Ben 10 General Discussion Thread

[Ghengiroo115]

They scale to Gwen's lucky girl form, also Gwen can one-shot all ultimates only if she tapped into her Anodite form's full potential which would cost her physical form/humanity

Her Anodite form in UAF and Lucky Girl form in OV are the same thing. They’re never stated to be different to my knowledge, and there’s also an unused but official OV Verdona design that has the same kind of design changes as Gwen’s form does. That second part though is a fair point, I’ll have to double check all her appearances to see whether she’s using her full power in each one or not.

As for the Malware's 2nd form, we can't tell if the Helix's energy was gonna kill his 1st form since that's only Albedo's saying(still had energy to destroy galvan B).

Albedo wouldn’t have said that if he wasn’t sure it was enough energy to kill him, he just underestimated Malware’s endurance and absorption capabilities.

But it's unlikely since 10 yrs 4Arms can keep up with both forms.

Four Arms was able to physically overpower first form Malware very easily, but was shown to struggle noticeably more with second form Malware.

 

[Ommf_Deity]

Her Anodite form in UAF and Lucky Girl form in OV are the same thing.

I know. That's why i edited my previous reply

Albedo wouldn’t have said that if he wasn’t sure it was enough energy to kill him, he just underestimated Malware’s endurance and absorption capabilities.

couldn't put words describe it better

Four Arms was able to physically overpower first form Malware very easily, but was shown to struggle noticeably more with second form Malware.

Malware 1st form did send Fourarms flying in the end though, as for the struggling part against the 2nd, He simply said he was toying

 

[Ghengiroo115]

I know. That's why i edited my previous reply

Misread, my bad.

Malware 1st form did send Fourarms flying in the end though

That was with the eye beam, not his physical strength.

as for the struggling part against the 2nd, He simply said he was toying

I don’t really see where he said that aside from the “I wanted to do this the easy way” thing, though Malware also didn’t seem to be taking things completely seriously either.

 

[Ommf_Deity]

That was with the eye beam, not his physical strength.

Thats still Attack potency, one could argue the beam caught him by surprise.

I don’t really see where he said that aside from the “I wanted to do this easy way” thing, though Malware also didn’t seem to be taking things completely seriously either.

Yep it's that line. Idk about Malware not taking it seriously, though

 

[GeneralSol16]

Snip

Hey, since you're all interested in the whole consostency thing, this is all the Tier 5 stuff i have, if there's anything else you have in mind let me know
The Great One
- Tanks the destruction of Cannonbolt's planet |
1. Four Arms cracks its shell | [1:05]
2. Cannonbolt tanks its self-destruction, which destroyed its shell | [2:10]

Helix / Galvanic Mechamorphs

• Tanks the destruction of Galvan B |
• Possesses enough energy to destroy Galvan B | [1:30]

1. Malware absorbs all of its energy to upgrade himself and gain its power | https://youtu.be/znGXeg3izFE?si=6iCs0rvrZKUxD-TB
2. Galvanic Mechamorphs, while drained of their energy, tank the destruction of Galvan B | https://youtu.be/ISG2jYcIz50?si=KeUTzboTqMMDqN2V
3. Diamondhead casually destroys the Helix by punching Malware into it | https://youtu.be/5uu7P1GXQfk?feature=shared [0:09]
4. Malware is unaffected after destroying the Helix with his body | https://youtu.be/5uu7P1GXQfk?feature=shared [0:09]
5. Galvanic Mechamorphs repair Galvan B after its destruction | https://youtu.be/XQcoWDX5w3E?si=yOxpiVLHK2vlS-Aq

Sub Energy
- Stated to be 20 times more powerful than the sun, and capable of wiping a continent off the face of the Earth if mishandled | https://youtu.be/psJ6uxCL_OM?si=uMp9ZKaGdrCiJH9Q
1. Upchuck is capable of matching the Forever King's Sub-Energy-powered attacks with only his basic blasts | https://youtu.be/kqI35pLpxgU?feature=shared [1:15]
2. The Forever King tanks a Sub-Energy-amped blast from Upchuck | https://youtu.be/kqI35pLpxgU?feature=shared [1:44]

