• This forum is strictly intended to be used by members of the VS Battles wiki. Please only register if you have an autoconfirmed account there, as otherwise your registration will be rejected. If you have already registered once, do not do so again, and contact Antvasima if you encounter any problems.

    For instructions regarding the exact procedure to sign up to this forum, please click here.
  • We need Patreon donations for this forum to have all of its running costs financially secured.

    Community members who help us out will receive badges that give them several different benefits, including the removal of all advertisements in this forum, but donations from non-members are also extremely appreciated.

    Please click here for further information, or here to directly visit our Patreon donations page.
  • Please click here for information about a large petition to help children in need.

Bleach Revision Cont'd

Status
Not open for further replies.
"The former existence of the three worlds before the Soul King was "nothingness" so the argument of the worlds becoming a new one afterwards from the manga is speculation on false head-canon contradicted by the novel."

This is itself contradicted by the manga though.

Dismissing it as head-canon is dismissing the manga itself.

EDIT: Yhwach was technically merging spiritual existences so that life and death were one. Combining three literal planets isn't necessarily required for that.
 
You didn't debunk anything. You are deliberatedly ignoring that the Soul King is a lynchpin, a specific cog in a machine, and not the whole machine.

The worlds collapse naturally if the flow of souls is put out of wack. Which is why the Quincy were all-but exterminated.
 
"People disagreed with it because they were listening to your misinformation. Its very, very simple.

To combine planets, one must overcome the GBE of said planets.

Yhwach was merging the planets as one. Profit."

Literally no proof of literal merging of landmasses. Again, just going from headcanons for the highest possible interpretations.

"Now your headcanon has ranged from it being a outlier to "merging" being that the planets are now connected via shattering dimensions. Lol."

It's literally shown in the Manga with the Quincy explanation way back then. Worlds collapse into each other when the flow of souls is not kept in check. It's a chain-reaction. Not a feat.

"The Kk calc was already accepted for a long time. Applelord sumd it up."

Still needs new calcs.

"If I insult you it's probably because you blatantly try downplay and downgrade Bleach when you dont even read the series and you dont know what you are talking about."

Insults show a lack of argumentative skills and proper arguments. And that is very much a reason more and more people agree with me. Because I don't treat people who disagree with me as idiots.
 
Aizen had a 6-A feat while sealed in a chair, Yhwach one is High 6-A also we should recalc Mimihagi speed feat, but i doubt it could get to Sub-Relativistic with the new timeframe.
 
>@Mathew claims that Yhwach last attack, is him letting go of the balance of souls. This is impossible and a misinterpretation of the cosmology. The only time its shown happening is when someone with the status of Soul King dies and immediate after the worlds begin to shake and collapse.

lol. If this is true that is the best downplay attempt yet. as a corpse I suppose Yhwach had a change of heart and wanted to prevent the worlds collapse xdddddd
 
Damage3245 said:
"The former existence of the three worlds before the Soul King was "nothingness" so the argument of the worlds becoming a new one afterwards from the manga is speculation on false head-canon contradicted by the novel."
This is itself contradicted by the manga though.

Dismissing it as head-canon is dismissing the manga itself.
Click to expand...
Do post evidence of how is contradicted by the manga.

Manga:

  • "The worlds will lose their form and return to their former existence" Yhwach's words.
Novel:

  • "what existed before the Soul King?" "A state of nothingness" -
Old Royal Family guy from the novel Can't Fear Your World when educating his son (the main villain) when he was a kid.
 
Nothing of what you said confirms anything.The fact of the matter is:

  • Worlds collapsing into each other is a natural event when the flow of souls is ruined
  • Soul King administers the flow of souls, and by doing that the worlds don't collapse. He doesn't literally hold the worlds apart through sheer power
 
If there was nothingness before the Soul King, then the Soul King wouldn't be required because there wouldn't be a flow of souls to regulate...
 
shouldnt the Soul king be 5-B by default considering its the source of Yhwach Powers?

and yet he was taken out by a 6-B/High 6-A Yhwach

hmmm
 
Debating and arguing is fine, but please...no insulting or hostility (not pointing fingers, just asking politely).
 
