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Alien X (And others) downgrade

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@Ryu

As I pointed out in the OP, the statement was taken down (I have a link to it tho), but it was used on the Ben 10 wiki and has circulated on several sites. Hence, I'm willing to believe it's true.
 
I already dropped the subject, as admins you have my respect and I feel like I'm being too rude. You guys aren't dumb and clearly know what your doing, I want to apologize for any rudeness I may have show it wasn't intentinal in the slightiest.

It's very hard for me to understand people at time, I can figure it out eventully but I'm just a little slow on the uptake.
 
I'm a man who knows when to fold them I'm not all knowing and sometimes people need debate with another so they can realized if their right or wrong about something.

Can I at least get a answer on why the statment of Alien X being able to destroy the multiverse doesn't count?You said because it wasn't serious but why isn't it serious? Even if it's says omiverse he also said multiverse to and we know what they're are talking about.

I know Omiverse can be used as absurd term but I don't think that statment should be written off since he mentioned the multiverse as well.
 
@Ever Misinformation can easily spread, circulate places and be treated by many on the internet as fact. Saitama = half Big Bang for example. I'll still agree to the downgrade for your other points though.

@Poincianana1971 You're not being rude at all. You're actually being far more respectful and kinder than many users I've dealt with. Thanks for that and for being very reasonable like Ever said.
 
The answer was just somewhat coy and joking, if I recall.

Azathoth the Abyssal Idiot would be able to answer better.
 
@Ryu

Yeah, I get that, it's just that I've explicitly seen a link (And very vaguely recall reading it long ago) and the link has been shown on various sites. It's not like it's just random guys saying 3-B Saitama without even attempting to give a source.
 
I guess I'm going to tribute that to me being unable to read people probably and take your advice. I wouldn't want to bother Azathoth anyway especially during this time.

Anyway I have no problems with this downgrade.
 
@Ever I'm not saying I don't believe you. But I'd still like to be able to see a direct source of such a claim before agreeing with it. Also for all I know you could have been misled by false information as well. It happens to all of us at some point. But regardless I still agree to the downgrade currently for your other reasons.
 
@Ryu

I'll apply the downgrades tomorrow, then, unless someone else can do it. I gotta to to bed now.
 
Maybe have Azzy or a couple others give input before such a massive downgrade first.
 
I also think that this mostly seems to make sense, but agree with Ryukama about that the weapons should probably stay at 2-A.

I vaguely recall that alternative timeline Ben 10000 simply fused Alien X and Atomix because he usually couldn't get the former alien to work.

I am also not sure what we should do about Atomic-X's current statistics. It technically makes limited sense that it is weaker than Alien X, but it did seem to be.

I also miss Dwayne McDuffie btw. He was my favourite western superhero animation writer, and I visited his questions and answers forum a few times.
 
Since I was a big part of listing reasons why I had problems with this tiering before, and have seen Evers reasons now, I am in full support of the downgrade entirely.
 
I agree but wasn't only Ben 10,000 able to access Atomic-X, there's no proof that he was given full control since this Ben was a different Ben from the normal one; he might have used it simply because he could do something with it plus, it was much stronger than normal Atomix.
 
Ah. I'm still disagree to use the word of McDuffie.This is like saying that Monty Oum in a review state that the characters from RWBY can go only at supersonic speed, but later in the series the characters shows MHS speed feats.

┬┐Does we go for what is stated or what it shows?

"sigh". But if you still want to go for the revision, go ahead, I will not stop anyone.
 
@Newendigo

That's entirely different.

A better example would be if Monty Oum said that there are Hunters stronger than Ozpin.
 
Also, while unanimous, there was something else too.

Wasn't one of the reasons he got upgraded to 2-A was for doing a reset of the universe which would apparently include the Time Bomb being recreated automatically? Because if so (I don't remember) there's problems with that too.
 
Let me look ;... It was because Paradox viewed the Celestialsapiens as far superior to the CHrono Navigator and CHromosapien Time Bomb, both being capable of affecting a infinite number of universes.

Couldn't we just assume Atomix was an lowshowing of Atomix ? I am not leaning for any side, just playing devil's advocate.
 
@Kukui

Recreating a bomb doesn't mean he's stronger than it. Same way Hugo from OFF doesn't get scaled to the Batter and the Queen for creating them.
 
@Everlasting

Oh I know that. I wasn't arguing that. In fact I was going against it the same as you.

The problems I have with that are:

1.) We have 0 evidence that the Time Bomb was made in the same universe or time period as Ben when he did the feat since, iirc, it was created by Chronosapiens who come from an entirely different reality and time completely and they were in the middle of some war stretching across space-time.

2.) Why would a 2-A weapon be able to be even remotely affected by a Low 2-C to 2-C level reset at best? The bomb would have to have some feature or capability to it that would allow it to survive the kind of destruction it unfolds and considering this thing is supposedly able to destroy endless timelines, then it should be able to sit through a recreation of the universe perfectly.

So to make the story short I'm agreeing with you. Just adding more fuel to the fire.
 
Looking into the issue even further, Infinite speed for the Celestialsapiens might not be legit either.

See, in the episode The Forge of Creation, at 5:55, Professor Paradox states that the Forge of Creation (Where the Celestialsapiens are born and live) is enclosed by a "Chronal Randomization Barrier", and out of sync with all of time.

However, being out of sync with time doesn't mean having no time, in contrast to what the pages say.

It's equivalent to the Daleks keeping the Medusa Cascade (A collection of dozens of planets) permanently one second ahead of time in the rest of the universe, to keep it from being discovered.

Hence, the Celestialsapiens should probably be downgraded to Massively FTL+ based on these feats.
 
I agree and from what I remember the last time this was discussed, I mentioned that Kid Ben who appeared in that episode still had the timer on his Omnitrix and it could still time out while in the Forge of Creation. If time wasnt really in the FoC then the omnitrix timing out would be completely impossible. Ben would remain in alien form for as long as he is in their and wouldn't time out until he left.
 
For yet another downgrade (Man I have a lot of these), Clockwork is rated as 2-A via time manipulation for reversing the effects of the Chronosapien Time Bomb.

While this did happen, the problem is that this isn't a feat, it was only time reversal. At best, it's 2-A via hax, but it's likely not even that, just hax.

Hence, that stat should get removed.
 
I'm confused as to what you're asking right now.

You're saying you can't recall a multiveral feat without hax, but literally any feat of blowing up/creating a multiverse is without hax.

What Clockwork did was literally just reverse time.
 
@Newendigo

The Everlasting's point is the fact that Clockwork never created or destroyed a multiverse, he simply reversed time.
 
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