Vilgax

• Since the Original Series, he was completely superior to every alien and villain Ben faced, placing him above the Forever King, Four Arms, Kevin 11, and Diamondhead | https://youtu.be/d-k_QlUO9NE?si=2mqBwyi1QRFFG22v - https://youtu.be/gcwYhEurhOo?si=Ix8CC-hgMX_fKUbo - https://i.postimg.cc/Wz0Xt6fC/Scree...-googlequicksearchbox-Lens-Exported-Act-1.jpg
• He became 10 times stronger in Alien Force, while Ben's aliens also became comparable to him (and even superior) after growing stronger with age. During Alien Force, Vilgax was stated to be "the most powerful alien there is" in a context referring to every threat the team had faced up to that point, placing him above the Great One, the Incurseans, and the Highbreeds | https://i.postimg.cc/T1jJT2KG/Ben-10-alien-force-vengeance-of-vilgax-premiere.png - https://youtu.be/kRgj1mXnfWI?feature=shared

Petrosapien Crystal
- Capable of destroying Petropia, the homeworld of the Petrosapiens | https://youtu.be/CUMlrLoKYj4?si=wEqyIff_PmyS8d7e
1. Vilgax is vastly superior to the crystal's remaining energy, which was still enough to resurrect the Petrosapiens, requiring more energy than what was needed to destroy the planet | https://youtu.be/od9oMI7sxog?feature=shared [3:02] - https://youtu.be/CUMlrLoKYj4?feature=shared [1:35]

Ultimate Aggregor
- Stated to be the most powerful, dangerous, and deadly villain both Ben's team and the world had ever faced, placing him above threats such as the Highbreeds, the Incurseans, and Vilgax, all of whom were capable of destroying planets | https://i.postimg.cc/CLmb7QDP/Scree...om-google-android-youtube-Main-Activity-1.jpg - https://i.postimg.cc/RVXwdDfD/f-NJo0wg.png

Ascalon (Unworthy Users)

• An Incursean, a race of intergalactic conquerors, accidentally destroyed his planet after gaining access to Azmuth's sword | https://youtu.be/VBoiwMxScFA?si=5absK3iS22gTOCRW
• Simply by holding it, Vilgax states it is the greatest power he has ever felt, despite previously feeling the "infinite" energy of the Petrosapien Crystal and using it to destroy Petropia, Diamondhead's homeworld | https://youtu.be/74XvkY5mEb4?feature=shared [2:21] - https://youtu.be/Q3SdB5ZkE5I?feature=shared [0:30]

1. Ultimate Humungousaur, who is 10 times stronger than his base form, is unaffected by George's direct attacks and nullifies them with a punch | https://i.postimg.cc/B64vdqfX/UA-EFA-DVD-Ultimate-Humungousaur-Data.png - https://youtu.be/aIYLz4SvocQ?feature=sharedg [0:28]

 

[Ommf_Deity]

Looks cool, Where the scans of Aggregor& Vilgax comes from?

 

[GeneralSol16]

CN Magazines

Looks cool, Where the scans of Aggregor& Vilgax comes from?

 

[Ommf_Deity]

Anyways, When next the Cosmology rework thread? There a lot of things need to change, beside of what I told like:

2-C Dagon, and Null void.

H1-B Annihilarrgh, with type 1CM.

Upgradeing Profiles of many characters.

A̶n̶d̶ p̶o̶s̶s̶i̶b̶l̶e̶ 1̶-̶A̶ A̶l̶i̶e̶n̶-̶X̶(If Hellformer managed to pull it somehow).

 

[GeneralSol16]

Anyways, When next the Cosmology rework thread? There a lot of things need to change, beside of what I told like:

2-C Dagon, and Null void.

H1-B Annihilarrgh, with type 1CM.

Upgradeing Profiles of many characters.

A̶n̶d̶ p̶o̶s̶s̶i̶b̶l̶e̶ 1̶-̶A̶ A̶l̶i̶e̶n̶-̶X̶(If Hellformer managed to pull it somehow).

Yeah, we know, but sadly the revisions goons top much to be completed.

And what are your arguments for tier 2 Dagon?

 

[Ultimate-Rex1]

H1-B Annihilarrgh, with type 1CM.


Upgradeing Profiles of many characters.

1-B what? Also verse don't have High 1-B (if you mean old argument it get rejected by Ultima)

A̶n̶d̶ p̶o̶s̶s̶i̶b̶l̶e̶ 1̶-̶A̶ A̶l̶i̶e̶n̶-̶X̶(If Hellformer managed to pull it somehow).

Hellformer disagree with 1-A, as there anti-feat for 1-A scaling

 

[Ommf_Deity]

Yeah, we know, but sadly the revisions goons top much to be completed.

And what are your arguments for tier 2 Dagon?

Easy, stated to by Vilgax to destroy the universe.

1000028872

Unlimited screen recording, AI meeting notes, and instant SOP creation in one tool.

kommodo.ai

1-B what? Also verse don't have High 1-B (if you mean old argument it get rejected by Ultima)

It's mainly via MWI, What was the arguments rejected by Ultima btw?

