6B or Higher Chainsaw Man: Falling Devil disrupts Earths Gravity, calcing problems

[Breadbear83]

(Title is kinda clickbait so people actually come at help with the calc, but the calc does gets to those tiers)

so it was stated Twice that Falling Devil disrupted Earths Gravity by her mere presence (Chapter 132 and 135 of Chainsaw Man)

i asked a Raiki (a translation helper) for a translation and it changes a bit the feat

the important details of the feat, from the official translation and a bit of Raikis one: Falling Devil caused ´´gravity fluctuations/abnormalities in gravity, reversing Earths gravity´´ in ´´every place around the world temporaly´´ with it being stated that it caused ´´landslides, cave-ins, and collapses, one after another across the world´´ which caused ´´ all countries simulatenously being damaged and becoming poor´´

this means high levels of destruction, with near whole earth range (every place in the world doesnt has to mean EVERYTHING, but it signifies the high range), Falling Devil is even able to Lift entire Building alongside Chunks of rock attached to them (also seen here and here) , which may be the way landslides happened, and so cave-ins and collapses

So Methodica of The feat, may go around like this:

Method 1
so i made a proposeed Calc of the Feat (which im gonna talk around it, and on what im unsure about it as im not an expert on these feats), that is also based on an idea that CGM Eljoaki5 agreed for calcing it (estimating when Falling Devil range was able to cover the entire world at once and as a lowball, a single nation)

this refers to first proposing a timeframe, the timeframe can be at most how long was Falling Devil active in her arc:

Falling Devil is present for about 8 Chapters, as i show scans here, midway Chapter 123 we first see Falling Devil manipulating Gravity by making People fly, and by Chapter 131 is when she is no longer Present after Fami eats her back, this likely being the start and end of her mere presence causing gravity disruptions

CSM chapters around this arc could have even just 15 pages, shorter that most Shonen jump manga chapters, and also the entire arc is just Falling Devil chasing Asa, with sometimes Denji interrupting her, everything happens rather quickly in the arc, and these 8 chapters of timeframe i mention can easily be read in less than half an hour, so ill assume Falling Devil was present for about 30 Minutes

EDIT: i explain at the bottom of the OP a new proposed timeframe of 3 minutes

second thing ´´using a single nation´´ refers to the fact Falling Devil didnt outright destroy/Lift every Country around the world, her range is still multi continental, but using a single nation is for assuming that she makes greater destruction in every corner of 1 nation

for that, id propose Japan or USA

1. Japan has a total land of 372,683.35 km2 (not accounting the water) this is just 0.25% of Earths total Land, if we were based on the average elevation from sea level of Japan (using whole elevation may be possible considering the worlwide destruction could include lifting entire buildings alongisde many meters or rock attached to them), then as its average elevation from sea level is 438 Meters, accounting Japan land and Continental Crust density being 2700 kg/m^3: 2700*438*1,000,000*372,683.35 = 4.4073e17kg​
2. USA has a land of 9.1522 million km2 (not accounting the water), this is just 6.144% of Earths total Land, average elevation from sea level of USA being 760 Meters: 2700*760*9,152,200 = 1.87803e19kg

now, i gotta clarify this, the calc pretends as if Falling Devil just lifted the entirety of Japan or USA, but this is as a lowball of she affecting the whole world but while lifting/destroying much less than the whole elevation from sea level of every country

with that specifies, calc would be like this:

using GPE formula (and the results are later divided by 1800, which is the seconds of the 30 minutes timeframe, as the Feat is overtime)

Japan End

|-6.6743e-11*4.4073e+17kg*5.972e+24/6378137^2| = 4.318276e18 Newtons

Radius of earth is 6,378,137 meters (cuz its not literally Japan being affected)

4.318276e18*6378137 = 2.754255e25 Joules

Attack Potency: 2.754255e25 Joules/1800 = 1.530141e22 Joules (3.6571 Teratons of TNT, Small Country Level)

Lifting Strength: 440.73 Trillion Metric Tons/1800 = 244.85 Billion Metric Tons (Class T)

Usa End​

|-6.6743e-11*1.87803e+19*5.972e+24/6378137^2| = 1.840095e20 Newtons

1.840095e20*6378137 = 1.17363e27 Joules

Attack Potency: 1.17363e27 Joules/1800 = 6.52016e23 Joules (155.8357 Teratons of TNT, Large Country Level)

Lifting Strength: 18.7803 Quadrillion Metric Tons/1800 = 10.4335 Trillion Metric Tons (Class P)


So thats the calc for now, theres this one that was the one that Eljoaki5 disagreed with, it doesnt considers it being overtime, and using the whole earth mass of 3% seems innacurate as the land of all the countries in the world isnt even close to Earth mass of 5.972e24kg (you can already see how the entire of USA being 1/15 of earths land is merely 1.87803e19kg)

is there any other ideas for how to do the calc? or something to fix on mine?

