Ben 10 General Discussion Thread

[NXCHT.66]

I've taken care of everything, and the only issue left is with grammar. I'm not very proficient in English, so I can't tell exactly where corrections need to be made. Therefore, I would like the profile to be accepted and created first, and then my friends can help fix the grammar. What do you think? Do these scans, feats and described seem okay and reasonable to you?

NXCHT.66/Sandbox2

vsbattles.fandom.com

The grammar seems okay.

Which thread approved Planet-level humans?

Can you please find the section where it was proposed and accepted?

Alright, now I think you would agree that humans in this series possess Planet-level strength or even beyond that. Has your opinion on this changed now, or what are your thoughts on it?

NXCHT.66/Sandbox2

vsbattles.fandom.com

 

[Firestorm808]

I suppose it's fine.

 

[GeneralSol16]

I suppose it's fine.

Hi, was wondering if my CRT is still on the list of future revisions.

X = CRT + 2 (Ben 10 CRT)

BEN TENNYSON - Supernatural Willpower (His will is so strong that he cannot be controlled by Lord Transyl's powers. Zs'Skayr had problems possessing Ben via him resisting it) - High Pain Tolerance (Ben could fight Captain Nemesis as Eatle, even when having a broken arm) - Intelligence - Genius...

vsbattles.com

 

[Firestorm808]

It's on the list.

 

[Ghengiroo115]

Milleous in this scene says he still has the Incursean Conquest Ray, but this is immediately after the moment where Way Big overpowered and destroyed what’s supposedly that very same Conquest Ray. What’s up with that?

 

[GeneralSol16]

Milleous in this scene says he still has the Incursean Conquest Ray, but this is immediately after the moment where Way Big overpowered and destroyed what’s supposedly that very same Conquest Ray. What’s up with that?

A script error.
Way Big literally overpowered the mother ship, and multiple WoG (including the writer itself of that ep) said that was indeed the Conquest Ray.

 

[Ghengiroo115]

A script error.
Way Big literally overpowered the mother ship, and multiple WoG (including the writer itself of that ep) said that was indeed the Conquest Ray.

Honestly I’m kinda dumb and didn’t realise Milleous’ ship was the same one from AF LMAO, so that’s my bad.

Do you have any links to the WoG statements (namely the episode writer one)? I know of one that used to be on Way Big’s profile, but ever since the Tier 4 stuff it seems to have been removed and I don’t remember it exactly. Not that I don’t buy the script error thing, just want the scans in case I see anyone else bring up the same thing.

 

[NXCHT.66]

Does anyone know the source of the information mentioned in this note?

 

[GeneralSol16]

Does anyone know the source of the information mentioned in this note?

Ben said that his Mimi Sun would last even if Zs'Skayr attempted to come back to his lab, and consozerikg he usually takes a few years to come back from death, well, yeah

 

[Lort15]

Get Yo a** up we need supporters

CN Teenager vs Anime Girl

Speed is equalized Omiverse Ben is being used with master control, he is blooddusted but Alien x is restricted 40m from each other. Battle takes Place in Tokyo SBA Ben TennysonUltimate-Rex1, Hellformer, ABSOLUTE-ABSTRACT-KING, Razor, AigerTheKing, Lort15 Yukari YakumoTopaz404, Ebihara...

vsbattles.com

 

[Ghengiroo115]

Quick question: When Malware changed from his first to second form, did he absorb all of the secondary Helix’s power or just some of it? I have a couple reasons to think it was entirely drained, but I wanted to see what others think.

 

[RedReaper616]

Quick question: When Malware changed from his first to second form, did he absorb all of the secondary Helix’s power or just some of it? I have a couple reasons to think it was entirely drained, but I wanted to see what others think.

I’d say a portion. Albedo says if the Link doesn’t get completed between Primary and Secondary Helix, the Secondary Helix’s power will “spiral out of control and blow up the Moon, with us on it.” Implying that the energy was under a control that made it lower than its “full” output, lest it destroy them all.

