tier only for the pocket reality creation feat but not add it in the stats section? Or is it still valid to add it into his AP section but only for the pocket reality creation feat?
 
Acertainbcplayer said:
But that doesn't really scales to his Stats though? Couldn't we list it on the Tier only for the pocket reality creation feat but not add it in the stats section? Or is it still valid to add it into his AP section but only for the pocket reality creation feat?
Click to expand...
It's a creation feat, it naturally wouldn't scale to his stats, it's just a measure of how large the structures he can create can be.
 
GunshyFever said:
It's a creation feat, it naturally wouldn't scale to his stats, it's just a measure of how large the structures he can create can be.
Click to expand...
Added it into Part 2 key. Also let me make sure again, is the AP scaling for Gun flesh Eternity right now okay? Or is the former one the right one (the backscaling one)?
 
Acertainbcplayer said:
Added it into Part 2 key. Also let me make sure again, is the AP scaling for Gun flesh Eternity right now okay? Or is the former one the right one (the backscaling one)?
Click to expand...
Would prefer the backscaling. The 800+ kg value was spread out over Denji's whole body and still broke both his arms. By contrast the hit that broke his neck was concentrated on his head.
 
koopa3144 said:
Freddy Krueger might be a good match for one of them. I was thinking of making a thread of him vs a primal but I can't decide on who to use.
Click to expand...
Only Aging would be able to match him due to the amount of hax (the regen is the worst part), his first form obviously gets obliterated by any primal fears, but then from what I can see he doesn't have dimensional traveling so then Aging would be able to sneak attack him from Hell and ends the fight with a banish.

Basically hax stomp as usual, ehhhhhhh....

Falling doesn't have much (or any at all) insta death hax, might be the best for a matchup.
 
Just gonna vent a general thought I had about CSM in terms of scaling and what I like about it. First, I think the CSM revisions are pretty amazing: there's a lot more links, evidence, and proper scaling that allows me to make more sense of how certain characters scale to one another. I think there're still a few pages that haven't been properly updated: Barem's page is still outdated and doesn't properly reflect the current speed and AP that characters in his tier have.

Anyway, the thing I've really come to enjoy is that the series sets hard limits on tiers and how powerful characters need to be. With the Primal Fears, their speed and power make it practically impossible for anyone to win. Darkness Devil's debut showed us exactly how screwed the protagonists were with its overwhelming AP and speed which allowed it to cut off all their limbs. Then there's Pochita: when he was awakened the first time, he easily blitzes and overpowers all the hybrids, and with his second awakening, we see that none of the characters even have the time to react, with the only character who could getting decapitated a second later. Quanxi also shows this: managing to blitz and hack the heads off every slower character to show just how strong and fast she is. When I see the massive differences in speed with the Supersonic+ and High Hypersonic+, I don't go with the usual, "Hey, how is there such a big speed gap when those characters can fight relatively evenly with one another?" Here, I absolutely see how there can be such a big speed gap because Fujimoto made it abundantly clear that there are tiers: that you can't drop a character from Tier 4 into a fight with Tier 1 and expect the Tier 4 character to put up a decent show. The only mild exceptions I see here are Yoshida and Kishibe being High 8-C+ despite taking hits from Quanxi, who's 8-A. Still, even then, Yoshida makes it clear he's only getting scrapping hits and a single direct hit would kill him, and the one hit where he drew blood from her could've just been like a lucky hit, and Quanxi most definitely held back against Kishibe due to their history.

Perhaps others here disagree or don't feel the way I do, but this is just one aspect of the series I find endearing. Even if I don't think CSM matches other great Shonen in terms of battle choreography or visuals, in terms of power-scaling, I think it's a lot cleaner than several of them.
 
Last edited:
CiscoTheSoto said:
Just gonna vent a general thought I had about CSM in terms of scaling and what I like about it. First, I think the CSM revisions are pretty amazing: there's a lot more links, evidence, and proper scaling that allows me to make more sense of how certain characters scale to one another. I think there're still a few pages that haven't been properly updated: Barem's page is still outdated and doesn't properly reflect the current speed and AP that characters in his tier have.

