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Byleth vs Deku

Spinoirr

Spinoirr

He/Him
16,054
9,026
Speed is equal and both are 7-A (45% Deku vs Base Byleth).

Byleth: 6
Izuku: 9
Icon:
female_byleth_is_here__by_mutationfoxy_dejmvwn-fullview.png
dek26ve-586f8616-f9c8-41c5-a7ed-248072da5ba2.png
 
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Divine Pulse gives Byleth an entire 12 resets at any point in the fight (including death) and Healing Focus allows them to easily outlast, along with Nosferatu. Byleth can also use Windsweep or trigger the Crest of Flames to prevent Deku from attacking.

I vote for Byleth
 
JustSomeWeirdo said:
Divine Pulse gives Byleth an entire 12 resets at any point in the fight (including death) and Healing Focus allows them to easily outlast, along with Nosferatu. Byleth can also use Windsweep or trigger the Crest of Flames to prevent Deku from attacking.

I vote for Byleth
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The only way they’re outlasting with their healing skills is if they actually manage to deal damage to Deku, which I’m very hard pressed to see ways that they would. Danger Sense + Analytical Prediction kinda hard shuts down Byleth’s skill and own attacks, since Deku can just stay on the defensive and they have no way of actually hitting him. Even when factoring in healing skills, Deku can keep this up for hours to several days straight, even if he takes hits.

The rewind is good, but it’s not enough to help the win outright. Namely because Deku will just adapt around their future knowledge with his intellect and change his own tactics too. From what I’m seeing, Byleth has a high susceptibility to basically all of Deku’s quirks, which makes the possibility of them getting caught by Blackwhip or beaten down by Fa Jin incredibly high. Deku has enough intelligence and versatility that rewinding time to avoid one lose condition does not give you immunity to him doing it again but differently.

These are my current stances on Byleth;

1) Byleth’s enhanced senses seem to not be good enough to get past smokescreen, meaning he can use it to grab Byleth with Blackwhip.

2) Byleth has no way of getting past Deku’s precognition + prediction to actually land blows on him.

3) Byleth is colossally outclassed in LS, so Blackwhip is an instant loss and guaranteed several resets. He could literally grab the sword of the creator and yank them to himself while binding them with Blackwhip.

4) Deku is ridiculously more athletic and mobile than Byleth is. So on top of precognition and predicting his moves, he can just fly in the air while avoiding all their attacks making the possibility of them harming him nil.

5) Rewinds only matter for the loses they are guaranteed to have, and they’re limited. Unless there’s a way for them to actually kill Deku through all his defensive abilities, they’re useless other than prolonging the fight.

6) Healing doesn’t matter if they get restrained by Blackwhip and he can fight for hours to days anyway. He outlasts unless they can do damage to him. Which is hard to do.
 
For Byleth, this is like fighting a flying 999 Speed character who hits just as hard as them and can instantly win a fight by binding them with a dozen tendrils, all while being able to predict their movements to most effectively capture them.

Resets are only going to do so much. They only alert Byleth of how they are going to lose in one instance, they don’t let them know that Deku is just flat out better at predicting and can switch up at literally any point in time to try again.
 
Kingofwolves999 said:
The only way they’re outlasting with their healing skills is if they actually manage to deal damage to Deku, which I’m very hard pressed to see ways that they would. Danger Sense + Analytical Prediction kinda hard shuts down Byleth’s skill and own attacks, since Deku can just stay on the defensive and they have no way of actually hitting him. Even when factoring in healing skills, Deku can keep this up for hours to several days straight, even if he takes hits.

The rewind is good, but it’s not enough to help the win outright. Namely because Deku will just adapt around their future knowledge with his intellect and change his own tactics too. From what I’m seeing, Byleth has a high susceptibility to basically all of Deku’s quirks, which makes the possibility of them getting caught by Blackwhip or beaten down by Fa Jin incredibly high. Deku has enough intelligence and versatility that rewinding time to avoid one lose condition does not give you immunity to him doing it again but differently.