 

[Ghengiroo115]

I’d say a portion. Albedo says if the Link doesn’t get completed between Primary and Secondary Helix, the Secondary Helix’s power will “spiral out of control and blow up the Moon, with us on it.” Implying that the energy was under a control that made it lower than its “full” output, lest it destroy them all.

I interpreted that as the Helix just being in a unstable state from the linking process not being finalised. One of the reasons I thought Malware drained the entire thing was from what Albedo said afterwards, where he says “by managing the power cycles of the two Helixes, I caused an overload just as the Mechamorph touched the control rods”. Having the two Helixes be linked and sharing power at all suggests that more than the power of just the secondary Helix was needed to overload Malware. Maybe I’m misinterpreting something here, but that was my thought process.

 

[GeneralSol16]

I interpreted that as the Helix just being in a unstable state from the linking process not being finalised. One of the reasons I thought Malware drained the entire thing was from what Albedo said afterwards, where he says “by managing the power cycles of the two Helixes, I caused an overload just as the Mechamorph touched the control rods”. Having the two Helixes be linked and sharing power at all suggests that more than the power of just the secondary Helix was needed to overload Malware. Maybe I’m misinterpreting something here, but that was my thought process.

Yeah, that makes sense to me
Why the interest?

 

[Ghengiroo115]

Yeah, that makes sense to me
Why the interest?

For personal scaling (or for VSBW in case a huge downgrade happens). I don’t really like the current 4-B meta for base cast characters because of how obscenely high it is relative to their other feats, but I remembered this stuff about the secondary Helix and was wondering if this could offer a smaller upgrade to the scaling I personally use (which is just the low-end scaling OS characters currently have on the wiki).

 

[Ghengiroo115]

The gap between this argument and the Great One feat is decently big, and Malware would also heavily upscale from the statement considering the transformation gave him a fairly low boost in power, so maybe the gap’s still too big for my standards. Meh, still works as a possibly rating assuming I’m correct about it being the entire thing and not just a portion.

 

[GeneralSol16]

For personal scaling (or for VSBW in case a huge downgrade happens). I don’t really like the current 4-B meta for base cast characters because of how obscenely high it is relative to their other feats, but I remembered this stuff about the secondary Helix and was wondering if this could offer a smaller upgrade to the scaling I personally use (which is just the low-end scaling OS characters currently have on the wiki).

I'm interested.
Can you elaborate, please? I've my own personal scaling as well.

 

[Ghengiroo115]

I'm interested.
Can you elaborate, please? I've my own personal scaling as well.

There’s not much to say. The OS characters scale the same as the wiki’s low end of High 6-A, and the post-timeskip characters are around 10x stronger via scaling to Vilgax so 5-C. I haven’t really thought much about where the higher tier characters would be, but the Ultimate Kevin level characters would bare minimum be 1/10th the Conquest Ray.

 

[GeneralSol16]

There’s not much to say. The OS characters scale the same as the wiki’s low end of High 6-A, and the post-timeskip characters are around 10x stronger via scaling to Vilgax so 5-C. I haven’t really thought much about where the higher tier characters would be, but the Ultimate Kevin level characters would bare minimum be 1/10th the Conquest Ray.

I do something similar, but not exactly the same.

Focusing on UAF and OV eras, I separate them (since the Official Omnitrix is the only one of the watches that is confirmed to turn Ben into the peaks/apex of the race) I don't downscale Ultimate Kevin from the Conquest Ray feat.

But UAF Way Big upscales from Ascalon and the Petrosspurn Crystal, and Ult Hsaur scales from the average energy output of the sword and 1/10th of that Way Big.

And for OV Ben's High Tiers (Four Arms, Hsaur, Duamondhead, etc) I scale them from the Mechamphs feats, Goop puling back Pisciss, etc.

 

[Naeem0304]

I did this drawing of Alien X (my first time drawing him) a few weeks ago.

