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Seems completely accurate and reasonable, Matt.
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Asura's Wrath Downgrade
- Thread starter Matthew_Schroeder
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Alright, with so many people agreeing, including various staff members, I will edit the profiles.
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I don't agree with this using the game to scale Chaka is just not good as virtually everything in the game wasen't to scale.....Just look at the Gohma carriers those things are described in game to be 800km in length and with, but when we actually see them in the game cinematics/cut scenes they don't even reach 300 meters lol
Same thing happen with virtually every single energy most of them where described to be much bigger than shown.
Plus we can't ignore that Chakavartin created the universe and possibly Naraka which is a dimension of infinite size.....If he wasen't at lest that strong than how the F did he created the universe if he was only large star level or Multi-solar system. It wouldn't make sense but whatever you guys do what you want
Same thing happen with virtually every single energy most of them where described to be much bigger than shown.
Plus we can't ignore that Chakavartin created the universe and possibly Naraka which is a dimension of infinite size.....If he wasen't at lest that strong than how the F did he created the universe if he was only large star level or Multi-solar system. It wouldn't make sense but whatever you guys do what you want
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Chakravartin didn't create the Universe. He created Gaia, and we don't know the size of the dimension.
The argument that the scale of the game is bad is flawed in this case, as all showings make it clear that he isn't Galactic in size.
Also, edited both profiles in light of the agreement here.
The argument that the scale of the game is bad is flawed in this case, as all showings make it clear that he isn't Galactic in size.
Also, edited both profiles in light of the agreement here.
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I'll say this again, the sense of scale isn't the only argument being used here.
The guidebook explicitly says that Chakravartin is in the center of the Milky Way sucking it in.
If you don't want to go by every single showing the game has made and go for authorial intent then this downgrade is still valid.
This is like saying Goku and Vegeta's fingers dwarf planets, even though Akira Toriyama explicitly says they are fighting at the center of the Earth and Vegeta is trying to absorb it.
It's not a matter of "things aren't to scale." It's a matter of "these characters clearly aren't as strong as people want them to be."
The guidebook explicitly says that Chakravartin is in the center of the Milky Way sucking it in.
If you don't want to go by every single showing the game has made and go for authorial intent then this downgrade is still valid.
This is like saying Goku and Vegeta's fingers dwarf planets, even though Akira Toriyama explicitly says they are fighting at the center of the Earth and Vegeta is trying to absorb it.
It's not a matter of "things aren't to scale." It's a matter of "these characters clearly aren't as strong as people want them to be."
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So basically you're going to ignore context, hell even Yasha staed The new world would begin in any moment....But you don't care about that since you think he only created just a planet lol And yes we do know how big is Naraka as I told you the dimension contains an infinite amount of pillar, that was stated in the gameMatthew Schroeder said:
Obviously,nothing in the game was to scale the way it was intended to be so yes using you're "logical reasoning" is definitely not the way.
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Also, Chakravartin calling himself "God", or "The Creator", or "Omnipotent" aren't feats. The are simply the ramblings of a mad, arrogant deity character.
Gods in fiction who are immensely arrogant, prepotent and believe in their own hype are fairly common in fiction. Look at Helios from God of War, who claims to "Be the Sun", literally. Or how Bhunivelze claims to be Almighty and All-Knowing. Or any series which features a version of the Judeo-Christian God as the villain.
Gods in fiction who are immensely arrogant, prepotent and believe in their own hype are fairly common in fiction. Look at Helios from God of War, who claims to "Be the Sun", literally. Or how Bhunivelze claims to be Almighty and All-Knowing. Or any series which features a version of the Judeo-Christian God as the villain.
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cough cough YHVH cough. You see he ain't omnipotent.
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My argument has nothing to do with the statements of Chaka being omnipotent or because his the supreme god, although those statements are valid people Just need to understand the context on how it was said.
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I'm sorry but I honestly think Chakravartin being multi-galactic in size is out of the question now. He simply isn't.
Every scaling they have shows him to be much, much smaller. But then if you want to ignore this and go for author intent, the authors explicitly say he isn't multi-galactic in size and a key element to the plot is taking place in the center of a single galaxy. There isn't an argument to support him being that large at this point.
The only thing possible to prevent a downgrade is the size of this supposed realm he created. However if there aren't any concrete statements of its size or things we can judge by (like if the realm has stars and such) then that feat would have to be considered unquantifiable.
Every scaling they have shows him to be much, much smaller. But then if you want to ignore this and go for author intent, the authors explicitly say he isn't multi-galactic in size and a key element to the plot is taking place in the center of a single galaxy. There isn't an argument to support him being that large at this point.
The only thing possible to prevent a downgrade is the size of this supposed realm he created. However if there aren't any concrete statements of its size or things we can judge by (like if the realm has stars and such) then that feat would have to be considered unquantifiable.
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Super Buu would be listed as Omnipotent if we went by statements
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@Ryu
There are no clear size to his dimension
There are no clear size to his dimension
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The word Omnipotent is commonly used in fiction and nowhere close as how we define it. I mean, Viewtiful Joe fought a boss called King Blue the Omnipotent and yet he isn't. We shouldn't take that word into they way we define it, especially when other official statements completely shows otherwise. This isn't up to debate, Chakra is 4-A for reason Ryu and Matt laid out.
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I didn't say Chaka was multi-Galaxy sized but he was depicted to be the size of the Mily way Galaxy.Ryukama said:
And scaling Chaka from game cinematics is obviously wrong unless you want to tell me this https://imgur.com/HIoWUWM was depicted the size stated in game.