Bleach cant have glass canon's due to the nature of the verse. your durability scales to your AP, so the Soul King being killed by a High 6-A feat contradicts Yhwach's statement and feat.
 
Matthew Schroeder said:
You didn't debunk anything. You are deliberatedly ignoring that the Soul King is a lynchpin, a specific cog in a machine, and not the whole machine.

The worlds collapse naturally if the flow of souls is put out of wack. Which is why the Quincy were all-but exterminated.
Click to expand...
This doesn't tell me anything. You're just arguing your own head-canon base on something that Yhwach wasn't even doing. I already debunk it with facts from the manga & novel.

Now you according to you Yhwach was going to let go of the balance of souls:

Contradictions:

  • The world were not shaking apart.
  • The Soul King was alive. (Yhwach) From the novel, even when Ichigo kill him, his reiatsu was seal with his corpse, which were holding the worlds together and they didn't shake or collapse either.
  • The collapse of the balance was only shown to happen when the Soul King dies. (Proof that Yhwach can do it willingly.)
  • Yhwach was using his own reiatsu. (Ichigo call it that.)
  • Ichigo isn't part of the balance of souls, yet it was hurting him.
  • During the last half of the arc it was stated a lot of times that Yhwach was going to destroy the worlds with his own power, and create a new one.
  • The existence prior to the Soul King was a state of "nothingness", there was no world waiting for them. Yhwach planned to make to make his own. Fuse live and death.
  • Yhwach already proof to have the power to move spiritual matter around, (not convert it into energy like Quincy do) and create stuff in a small scale without any effort.
 
>Literally no proof of literal merging of landmasses. Again, just going from headcanons for the highest possible interpretations

Hardly. This is what happens when you don't read the series.

Screenshot 20180116-232856
015dkdjficisej
 
Okay:

First. I will not let this get derailed again.

Second: https://vsbattles.com/vsbattles/1279813

As you can see in that thread, the accepted result will be Country level 6-B. Therefore, all the profiles listed above will need an adjustment. This will be arranged after that thread is concluded (note, that thread is only for calc members).

Third, until all the profiles are adjusted this thread is not meant to contain any type of discussion regarding Yhwach. Refrain yourselves from discussing that in here.

Last: if there is any type of revision left (excluding Tier 5 stuff), I suggest we continue with that. If there is not, I will close this thread until the Calc group thread is closed and reopen this one after that.
 
Lille and Shunsui have no canon references to Gremmy so no. Also Yamamoto does not scale as Gwen alrweady calculated him as small Country Level and he has no other feats to suggest otherwise.
 
I believe they were scaled to Kenpachi, nothing else. We are not discussing scaling.
 
if 2 gremmy =8 then 1 =4. Zaraki then is at least 4 in base and at least 8 in shikai, but less than 24 (6 gremmy). Unohana rivaled but ultimately weaker than Base kenpachi so she shoul be at least small country level (He's small country level plus).

Pernida evolved to base kenpachi's level, though he was still heavily bandaged at the time. Nemuri pulverized pernida so she should be adjusted as well.

Referencing Damage's question about effected profiles via the new gremmy calc.
 
Agreed. Neither of them have any references to Kenpachi or the meteor feat, so they can remain as they are.
 
I agree with @Dr.Fix Yamamoto and Shunsui don't scale to Kenpachi. Yamamoto was afraid of Kenpachi's power and refrained him from classes of Kendo that would make him more powerful.
 
Downgrades:

Rukia post royal guard training.

  • Town level+ (Lieutenant level combatant, quickly dispatched Di Roy Rinker, a Fraccion level Arrancar. Managed to defeat a Resurrección Aaroniero and Kaien Shiba.) | At least Large Town level, likely higher with Bankai (Comparable to Renji, defeated As Nodt, stated by Byakuya to have gotten strong), ignores conventional durability with Absolute Zero
As Nodt

  • Town level + (Stronger than Renji with Shikai) | At least Large Town level, with Bankai: Senbonzakura Kageyoshi (Comparable to Byakuya pre-royal guard training) likely, higher with Quincy: Vollständig
Renji post royal guard training.