 

[Lort15]

I did this drawing of Alien X (my first time drawing him) a few weeks ago.

that's so cool

 

[Alexander]

I did this drawing of Alien X (my first time drawing him) a few weeks ago.

******* EPIC DUDE (sorry for the uppercase)

 

[Ghengiroo115]

I did this drawing of Alien X (my first time drawing him) a few weeks ago.

This is glorious

 

[Hellformer]

I did this drawing of Alien X (my first time drawing him) a few weeks ago.

Marvelous

 

[BlastX]

The gap between this argument and the Great One feat is decently big, and Malware would also heavily upscale from the statement considering the transformation gave him a fairly low boost in power, so maybe the gap’s still too big for my standards. Meh, still works as a possibly rating assuming I’m correct about it being the entire thing and not just a portion.

If you're talking about Malware second form, the transformation wasn't treated as low, even he said he was "overflowing with power" and he did start performing better.

 

[Ghengiroo115]

If you're talking about Malware second form, the transformation wasn't treated as low, even he said he was "overflowing with power" and he did start performing better.

I mis-worded it a bit, by “fairly low” I meant it wasn’t a big enough boost to one-shot any character he could previously fight. In both his first and second form he fights against Four Arms and his second form is comparable to Diamondhead, so it’s probably no more than like a 2x boost if even that.

That being said I think I might’ve underestimated the potential gap between kid Ben’s high tiers like Diamondhead and mid-tiers like Heatblast. First form Malware doesn’t need to “massively upscale” from 5-C to make it make sense, in fact it probably doesn’t make as much sense since him absorbing that power was supposed to kill him. Maybe at a lowball Heatblast level characters should be baseline 5-C while Diamondhead level characters can be 2x baseline. Idk maybe that’s too big or small of a gap.

 

[Ghengiroo115]

Couple thoughts/questions:

1. Which Vilgax should the 10x statement apply to? The Vilgax who fought 10 year old Ben, or the Vilgax who fought 11 year old Ben off-screen according to the episode Bengeance Is Mine. I ask because I’m not sure if 10 year old Ben’s aliens should scale to the 5-C thing.
2. How durable is The Worst, and what can he be scaled to? Blossomed Swampfire could reflect an attack from mutated Kevin that was strong enough to give him that scar on his chin, so I believe both of them should scale to 1/10th of whatever The Worst scales to.

 

[GeneralSol16]

Couple thoughts/questions:

1. Which Vilgax should the 10x statement apply to? The Vilgax who fought 10 year old Ben, or the Vilgax who fought 11 year old Ben off-screen according to the episode Bengeance Is Mine. I ask because I’m not sure if 10 year old Ben’s aliens should scale to the 5-C thing.

I'm sure they're the same in lore.

1. How durable is The Worst, and what can he be scaled to?

He survived a beat down from an Appoplexian for hours, and tanked a blast from Exo-Skull, so maybe around Ben's high tiers.

1. Blossomed Swampfire could reflect an attack from mutated Kevin that was strong enough to give him that scar on his chin, so I believe both of them should scale to 1/10th of whatever The Worst scales to.

Blossomed Swampfire scales from 1/10th of every alien unlocked up to OV, except Alien X.

 

[Ghengiroo115]

I'm sure they're the same in lore.

Meant which point in time the 10x statement should be applied to, I didn’t phrase it well. Should AF characters be 10x Original Series characters or 10x Omniverse flashback characters?

He survived a beat down from an Appoplexian for hours, and tanked a blast from Exo-Skull, so maybe around Ben's high tiers.

Considering he was described as “indestructible” or something along those lines, I was wondering if there’s anything he could scale to or if it’s too vague to say.

Blossomed Swampfire scales from 1/10th of every alien unlocked up to OV, except Alien X.

Kevin had 1/10th of (almost) every alien unlocked?

