BTD6 TORNAMENT ROUND 1 Apache Dartship VS Wizard Lord Phoenix(Grace)

[JustANormalLemon]

THIS IS A TOURNAMENT WERE THE WINNER MONKEY GET A LIFE SUPPLY OF BANANAS!!! SO LET'S START THIS BATTLE!!

FOR THE FIRST ROUND WE HAVE TO FITTING AERAL MANACES!! ONE BORN FROM MAGIC AND THE OTHER FROM THE TECHNOLOGY!!! THE FIRE BIRD MAGE VS THE MILITAR AERIAL VEHICLE!!! THE:

APACHE DARTSHIP VS WIZARD LORD PHONEIX

RULES:

• Only 8-B key for both, the said upgrades above are the used ones (AD=4-2-2)(WM=2-5-2)
• Battle takes place at the Logs map both start at oposite ends of the map extension
• Speed is NOT equalized
• Remenber, only Apache Prime has plama manipulation, and only his missels are homing

Apache Dartship:

Wizard Lord Phoenix: 7 (Noneless21, Peppersalt43, Sero, ProPlayerJohn, FRIMI, DemonicDude, me)

Round 63(incon):

 

[Sero]

I'M HERE.

 

[JustANormalLemon]

I'm getting better into summoning penguins

 

[Sero]

Hm i'll start.

First off you can forget about fire resistence for Heli since Phoenix negates resistence to fire, i essentially beat you in speed since has in unknown when it comes to movement speed, not like it really matters cuz phoenix has danmaku at his disposal, homing is worring but i have feeling Phoenix can shoot the missiles down before he hits em, plus wizard has homing of his own.

As you can see, heli is heavily out haxed

 

[JustANormalLemon]

Hm i'll start.

First off you can forget about fire resistence for Heli since Phoenix negates resistence to fire, i essentially beat you in speed since has in unknown when it comes to movement speed, not like it really matters cuz phoenix has danmaku at his disposal, homing is worring but i have feeling Phoenix can shoot the missiles down before he hits em, plus wizard has homing of his own.

As you can see, heli is heavily out haxed

Well, even trough is unknow, The wizard monkey is only superhuman thanks to being compared to RL monkeys, so the helicopter should be faster even with unknow speed

also the Dartship has homing atacking missels and a higher DPS thanks to all the focused atacks It has

But that large size is a real problem...

 

[FRIMI]

The wizard monkey is only superhuman thanks to being compared to RL monkeys

Not quite true, remember that WLP specifically transforms themself into the giant phoenix in addition to summoning a permanent lesser phoenix

 

[JustANormalLemon]

Not quite true, remember that WLP specifically transforms themself into the giant phoenix in addition to summoning a permanent lesser phoenix

I'm talking in speed, and this is how the Wizard monkey is on It's profile

 

[Noneless21]

So what's both of monkey's first move then usually? If WLP start using it's special move then we can kiss goodbye at apache

 

[JustANormalLemon]

So what's both of monkey's first move then usually? If WLP start using it's special move then we can kiss goodbye at apache

Apache aproches and starts shooting

WLP should use his hability if he start to strugle thanks to the cooldown

 

[Noneless21]

Then the next question is can apache withstand the WLP's special abilities?

 

[JustANormalLemon]

Then the next question is can apache withstand the WLP's special abilities?

With ones?

 

[Noneless21]

With ones?

The one that turn WLP into a giant bird and just spew out some dangerous fireballs and flame breaths

 

[JustANormalLemon]

The one that turn WLP into a giant bird and just spew out some dangerous fireballs and flame breaths

Well, WLP has alread one phonexi out all the time, he becomes another, now about It, I feel like Apatche can outdamage thanks to having more focused fire, but It's so big that wouldn't be able to dodge danmaku

Well, as I see It

Apatche wincons:
Focused fire
Faster movement speed
Shereder them with It's blades

WLP wincons:
Apatche can't dodge him
Hit the monkey inside the helicopter
Out damage
Better mobility as phonexi

 

[Noneless21]

Hmm, then we can assume that apache will target the bigger phoenix then?

 

[JustANormalLemon]

Hmm, then we can assume that apache will target the bigger phoenix then?

Well, he would probable focus to wizard first, sinse It know that if the wizard dies the other phonexi disaoear as well... And the bigger one is the wizard, but Idk, kinda thinking both have to equal chances, maybe a incon?

 

[Noneless21]

Let's wait for other people first because it looks pretty even to me

 

[JustANormalLemon]

Yes, It's a shoking first battle I might say, don't think the rest of the tournament will be this close

 

[Noneless21]

Bump

 

[FRIMI]

so here's my take, this map is particularly interesting since both participants actively move around ingame and we can actually do direct speed comparisons, which I did. WLP has way more dps apache (tbh the fact that WLP is 8-B is very shocking, but anyway), however a lot of that damage comes from meteor/fireball attacks for which I was messing around in sandbox and a heli with bigger jets can pretty easily avoid all the fireballs which would've in all likelyhood either take out the helicopter or oneshot the monkey inside. In fact even if the WLP tries to follow the heli directly instead of going in a circle like it usually would, the heli with bigger jets is actually faster than the phoenix so the big damage fireballs. However the fire breath attacks from both phoenixes will pretty much be unavoidable. The heli at a long range can only fire seeking missiles, in order to shoot darts it needs to get up close. WLP can fire from across the map shots which the apache cannot avoid. Now we already know that all towers can easily survive under extreme conditions, including the inside of a volcano, so the monkey inside the heli probably wont die from the heat alone, it'd need to be via ap. Even though WLP's main damage comes from the multi-direction meteor/fireball attacks, the breath attack is also pretty significant and does far more dps from a distance than Apache missiles. An apache with missiles only can't beat a single fortified bfb on round 1. Just the lesser phoenix alone without the actual WLP's help can solo the same f-BFB before it crosses the second bend in logs.

