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Beelzebub Scaling

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RinkakuKagune

RinkakuKagune

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I've noticed that a lot of the characters in Fist of the North Star are scaled especially to Raoh's feat, while many of them such as Toki, Rei, Yuda and Shin are justified in their scaling.

However Jagi's AP is justified mainly on the fact that: While still the weakest of the Hokuto siblings by far, he should be closer to their level than the level of nameless fodder. Scarred himself and Amiba. Amiba isn't that notable as well, as he only lasted as long as he did due to Kenshiro being demoralised.

Now don't misunderstand. I can understand why Jagi would be gived such a Tier, because he was a potential successor to the Fist. But that made me wonder (and I've said this to Ant as well but I don't think i got a reply) why I couldn't scale Yohei Nasu to Takamiya. Now Nasu doesn't have a page yet, but if one were to be created it should be: High 7-A due to him being ranked a member of the Three Beasts, which consists of Fuji and Takamiya, and due to him being able to greviously harm Oga.

If this is accepted then I also propose that Jabberwock is placed in the same tier as Nasu as they were both defeated by Oga once he activated Father Switch.

Now this is REALLY reaching, but we could use Jabberwock's Tier to scale to the rest of the Pillar Squad.

  • If the Pillar Baron's are considerably comparable to Jabberwock then they should all be 7-A.
  • And if the Pillar Generals are considerably comparable to the Pillar Baron's then they should be 7-B.
What do you guys think?
 
Does Jabberwock have a feat that places him at 7-A? If he does, and if the Pillar Barons are comparable to Jabberwock, they should be scaled to Jabberwork, meaning they should also be 7-A as well.

If the Pillar Generals are comparable to the Pillar Barons, as you stated, they should also be given the rating of 7-A as well, considering that the power gap between the Generals and the Barons don't seem to be all that large.
 
Well a direct feat no. But he overpowered Oga and Toujou both and was able to damage Oga even after he (Oga) was powered up by the Father Switch.
 
I just need to know where the whole 7-A thing comes from here. If Jabberwock overpowered both Oga and Toujou, and Jabberwock is rated 7-A because of this, what is the actual justification for the 7-A here?

Is Jabberwock scaled to someone who is able to perform a Mountain level feat? If he is, can the feat that Jabberwock is scaled to be calculated?
 
Yes, Jabberwock is scaled to significantly weaker versions of Oga (currently High 6-C) and Toujou (currently 6-C) due to him defeating both of them, which is why I proposed him and Nasu be made High 7-A.
 
It seems like too much guesswork to me, but I would appreciate further community input.
 
Yeah, I'm pretty sure we don't do downwards scaling like this. The best I can think of would be scaling them to the character from the demon world arc who casually threw giant baby Beelze through the air. I don't remember what his position was revealed as in the extra chapter he was in, but regardless the pillars should at least be comparable to him.

Edit: oh, they were also able to survive Oga destroying the top of that skyscraper, do you know if that feat was any good?

Also, did I miss something? Why are Super Saiyan Oga's stats now the only thing on his page?
 
I'm a little confused on the question for fist of the North Star(I can't help with the other verse.)

So your saying the description for his AP is weird.? Is what I'm getting at cus I didn't right that prom did.
 
Blahblah9755 said:
Yeah, I'm pretty sure we don't do downwards scaling like this. The best I can think of would be scaling them to the character from the demon world arc who casually threw giant baby Beelze through the air. I don't remember what his position was revealed as in the extra chapter he was in, but regardless the pillars should at least be comparable to him.

Edit: oh, they were also able to survive Oga destroying the top of that skyscraper, do you know if that feat was any good?

Also, did I miss something? Why are Super Saiyan Oga's stats now the only thing on his page?
Click to expand...

Because we need to scale correctly to his opponents in order to add the key. We currently don't have a scale for them so thqts what we're trying to figure out.
 
Grudgeman1706 said:
I'm a little confused on the question for fist of the North Star(I can't help with the other verse.)

So your saying the description for his AP is weird.? Is what I'm getting at cus I didn't right that prom did.
Click to expand...
No I'm just saying, why can't we use the same scaling that was used on the Hokuto no Ken characters on Beelzebub, when their situations are practically the same.
 
The Hokuto no Ken scenario has a character scaling to another for being somewhat comparable, what you're doing is saying that you don't think these characters are leagues weaker than each other so they should only be a tier lower. Thing is, to my knowledge we have no indication that any of these gaps are particularly small.

Another issue is the scale you're doing this on. Reverse scaling an entire series by your estimates of when their power is a tier above or below each other is taking an already problematic idea and stretching it too far.

Anyways, I was looking into some stuff, and realized that Satan performed their high 6C feat in the demon world where they wouldn't be able to amp their power through fusion with a contractor, however without Super Saiyan mode active Oga can still hurt Satan, this scales to pre-fusion Fuji and Takamiya, and would therefore also scale to Toujou.

Even without that, Lucifer had been able to challenge Beelz III in the past, even if she lost in the end she (and by proxy Takamiya and Toujou) should scale to him.
 
