Akuto Sai from the light novel “Ichiban Ushiro no Daimao”, or “Demon King Daimao” in English, is a character that is heavily misconstrued in powerscaling due to misinformation and out of context “evidence”. There has already been a disrespect thread debunking Akuto Sai, however this debunk has been neglected recently due to more misinformation from a VSBW “rebunk”. The debunk also doesn’t cover everything that has been used to wank Akuto to absurd levels. In the following thread, I will go over every argument used to justify Akuto’s power, and debunk them.
“Akuto is baseline 4D as he existed within the 4th dimension.”
This argument is flawed in many ways. First and foremost, it is important to note that the realm is not even 4D, it was just named the 4th dimension.
There is an argument to be made for the 4th dimension being an infinite realm, however this is irrelevant as the dimension is simply a virtual world.
Not only this, but the world is akin to a video game.
And this world is below the physical realm, and will cease to exist without the physical realm.
This should explain how the 4th dimension scales Akuto nowhere.
“Akuto scales to the afterlife which is infinite and transcendent.”
First of all, we should tackle the “infinite” claim. The afterlife is stated to be a finite realm multiple times.
It is also called a planet.
As for the afterlife being transcendent, this is directly contradicted when it’s called a 3 dimensional finite world.
Some may argue that time is meaningless in the afterlife, therefore it is transcendent over some concepts. While it is true that time is different in the afterlife, it certainly does exist.
And no, just because time is different doesn’t mean anything.
Some argue that Akuto expanded the afterlife, and turned it into an infinite realm due to this quote:
This is another example of taking the novel out of context. Akuto never expanded the afterlife, that is never once stated, all he did was create another surface within the afterlife, which as I already proved is finite. We actually get direct confirmation that this surface is contained within the space of the afterlife just two paragraphs after that quote.
This is very similar to how the 4th dimension was an infinite sized realm, but was lower than, and powered by the finite physical realm. This could mean one of two things; either this surface is not actually infinite and that is just a hyperbolic claim, or the surface is a virtual/lower world. Either way, this feat doesn’t scale Akuto anywhere.
There is nothing to suggest the afterlife is anything but an alternative planet.
“Akuto creates infinite fictional worlds with infinite possibilities that he transcends.”
The first thing to point out is that the words “story” and “fiction” are almost certainly used as metaphors for “world” and “weakness”. However, for the sake of argument, we will assume they are being used literally.
As you probably know by now, the universe of Demon King Daimao is a solar system. This is stated many times, but since it’s such a well known point, I will only provide a couple of statements from the novel.
As you can see, the universe being a solar system isn’t specific to one universe, the other universes are also solar systems.
Some argue that there are different story densities, therefore the stories are different in size and have infinite gaps between them, however there is no proof of this. In fact it’s implied that the density just refers to the characters themselves.
In fact, the characters can use their wills to go against their creators, proving there are no infinite fictional gaps.
The “rebunk” on VsBattles Wiki argues that the characters cannot actually use their wills to go against their creators, instead it was just an idea that was unable to be acted upon. However, we clearly see their will going against The Law of Identity to an extent.
Not to mention the Extra-Universal Gods can win fights against Akuto, showing he is not transcendent over them.
The rebunk states that Akuto was simply self-inserting himself, but there is no evidence to support that this was a self-insert being defeated, that argument is an example of an unwarranted assumption. The rebunk also states that Akuto had to create all possibilities, therefore he had to create ones in which he loses. This is once again an unwarranted assumption as Akuto losing had little to do with the stories themselves.
Akuto also gave up on creating all stories.
It also takes Akuto an insane amount of time to create only some of these stories, thus, this would not help him in the scaling aspect of things even if he were to create infinite possibilities.
It’s also worth noting that these possibilities are not even a full timeline.
It’s also implied that these “other stories” are just the same story being reconstructed.
With the understanding of what these stories really are, I think it’s clear that they don't scale Akuto very high, and that there is no reality > fiction hierarchy. These feats are also just creation feats, which are highly inapplicable in an actual battle.
