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Goku was really suppressed in the pre-Tournament of Power match and current Goku is way stronger than before given the Post-Jiren Zenkai.Kyle Ramos said:
I agree that 17 is probably on Super Saiyan level at best, but not Blue.
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Android 18 Universal and Massively FTL Upgrade
- Thread starter Fankid
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I agree that 17 is probably on Super Saiyan level at best, but not Blue.
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17 below SS Goku makes me wanna laugh. You realize they were tag teaming right?Matthew Schroeder said:
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I honestly think it's not an outlier.
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"Dude 17 fodderized SS1 Goku. Goku even proceeds to say he didn't intend to go SSB that would mean Android 17 > SSG Lvl at minimum."
That's debatable really. Both Goku and 17 were holding back on SSB.
That's debatable really. Both Goku and 17 were holding back on SSB.
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Exactly and Goku said he didn't intend to go SSB even though he could've gone either SS2, SS3 or SSG. But you know what he did? He skipped them all and went straight to SSB. This literally implies Android 17 is at the very least SSG Lvl. So to say 17 is only at most SS1 Lvl is just dumb.Matthew Schroeder said:
Back on topic I don't think this is an outlier if 18 shows a bit more feats later on in the tournament.
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You should rewatch episode 86 then... Goku states to go all out.. yet 17 held back and so did goku while being in blue. He also said he was only saving some power, one could argue that he meant kaioken, because his full power was blue kaioken x20. Goku also stated he did not plan on or intended on using Blue for 17 cause he didn't think he'd need it. So even if you think he was suppressed in blue.. 17 would still be SSB Tier regardless. Not to mention Goku noted that 17 was still holding back as well.Matthew Schroeder said:
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DBS' writing has always been trash tier. No surprise that all the characters benefit from it.
Anyway upgrade is legit. Wew
Anyway upgrade is legit. Wew
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I went back and checked. It turns out you were right it was SSB Goku blast she deflected. At that time that would be an outlier now it's pretty much confirmed she can operate on those levels.Aeyu said:
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Super Suppressed SSB off guard..Kasyacarey said:
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I went back and checked. It turns out you were right it was SSB Goku blast she deflected. At that time that would be an outlier now it's pretty much confirmed she can operate on those levels.
Super Suppressed SSB off guard..
Yes, forgot that either way she should still be higher than star level because of that a while back.
Super Suppressed SSB off guard..
Yes, forgot that either way she should still be higher than star level because of that a while back.
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Super Suppressed SSB off guard..Kasyacarey said:
Yes, forgot that either way she should still be higher than star level because of that a while back.
Well, if you want to get technical "mostly" everyone in the tournament is higher than star level, per pis boosts and destroying katchin that's far heavier and durable than the katchin that Shin threw on Goku in buu saga. Goku had to lift it in super saiyan and the Z sword couldn't even cut it.
In Super Manga Zamasu was able to amp it to Universal+ levels lol.
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As we see with the fodder of Universe 2 they even apparently have enough power to produce black hole like sheer of power.
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I went back and checked. It turns out you were right it was SSB Goku blast she deflected. At that time that would be an outlier now it's pretty much confirmed she can operate on those levels.Super Suppressed SSB off guard..
Yes, forgot that either way she should still be higher than star level because of that a while back.
Well, if you want to get technical "mostly" everyone in the tournament is higher than star level, per pis boosts and destroying katchin that's far heavier and durable than the katchin that Shin threw on Goku in buu saga. Goku had to lift it in super saiyan and the Z sword couldn't even cut it.
In Super Manga Zamasu was able to amp it to Universal+ levels lol.
PIS fights like who?
Yes, forgot that either way she should still be higher than star level because of that a while back.
Well, if you want to get technical "mostly" everyone in the tournament is higher than star level, per pis boosts and destroying katchin that's far heavier and durable than the katchin that Shin threw on Goku in buu saga. Goku had to lift it in super saiyan and the Z sword couldn't even cut it.
In Super Manga Zamasu was able to amp it to Universal+ levels lol.
PIS fights like who?
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I said PIS boosts. Like everyone is able to destroy Katchi Katchin made by the GP to be way more durable than a regular Katchin.
Master Roshi apparently was doing in secretive training for what 35+ years.
17 SSB Tier by just training alone and protecting animals and tending to his family for 14+ years.
18 SSB Tier out of the blue just cause she needs the boost.
Krillin and Gohan at least had a little build up to their power. Krillin's make sense. Gohan's in a few hours becoming at least SSJ3 to SSB Tier is ridiculous.
Piccolo never stopped training so he's fine.
Tien not even stronger than Master Roshi and stayed the weakest lol.