After a little more testing I actually realized that Apache can't even fire the missiles from all the way across the map, it needs to be in a range. This puts apache at an even bigger disadvantage than I initially thought. Apache gets both outranged and out-damaged at the start of the fight. With the movement speed advantage, Apache can close the distance decently fast, but when I tried dodging the fireballs earlier I could only do it from missile firing range, if apache wants to get bigger damage from the attached short-range dartling gun it'll need to get too close to reliably dodge big fireballs.

Because of all that, I vote WLP

 

[Noneless21]

Guess apache got outrange huh, welp, gotta go with WLP then

 

[JustANormalLemon]

Well, would help the fact It could teorically kill WLP before him using his hability? Or try to avoid his until It runs out of phonexi transformation time? Sinse both should have knoladge of one another

 

[Noneless21]

Well, would help the fact It could teorically kill WLP before him using his hability? Or try to avoid his until It runs out of phonexi transformation time? Sinse both should have knoladge of one another

Well speed is indeed not equalize so theoratically apache may be able to take down WLP before it uses its ability, but even before that, it needs to dodge theregular phoenix's fireball first which will be hard to do

 

[FRIMI]

regular phoenix doesn't have fireballs, but I assume you're referring to its fire breath in which case, yeah. Anyway, if they start on opposite sides of the map heli will take over a second to get in missile range (assuming it moves in a straight line which it wont if it wants to avoid phoenix fire) which is more than enough time for WLP to transform

 

[JustANormalLemon]

regular phoenix doesn't have fireballs, but I assume you're referring to its fire breath in which case, yeah. Anyway, if they start on opposite sides of the map heli will take over a second to get in missile range (assuming it moves in a straight line which it wont if it wants to avoid phoenix fire) which is more than enough time for WLP to transform

I mean, WLP can't be in this form forever, and has cooldown after It, so would be kinda dumb use It first move, and If he uses It first move cant the helicopter just time him out dodging?

 

[Noneless21]

That's why i'm wondering what will be WLP's first move, if WLP uses its ability then the odds are at its side, but if it didn't then the apache may take this

 

[FRIMI]

i mean if "in character" is just whatever the optimal strategy would be ingame, you (usually) wanna use it immediately after the biggest bloon is onscreen, so in a 1v1 yeah WLP uses the ability right away. Apache should be able to dodge the fire balls from missile range but not the fire breath and the missile damage is negligible by comparison

 

[Noneless21]

I mean apache's missle is slower so after WLP uses its ability, then apache may try to avoid it at all cost because the barrage of fireball will do damage to the heli

 

[FRIMI]

oh yes absolutely, but theres literally no way for heli to avoid either firebreath attack

 

[Noneless21]

Well the amount of fire breath is doubkr the amount with noth phoenix plus the firebreath can decimate ceramics and leads so while it won't do as much damage as the giant fireball, it still will do significant amount of damage to the heli

 

[FRIMI]

fire breath alone can solo fortified bfb's so you're underselling it a little bit. Also iirc the lava phoenix's breath attack is much stronger than the regular phoenix

 

[Noneless21]

fire breath alone can solo fortified bfb's so you're underselling it a little bit. Also iirc the lava phoenix's breath attack is much stronger than the regular phoenix

I see, then WLP takes this high-extreme diff then

 

[JustANormalLemon]

i mean if "in character" is just whatever the optimal strategy would be ingame, you (usually) wanna use it immediately after the biggest bloon is onscreen, so in a 1v1 yeah WLP uses the ability right away. Apache should be able to dodge the fire balls from missile range but not the fire breath and the missile damage is negligible by comparison

This is in a situation were It is not in direct atack, why use your hability with huge cooldown in the start? It can fail misserable, but I guess It's a fair assumption?

I see, then WLP takes this high-extreme diff then

Counted

 

[Peppersalt43]

Phoenix and Monke FRA

 

[JustANormalLemon]

Counted

 

[FRIMI]

This is in a situation were It is not in direct atack, why use your hability with huge cooldown in the start?

that's just not how you play optimally. Also phoenix ability has 1/2 uptime which isn't too huge. As long as the cooldown is, the actual ability is just as long

 

[JustANormalLemon]

Fair

 

[JustANormalLemon]

Bump

 

[Sero]

Can i vote even if i chosed the monkey?

 

[Noneless21]

Well yes

 

[Noneless21]

plus it's not too popular so might as well