Hellformer disagree with 1-A, as there anti-feat for 1-A scaling

I think he still working on 1-A A-X outside the wiki

 

[GeneralSol16]

Easy, stated to by Vilgax to destroy the universe, and even further supported by Azmuth.

https://www.image2url.com/r2/default/images/1779980223107-604a0d2e-2c47-42b1-b19b-8d1590fdb56d.jpg

https://www.image2url.com/r2/default/images/1779980303780-7a7f8348-5e24-49e7-9b01-5f2ffe06cfbc.jpg

The links don't work

It's mainly via MWI which Annihilarrgh does scale, What was the arguments rejected by Ultima btw?

I think he still working on 1-A A-X outside the wiki

 

[Ommf_Deity]

The links don't work

Try it now

 

[Ultimate-Rex1]

Easy, stated to by Vilgax to destroy the universe.

1000028872

Unlimited screen recording, AI meeting notes, and instant SOP creation in one tool.

kommodo.ai

Link don't work

It's mainly via MWI, What was the arguments rejected by Ultima btw?

MWI isn't High 1-B in this wiki btw

 

[Ommf_Deity]

Link don't work

"The ruination of this universe is at hand, the Dagon comes" –Vilgax

MWI isn't High 1-B in this wiki btw

It's High 1-B, but not in physical space

 

[Ultimate-Rex1]

"The ruination of this universe is at hand, the Dagon comes" –Vilgax

Idk

It's High 1-B, but not in physical space

It's already use, and get disagree by staffs

 

[Ommf_Deity]

It's already use, and get disagree by staffs

It's scientifically proven within the theory and the verse, and not a name drop, What was thier main arguments?

 

[GeneralSol16]

"The ruination of this universe is at hand, the Dagon comes" –Vilgax

I doubt that's enough to grant a tier, especially by the lack of feats

 

[Ommf_Deity]

especially by the lack of feats

(Enslaved countless dimensions, with Azmuth and many of the characters saying multiple times the Universe is at stake if they dont stop Dagon)

 

[GeneralSol16]

I think upscaling Dagon above any weapon and character should be better, which would include the Map of Infinity, and all of that

 

[Ommf_Deity]

I think upscaling Dagon above any weapon and character should be better, which would include the Map of Infinity, and all of that

Idk about any of that, but 2-C Dagon is a definitive thing

 

[Ghengiroo115]

I think upscaling Dagon above any weapon and character should be better, which would include the Map of Infinity, and all of that

Idk about Map of Infinity (where does that even scale?), but he should be above Eon and Ben has that “create any universe he imagines” statement using the power of both Ascalon and Dagon. Ascalon also has statements of being able to tap into the primal/fundamental forces of the universe, if that’s worth anything. I think the statements from Vilgax and Azmuth about Dagon destroying the universe are too vague and could be argued to be an over time thing, but there are other ways for him to reach universal and higher.

 

[KaramcaS]

It's scientifically proven within the theory and the verse, and not a name drop, What was thier main arguments?

MWI is literally 2-B possibly 2-A just byself

 

[DemonicDude]

Ben 10 Speed Update Reboot

Hi everyone Currently all Ben 10 Reboot aliens have Relativistic speed, because it is based on Vilgax laser beams and while in the past question has been asked about reboot vilgax laser being calced here those threads never really went anywhere. However upon watching the series again Vilgax...

vsbattles.com

 

[Ommf_Deity]

I think upscaling Dagon above any weapon and character should be better, which would include the Map of Infinity, and all of that

Idk about Map of Infinity (where does that even scale?), but he should be above Eon and Ben has that “create any universe he imagines” statement using the power of both Ascalon and Dagon.

The problem is, where will you find statements of Dagon upscaling all these? The only statements I could find of Dagon upscaling anything, is him and lucubra Vilgax upscaling Ascalon

Ascalon also has statements of being able to tap into the primal/fundamental forces of the universe, if that’s worth anything.

Sadly, the statement only mention Ascalon drawing power from the Universe there is no proof that it could reach Universal lvl.

I think the statements from Vilgax and Azmuth about Dagon destroying the universe are too vague

Doubt to be vague, since both Vilgax and Azmuth are knowledgeable characters. And statements are nothing new to his previous feats.

and could be argued to be an over time thing, but there are other ways for him to reach universal and higher.

Unless you somehow gave Dagon inf speed, without being Uni. There is nothing implies it to be over time, Azmuth even says if Dagon placed a foothold there, the entire universe will fall, and urged Ben and the others to destroy him once he come.