And like I said before it is infinite in size http://i.imgur.com/r5trXyT.png that is from the game not the Guidebook.
That's concistent with the fact that he has created many other worlds in the context, Universe why well this statemet leaves it pretty clear that he was never talking about Gaia(Earth) https://imgur.com/a/vNpU7 even Asura states this world is not yours to control but why would he be talking about Gaia? If they weren't even close to it? Scans for that http://i.imgur.com/yJF24fc.png
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Endless in that context is pretty clearly hyperbole.
He never said that he created other worlds, he's just saying he'll travel to other ones in need of his "guidance".
"even Asura states this world is not yours to control but why would he be talking about Gaia? If they weren't even close to it?"
Because Asura just learned he spent the last 12,500 years manipulating all of Gaia just to get a successor?
He never said that he created other worlds, he's just saying he'll travel to other ones in need of his "guidance".
"even Asura states this world is not yours to control but why would he be talking about Gaia? If they weren't even close to it?"
Because Asura just learned he spent the last 12,500 years manipulating all of Gaia just to get a successor?
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"Endless" is clearly a metaphor / hyperbole.
Chakravartin only created Gaia.
Chakravartin only created Gaia.
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You said that "this downgrade is silly." That would seem to imply that that you believe it's alright for us to keep listing them as 3-B via size.
But regardless if Chakravartin is capable of having a fight within the center of the galaxy, then he isn't as large as an entire galaxy.
And honestly the scaling arguments are still valid. We're not expecting perfect, mathematically flawless scaling. But for a group of galaxies to still be completely visible when shown near a planet clearly indicates that these aren't real galaxies. We don't demand they scale everything with total accurace, but galaxies being comparable to Earth is something anyone should know isn't appropriate.
I can't judge whether the size of this realm is legitamate or not. However these characters cannot be upgraded to Tier 3 or above due to their own physical size.
But regardless if Chakravartin is capable of having a fight within the center of the galaxy, then he isn't as large as an entire galaxy.
And honestly the scaling arguments are still valid. We're not expecting perfect, mathematically flawless scaling. But for a group of galaxies to still be completely visible when shown near a planet clearly indicates that these aren't real galaxies. We don't demand they scale everything with total accurace, but galaxies being comparable to Earth is something anyone should know isn't appropriate.
I can't judge whether the size of this realm is legitamate or not. However these characters cannot be upgraded to Tier 3 or above due to their own physical size.
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It obviously isn't a hyperbole but you think what you wantThe Everlasting said:
Wrong again he did said he created other worlds by the way he talked http://i.imgur.com/n3ke5yu.png http://i.imgur.com/QYvERKp.png
That is true, but there still the fact that he said that he would leave that world which emphasize that he was talking about the entire universe and not just Gaia
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At this point you guys are just ignoring evidence, I'm out it's more than obvious that people will continue to ignore all the evidence because why the f not.
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That isn't him creating new worlds, that is referring to the death and rebirth of one world.
And you are acting very polite and cute treating everyone who doesn't agree with you as idiots. Nobody will side with you like this.
And you are acting very polite and cute treating everyone who doesn't agree with you as idiots. Nobody will side with you like this.
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I'm not treating anyone as idiots, just saying that they are ignoring the evidence but aren't giving a good reasoning to why they don't agree.
Yeah and he is the embodiment of life and death, and like he said "I will bring an end to this world" although I'm pretty sure you will state his talking about just Gaia, would make no sense really but you're entitled to believe what you desire.
Now for real I'm out unless someone makes a good argument
Yeah and he is the embodiment of life and death, and like he said "I will bring an end to this world" although I'm pretty sure you will state his talking about just Gaia, would make no sense really but you're entitled to believe what you desire.
Now for real I'm out unless someone makes a good argument
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Where's any of your proof? That's only a statement, and with that logic he'd only be planet level....
The second picture is enough evidence for this upgrade. Unless you can provide any 3-B feats, which you haven't, this upgrade is already proven.
The second picture is enough evidence for this upgrade. Unless you can provide any 3-B feats, which you haven't, this upgrade is already proven.
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Statements are evidence as long as nothing contradicts it.JustSomeWeirdo said:
I already posted evidence, regardless the fact that he created Naraka pretty much says no to the downgrade, what lol why do you keep saying upgrade
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Naraka is a dimension of unknown size, get over it. You've shown no statements of Universe-Creation.
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And I have already showed evidence saying it's infinite in sizeMatthew Schroeder said:
Yet it was stated multiple times that he did.
You see what I'm saying ignoring evidence
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No, you are the one ignoring all the debunking.
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The wank is strong in this one
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Yet nobody made a debunk worth anything
It was all statement therefore doesn't matter
Post evidence on Naraka being infinite in size, people say no it's hyperbole lol
Yeah that'd quite the debunk, have a good day
It was all statement therefore doesn't matter
Post evidence on Naraka being infinite in size, people say no it's hyperbole lol
Yeah that'd quite the debunk, have a good day
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Burden of proof, you have not proven that it is infinite in size
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I posted an in game description of it, so the burden of proof is on you guys who say it isn't despite evidence saying otherwise.JustSomeWeirdo said:
We are done here
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Can we please close this thread? There's more people who agree with the downgrade than those who don't and the discussion is getting agressive and ridiculous.
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Then make a thread to upgrade them to 3-A, which I highly doubt will pass anyway. "Endless pillars" would mean there is an infinite number of pillars, there clearly isn't, meaning it was hyperbole, as for there to a truly infinite number of pllars the dimension would have to both be infinite in size and have nothing but pillars throughout the size of an infinite universe.
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