  • Town level+ in base and Shikai (Should be at least comparable to Ikkaku, damaged Szayelaporro with Shakkahō), higher with Bankai (Somewhat pressured a Shikai using Byakuya Kuchiki and got him onto his knee, though it should be noted that he was no match once Byakuya got fully serious) | At least Large Town level, (Effortlessly defeated Mask De Masculine who took on 2 captains that used Bankai and defeated them).
Mask De Masculine

  • Town level + (Stronger than Renji with Shikai. | Large Town level, with Quincy: Vollständig (Stronger than before, by this calc.)
 
Rocker1189 said:
Sorry, I was interested in this debate and read like the last 40 or so chapters of bleach. Where were the land masses of 3 (or is it 4?) planets being merged together.
Click to expand...
Discussing that would be derailing the current thread.
 
@AppleLord

Where did Town level+ come from? The current 6-C characters would scale to the 7-B to 7-A calc for pre time-skip Hitsugaya. And then there is Komamura's High 7-C calc.
 
Rocker1189 said:
@AppleLord so are you saying that he can fuse 3 literal planets or not?
Click to expand...
Not fuse them literately. Destroy them, and then make a new one from their remains, according to the manga statements. That was the threat from the last arc that made three different races joined forces to stop his plans. But he was killed before doing it, and since no one has a Planet level feat or Moon level feat (questionable since that was one of the calcs for Yhwach's casual feat, but it got downgraded to Continent level) in Bleach some people are against the characters been Planet level.
 
You see, I grow tired of repeating myself over and over.

No Yhwach stuff yet, and dont try to use the excuse of "but I didnt ask about Yhwach".

If you are interested in bleach talk in each other's walls.
 
AppleLord said:
Can we use Edrad's feat or not?
Click to expand...
Two calc group members looked at and gave the green light for Edrad's 7-C feat. So it's legit.

As for the Sternritter, they should scale to 7-B or 7-A from Hitsugaya. His storm was calc'ed at these levels and Gwyn's calc for his falling city stopping feat was 60+ Megatons (City level+).
 
Do all Sternritter scale to Hitsugaya? We know they're all roughly Captain level but does that make them Hitsugaya level?

Oh, and Royd Lloyd needs to be added to the list for revisions as well since he's currently at Multi-Continent level.
 
I think he should be put at High 6-C (Large Island level+) as Gwyn calc'ed his durability at that level. That should scale to his AP.

I just need to track down that blog.
 
Rukia, Renji and As Nodt all scale to mountain level with Byakuya and Toshiro. That much should be obvious.
 
Amlad22 said:
Rukia, Renji and As Nodt all scale to mountain level with Byakuya and Toshiro. That much should be obvious.
Click to expand...
NO. Rukia, and Renji are nowhere stronger or in the same level as Hitsugaya.

Renji shikai is x5 Ikkaku shikai and Edrad Resurrection, but that's it. The Mountain level feat is going to be remove.
 
Status
Not open for further replies.

Similar threads

Valeska24
  • Locked
Bleach Resistance addition for Quincy and Shinigami physiology
Replies
30
Views
3K
DarkGrath
DarkGrath
Guacamolefletcher
  • Locked
Kenpachi's upgrade
2 3
Replies
88
Views
6K
UchihaSlayer96
UchihaSlayer96
Strongest Bleach Characters ranked by levels
2 3
Replies
81
Views
9K
Louise1959
  • Locked
Retsu Unohana high 6-A bleach upgrade
2 3
Replies
103
Views
7K
LordTracer
LordTracer
Arc7Kuroi
  • Locked
Hueco Mundo Invasion Stat Revisions (Chapters ~240-320)
2
Replies
54
Views
4K
LordTracer
LordTracer
Back
Top