But hey. If you know better ways, feel free to share

MWI is literally 2-B possibly 2-A just byself

2-B, 2-A, and low 1-C depending on the context. H1-B if you somehow scaled to the probabilities space

Ben 10 Speed Update Reboot

Hi everyone Currently all Ben 10 Reboot aliens have Relativistic speed, because it is based on Vilgax laser beams and while in the past question has been asked about reboot vilgax laser being calced here those threads never really went anywhere. However upon watching the series again Vilgax...

vsbattles.com

Sounds good, count me agreed

 

[DemonicDude]

Sounds good, count me agreed

you need to actually go to the crt link and mentioned that lol, ya know rules and stuff

 

[GeneralSol16]

But hey. If you know better ways, feel free to share

I mean, Dagon stated that he exists literally "everywhere", and although this could souks like a hyperbole (which already is kinda wrong to deduce that based on the context of the scene), we know that his entire existence was capable of banging on the seal without actually being visually there or in his dimension, meaning that his existence is indeed something not related to his visuals.
And after he breaks out, he concentrated his entire existence into that squid form.

 

[Ommf_Deity]

I mean, Dagon stated that he exists literally "everywhere", and although this could souks like a hyperbole (which already is kinda wrong to deduce that based on the context of the scene), we know that his entire existence was capable of banging on the seal without actually being visually there or in his dimension, meaning that his existence is indeed something not related to his visuals.
And after he breaks out, he concentrated his entire existence into that squid form.

We don't know to how much that extends.

 

[Apollonir.Scale]

Wonder what a female Atomix would look like

I wonder what a female Brainstorm would look like.

 

[DemonicDude]

I wonder what a female Brainstorm would look like.

 

[Apollonir.Scale]

Bro is using ult echo echo against Kevin but not Aggregor i dunno Ben 10K could defeat him he would know what happen kind of so he would use better aliens

I think Kevin Arc's aliens are stronger than Aggregor Arc's aliens.

There's also the statement that Ultimate Cannonbolt can defeat Aggregor.

 

[Apollonir.Scale]

Random question: how would everyone rank the 10 strongest villains?

Malturant
Dagon
Future Vilgax
Kevin 11.000
Future Animo
ExoSkull

 

[Lort15]

I think Kevin Arc's aliens are stronger than Aggregor Arc's aliens.

There's also the statement that Ultimate Cannonbolt can defeat Aggregor.

Aggregor was playing safe, he outsmarted Ben and took the parts of MoI in the last fight Ben could use something stronger like Ultimate Humungausour or Waybig to defeat him, he got tagged by Ra'ad as Ultimate Swampfire before

 

[Apollonir.Scale]

Full Guidebook.
Mommy

Is this your hand?

 

[DemonicDude]

Is this your hand?

no, I wear a ring in mine.

 

[Ghengiroo115]

2. Galvanic Mechamorphs, while drained of their energy, tank the destruction of Galvan B |

Is anyone in the thread willing to calculate the Mechamorphs and Helix’s durability from this feat (if possible)?

Btw forgot to mention it before, but thanks @GeneralSol16 for this list! Sometime later I think I’ll put this stuff plus some other relevant feats into a sandbox or something to make it easy to find.

 

[Ultimate-Rex1]

Is anyone in the thread willing to calculate the Mechamorphs and Helix’s durability from this feat (if possible)?

Btw forgot to mention it before, but thanks @GeneralSol16 for this list! Sometime later I think I’ll put this stuff plus some other relevant feats into a sandbox or something to make it easy to find.

I remember Reiner did make calc for it

 

[Ultimate-Rex1]

Here

https://vsbattles.fandom.com/wiki/User_blog:Reiner04/Galvanic_Mechamorph_pulling_back_Galvan_B_and_Malware_surviving_Galvan_B_destruction#Malware_surviving_Galvan_B_destruction:

 

[KaramcaS]

I have a group of friends who are Ben 10 fans. But they think Alien X created only one universe and haven't quite grasped the concept of Timelines. You guys are an expert on Ben 10. How can I explain these details to my friends, who are also Ben 10 fans but don't know much details, in the simplest way possible?

 

[Ghengiroo115]

Here

https://vsbattles.fandom.com/wiki/User_blog:Reiner04/Galvanic_Mechamorph_pulling_back_Galvan_B_and_Malware_surviving_Galvan_B_destruction#Malware_surviving_Galvan_B_destruction:

I think that calc only calculated the explosion itself. It doesn’t seem to account for how far away everyone on the moon is from the centre of the explosion. Maybe I’m wrong though.