I think that Blahblah9755 seems to make sense.
 
Blahblah9755 said:
The Hokuto no Ken scenario has a character scaling to another for being somewhat comparable, what you're doing is saying that you don't think these characters are leagues weaker than each other so they should only be a tier lower. Thing is, to my knowledge we have no indication that any of these gaps are particularly small.

Another issue is the scale you're doing this on. Reverse scaling an entire series by your estimates of when their power is a tier above or below each other is taking an already problematic idea and stretching it too far.

Anyways, I was looking into some stuff, and realized that Satan performed their high 6C feat in the demon world where they wouldn't be able to amp their power through fusion with a contractor, however without Super Saiyan mode active Oga can still hurt Satan, this scales to pre-fusion Fuji and Takamiya, and would therefore also scale to Toujou.

Even without that, Lucifer had been able to challenge Beelz III in the past, even if she lost in the end she (and by proxy Takamiya and Toujou) should scale to him.
Click to expand...
What about Nasu and Jabberwick then? Shouldn't they also be scaled?
 
Antvasima said:
I think that Blahblah9755 seems to make sense.
Click to expand...
So should I change the profiles of Oga and Fuji to; At least High 6-C (possibly higher), and make Takamiya and Toujou High 6-C?
 
Why do you wish to add "At least" to Oga and Fuji?
 
I think he specifically means in their super Saiyan and fused forms respectively. These forms significantly amp their power and each of them is on par with Satan's high 6C in their base.
 
Okay. Then I think that "At least" seems fine.
 
^ That's it. Like Blahblah said Satan did that fear in the Demon Wolrd, with no contractor (and definately no Fusion) which greatly amp up a Demons power, since Base Oga overpowered Base Fuji, and SS Oga overpowered Fusion Fuji they both deserve the Tiers.
 
Antvasima said:
Okay. Then I think that "At least" seems fine.
Click to expand...
Oh and regarding the speed, Takamiya and Toujou should both be High Hypersonic+ possibly Massively Hypersonic (due to the high end) and Oga and Fuji Massively Hypersonic due to being greatly superior to Takamiya?
 
And Nasu and Jabberwock...?

Should they be 6-C since as a memeber of the Three Beasts (which are chosen by Solomon Company mind you) he shouldn't be that much weaker than Takamiya , and since Jabberwock was actually able to wound Father Switch Oga, the same form that defeated Nasu, he should be the same Tier as whatever Nasu is in.
 
I am not sure about Nasu and Jabberwock. What do you think Lina and Blahblah?

However, I do not think that any Beelzebub speed calculation has been accepted yet.
 
Now with the calc stacking part, the speed of the expanding emblem yielded High Hypersonic results, at a minimum. Thus, that would probably be the attack speed of the one who performed the emblem feat.

Seeing that the beam that is fired from the emblem itself shouldn't be any slower than then the emblem that was formed (The exact speed of the beam we don't know), so the speed of the beam would likely be High Hypersonic as well.

Since using the value of the calculated speed (of emblem being formed), and applying that speed to beam would violate one of the Calc Stacking rules, an alternative way of figuring out the speed of those that scale to the beam is something like this.

A character was able to dodge an attack that moves at High Hypersonic at a relatively close range, thus his/her speed should be High Hypersonic as well.
 
Considering how close the (middle) speed is to MH could I put likely/possibly Massively Hypersonic for Tojou and Takamiya, and Massively Hypersonic for Oga and Fuji due to them being significantly superior to Takamiya?
 
Note: If this feat happened in the anime, we can find a proper timeframe for it.

Since the minimum timeframe used for that calc is 1 second, 1 second seems to be low enough of a timeframe unless it states that the barrier was formed quicker or something.
 
For the AP scaling I think we can say Nasu is "possibly high 6C" since he shouldn't be drastically below the other two, but considering how badly he got beaten by father switch Oga I'm against anything more than possibly.

As for Jabberwock, I don't think he can scale, the limit Oga can achieve in super milk time is dependent on how much magic his body can handle, which is determined by his strength and also controls how much the contract naturally amps him. When he fought against Jabberwock he could only achieve 260cc while he could use 600cc by the time he fought Nasu, so he would have had to be much stronger by then.
 
So from what is stated above:

Nasu and those who scale to him

  • Attack Potency: Possibly High 6-C (Depending on where the results of that calc sits in terms of Large Island level here. The gap between the lowest and highest points of that tier is 10 times).
  • At least Island level would be a reasonable option to be on the safe side since Father Switch Oga seem to be >> Nasu or something.
 
Lina Shields said:
Note: If this feat happened in the anime, we can find a proper timeframe for it.

Since the minimum timeframe used for that calc is 1 second, 1 second seems to be low enough of a timeframe unless it states that the barrier was formed quicker or something.
Click to expand...
So if I put At least High Hypersonic, at most Massively Hypersonic would it be correct?
 
I think that Lina and Blahblah make sense.
 
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