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Akuto Sai vs Sans

StorytellingDemonKing said:
Has he shown resistance to Social Influencing?
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you don't need resistance to social infuencing to simply not give a shit to what someone's saying. (something sans, and other characters do against frisk, who also has it)

unless you have some crazy ******* social influencing (or your a pacifist using it to get out of a fight), its not useful in combat.
 
FarerPurple said:
you don't need resistance to social infuencing to simply not give a shit to what someone's saying. (something sans, and other characters do against frisk, who also has it)

unless you have some crazy ******* social influencing (or your a pacifist using it to get out of a fight), it's not useful in combat.
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How is it not? This isn't a pep talk a buddy would give you and you just don't listen. This is an entire ability. I don't remember there being a note on the SI page saying "Yeah if you decide to then a character just won't be affected by this." Hell, Akuto's social influence straight up entrances people. So, has sans shown resistance to this level of degree? Of course, this simply increases Akuto's chance to win, but I just want to know.
 
StorytellingDemonKing said:
How is it not? This isn't a pep talk a buddy would give you and you just don't listen. This is an entire ability. I don't remember there being a note on the SI page saying "Yeah if you decide to then a character just won't be affected by this." Hell, Akuto's social influence straight up entrances people. So, has sans shown resistance to this level of degree? Of course, this simply increases Akuto's chance to win, but I just want to know.
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Social Influencing isn't a real ability like empathic manipulation. it's just someone being able to charm another with words (manipulation, talking down fights, etc) . it's not helpful in combat unless you're trying to stop someone from fighting like any pacifist protagonist in a video game does.

sans, does not give a shit about someone doing that with him. frisk trying to spare sans in his fight shows social influencing does not mean shit to him.
 
FarerPurple said:
Social Influencing isn't a real ability like empathic manipulation. it's just someone being able to charm another with words (manipulation, talking down fights, etc). it's not helpful in combat unless you're trying to stop someone from fighting like any pacifist protagonist in a video game does.

sans does not give a shit about someone doing that with him. frisk trying to spare sans in his fight shows social influence does not mean shit to him.
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Did Frisk's speech entrance Sans and he snap out of it? No? Then I doubt it matters. Also, I don't know much about Undertale but from what I remember Sans got nervous over his fight with Frisk as it was getting harder, which means it won't be long before Akuto's social influence heavily burdens him in their fight. If this was someone else who talks a lot, like a leader, and motivates people, then sure, I guess Sans wouldn't care. But if it's listed as an ability then I'm not so sure. Maybe ask a staff member?
 
StorytellingDemonKing said:
Did Frisk's speech entrance Sans and he snap out of it? No?
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No it didn't do ******* shit. thats the thing. Social influencing ISN'T A REAL POWER it's 9/10 NOT combat applicable, and it's likely like that here.
StorytellingDemonKing said:
Also, I don't know much about Undertale but from what I remember Sans got nervous over his fight with Frisk as it was getting harder, which means it won't be long before Akuto's social influence heavily burdens him in their fight.
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Sans never showed any emotions throughout the entire game (besides like, 3 times at best). not sure where your getting that from. he got tired, not nervous. and was never effected by frisk's social influencing. showing if you don't give a ****, the power doesn't work. the only reason frisk was able to talk down the monsters is because they weren't horrible people, and actively were pretty okay with being befriended.

sans does not care. (he even tells you the only reason he didn't kill you is that someone else told him not to, showing frisk's social influencing means shit to sans). if he's in this situation fighting someone talking to him will not change his mind. end of story.
 
FarerPurple said:
No it didn't do ******* shit. thats the thing. Social influencing ISN'T A REAL POWER it's 9/10 NOT combat applicable, and it's likely like that here.
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It fits under P&A so, it is. And how is it not combat applicable when Akuto commonly talks and tries to get advantage or at least get things going his way?
FarerPurple said:
Sans never showed any emotions throughout the entire game (besides like, 3 times at best).
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Ok?
FarerPurple said:
not sure where your getting that from. he got tired, not nervous. and was never effected by frisk's social influencing. showing if you don't give a ****, the power doesn't work. the only reason frisk was able to talk down the monsters is because they weren't horrible people, and actively were pretty okay with being befriended.
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So, it's to a far lesser degree than Akutos social influence.
FarerPurple said:
Sans does not care. (he even tells you the only reason he didn't kill you is that someone else told him not to, showing frisk's social influencing means shit to sans). if he's in this situation fighting someone talking to him will not change his mind. end of story.
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SI to a far lesser degree from the way you described it.
"The only reason frisk was able to talk down the monsters is because they weren't horrible people, and actively were pretty okay with being befriended."
The way you describe it, Frisk might as well not have SI.

Hell, the SI page outright says this can be used to manipulate your opponents and Akuto does it so well it entrances people who fear and hate him.

"While it does not usually seem combat applicable, this skill can be used in many ways that can affect a fight indirectly, including buying time, obtaining information that could be important, or manipulating how a person might approach a situation."

The original question was if it increases Akuto chances, so far it does.
 
Social influence won't work, Sans' first move is to go straight for the kill, he won't give Akuto time to talk
 
Don't think Danmaku helps much due to mana being in surrounding so he would just casually stop it.
As for bloodlust, don't know if it's different from hate, but pretty much the entire school either absolutely despises him and wants him dead, because he's the demon king, or fears him. And even then SI works. Also Junko was bloodlusted, even rallied up the entire school, and he changed her mind. But don't know how much SI applies to that exactly.
 
