A Wild Last Boss Appeared Qualitative Upgrade

[Enter_Bluey]

I think that description is good for Alovenus, and it would replace what the hyperverse description is. Could probably leave the "merely believing she is stronger" part and afterward which already exists there. Since it still explains what they do. The rest of them I think are fine too. Like ruphas would just say "reached the same realm as Alovenus" then the explanation there does the rest.

 

[NatzuX]

The moment I've been waiting for is coming (or is it?). So, I'm exciting

 

[Grabbing_dragon]

eternal Endpoint, even causing cracks within it. Even then, her power increasing continuously

Remove the word eternal because the place is not even eternal. Things like destruction,death,cracks,end etc dont apply to someone eternal.
It maybe the begining and ending but that does not make it eternal. Also eternal existence now that has no begning and ending that is outside of time is acausality type 5 now.

 

[Delta333]

due to its conceptually sizeless nature

"due to being aspatial and atemporal" should be better, so those who read the profile can understand that the reason for 1-A comes from BDE type 2, as previously mentioned the lack of physicality (white nothingness) within this realm.

 

[Celestial_Pegasus]

Hmm, I assume we are waiting on more staff? Everything obviously agrees, Ultima and myself, not sure how many more we need here.

 

[Setsuna_tenma]

Hmm, I assume we are waiting on more staff? Everything obviously agrees, Ultima and myself, not sure how many more we need here.

for tier 1 threads atleast 3 staff vote is needed which, this thread . There is already 3 vote so it should be enough

 

[Tsavorae]

If so, then, these pages need to be unlocked:

• Cosmology
• Alovenus
• Ruphas
• Benetnash
• Orm

 

[Celestial_Pegasus]

They are open now.

 

[IlekVad14]

With how much they throw out infinity there and how it's used, hard to quantify especially their layers of hax and well...everything actually lol. Someone somehow having a "bigger infinity" well...that will quickly not be the case infront of them that's for sure. Especially when they drop an actual setting where they declare they're the strongest character too that can't be surpassed either. More than a normal growth is needed to surpass that plot. Benetnash and Orm will be involved as well (albeit left in the dust by the other two as usual, not their fault truly)

Seems like the light years stuff is alright, and the final point has a good arguement for qualitative. Assuming it does goes through, would any of their descriptions need to change? Only one though I guess is Alovenus who can have a part removed to leave the one where she paints over the final point.

I think maybe the difference between each infinity is more impressive than baseline.

The simple logic is that each Setting taking place in the Final Point is 1A by virtue of their nature, as they each represent an R>F gap between one another. From this perspective as Alovenus' existence by default is infinite in comparison to creation, these settings would view everything they have surpassed as finite (equal to 1) in comparison to their own infinite status, which would suggest that the difference between them would or could act as an R>F transcendence.

It could work like this:

Setting X>Y
Setting Z>X

Setting Y here would have infinite stats in the final point but in the eyes of X their stats would be finite and then X would get their stats viewed as finite by Z etc.

To clarify, anything below the Final Point is, by definition, finite in comparison to Baseline Alovenus (infinite stats). Thus, Ruphas and others, before reaching the Final Point, had finite stats regardless of their power. You can view it as follows:

Y: Normal Universes/All of creation
X: Ruphas' existence
Z: Alovenus' existence
The difference between X and Z functions in the same manner as the difference between Y and X.

So lastly Z views X (who is 1A) the same way X views everything below it (below the Final Point.)

As Alovenus explained herself:

"Even if there was someone labeled as the strongest among these characters in a setting this overwhelming, things would be flipped upside down by nothing but one word from the author, or in other words, God. That being that there was an even stronger character able to defeat the first character with but one punch. Just like that, another powerhouse would appear."

"This was the dimension of gods; the scale of it all was just different. This is all just the product of childish arguments," Alovenus continued."

The key point here is the comparison between fictional characters and their author or "God." Transcending and establishing a setting where you surpass this author and "God," who should view you and your entire existence as finite compared to themselves, constitutes or at least should indicate an R>F transcendence.

I would love to hear your feedback about this approach and interpretation and whether or not it is useable.

 

[Enter_Bluey]

Looks like this went well and got applied. Happy to see that. I also hop the recovery from that chemo goes well and smoothly.

I think maybe the difference between each infinity is more impressive than baseline.