They could've handled everyone getting stronger better than what they did.
Master Roshi apparently was doing in secretive training for what 35+ years.
17 SSB Tier by just training alone and protecting animals and tending to his family for 14+ years.
18 SSB Tier out of the blue just cause she needs the boost.
Krillin and Gohan at least had a little build up to their power. Krillin's make sense. Gohan's in a few hours becoming at least SSJ3 to SSB Tier is ridiculous.
Piccolo never stopped training so he's fine.
Tien not even stronger than Master Roshi and stayed the weakest lol.
They could've handled everyone getting stronger better than what they did.
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She got empowered by their love not their powers. No. 18 was about to give and remembered she had a family. She even stated in the fight she's just there to save her family.Dziga said:
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That was not the point of her winning. No.18 thought about her family the entire time pushing through as she stated before Rib received a power up.Amlad22 said:
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Yeah learning over more to this still being an Outlier until something comes up to change my mind.
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If 18's thing is "an outlier", wouldn't that mean we might have to downgrade 17?
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Dude. Love is not Pis.
Even then, this would always be a case of "3-A with Love"
Not kidding, she deserves 3-A
Even then, this would always be a case of "3-A with Love"
Not kidding, she deserves 3-A
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Nope, fairy tale rely on the power of friendship on basically everything to keep the fight going. 18 stop herself from giving up because she had a daughter and husband she had to protect. That was her duty has she stated before the fight got serious.Dziga said:
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I'd put 18 at multi-galaxy tier. I don't even believe Rib can beat Vegeta or Goku in their base honestly. Lol Goku and Vegeta go blue for show. Goku only been serious twice( Jiren and Kefla).
Dragon Ball Heroes 30th anniversary live stream gave out teaser spoilers that Goku will go UI again more than once and that Vegeta isn't serious, no one has pushed him to fight seriously yet.
Dragon Ball Heroes 30th anniversary live stream gave out teaser spoilers that Goku will go UI again more than once and that Vegeta isn't serious, no one has pushed him to fight seriously yet.
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This is a massive outlier.
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How do you even figure? It's incredibly consistent with what's been shown. (She knocked away an SSJB Goku's Kamehameha with ease before, and it doesn't matter if she was holding back.)Celestial Pegasus said:
Or else SSB Gohan clashing with Goku is ALSO an outlier, which it's not.
Kefla is Low 2-C
18 is 3-A from scaling to Ribrianne.
These are real things.
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This upgrade doesn't make sense. 3-A Fat Buu was rejected for literally the same reasons. 18 doesn't train in her free time, she cares for her family, even she states this. This upgrade would also upgrade Krillin, regardless, because before the ToP, he was shown to be on par with her, although, still somewhat weaker. If you can stomach a 3-A Krillin, then you must have stomachs made of led.
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What about 17? 18 and 17 seem to be on a similar level to each other.
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If this is an outlier, just about everyone in DBZ should be downgraded. That does seem fair.
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No, because 17 and 18 were not stated to be equal in power.OishiLover75 said:
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Honestly I don't even think the writers liked Ribrianne as a character to be real. Probably thought she's ass of a homage/parody.
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This would not upgrade Krillin.
If anything, the statement that they were "comparable," should be seen as an outlier for Krillin, because feats would demonstrate otherwise.
Additionally, there is a massive difference between completely overpowering a 3-A character and simply sparring with one in your free time to see "how much stronger you've gotten".
You could also argue that her bonds with Krillin gave her a power boost, which was shown. I can deliver scans on request.
If anything, the statement that they were "comparable," should be seen as an outlier for Krillin, because feats would demonstrate otherwise.
Additionally, there is a massive difference between completely overpowering a 3-A character and simply sparring with one in your free time to see "how much stronger you've gotten".
You could also argue that her bonds with Krillin gave her a power boost, which was shown. I can deliver scans on request.
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18 didn't do any training, and was on par with krillin, her being 3-A makes no sense. Other characters at least have some justification for them being 3-A, albeit i think it's shitty writing why they got so powerful, but it's still a justification nonetheless.
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17 nor 18 and everyone else is not even on the same level. That fallacious claim is more so, " well sense 18 isn't 3-A everyone else shouldn't be." No that's not how it works lol. 18 is more along the lines of 3-C or 3-B.
17 literally role played with Rib didn't take her serious. Vegeta and goku mainly fought her base. Hell Vegeta almost eliminated her and Rozie at the same time while being in base.
17 literally role played with Rib didn't take her serious. Vegeta and goku mainly fought her base. Hell Vegeta almost eliminated her and Rozie at the same time while being in base.
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