These are my current stances on Byleth;

1) Byleth’s enhanced senses seem to not be good enough to get past smokescreen, meaning he can use it to grab Byleth with Blackwhip.

2) Byleth has no way of getting past Deku’s precognition + prediction to actually land blows on him.

3) Byleth is colossally outclassed in LS, so Blackwhip is an instant loss and guaranteed several resets. He could literally grab the sword of the creator and yank them to himself while binding them with Blackwhip.

4) Deku is ridiculously more athletic and mobile than Byleth is. So on top of precognition and predicting his moves, he can just fly in the air while avoiding all their attacks making the possibility of them harming him nil.

5) Rewinds only matter for the loses they are guaranteed to have, and they’re limited. Unless there’s a way for them to actually kill Deku through all his defensive abilities, they’re useless other than prolonging the fight.

6) Healing doesn’t matter if they get restrained by Blackwhip and he can fight for hours to days anyway. He outlasts unless they can do damage to him. Which is hard to do.
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1. Byleth has fought through fog before and reacted to attacks coming from behind in relatively safe environments (such as literally just walking around the monastery), he's not gonna just lower his guard because of smoke

2. Perhaps, Deku also literally cannot fight through Windsweep or a CoF activation. Byleth is also highly capable of dodging

3. Cool, now Byleth resets and knows to evade, they also have combat arts to allow them to evade while staying on the offensive like with Fading Blow, Prowess skills also help on the evasion side of things

4. Byleth uh, literally has ranged options and has fought flying opponents before, I don't even understand the argument of "he flies away and sits there while Byleth can't reach", Chalice also exists

5. Sure, but if Deku literally gives Byleth a single opportunity to kill him at any point prior to a reset, Byleth could just go there and take it, it's not even unreasonable to suggest they'd just go back to the start and spam Windsweep, which would pretty much neg Deku on the spot

6. Only Nosferatu and Draining Blow require damage, Healing Focus can just be used whenever and just heals Byleth
 
JustSomeWeirdo said:
1. Byleth has fought through fog before and reacted to attacks coming from behind in relatively safe environments (such as literally just walking around the monastery), he's not gonna just lower his guard because of smoke

2. Perhaps, Deku also literally cannot fight through Windsweep or a CoF activation. Byleth is also highly capable of dodging

3. Cool, now Byleth resets and knows to evade, they also have combat arts to allow them to evade while staying on the offensive like with Fading Blow, Prowess skills also help on the evasion side of things

4. Byleth uh, literally has ranged options and has fought flying opponents before, I don't even understand the argument of "he flies away and sits there while Byleth can't reach", Chalice also exists

5. Sure, but if Deku literally gives Byleth a single opportunity to kill him at any point prior to a reset, Byleth could just go there and take it, it's not even unreasonable to suggest they'd just go back to the start and spam Windsweep, which would pretty much neg Deku on the spot

6. Only Nosferatu and Draining Blow require damage, Healing Focus can just be used whenever and just heals Byleth
Click to expand...
1) I didn’t say their guard would lower, just that they don’t seem to have good enhanced senses. So smokescreen is just a good option. Probably. Or it’s useless. It doesn’t change much, that quirk sucks and I’m honestly just looking for fights where it’s in any way relevant.

2) I mean, how much can they use those attacks? And how do they “stop counterattacks”? If Deku just proactively attacks them or tries to restrain them, does that count as an attack? Can he not attack while they are attacking or not attack at all? What defines a counterattack? How long does this ability last? Does it have limited uses?