“Akuto scales to “the system” which is an infinite transcendent hierarchy.”
Many people use this as an argument due to a very misinterpreted line in the novel.
While it is true there are infinite layers in the system, there is nothing that implies these layers are transcendent or have infinite fictional gaps. In fact, I’ve already proven that they aren’t transcendent in the last section.
This argument is invalid anyway as Akuto doesn’t even scale to the system, he just scales to the afterlife which is the second layer of the system, which I’ve also already proven to not be transcendent over anything.
“Akuto scales to the anti-universe which is transcendent over the system.”
This argument is not commonly used, however it is still used nonetheless. There is not much to say about this point as the novel never says much about the anti-universe at all besides the fact it is empty. It is referred to as a “new land”, but this obviously doesn’t mean it’s transcendent by any means.
Saying this scales Akuto anywhere is a very disingenuous argument to make, as there is basically no argument to be made for it in the first place.
“Akuto in Void Body scales to The Law of Identity who dreams reality and completely transcends everything.”
There are many statements that contradict The Law of Identity dreaming reality. I could go over them, but they are irrelevant as Akuto doesn’t even scale to her in the first place.
Some argue that Akuto merged with, and transcended The Law of Identity, but this is just false. Akuto never merged with TLOI, but only Keena Soga after she left her position as The Law of Identity.
Also, the Void Body itself has no feats besides a few statements that can easily be seen as hyperbolic.
There are three main points that come with this argument. The first is “data made of imaginary numbers.” The argument is that Akuto was a completely nonexistent entity, or at the very least, a conceptual entity.
Firstly, imaginary numbers are real mathematical numbers that represent something intangible, not something inherently conceptual. This could easily be seen as more of a spiritual form if anything. This is further supported by the same paragraph saying “It was casting aside one’s earthly form.”
The second point is “beyond causality”. Being beyond causality is a scientific notion that refers to being beyond what is logical or physical. The paragraph also supports this by saying “It was a place where the laws of physics came to an end.” Saying it is completely transcendent over causality is a disingenuous claim, especially considering the next few chapters explicitly show Akuto being affected by causality.
The third and final point that is made is “it was space with no time.” The argument being made is that Akuto is transcendent over space time. This argument contradicts itself as it clearly says it is space. Nothing suggests it is transcendent over time either, it just says this specific space has no time.
While I will even admit, the Void Body does give Akuto some decent hax, it scales him nowhere.
“Author statements scale Akuto high.”
The main author statement being used is one in which the author claims Akuto is omnipotent.
First of all, the author makes it clear that Akuto would only be omnipotent in one multiverse. This alone is a contradiction. By definition, one cannot be omnipotent over one thing. However, let’s assume he is all powerful over his multiverse. I have already explained how his multiverse is not as big as an ordinary multiverse in fiction, so this statement doesn’t equate to him being all that powerful. I also find this funny as using omnipotence as an argument is against VSBW’s rules.
I covered this statement as it is very popular amongst powerscalers, but there are many other author statements people use to scale Akuto to absurd levels, however these all fall under the death of the author fallacy. While one could argue this fallacy doesn’t apply to all works of fiction, the author of Demon King Daimao himself has confirmed that he is not privileged to his novel, and only what is written in said novel is correct.
It’s also worth noting that most of the author’s claims use vague wording such as “I think” or “I believe” which is also against VSBW’s rules.
This section also mentions that fan-questions answered on social media are usually disregarded, yet mods still seem to use them to defend a character they like, in this case Akuto. But as I've already proven, it doesn’t matter as all of the author statements for DKD are not canon anyway.
“Rebunk”
As stated earlier, there was a post on VsBattles Wiki by DontTalkDT, who I will just refer to as DT for simplicity's sake, that claimed to “rebunk” Akuto. This post however was filled with many flaws, some of which I have already gone over.
There are many claims in this post, most of which don’t scale Akuto anywhere. I will be going over the main points being made, and the ones used to scale Akuto to absurd levels.