Method 2
based on what Epyriel proposed (about using E = mgΔh)

instead of using Japan Weight of its average elevation from sea level of 4.4073e17kg, i may use like 10% of earths land, with estimates based on other feats of her gravity manipulation (using lower vertical lengths than Average elevation from sea level of Japan being 448 meters)

like i shown earlier, Falling Devil can lift entire buildings that are around her ´´Falling Devil is even able to Lift entire Building alongside Chunks of rock attached to them (also seen here and here)´´

the calc of the first link, shows that, even if Falling Devil wouldnt be lifting a building in every corner of the world as not even cities are full of buildings, it shows and calcs how she can lift big chunks of continental crust alongisde the buildings (and should be able to even where there arent buildings to cause landslides), unless i see some way that doesnt use this calc value or other calcs, the calc says she lifts 10.6115 Meters of vertical continental crust (even the building on the calc is heavier than that rock formation ,even while having a lower width)

applying this to 10% of Earths land, and using 2700kg for continental crust: 2700*10.6115*1,000,000*14,893,910 = 4.26726e17kg

as for how far she lifts the buildings, in the feats i shown of she lifing and throwing buildings, she generally lifts the buildings at higher distance than the height of those building

since 1991, in Tokyo multiple buildings of 150 meters has been made, so id assume she lifts stuff at only that distance (at the height of tall buildings, but not higher than those buildings)

so formula: 4.26726e17*9.81*150= 6.27927e20 Joules

AP: 150.078285 Gigatons of TNT (Large Island Level)
Lifting Strength: 426.72 Trillion Metric Tons (Class P)

id assume it being overtime still counts

AP: 150.078285 Gigatons of TNT/1800 = 83.37682 Megatons of TNT (City Level+)
planetary Range feat being City level looks weird tbh
Lifting Strength: 426.72 Trillion Metric Tons/1800 = 237 Billion Metric Tons (Class T)

EDIT: so i have thought that the Feat may had been more brief than those 30 minutes

far before Chapter 131 Were Falling Devil is desummoned by Fami (the end of her presence affecting gravity) most people were still chilling (like seeming relaxed, up until Falling takes their body parts as groceries), not running away from cave-ins killing people, and across the whole arc up until Justice Devil eats Asa and Denji, all buildings are fine by gravity fluctuations not happening yet

so new proposed timeframe is 3 Minutes

as nothing shows that before Chapter 130 Buildings were being affected by gravity, then gravity may hadnt been affecting the whole world with buildings and stuff up until Chapter 130

i count 36 Panels from when a building is first actually seen flying, and to when Falling Devil is dessumoned

if assuming every panel is 5 seconds, then thats 3 Minutes Timeframe

that increase all results values by 10x

Method 1:
Japan:
Attack Potency: 36.57 Teratons of TNT (Country Level)
Lifting Strength: 2.4485 Trillion Metric Tons (Class P)

USA:
Attack Potency: 1.558357 Petatons of TNT (Continent Level)

Lifting Strength: 104.33 Trillion Metric Tons (Class P)

Method 2:
AP: 833.7682 Megatons of TNT (Mountain Level+)
Lifting Strength: 2.37 Trillion Metric Tons (Class P)

 

[Arkenis]

I think doing it by the tectonic plates radius is a better lowball.

 

[Breadbear83]

I think doing it by the tectonic plates radius is a better lowball.

Didn't know what tectonic plates are, for what I see, the average tectonic plates are Quintillions of metric Tons in weight, that's far higher than the USA end I gave

And so tectonic plates also go below sea level? Its not stated that Falling Devil caused tsunamis

 

[GunshyFever]

We need to reach out to some CGM's, it's a large feat so it's best we don't tarry, it can change alot of scaling.