3) Deku adapts around them trying to evade and captures them with a different application of Blackwhip. That’s the issue here: Deku will and can adapt faster than Byleth will. He’s far smarter than them in a straight fight. If Byleth dodges Blackwhip, Deku is just going to start using it more creatively or at different times. The quirk is too versatile to say “oh they know about it so they can avoid it now.” It can come out of any part of his body, so they are never safe from Blackwhip nor ever know when he’s going to use it. They will be burning resets like crazy trying to keep up with Blackwhip. Also they’ll get tired very quickly if they’re spamming as many skills as you’re saying they will. From what I recall, those skills are limited no?

4) That wasn’t the argument, it was that he’s ridiculously more mobile. Also he can actually fly out of their range. The counterattack from everywhere thing doesn’t matter because he’d still just dodge it with Danger Sense.

5) Deku dodges Windsweep and stays on the defensive until he can fight back. They literally cannot hit him, especially if they’re going to use the same move over and over. Their fighting ability is no where near enough to get past his base intelligence let alone his precognition. Them spamming is worthless other than prolonging the fight

6) Considering that Deku’s win condition is restraining them and then beating them unconscious, I don’t think healing is going to matter much other than, again, prolonging the fight.

A majority of Byleths options seem to be about prolonging the fight and getting rid of what your opponent has done. But none of them help them actually hit Deku. Ever. Couple that with him having immense stamina and a constantly adapting fighting style, and Byleth can’t really do anything that sticks. So they’re just stuck using fight extenders until they inevitably run out of options or he finds a gap in their armor and forces a reset. Then does it again and again until they run out.
 
The resets don’t matter if Byleth can’t find a way to actually hit him. And it’s not like they have infinite stamina to figure out everything he’s capable of doing.

Like, by which reset are they even going to learn he has precognition? Or that Blackwhip can come out of any part of his body? Or about Fa Jin?

Yes, they can avoid his abilities, but he’s just going to use them differently every time they come back if they avoid it the first time. It’s not like knowing he can spawn Blackwhip randomly without any warning from any part of his body is going to help then when they’re already struggling to land hits on him to begin with. Deku’s ability to understand what is happening and respond to it is being heavily underplayed here.

Look at this from Deku’s perspective: all he’s seeing is someone avoiding his attacks pretty good, but who can’t really hit him back as well unless they do a sick dodge and counterattack, which he can sense and avoid. He might even think they have a version of Danger Sense given how well they will be avoiding him. So naturally, he’s just going to keep trying new tricks to see what sticks.

Unless Byleth can put him down through not only his ridiculous defensive dodging abilities, but also immense stamina and willpower, they will get tired long before he does, or will run out of resources.
 
It’s like this: picture you have someone with no weapons and a guy with a gun that has multiple settings. The guy with no weapons can rewind time. The guy with the gun has precognition.

Rewind guy runs forward. Gun guy shoots rewind guy. Rewind guy goes back and runs to the left. Gun guy changes his guns settings and shoots Rewind guy again.

Rewind guy goes back and flies in the air. Gun guy changes his settings and shoots Rewind guy again.

Rewind guy goes back and runs to the left. He avoids Gun guys bullet cause he knows where he’s going to shoot and closes in on him. Gun guy changes his guns settings again and shoots Rewind guy.

Rewind guy goes back and gets to the same situation, avoiding both shots. Gun guy ducks out of the way of his attack and shoots him anyway.

He does it again and predicts Gun guys dodge. Gun guy, who has precognition, sees that Rewind guy is trying to catch his dodge, and blocks it completely. He then changes the gun settings and shoots him again.

In this scenario, regardless of what Rewind guy does, Gun guy has enough options and is smart enough to react to what he’s going to do, even though he’s seeing it for the first time and is unaware of the rewind even happening. So when you then put a limit on the number of times Rewind guy can go back, the situation looks very very bleak.
 
Spinoirr said:

At 5:12
Click to expand...

Oh, well kinda I guess?

It’s not really time stop as it is… the preparation for the rewind? Because they can’t do anything either. So idk how effective it really is in combat. Rewind seems like the main function for Divine Pulse.