StorytellingDemonKing said:
Don't think Danmaku helps much due to mana being in surrounding so he would just casually stop it.
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Sans attacks are intangible.

"As for bloodlust, don't know if it's different from hate, but pretty much the entire school either absolutely despises him and wants him dead, because he's the demon king, or fears him. And even then SI works. Also Junko was bloodlusted, even rallied up the entire school, and he changed her mind. But don't know how much SI applies to that exactly."

How long it took?
 
Dragonite007 said:
Sans attacks are intangible.
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Akuto should still be able to affect them via mana IMO since he later killed a Computer God with mana attacks and they have incorporeality. (Also if Sans attacks use magic then it should be even less trouble)
Dragonite007 said:
"As for bloodlust, don't know if it's different from hate, but pretty much the entire school either absolutely despises him and wants him dead, because he's the demon king, or fears him. And even then SI works. Also, Junko was bloodlust, and even rallied up the entire school, and he changed her mind. But don't know how much SI applies to that exactly."

How long does it take?
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About instantly. In the beginning, he just ran since he did not want to fight or even talk to anyone but when he got serious Junko listened. And in the cafeteria, it was also instant.
 
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Dragonite007 said:
What is Sans Incon?
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Honestly, IDK. Damage and get good hits on Akuto?

I mean:
-Akuto has slightly more AP
-Slightly more durability
-Arguably quicker decision-making in tight situations
-Hax that counters some of sans abilities

For Sans, I don't know. He likely has much more experience considering he's probably much older. Also he's an extraordinary genius so he's more knowledgable in scientific fields compared to Act 1 Akuto. I think Sans could win some scenarios with good shots in but I'm not 100% sure.
 
ok sans dies miserably rest in peace

can this be added on their win/loss section in their profiles?
 
Nah, we didn't reach grace period, I think it might be a stomp because of thought-based attacks.

Then again, we do have matches where thought-based gave people W's before so I think this can be voted for and added still.

All of Akuto's Magic is thought-based, I remember Mitsuko explaining in Act 1 that any Constant Magic Academy magician should be capable of controlling internal mana (the mana inside your body) and external mana (the mana in the air) using their mind.
 
Imo, I'm thinking of casting a rematch of Akuto against Mugman, there weren't anyone who knew much about Act 1 Akuto arguing there-

I'd do a Tanjirou rematch but he resists a lot Akuto throws at him, although because of the whole 'rules of mana' thing I learned from reading the story, there could be another outcome.

But those are threads for another day, this however, could be a stomp.
 
Gohan?_You're_still_alive? said:
Imo, I'm thinking of casting a rematch of Akuto against Mugman, there weren't anyone who knew much about Act 1 Akuto arguing there-

I'd do a Tanjirou rematch but he resists a lot Akuto throws at him, although because of the whole 'rules of mana' thing I learned from reading the story, there could be another outcome.

But those are threads for another day, this however, could be a stomp.
Click to expand...
Honestly I want to redo a lot of daimaou matchups in general. People straight up didn't even try to argue for daimaou characters in some of them and so the other side won.
 
Dragonite007 said:
Does Sans have any win conditions?
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If this is genocide Sans then yes, he'll spare no mercy in going bloodlust mode to take Akuto down, the fact that his attacks can harm the soul could mean that he might be capable of dispatching Akuto quickly, but Akuto's also quick with his head too, it's not that he's smart, it's...

Will he be quick enough to use thought-based Paralysis and take the W?
 
Akuto really just needs to land a good hit, and I see that happening.

As stated before, here's a tldr; he'll rely on explosive magic, get harmed since Sans is prone to dodging and attacking, and then use thought-based Paralysis, because Sans can't control mana, he's screwed, that's how I see Akuto winning.

As for if Akuto can use it quickly enough?

He's fought in a crowd of people before, and prone to closing the range between him and his opponent, hence why he approached Takeshi in order to torture him, Akuto's magic is bound to range, although, Takeshi could do something because he had a decent control over mana, Sans doesn't use mana, he's a being of magic, and Akuto can manipulate magic, so Akuto could easily also use external mana in the air to twist Sans and one-shot him that way.

Bound by range, that's where the next portion stands.

Here's the ✨math✨

The wiki put Akuto's magic range at 'several' meters, this fight starts at 'few'.

The most common interpretation or intended sense of several is around three to five, but this can vary greatly depending on the context.

As for few? It commonly refers to a low number, such as two or three.

What does this mean? Sans is totally put in range, and Akuto won't hesitate to close the distance regardless, he'd eventually use paralysis and end it.
 
Also, social influencing would make no difference.

Before you say Sans and Akuto have a talk and Sans would likely trick Akuto into the "GEEEEET DUNKED ON!" situation, paralysis and Akuto's control over external mana kinda ends the fight before they have a chance to talk it out like that.

Heck, Akuto would have all the rights not to trust Sans, this is a fight after all, Sans knew Frisk the entirety of Undertale technically at Snowdin but still, in this thread Akuto just kinda runs into him and they fight-

And while Akuto's LS is unknown in this key, in Act's 2-4, he has a superior lifting strength that quickly, while he achieves this LS shortly later during the story, it is still a good example to have of what could happen if Akuto was backed into that kind of situation.
 
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