 

[Arkenis]

Didn't know what tectonic plates are, for what I see, the average tectonic plates are Quintillions of metric Tons in weight, that's far higher than the USA end I gave

And so tectonic plates also go below sea level? Its not stated that Falling Devil caused tsunamis

What's wrong with it being higher? We'd just be doing the radius as well no? What's the issue with the sea level? You took that into account

 

[Epyriel]

is there any other ideas for how to do the calc? or something to fix on mine?

I’m a bit confused on why you are using Newton’s Law of Gravitation instead of a more standard delta GPE approach.

What you are essentially doing is treating the landmass of a country as separate from the Earth and then quantifying the gravitational force between them (something already factored into the regular GPE formula for Earth), and then using the work formula to calculate the energy it would take to basically launch Japan or the US’s landmass 6,000+ kilometres away into space.

Instead I would just use E = mgΔh and base the height differential on how far Falling usually lifts stuff with her gravity manipulation.

As for the calc’s assumptions:
I would use a much smaller vertical portion for the affected mass (since as you acknowledged she hasn’t been shown literally lifting the entire landmass above the sea-line, maybe try to quantify this value off of her other feats of gravity manipulation as an estimate instead) and a much larger portion of Earth’s surface (since she is doing considerable damage across every nation on Earth, not just one - perhaps use something like 10% of Earth’s land surface as a lowball instead).

 

[Anonymous_Learner]

following

 

[Breadbear83]

I’m a bit confused on why you are using Newton’s Law of Gravitation instead of a more standard delta GPE approach.

What you are essentially doing is treating the landmass of a country as separate from the Earth and then quantifying the gravitational force between them (something already factored into the regular GPE formula for Earth), and then using the work formula to calculate the energy it would take to basically launch Japan or the US’s landmass 6,000+ kilometres away into space.

Instead I would just use E = mgΔh and base the height differential on how far Falling usually lifts stuff with her gravity manipulation.

As for the calc’s assumptions:
I would use a much smaller vertical portion for the affected mass (since as you acknowledged she hasn’t been shown literally lifting the entire landmass above the sea-line, maybe try to quantify this value off of her other feats of gravity manipulation as an estimate instead) and a much larger portion of Earth’s surface (since she is doing considerable damage across every nation on Earth, not just one - perhaps use something like 10% of Earth’s land surface as a lowball instead).

used your method and added it to the OP, does it seems fine? had to use a calc for how much vertical portion its affected as i cant just assume it, but with how often she lifts buildings, using one calc value seems fine for it (the one where she lifts a big chunk of rock formation alongside a building, even the building, while having a lower area than the rock formation, still being heavier than the rock formation, so using only that rock formation is lowballing)

 

[Epyriel]

used your method and added it to the OP, does it seems fine? had to use a calc for how much vertical portion its affected as i cant just assume it, but with how often she lifts buildings, using one calc value seems fine for it (the one where she lifts a big chunk of rock formation alongside a building, even the building, while having a lower area than the rock formation, still being heavier than the rock formation, so using only that rock formation is lowballing)

Looks good, nice work

 

[GunshyFever]

AP: 150.078285 Gigatons of TNT/1800 = 83.37682 Megatons of TNT (City Level+)
planetary Range feat being City level looks weird tbh
Lifting Strength: 426.72 Trillion Metric Tons/1800 = 23.7 Billion Metric Tons (Class T)

Y'all peep the consistency though

 

[Arkenis]

I prefer H4C Primals (objective), but 7B is fitting.

 

[Bruh]

I prefer H4C Primals (objective), but 7B is fitting.

The world not ready for that yet

 

[Breadbear83]

bump

 

[Naito-desu]

This is just my opinion but OP's first calculations do have some good assumptions but it's also highballing it assuming things that we don't see on the panels. I think Epyriel's is more suitable, mostly because I feel like applying this is more consistent with the physics involved.

 

[GunshyFever]

This is just my opinion but OP's first calculations do have some good assumptions but it's also highballing it assuming things that we don't see on the panels. I think Epyriel's is more suitable, mostly because I feel like applying this is more consistent with the physics involved.

Aye, thanks for your input, wondering if you could tag a fellow CGM who could give a second eye, then we'd be confident for an evaluation.

 

[Breadbear83]

This is just my opinion but OP's first calculations do have some good assumptions but it's also highballing it assuming things that we don't see on the panels. I think Epyriel's is more suitable, mostly because I feel like applying this is more consistent with the physics involved.

thanks for the reply, but also i proposed a new timeframe of 3 minutes in the OP as the gravity fluctuations seems to be active far less time/far ealier

that upscales all results by 10x, as its now 3 minutes

doesnt changes methodica tho

(and could you do as gunshyfever says of bringing some CGMs here? this is an important feat for the verse)

 

[GunshyFever]

I believe 30 minutes is far more safer. The falling devils presence reversed gravity, meaning from her appearance.