Anyway, the thing I've really come to enjoy is that the series sets hard limits on tiers and how powerful characters need to be. With the Primal Fears, their speed and power make it practically impossible for anyone to win. Darkness Devil's debut showed us exactly how screwed the protagonists were with its overwhelming AP and speed which allowed it to cut off all their limbs. Then there's Pochita: when he was awakened the first time, he easily blitzes and overpowers all the hybrids, and with his second awakening, we see that none of the characters even have the time to react, with the only character who could getting decapitated a second later. Quanxi also shows this: managing to blitz and hack the heads off every slower character to show just how strong and fast she is. When I see the massive differences in speed with the Supersonic+ and High Hypersonic+, I don't go with the usual, "Hey, how is there such a big speed gap when those characters can fight relatively evenly with one another?" Here, I absolutely see how there can be such a big speed gap because Fujimoto made it abundantly clear that there are tiers: that you can't drop a character from Tier 4 into a fight with Tier 1 and expect the Tier 4 character to put up a decent show. The only mild exceptions I see here are Yoshida and Kishibe being High 8-C+ despite taking hits from Quanxi, who's 8-A. Still, even then, Yoshida makes it clear he's only getting scrapping hits and a single direct hit would kill him, and Quanxi most definitely held back against Kishibe due to their history.

Perhaps others here disagree or don't feel the way I do, but this is just one aspect of the series I find endearing. Even if I don't think CSM matches other great Shonen in terms of battle choreography or visuals, in terms of power-scaling, I think it's a lot cleaner than several of them.
Click to expand...
Thank @ElajRuengies most of this wouldn't be possible without him!
CiscoTheSoto said:
When I see the massive differences in speed with the Supersonic+ and High Hypersonic+, I don't go with the usual, "Hey, how is there such a big speed gap when those characters can fight relatively evenly with one another?" Here, I absolutely see how there can be such a big speed gap because Fujimoto made it abundantly clear that there are tiers: that you can't drop a character from Tier 4 into a fight with Tier 1 and expect the Tier 4 character to put up a decent show.
Click to expand...
Even then, we're preparing for a massive speed revision, so stay in tune of that as well 👀
 
CiscoTheSoto said:
Just gonna vent a general thought I had about CSM in terms of scaling and what I like about it. First, I think the CSM revisions are pretty amazing: there's a lot more links, evidence, and proper scaling that allows me to make more sense of how certain characters scale to one another. I think there're still a few pages that haven't been properly updated: Barem's page is still outdated and doesn't properly reflect the current speed and AP that characters in his tier have.
Click to expand...
Gunshy's gonna redo Barem's page from the ground up since he called dibs, so pretend the current page just doesn't exist.
CiscoTheSoto said:
Anyway, the thing I've really come to enjoy is that the series sets hard limits on tiers and how powerful characters need to be. With the Primal Fears, their speed and power make it practically impossible for anyone to win. Darkness Devil's debut showed us exactly how screwed the protagonists were with its overwhelming AP and speed which allowed it to cut off all their limbs. Then there's Pochita: when he was awakened the first time, he easily blitzes and overpowers all the hybrids, and with his second awakening, we see that none of the characters even have the time to react, with the only character who could getting decapitated a second later. Quanxi also shows this: managing to blitz and hack the heads off every slower character to show just how strong and fast she is. When I see the massive differences in speed with the Supersonic+ and High Hypersonic+, I don't go with the usual, "Hey, how is there such a big speed gap when those characters can fight relatively evenly with one another?" Here, I absolutely see how there can be such a big speed gap because Fujimoto made it abundantly clear that there are tiers: that you can't drop a character from Tier 4 into a fight with Tier 1 and expect the Tier 4 character to put up a decent show.
Click to expand...
Ehhh, Hard-Defined Tiers are more a consequence of 90% of CSM fights being curbstomps rather than intentional huge gaps in power like in DBZ, and the curbstomps themselves are a consequence of really, really fast pacing.
CiscoTheSoto said:
The only mild exceptions I see here are Yoshida and Kishibe being High 8-C+ despite taking hits from Quanxi, who's 8-A. Still, even then, Yoshida makes it clear he's only getting scrapping hits and a single direct hit would kill him, and the one hit where he drew blood from her could've just been like a lucky hit, and Quanxi most definitely held back against Kishibe due to their history.
Click to expand...
Also the Aging - Pochita - Yoru Triangle.
And Makima not instantly dying against Darkness.
And spears being made of Wolverine Claws.
And Fumiko's midriff being tougher than Public Safety Uniforms.
And Fakesaw Man parrying a Bang- actually wait no that one's cool enough that I don't care about the scaling for it.
CiscoTheSoto said:
Perhaps others here disagree or don't feel the way I do, but this is just one aspect of the series I find endearing. Even if I don't think CSM matches other great Shonen in terms of battle choreography or visuals, in terms of power-scaling, I think it's a lot cleaner than several of them.
Click to expand...
While it's not the most incoherent, it can be pretty dang confusing. If it looks clean, it's because we spent months scrubbing off the dirt.
 