The original debunk claimed that characters can use their wills to influence their creators, therefore proving their creators aren’t fictionally transcendent over them. As I stated earlier, DT claims that that specific argument was taken out of context, and also says that he will add the extra context needed to show how this doesn’t debunk Akuto.
While this may seem convincing at first glance, actually reading the novel will provide even more context. You may recall earlier in this thread when I showed a line in the novel in which Keena directly shows that she was able to use her will to go against TLOI, albeit barely.
This sentence was only a few sentences after the paragraph DT is using. What DT is doing is strategically claiming he knows the context so people will believe him without question, while purposefully leaving out context.
Another argument DT makes is one that I have already been over. The argument is that when Akuto lost to the extra-universal gods, it was just his avatar losing.
While this argument also makes sense on paper, it’s never stated these are avatars that lost. In fact, it is never even stated that Akuto has an avatar. Instead it seems as if Akuto just puts himself into the worlds until they end, which would explain why it takes him so long to test the stories. But even assuming Akuto is self inserting an avatar into the stories, this argument still doesn’t hold up as even after Akuto quit making stories the gods are shown to be more than just fiction to Akuto.
And before the argument that Akuto just summoned these gods is made, this paragraph is stated before that.
DT also claims Akuto has existence erasure, thus proving Akuto is fictionally transcendent.
First of all, if Akuto were truly fictionally transcendent over everything, he could surely destroy people’s concepts, however it’s directly stated he just reduces them to a concept. If that wasn’t enough, it goes on to state how this simply means Akuto can experience people’s personalities, not literally reduce them to a concept. But even if we humor the idea that Akuto has existence erasure, this does not in any way prove he is fictionally transcendent over anything.
DT then attempts to refute a claim that states that the afterlife isn’t transcendent. The claim in question was the one about the afterlife being three dimensional and finite.
DT’s response here is actually quite good. The afterlife being finite and seen as fiction doesn’t necessarily mean much as Akuto can warp it to an extent. DT also explains how just because it’s finite or seen as fiction doesn’t mean it isn’t transcendent, which I also agree with, however within this wall of text, he seems to subtly dismiss the entire 3-dimensional argument, which does indeed debunk the afterlife. I find it quite ironic that the one claim that proves the afterlife isn’t transcendent is also the one claim that DT refuses to mention in this section, or in the entire post for that matter.
DT also uses an author statement in this argument, but that is something that I have already explained to be irrelevant.
Something I briefly mentioned earlier was that words like “fiction” and “story” are most likely used as metaphors in the context of DKD. DT tries to refute this claim by showing an image of Hiroshi writing a story while Akuto and Keena leave him.
It is very dishonest to use an image that can be seen as metaphorical to refute a claim that is literally “some words are metaphorical.” All this does is add an extra layer of opinions to an argument that is already based around opinions, and it doesn’t prove or disprove anything.
Another way DT tries to disprove that these words are used as metaphors is by saying that since these statements are written in a scientific journal, it cannot be metaphorical.
Obviously this argument is a clear example of the begging the question fallacy. Plus, the “scientific journal” was based on baseless assumptions anyway. DT even shows this in his post.
This journal was just confirming someone was outside of the world. It was just an assumption that the world could be fictional, and that is only assuming the word fiction isn't being used as a metaphor. Actually, since the afterlife was confirmed to be 3D, that proves that this journal was either wrong, metaphorical, or was never talking about infinite gaps in the first place. Take your pick. I’d also like to mention that if your only argument is based on a journal that was, in itself, based on assumptions, it’s not a good argument.
Finally, as I’ve already explained, Akuto was not creating multiple stories, but was just recreating the same story over and over again. The original debunk also mentions this. DT however never even tries to refute this claim in his post despite it being pretty damning towards Akuto.
I think it’s pretty clear that this “rebunk” is not as reliable as people believe it to be.
“The Law of Identity”
Earlier in this thread I stated that debunking TLOI was irrelevant as Akuto doesn’t scale to her, which is true, however I think now it’s a good time to debunk TLOI anyway just to show how many misconceptions there are in DKD.