Like, them stopping time doesn’t seem to grant them much benefit, and idk how often they use the “stopped time” function over the “rewind time” function in character.
 
Kingofwolves999 said:
1) I didn’t say their guard would lower, just that they don’t seem to have good enhanced senses. So smokescreen is just a good option. Probably. Or it’s useless. It doesn’t change much, that quirk sucks and I’m honestly just looking for fights where it’s in any way relevant.

2) I mean, how much can they use those attacks? And how do they “stop counterattacks”? If Deku just proactively attacks them or tries to restrain them, does that count as an attack? Can he not attack while they are attacking or not attack at all? What defines a counterattack? How long does this ability last? Does it have limited uses?

3) Deku adapts around them trying to evade and captures them with a different application of Blackwhip. That’s the issue here: Deku will and can adapt faster than Byleth will. He’s far smarter than them in a straight fight. If Byleth dodges Blackwhip, Deku is just going to start using it more creatively or at different times. The quirk is too versatile to say “oh they know about it so they can avoid it now.” It can come out of any part of his body, so they are never safe from Blackwhip nor ever know when he’s going to use it. They will be burning resets like crazy trying to keep up with Blackwhip. Also they’ll get tired very quickly if they’re spamming as many skills as you’re saying they will. From what I recall, those skills are limited no?

4) That wasn’t the argument, it was that he’s ridiculously more mobile. Also he can actually fly out of their range. The counterattack from everywhere thing doesn’t matter because he’d still just dodge it with Danger Sense.

5) Deku dodges Windsweep and stays on the defensive until he can fight back. They literally cannot hit him, especially if they’re going to use the same move over and over. Their fighting ability is no where near enough to get past his base intelligence let alone his precognition. Them spamming is worthless other than prolonging the fight

6) Considering that Deku’s win condition is restraining them and then beating them unconscious, I don’t think healing is going to matter much other than, again, prolonging the fight.

A majority of Byleths options seem to be about prolonging the fight and getting rid of what your opponent has done. But none of them help them actually hit Deku. Ever. Couple that with him having immense stamina and a constantly adapting fighting style, and Byleth can’t really do anything that sticks. So they’re just stuck using fight extenders until they inevitably run out of options or he finds a gap in their armor and forces a reset. Then does it again and again until they run out.
Click to expand...
2. "Preventing Counterattacks" means that if he goes first and uses them, Deku can't strike back, also the limit for Windsweep is that it runs through weapon durability faster

3. Kinda covered in 2, Combat arts just make weapons break faster

4. Would Deku actually just air camp in character?

6. It's his win con, sure, but what does he lead with?
 
JustSomeWeirdo said:
2. "Preventing Counterattacks" means that if he goes first and uses them, Deku can't strike back, also the limit for Windsweep is that it runs through weapon durability faster

3. Kinda covered in 2, Combat arts just make weapons break faster

4. Would Deku actually just air camp in character?

6. It's his win con, sure, but what does he lead with?
Click to expand...
So wouldn’t their weapon just become unusable after a while if they spam those arts?

He wouldn’t air camp unless he feels threatened, but when he sees Byleth can’t fly and is very immobile compared to him, he will be using Float more than not.

His most standard line of attack would probably be leading with cqc, figuring out the opponents gimmick, then binding them with Blackwhip into a KO. His fighting style is “reactive”. It changes depending on what his opponent does, because he adapts it to fit his situation. So he could really start with any of his quirks to see what Byleth can do.

He revolves around “what can the opponent do, how do I avoid it, then how do I beat them.” So he spends a lot of the time dodging. So he’d know all of Byleth’s options long before Byleth knows all of his.
 
From what I gather, Danger Sense triggers based on like, hatred and anger and whatnot, right?

Byleth is emotionally stunted and wouldn't really feel anything towards some rando who started fighting him
 
JustSomeWeirdo said:
From what I gather, Danger Sense triggers based on like, hatred and anger and whatnot, right?

