Aku Abstract Existence

[ActuallySpaceMan42]

There are two ways to deal with a Type 2 Concept. Either deal with the concept itself or deal with every representation of that concept in reality. For example, if you destroy every 'chair' in the universe, the concept of chairs still exists but chairs themselves don't.

AE Type 2 is the embodiment of an abstraction and getting regen or immortality because of that. If you are saying Aku is the embodiment of evil, then the abstraction in this case would be evil itself. This means you would have to get rid of evil to permanently kill Aku, though he can still be affected normally.

Right now, what you need to prove is that Aku is actually linked to a proper abstraction, and doesn't just have Immortality or Ressurection. I don't find the evidence that he is the embodiment of evil convincing right now.

 

[Eneseditzm0]

There are two ways to deal with a Type 2 Concept. Either deal with the concept itself or deal with every representation of that concept in reality. For example, if you destroy every 'chair' in the universe, the concept of chairs still exists but chairs themselves don't.

AE Type 2 is the embodiment of an abstraction and getting regen or immortality because of that. If you are saying Aku is the embodiment of evil, then the abstraction in this case would be evil itself. This means you would have to get rid of evil to permanently kill Aku, though he can still be affected normally.

Right now, what you need to prove is that Aku is actually linked to a proper abstraction, and doesn't just have Immortality or Ressurection. I don't find the evidence that he is the embodiment of evil convincing right now.

Your 1st example supports me, it's the same as what I said, destroying Aku doesn't destroy the original concept just like the example says and can you tell me what exactly is missing for you to accept it?

 

[DarkDragonMedeus]

I think ActuallySpaceMan is making more sense here.

 

[Eneseditzm0]

I think ActuallySpaceMan is making more sense here.

I think I didn't explain it to you properly, let me explain it properly one last time and then we can decide.

 

[Eneseditzm0]

Aku is portrayed many times throughout the series as "pure evil, evil". He is not just a nickname, we see this in the episode "Jack Infection". When Aku possesses Jack, Jack is told that he can only beat by using the good within him, and Jack does so. This shows that Aku himself is what we call evil, that the definition of sacred power is already used for evil, and Gods Said that holy power defeats abstraction through negation Jack destroy abstraction. We know that even if any part of Aku remains, he is constantly regenerating, and that every part of Aku has control over abstraction, can use evil, can use his own body to lead people to evil, and when he possesses Jack, he causes his evil actions. (Embodying a concept is not enough to obtain this ability, an abstract needs feats or reliable statements proving that the concept they represent grants them Immortality/Regeneration or control over the abstraction.).Jack's statement that people were honest and their lands were peaceful before Aku and that they were all gone when Aku came confirms once again that Aku is evil, and Jack's goal was to defeat him and reverse evil, as he said from the beginning.Also, Jack calling Aku Evil Personified would support this issue.

 

[Eneseditzm0]

There are two ways to deal with a Type 2 Concept. Either deal with the concept itself or deal with every representation of that concept in reality. For example, if you destroy every 'chair' in the universe, the concept of chairs still exists but chairs themselves don't.

AE Type 2 is the embodiment of an abstraction and getting regen or immortality because of that. If you are saying Aku is the embodiment of evil, then the abstraction in this case would be evil itself. This means you would have to get rid of evil to permanently kill Aku, though he can still be affected normally.

Right now, what you need to prove is that Aku is actually linked to a proper abstraction, and doesn't just have Immortality or Ressurection. I don't find the evidence that he is the embodiment of evil convincing right now.

I wrote an article last time and explained this issue. Your answer is above. Please look and answer so that we can reach a common decision on the issue.

 

[Eneseditzm0]

I think ActuallySpaceMan is making more sense here.

I wrote an article about this above, read it and then let's decide.

 

[ActuallySpaceMan42]

Aku is portrayed many times throughout the series as "pure evil, evil". He is not just a nickname, we see this in the episode "Jack Infection". When Aku possesses Jack, Jack is told that he can only beat by using the good within him, and Jack does so. This shows that Aku himself is what we call evil, that the definition of sacred power is already used for evil, and Gods Said that holy power defeats abstraction through negation Jack destroy abstraction.

Being affected by goodness does not mean you are evil itself, that's a leap in logic. Demons can be affected by goodness, vengeful spirits, or just, evil people.

We know that even if any part of Aku remains, he is constantly regenerating, and that every part of Aku has control over abstraction, can use evil, can use his own body to lead people to evil, and when he possesses Jack, he causes his evil actions.

Again all of this is supporting evidence. Nothing listed here requires him to be Evil itself.

(Embodying a concept is not enough to obtain this ability, an abstract needs feats or reliable statements proving that the concept they represent grants them Immortality/Regeneration or control over the abstraction.).Jack's statement that people were honest and their lands were peaceful before Aku and that they were all gone when Aku came confirms once again that Aku is evil, and Jack's goal was to defeat him and reverse evil, as he said from the beginning.Also, Jack calling Aku Evil Personified would support this issue.