The simple logic is that each Setting taking place in the Final Point is 1A by virtue of their nature, as they each represent an R>F gap between one another. From this perspective as Alovenus' existence by default is infinite in comparison to creation, these settings would view everything they have surpassed as finite (equal to 1) in comparison to their own infinite status, which would suggest that the difference between them would or could act as an R>F transcendence.

It could work like this:

Setting X>Y
Setting Z>X

Setting Y here would have infinite stats in the final point but in the eyes of X their stats would be finite and then X would get their stats viewed as finite by Z etc.

To clarify, anything below the Final Point is, by definition, finite in comparison to Baseline Alovenus (infinite stats). Thus, Ruphas and others, before reaching the Final Point, had finite stats regardless of their power. You can view it as follows:

Y: Normal Universes/All of creation
X: Ruphas' existence
Z: Alovenus' existence
The difference between X and Z functions in the same manner as the difference between Y and X.

So lastly Z views X (who is 1A) the same way X views everything below it (below the Final Point.)

As Alovenus explained herself:

"Even if there was someone labeled as the strongest among these characters in a setting this overwhelming, things would be flipped upside down by nothing but one word from the author, or in other words, God. That being that there was an even stronger character able to defeat the first character with but one punch. Just like that, another powerhouse would appear."

"This was the dimension of gods; the scale of it all was just different. This is all just the product of childish arguments," Alovenus continued."

The key point here is the comparison between fictional characters and their author or "God." Transcending and establishing a setting where you surpass this author and "God," who should view you and your entire existence as finite compared to themselves, constitutes or at least should indicate an R>F transcendence.

I would love to hear your feedback about this approach and interpretation and whether or not it is useable.

I do think this explanation makes sense, since settings are also basically them becoming the author of the lower reality/setting. Just like Alovenus describes a setting being overturned, the higher setting of a God flips over and can shred the setting of a lower one. Just like how when Ruphas and Co. reached the final point, levels and numbers meant nothing anymore. They themselves had essentially reached that Ascendent level. However, Alovenus's stats even to them were pointless to measure yet again in the same way. A setting basically, would allow them to then view the lower opponent as fiction. Infinity being viewed as 1 is in viewpoint of their status in setting, and regardless they will have finite stats unless their own setting is applied. It's something I've thought about before but wasn't entirely sure how to go about it. This puts that whole quantity jump into better perspective. The only issue I think is reaching these R>F jumps themselves. Not sure if RE to their opponent to layer a higher setting would be problematic or not with the system. Or if it's considered it now being their power originally which I doubt. Reaching to Alovenus's level wouldnt be the issue, but afterward I think. Maybe this could be in a new thread, or the discussion thread.

 

[IlekVad14]

Not sure if RE to their opponent to layer a higher setting would be problematic or not with the system. Or if it's considered it now being their power originally which I doubt.

Actually, I don't think this would cause any real problems according to the standards used in VSBW, as what's taking place in Awlba doesn't really fall under any of the disqualifiers listed. But yea a discussion thread would have been ideal.

"The fictional characters being able to attack the real ones without being shown to somehow have transcended their fictional world or having special abilities that allow it by being something rooted in a higher reality. Such instances often have to be analyzed on a case-by-case basis to judge how they are best rated. For more detailed information, see here."

 

[Tsavorae]

They are open now.

Applied.

 

[Enter_Bluey]

Actually, I don't think this would cause any real problems according to the standards used in VSBW, as what's taking place in Awlba doesn't really fall under any of the disqualifiers listed. But yea a discussion thread would have been ideal.

"The fictional characters being able to attack the real ones without being shown to somehow have transcended their fictional world or having special abilities that allow it by being something rooted in a higher reality. Such instances often have to be analyzed on a case-by-case basis to judge how they are best rated. For more detailed information, see here."

Well thing is the stuff applying to reaching 1A also applies to layers into 1A. While they do stuff based on their whims and will, they would also be making these transcendences basically on their own. I do see an arguement could probably be made for it. But seems to be a case that would need to be looked at I guess. I do think the idea makes sense with how they work though.

This is a thread for qualitative upgrades, though it was applied so not sure if talk about it here is good or not. If not, can just make a different one of more of a discussion. Or on the awlba thread

 

[Tsavorae]

Yeah, it would be better to continue these discussions in the awlba thread.

@Celestial_Pegasus It's concluded, there's nothing more to do here this thread can be closed.