Byleth is emotionally stunted and wouldn't really feel anything towards some rando who started fighting him
Click to expand...
It triggers based on danger to Deku, not just bloodlust. It’s how he can sense bullets, which have no emotions or bloodlust. If it was solely person based it would suck.
 
Nierre said:
Really? When has he abused aerial advantage against someone who is immobile (compared to him)?
Click to expand...
He’s never fought anyone that couldn’t also fly or leap after him. He’s got in like 2 on-screen fights since he even got Float and the first one was him stomping Mucular. Why wouldn’t he take advantage of someone not being able to fly?
 
Deku leading with cqc gives Byleth 13 attempts to just stab him, with each further attempt giving them even greater knowledge to adapt, while Deku has (at that point) not adapted yet

There's also the surprise factor of the Sword of the Creator being a whip, Danger Sense doesn't seem to tell Deku what's gonna come at him, just that something is

Deku has to win flawlessly 13 times (if you give Byleth even a single opening, he WILL rewind to that exact point and take it) and with all due respect, I can't see that happening
 
JustSomeWeirdo said:
Deku leading with cqc gives Byleth 13 attempts to just stab him, with each further attempt giving them even greater knowledge to adapt, while Deku has (at that point) not adapted yet

There's also the surprise factor of the Sword of the Creator being a whip, Danger Sense doesn't seem to tell Deku what's gonna come at him, just that something is

Deku has to win flawlessly 13 times (if you give Byleth even a single opening, he WILL rewind to that exact point and take it) and with all due respect, I can't see that happening
Click to expand...
Your first mistake is thinking that stabbing Deku is going to even kill him. They would need to get an instant kill shot in order to beat him, and that’s AFTER getting past him realizing they are going to attack in the first place and dodging. Also, attempting to get that kill shot through his mobility and predicting their moves? It’s going to take more than 13 tries to do that.

Your scenario of him fighting perfectly relies on him only doing cqc and not his other quirks. Lets say he gets in cqc and goes right for Blackwhip. Is Byleth going to continue trying cqc? Especially when, no matter what kind of attacks they do, he can sense and predict them? And they have no way of knowing how he’s doing it?

You are overestimating the information they are gaining from resetting. All they are learning is what movement he is going to make for that particular instance. When they go back and try to adjust themselves for that instance, he’s still going to sense them trying to adjust. He will then adjust too. They try to attack him when he goes for a kick? He blocks the sword. They try to side step him? He grabs them with Blackwhip out of his back.

He does not have to win flawlessly, he can take getting stabbed and slashed several times. The issue is Byleth even managing to get to that point when they only have 13 tries. I doubt it would take less than 6-7 tries to even understand that Blackwhip can just spawn from wherever he wants it to come from. No matter how many times they try to replay the fight, they are going to encounter a wall where he just avoids their attacks or blocks them completely.

Also, he would just yank the Sword of the Creator out of their hands with Blackwhip if they tried that with him. He can predict attacks that are faster than him, so it’s not like he can ever get caught off guard reliably. His Mid Gauntlets also function as mini-shields for his arms so he can block their sword (though they tend to not hold up forever) and he has enough stamina to just get hit and keep going.

They need more than 13 tries.
 
JustSomeWeirdo said:
Deku leading with cqc gives Byleth 13 attempts to just stab him, with each further attempt giving them even greater knowledge to adapt, while Deku has (at that point) not adapted yet

There's also the surprise factor of the Sword of the Creator being a whip, Danger Sense doesn't seem to tell Deku what's gonna come at him, just that something is

Deku has to win flawlessly 13 times (if you give Byleth even a single opening, he WILL rewind to that exact point and take it) and with all due respect, I can't see that happening
Click to expand...
Considering the starting distance between them Byleth would probably start out with the Whip Version of their sword allowing Deku to know about it straight from the get go since they're both pretty far away from each other starting out.
 
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