Is this saying Evil did not exist until Aku appeared, or did Aku appear and actively have to make things worse?

 

[Eneseditzm0]

Being affected by goodness does not mean you are evil itself, that's a leap in logic. Demons can be affected by goodness, vengeful spirits, or just, evil people.

yes but it was always said that Aku was pure evil and considering that these were his only weaknesses this is supporting evidence and Aku used words like his evil was everywhere."As far as the eye can see, the land is desolate and full of despair. Shadows crawl across the Earth and block out the light. Darkness oozes from every crevice. Hope has been eradicated. Only terror reigns. Yet, there is one that mocks my omnipresent evil with his existence. He possesses a sword which could destroy me. They call him... Samurai Jack!"

Is this saying Evil did not exist until Aku appeared, or did Aku appear and actively have to make things worse?

According to Jack's words, everything was good and there was no evil, until Aku came

 

[Eneseditzm0]

Being affected by goodness does not mean you are evil itself, that's a leap in logic. Demons can be affected by goodness, vengeful spirits, or just, evil people.

Again all of this is supporting evidence. Nothing listed here requires him to be Evil itself.

Is this saying Evil did not exist until Aku appeared, or did Aku appear and actively have to make things worse?

I'm waiting for your answer

 

[ActuallySpaceMan42]

yes but it was always said that Aku was pure evil and considering that these were his only weaknesses this is supporting evidence and Aku used words like his evil was everywhere."As far as the eye can see, the land is desolate and full of despair. Shadows crawl across the Earth and block out the light. Darkness oozes from every crevice. Hope has been eradicated. Only terror reigns. Yet, there is one that mocks my omnipresent evil with his existence. He possesses a sword which could destroy me. They call him... Samurai Jack!"

According to Jack's words, everything was good and there was no evil, until Aku came

Yeah, but it wasn't because Aku just existed. He had to actively make things worse, things didn't just become worse cause he was walking around.

 

[Eneseditzm0]

Yeah, but it wasn't because Aku just existed. He had to actively make things worse, things didn't just become worse cause he was walking around.

Its mere existence has made things worse, Even before Aku's birth, the evil forest was affecting nature, so the emperor wanted to stop it, Aku's existence was bringing evil, sealing Aku improved things a little but when he returned, everything went bad.

 

[Eneseditzm0]

Yeah, but it wasn't because Aku just existed. He had to actively make things worse, things didn't just become worse cause he was walking around.

By the way, your explanations are wrong, if you destroy the concretization for a Ae2 char, the evil will still exist, you will only destroy that abstraction, just like you gave in your chair example.Our narrative about why Aku's death was supposed to destroy evil doesn't make sense.You are probably confusing it with type 1

 

[Cropfist]

I disagree with this.

 

[Eneseditzm0]

I disagree with this.

I am waiting for your proof

 

[ActuallySpaceMan42]

Its mere existence has made things worse, Even before Aku's birth, the evil forest was affecting nature, so the emperor wanted to stop it, Aku's existence was bringing evil, sealing Aku improved things a little but when he returned, everything went bad.

Scans?

 

[Qawsedf234]

Scans?

I mean, the reasoning if off per Aku's backstory. He's a fragment of the Nameless Evil that Odin, Ra and Indra destroyed. By his origin he can't be the source of evil.

Additionally we know that magical beings like the Minions of Set (which are evil), the Titan Chronos, Lazarus-92 and the Scottish Demons (to the best of my knowledge) are independent of Aku and exist irrelevant of him. So evil exists without him in the first place and would still exist after his destruction.

 

[ActuallySpaceMan42]

I mean, the reasoning if off per Aku's backstory. He's a fragment of the Nameless Evil that Odin, Ra and Indra destroyed. By his origin he can't be the source of evil.

Additionally we know that magical beings like the Minions of Set (which are evil), the Titan Chronos, Lazarus-92 and the Scottish Demons (to the best of my knowledge) are independent of Aku and exist irrelevant of him. So evil exists without him in the first place and would still exist after his destruction.

Yeah, that was why I'm still in disagreement right now. Aku being evil personified doesn't seem literal.

 

[Eneseditzm0]

Its mere existence has made things worse, Even before Aku's birth, the evil forest was affecting nature, so the emperor wanted to stop it, Aku's existence was bringing evil, sealing Aku improved things a little but when he returned, everything went bad.

I am not saying that Aku is the concept of evil itself, which I still do not understand your examples, according to Type 2 Aku is just an abstraction of evil, not the concept itself, what you are explaining is for Type 1. Aku is not the concept itself, just an abstraction of it.Evil already existed as a concept, Aku came as an abstraction of it, bringing evil into the world with him, the other examples given could be because evil already existed as a concept.

 

[Qawsedf234]

to Type 2 Aku is just an abstraction of evil, not the concept itself

In order to have Type 2 you have to show that they can come back endlessly from that concept. Meaning the only way to permanently destroy them you have to destroy or alter that concept.

If Aku is a Type 2 Abstract through evil, it means that Jack would need to destroy or conceptually alter the idea of evil. Which doesn't happen.