Zabazab said:
@GunshyFever What are you plotting with the chapter 87 scan...
Click to expand...
Tehee I'm plotting an evil scheme to downgrade the verse. But jokes aside, I'm just checking on something that's got me a bit confused. In the official translation, Makima states, "You fought the weapon devils and the four horsemen, who are now here." But I've seen other translations that change the context. For example, one has Makima saying they fought you, which confirms the four horsemen as the pursuers. Then there's another where she says "he fought the weapon devils, and among them, four knights," which suggests that the four horsemen are considered weapon devils. And finally, in some translations, Makima uses pronouns referring to herself, saying "I tried searching for you after you suddenly disappeared." Instead of saying (we) (all of the four horsemen) were involved, this changes a lot because if the four horsemen did come to Earth to seek Pochita, they should logically be on Earth too, which aligns with the original scan. However, the later translations make it seem like Makima was the only one involved in the search. Among other minor issues.
 
I present you, a cool matchup between 2 of my most favorite verses:

vsbattles.com

Falling Devil vs Kakine Teitoku

speed equalized (doesn't apply for Kakine's SoL attacks, or anything that might be faster that he could throw out), Pre-revival Kakine, fight happens in Academy City otherwise SBA Falling: Kakine: Inconclusive:
vsbattles.com vsbattles.com
 
ElajRuengies said:
Ehhh, Hard-Defined Tiers are more a consequence of 90% of CSM fights being curbstomps rather than intentional huge gaps in power like in DBZ, and the curbstomps themselves are a consequence of really, really fast pacing.
Click to expand...
Perhaps, but with such large tier gaps, curbstomps happen. Like I said before, I don't believe CSM has the best overall fights, and I think the fact that there's chainsaws prevent many more intricate fighting styles or fighting techniques from being displayed, but at least I know what to expect when a powerful character appears on-screen.
ElajRuengies said:
Also the Aging - Pochita - Yoru Triangle.
Click to expand...
That just shows they became comparable; don't see why it's that big a deal.
ElajRuengies said:
And Makima not instantly dying against Darkness.
Click to expand...
Makima's got hax that caught Darkness Devil off-guard, and was literally about to die had she not gotten herself and everyone else out of Hell.
ElajRuengies said:
And spears being made of Wolverine Claws.
Click to expand...
I don't get this one.
ElajRuengies said:
And Fumiko's midriff being tougher than Public Safety Uniforms.
Click to expand...
I mean, we know shit about who or what Fumiko really is, so I wouldn't put too much weight behind that one as an inconsistency.
ElajRuengies said:
And Fakesaw Man parrying a Bang- actually wait no that one's cool enough that I don't care about the scaling for it.
Click to expand...
Don't have much to say about this one. Maybe she didn't fire seriously or at full speed cuz she assumed it was just another weaker pseudo-Chainsaw Man?
ElajRuengies said:
While it's not the most incoherent, it can be pretty dang confusing. If it looks clean, it's because we spent months scrubbing off the dirt.
Click to expand...
And that's why you guys are awesome.
 
Last edited:
Saqphire said:
Lowk feel like Gun Goddess should be way faster if we already accept Yoru's weaponification speed's timeframe via the Mach 1 statement (albeit that leaves out the AP scaling due to the feat reaching FTL+ but honestly I'm fine with that)
Click to expand...
It should be way faster considering how Yoru's hair looks frozen in time anyways (hair calc W again...), but we gotta go with 2 seconds first, hair calc is still looking dead anyways...

Also it's not FTL+ btw, it's relativistic.
 
Acertainbcplayer said:
It should be way faster considering how Yoru's hair looks frozen in time anyways (hair calc W again...), but we gotta go with 2 seconds first, hair calc is still looking dead anyways...

Also it's not FTL+ btw, it's relativistic.
Click to expand...
With that distance? Even using the classic 1 meter / (speed) formula to get a timeframe (which seems to be accepted usually), with speed being Mach 1, Gun Goddess already gets to 33 times the speed of light bro, idk how u got Rel from that 😭
 
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