 

[GeneralSol16]

Meant which point in time the 10x statement should be applied to, I didn’t phrase it well. Should AF characters be 10x Original Series characters or 10x Omniverse flashback characters?

Ih, he should be 10x OVf characters.

Considering he was described as “indestructible” or something along those lines, I was wondering if there’s anything he could scale to or if it’s too vague to say.

Maybe he could scale from Tikustars, but that sounds too vague to be an actual way to scale him.

Kevin had 1/10th of (almost) every alien unlocked?

Yeah, he didn't do anything different from UA Kevin, who absorbed all of the available playlist up to that moment.

 

[BlastX]

I mean, in OV they're treating Kevin as only absorbing batches of aliens at the time.

Like how OV Flashbacks Kevin only has the additional aliens and nothing of the original 10 in his composition, unless you want to argue that Kevin's absorption powers grew better with age.

 

[RedReaper616]

I mean, in OV they're treating Kevin as only absorbing batches of aliens at the time.

Like how OV Flashbacks Kevin only has the additional aliens and nothing of the original 10 in his composition, unless you want to argue that Kevin's absorption powers grew better with age.

Considering his Ultimate Kevin was described to have all of Ben’s powers at that time, and displayed ones that don’t come from his hybridized physiology, I’d say his powers got better.

 

[GeneralSol16]

unless you want to argue that Kevin's absorption powers grew better with age.

That's not a head canon, literally Kevin passed from just coating himself in the material he absorbed to becoming the material itself after he got mutated in AF.

So yeah, Kevin's powers improved over time

 

[BlastX]

TBH I thought that would only apply to his material absorption since I doubt he trains his energy absorption, but if you think that applies to all ramifications of his powers I don't think I have good arguments against it.

 

[jgms2008]

Cosmologia de Ben 10 (Remake)

crossverse.fandom.com

Interesting

 

[jgms2008]

 

[Lort15]

why ben 10 vs sukuna got that popular they have nothing similiar

 

[Spinoirr]

WoG says In the comments 'Full Stop's Absolute Grip means that when he holds on to you to his fullest extent, he holds you at an absolute fixed point across time and space. While this does mean that nothing within whatever dimension they're currently in could move what he's holding onto (weather, external forces like gravity, any physics at all really) he's also holding onto you across infinite dimensions, too. So no phasing, teleporting, time-shifting, etc. could escape his grip, either. Although, this is only when Full Stop is using his Absolute Grip, which takes a lot of effort and concentration. But even if it's not absolute, he still locks onto you fairly definitively. Picture Syndrome's gauntlets from The Incredibles.'

This proves infinite dimensions for 5YL cosmology and you know what that means for Alien X who scales basically to the cosmology. Something to take into account for a possible 5YL profiles for FCOC

 

[Adr10K]

WoG says In the comments 'Full Stop's Absolute Grip means that when he holds on to you to his fullest extent, he holds you at an absolute fixed point across time and space. While this does mean that nothing within whatever dimension they're currently in could move what he's holding onto (weather, external forces like gravity, any physics at all really) he's also holding onto you across infinite dimensions, too. So no phasing, teleporting, time-shifting, etc. could escape his grip, either. Although, this is only when Full Stop is using his Absolute Grip, which takes a lot of effort and concentration. But even if it's not absolute, he still locks onto you fairly definitively. Picture Syndrome's gauntlets from The Incredibles.'

This proves infinite dimensions for 5YL cosmology and you know what that means for Alien X who scales basically to the cosmology. Something to take into account for a possible 5YL profiles for FCOC

And Full Stop is his third strongest alien, damn.
Im sure he should be above Clockwork

 

[Lort15]

Alien x might have electricity manipulation
We know Phill malfunctions omnitrix to turn ben into electricital type aliens explained in "Max's Monster episode" Ben was able to transform into Alien x while being near to Phill in the episode where he fights with amalgams so if Phill is forcing ben turn into only electricital type aliens Alien x is also one of them