The original debunk also debunks TLOI, and as far as I’m aware DT hasn’t refuted any of these claims, but I have been told that someone else has, and I have been sent this person’s “rebunk”. I’m unaware as to who made it though, so I will just refer to them as Unk (Unknown).
For starters, we must go over the idea that The Law of Identity dreams reality and completely transcends everything. We already know this is false as characters can use their wills to go against her as I’ve already proven.
There is more evidence though. For example, The Law of Identity doesn’t possess everything.
Unk claims that these were just “tropes” in a story that TLOI didn’t possess, but that is just downright false. We get confirmation that these elements can be anything such as machines and cities.
If The Law of Identity truly was dreaming or containing everything, it would make no sense for her to not possess these things unless she wasn’t a transcendent being after all.
The Law of Identity can actually be contained within one of the gods.
Unk states that the Formless Universe allows for self-recognition, not that it actually contains TLOI. While that is an interesting claim, it’s one with no sources to back it up with, and is essentially just headcanon. That seems to be the case with all of the DKD “rebunks”.
I don’t want to completely sell Unk short, he made some decent points. For example, the original debunk claimed TLOI couldn’t fix time travel problems, which Unk proved false. Unfortunately, that still doesn’t prove TLOI is a transcendent being at all.
DT has also made some claims about TLOI, such as him saying she is beyond the system of stories. While that is true, I’ve already explained how this system is not transcendent by any means. DT seems to use a lot of assumptions with no solid evidence when talking about DKD.
TL;DR
All of the points used to wank Akuto can be easily debunked using the novel itself. You must also think to yourself, if Demon King Daimao were really as powerful as VSBW says it is, why would the novel have so many statements against that? You must also wonder why the only decent arguments in favor of DKD’s tier are based on assumptions and author statements that have already been proven to be irrelevant.
“Akuto is baseline 4D as he existed within the 4th dimension.”
This argument is flawed in many ways. First and foremost, it is important to note that the realm is not even 4D, it was just named the 4th dimension.
There is an argument to be made for the 4th dimension being an infinite realm, however this is irrelevant as the dimension is simply a virtual world.
Not only this, but the world is akin to a video game.
And this world is below the physical realm, and will cease to exist without the physical realm.
This should explain how the 4th dimension scales Akuto nowhere.
“Akuto scales to the afterlife which is infinite and transcendent.”
First of all, we should tackle the “infinite” claim. The afterlife is stated to be a finite realm multiple times.
It is also called a planet.
As for the afterlife being transcendent, this is directly contradicted when it’s called a 3 dimensional finite world.
Some may argue that time is meaningless in the afterlife, therefore it is transcendent over some concepts. While it is true that time is different in the afterlife, it certainly does exist.
And no, just because time is different doesn’t mean anything.
Some argue that Akuto expanded the afterlife, and turned it into an infinite realm due to this quote:
This is another example of taking the novel out of context. Akuto never expanded the afterlife, that is never once stated, all he did was create another surface within the afterlife, which as I already proved is finite. We actually get direct confirmation that this surface is contained within the space of the afterlife just two paragraphs after that quote.
This is very similar to how the 4th dimension was an infinite sized realm, but was lower than, and powered by the finite physical realm. This could mean one of two things; either this surface is not actually infinite and that is just a hyperbolic claim, or the surface is a virtual/lower world. Either way, this feat doesn’t scale Akuto anywhere.
There is nothing to suggest the afterlife is anything but an alternative planet.
“Akuto creates infinite fictional worlds with infinite possibilities that he transcends.”
The first thing to point out is that the words “story” and “fiction” are almost certainly used as metaphors for “world” and “weakness”. However, for the sake of argument, we will assume they are being used literally.
As you probably know by now, the universe of Demon King Daimao is a solar system. This is stated many times, but since it’s such a well known point, I will only provide a couple of statements from the novel.
As you can see, the universe being a solar system isn’t specific to one universe, the other universes are also solar systems.
Some argue that there are different story densities, therefore the stories are different in size and have infinite gaps between them, however there is no proof of this. In fact it’s implied that the density just refers to the characters themselves.
In fact, the characters can use their wills to go against their creators, proving there are no infinite fictional gaps.
The “rebunk” on VsBattles Wiki argues that the characters cannot actually use their wills to go against their creators, instead it was just an idea that was unable to be acted upon. However, we clearly see their will going against The Law of Identity to an extent.
Not to mention the Extra-Universal Gods can win fights against Akuto, showing he is not transcendent over them.
The rebunk states that Akuto was simply self-inserting himself, but there is no evidence to support that this was a self-insert being defeated, that argument is an example of an unwarranted assumption. The rebunk also states that Akuto had to create all possibilities, therefore he had to create ones in which he loses. This is once again an unwarranted assumption as Akuto losing had little to do with the stories themselves.
Akuto also gave up on creating all stories.
It also takes Akuto an insane amount of time to create only some of these stories, thus, this would not help him in the scaling aspect of things even if he were to create infinite possibilities.
It’s also worth noting that these possibilities are not even a full timeline.
It’s also implied that these “other stories” are just the same story being reconstructed.
With the understanding of what these stories really are, I think it’s clear that they don't scale Akuto very high, and that there is no reality > fiction hierarchy. These feats are also just creation feats, which are highly inapplicable in an actual battle.
“Akuto scales to “the system” which is an infinite transcendent hierarchy.”
Many people use this as an argument due to a very misinterpreted line in the novel.
While it is true there are infinite layers in the system, there is nothing that implies these layers are transcendent or have infinite fictional gaps. In fact, I’ve already proven that they aren’t transcendent in the last section.
This argument is invalid anyway as Akuto doesn’t even scale to the system, he just scales to the afterlife which is the second layer of the system, which I’ve also already proven to not be transcendent over anything.
“Akuto scales to the anti-universe which is transcendent over the system.”
This argument is not commonly used, however it is still used nonetheless. There is not much to say about this point as the novel never says much about the anti-universe at all besides the fact it is empty. It is referred to as a “new land”, but this obviously doesn’t mean it’s transcendent by any means.
Saying this scales Akuto anywhere is a very disingenuous argument to make, as there is basically no argument to be made for it in the first place.
“Akuto in Void Body scales to The Law of Identity who dreams reality and completely transcends everything.”
There are many statements that contradict The Law of Identity dreaming reality. I could go over them, but they are irrelevant as Akuto doesn’t even scale to her in the first place.
Some argue that Akuto merged with, and transcended The Law of Identity, but this is just false. Akuto never merged with TLOI, but only Keena Soga after she left her position as The Law of Identity.
Also, the Void Body itself has no feats besides a few statements that can easily be seen as hyperbolic.
There are three main points that come with this argument. The first is “data made of imaginary numbers.” The argument is that Akuto was a completely nonexistent entity, or at the very least, a conceptual entity.
Firstly, imaginary numbers are real mathematical numbers that represent something intangible, not something inherently conceptual. This could easily be seen as more of a spiritual form if anything. This is further supported by the same paragraph saying “It was casting aside one’s earthly form.”
The second point is “beyond causality”. Being beyond causality is a scientific notion that refers to being beyond what is logical or physical. The paragraph also supports this by saying “It was a place where the laws of physics came to an end.” Saying it is completely transcendent over causality is a disingenuous claim, especially considering the next few chapters explicitly show Akuto being affected by causality.
The third and final point that is made is “it was space with no time.” The argument being made is that Akuto is transcendent over space time. This argument contradicts itself as it clearly says it is space. Nothing suggests it is transcendent over time either, it just says this specific space has no time.
While I will even admit, the Void Body does give Akuto some decent hax, it scales him nowhere.
“Author statements scale Akuto high.”
The main author statement being used is one in which the author claims Akuto is omnipotent.
First of all, the author makes it clear that Akuto would only be omnipotent in one multiverse. This alone is a contradiction. By definition, one cannot be omnipotent over one thing. However, let’s assume he is all powerful over his multiverse. I have already explained how his multiverse is not as big as an ordinary multiverse in fiction, so this statement doesn’t equate to him being all that powerful. I also find this funny as using omnipotence as an argument is against VSBW’s rules.
I covered this statement as it is very popular amongst powerscalers, but there are many other author statements people use to scale Akuto to absurd levels, however these all fall under the death of the author fallacy. While one could argue this fallacy doesn’t apply to all works of fiction, the author of Demon King Daimao himself has confirmed that he is not privileged to his novel, and only what is written in said novel is correct.
It’s also worth noting that most of the author’s claims use vague wording such as “I think” or “I believe” which is also against VSBW’s rules.
This section also mentions that fan-questions answered on social media are usually disregarded, yet mods still seem to use them to defend a character they like, in this case Akuto. But as I've already proven, it doesn’t matter as all of the author statements for DKD are not canon anyway.
“Rebunk”
As stated earlier, there was a post on VsBattles Wiki by DontTalkDT, who I will just refer to as DT for simplicity's sake, that claimed to “rebunk” Akuto. This post however was filled with many flaws, some of which I have already gone over.
There are many claims in this post, most of which don’t scale Akuto anywhere. I will be going over the main points being made, and the ones used to scale Akuto to absurd levels.
The original debunk claimed that characters can use their wills to influence their creators, therefore proving their creators aren’t fictionally transcendent over them. As I stated earlier, DT claims that that specific argument was taken out of context, and also says that he will add the extra context needed to show how this doesn’t debunk Akuto.
While this may seem convincing at first glance, actually reading the novel will provide even more context. You may recall earlier in this thread when I showed a line in the novel in which Keena directly shows that she was able to use her will to go against TLOI, albeit barely.
This sentence was only a few sentences after the paragraph DT is using. What DT is doing is strategically claiming he knows the context so people will believe him without question, while purposefully leaving out context.
Another argument DT makes is one that I have already been over. The argument is that when Akuto lost to the extra-universal gods, it was just his avatar losing.
While this argument also makes sense on paper, it’s never stated these are avatars that lost. In fact, it is never even stated that Akuto has an avatar. Instead it seems as if Akuto just puts himself into the worlds until they end, which would explain why it takes him so long to test the stories. But even assuming Akuto is self inserting an avatar into the stories, this argument still doesn’t hold up as even after Akuto quit making stories the gods are shown to be more than just fiction to Akuto.
And before the argument that Akuto just summoned these gods is made, this paragraph is stated before that.
DT also claims Akuto has existence erasure, thus proving Akuto is fictionally transcendent.
First of all, if Akuto were truly fictionally transcendent over everything, he could surely destroy people’s concepts, however it’s directly stated he just reduces them to a concept. If that wasn’t enough, it goes on to state how this simply means Akuto can experience people’s personalities, not literally reduce them to a concept. But even if we humor the idea that Akuto has existence erasure, this does not in any way prove he is fictionally transcendent over anything.
DT then attempts to refute a claim that states that the afterlife isn’t transcendent. The claim in question was the one about the afterlife being three dimensional and finite.
DT’s response here is actually quite good. The afterlife being finite and seen as fiction doesn’t necessarily mean much as Akuto can warp it to an extent. DT also explains how just because it’s finite or seen as fiction doesn’t mean it isn’t transcendent, which I also agree with, however within this wall of text, he seems to subtly dismiss the entire 3-dimensional argument, which does indeed debunk the afterlife. I find it quite ironic that the one claim that proves the afterlife isn’t transcendent is also the one claim that DT refuses to mention in this section, or in the entire post for that matter.
DT also uses an author statement in this argument, but that is something that I have already explained to be irrelevant.
Something I briefly mentioned earlier was that words like “fiction” and “story” are most likely used as metaphors in the context of DKD. DT tries to refute this claim by showing an image of Hiroshi writing a story while Akuto and Keena leave him.
It is very dishonest to use an image that can be seen as metaphorical to refute a claim that is literally “some words are metaphorical.” All this does is add an extra layer of opinions to an argument that is already based around opinions, and it doesn’t prove or disprove anything.
Another way DT tries to disprove that these words are used as metaphors is by saying that since these statements are written in a scientific journal, it cannot be metaphorical.
Obviously this argument is a clear example of the begging the question fallacy. Plus, the “scientific journal” was based on baseless assumptions anyway. DT even shows this in his post.
This journal was just confirming someone was outside of the world. It was just an assumption that the world could be fictional, and that is only assuming the word fiction isn't being used as a metaphor. Actually, since the afterlife was confirmed to be 3D, that proves that this journal was either wrong, metaphorical, or was never talking about infinite gaps in the first place. Take your pick. I’d also like to mention that if your only argument is based on a journal that was, in itself, based on assumptions, it’s not a good argument.
Finally, as I’ve already explained, Akuto was not creating multiple stories, but was just recreating the same story over and over again. The original debunk also mentions this. DT however never even tries to refute this claim in his post despite it being pretty damning towards Akuto.
I think it’s pretty clear that this “rebunk” is not as reliable as people believe it to be.
“The Law of Identity”
Earlier in this thread I stated that debunking TLOI was irrelevant as Akuto doesn’t scale to her, which is true, however I think now it’s a good time to debunk TLOI anyway just to show how many misconceptions there are in DKD.
The original debunk also debunks TLOI, and as far as I’m aware DT hasn’t refuted any of these claims, but I have been told that someone else has, and I have been sent this person’s “rebunk”. I’m unaware as to who made it though, so I will just refer to them as Unk (Unknown).
For starters, we must go over the idea that The Law of Identity dreams reality and completely transcends everything. We already know this is false as characters can use their wills to go against her as I’ve already proven.
There is more evidence though. For example, The Law of Identity doesn’t possess everything.
Unk claims that these were just “tropes” in a story that TLOI didn’t possess, but that is just downright false. We get confirmation that these elements can be anything such as machines and cities.
If The Law of Identity truly was dreaming or containing everything, it would make no sense for her to not possess these things unless she wasn’t a transcendent being after all.
The Law of Identity can actually be contained within one of the gods.
Unk states that the Formless Universe allows for self-recognition, not that it actually contains TLOI. While that is an interesting claim, it’s one with no sources to back it up with, and is essentially just headcanon. That seems to be the case with all of the DKD “rebunks”.
I don’t want to completely sell Unk short, he made some decent points. For example, the original debunk claimed TLOI couldn’t fix time travel problems, which Unk proved false. Unfortunately, that still doesn’t prove TLOI is a transcendent being at all.
DT has also made some claims about TLOI, such as him saying she is beyond the system of stories. While that is true, I’ve already explained how this system is not transcendent by any means. DT seems to use a lot of assumptions with no solid evidence when talking about DKD.
TL;DR
- 4th dimension: Not actually 4D and below the physical realm.
- The afterlife: A 3D finite planet that is not transcendent over anything and was never expanded.
- The universe: A solar system.
- Akuto’s stories: One story being rebuilt with different densities, not sizes.
- The system: A group of layers that Akuto doesn’t scale to and have no evidence of being transcendent.
- Anti-universe: Outside of the afterlife but not transcendent over anything.
- Void body: Has almost no feats besides some misinterpreted and possibly hyperbolic statements.
- Author statements: Confirmed to be irrelevant.
- DontTalkDT’s rebunk: Baseless assumptions with little to no actual rebunking.
- The Law of Identity: Creator of, but not transcendent over the system.
All of the points used to wank Akuto can be easily debunked using the novel itself. You must also think to yourself, if Demon King Daimao were really as powerful as VSBW says it is, why would the novel have so many statements against that? You must also wonder why the only decent arguments in favor of DKD’s tier are based on assumptions and author statements that have already been proven to be irrelevant.