And we do get small shots of collateral amist their battle.

 

[Arkenis]

so new proposed timeframe is 3 Minutes

as nothing implies that before Chapter 130, Buildings were being affected by gravity, then gravity wasnt affecting the whole world with buildings and stuff up until Chapter 130

i count 36 Panels from when a building is first actually seen flying, and to when Falling Devil is dessumoned

if assuming every panel is 5 seconds, then thats 3 Minutes Timeframe

that increase all results values by 10x

Yeah ngl I don't think this is very accurate. We know stuff happened across the world even prior to this chapter, she also directly levitated that building with her control. I'd go with no less than a hr since at the start of her arrival the sun was just setting, and after coming back from the flash back we see its night. Or FD needs planetary darkness manip . By chapter 125 this is what's happening. Then 130. These are entirely done within the area not that she controlled one thing but affected the whole world while doing it.

I still think this should be done by area/region and not world. Tokyo, New York, Los Angeles, Shanghai, Middle East, etc. If you reread this scan, it is evident Yoru means various areas were affected by the fluctuations as in different places felt it not the entire world.

 

[GunshyFever]

Boiling it down to only affecting people in terms of "feeling it" isn't really right, considering entire nations and countries became poorer as a result of its effects. I'd say EP's method with a 30 minute timeframe is the go to. An hour is way too lengthy with how quickly events panned out. 30 minutes is ideally perfect: 5 minutes of Falling gathering her ingredients, and 25 more of Denji trying to save Asa.

We see everything happening as it goes, so we know it happened rather quickly and was not dragged out. Falling made her appearance at night as well, not at the very beginning of the chapter. Nvm, that entire sequence took 40 seconds for all we know

 

[Breadbear83]

I believe 30 minutes is far more safer. The falling devils presence reversed gravity, meaning from her appearance.

And we do get small shots of collateral amist their battle.

that panel is from Chapter 125, when she got tired of a sniper hitting her, so she blew up that building specifically to make him fly, then beheaded him midair

besides that, up until Chapter 130 there arent any buildings flying or being destroyed (besides this which was only for one attack), only some people flying

if the general surroundings of Falling Devil werent visibly being affected up until chapter 130, then i dont think her range was also reaching the whole world with massive destruction yet

but could follow the 30 minutes timeframe if following the ´´mere presence´´ statement from Yoru, althought she would had gotten that info of the worlwide destruction from the news, cuz she didnt see buildings being destroyed near her up until Chapter 130

Yeah ngl I don't think this is very accurate. We know stuff happened across the world even prior to this chapter, she also directly levitated that building with her control. I'd go with no less than a hr since at the start of her arrival the sun was just setting, and after coming back from the flash back we see its night. Or FD needs planetary darkness manip . By chapter 125 this is what's happening. Then 130. These are entirely done within the area not that she controlled one thing but affected the whole world while doing it.

I still think this should be done by area/region and not world. Tokyo, New York, Los Angeles, Shanghai, Middle East, etc. If you reread this scan, it is evident Yoru means various areas were affected by the fluctuations as in different places felt it not the entire world.

across the whole arc the background varies from gray to black, even in chapter 124 the background was already black, and also with no stars nor the moon to be seen like in actual nightime

either it was already night, just inconsistent background colors across the chapter (also that page you shared is an extra, doesnt has to follow the ´´consistency´´ of the background of the rest of the chapter´´, or falling devil also makes the background black

 

[GunshyFever]

Still, I feel like 30 minutes has more base than 3.

 

[Arkenis]

that panel is from Chapter 125, when she got tired of a sniper hitting her, so she blew up that building specifically to make him fly, then beheaded him midair

besides that, up until Chapter 130 there arent any buildings flying or being destroyed (besides this which was only for one attack), only some people flying

if the general surroundings of Falling Devil werent visibly being affected up until chapter 130, then i dont think her range was also reaching the whole world with massive destruction yet

but could follow the 30 minutes timeframe if following the ´´mere presence´´ statement from Yoru, althought she would had gotten that info of the worlwide destruction from the news, cuz she didnt see buildings being destroyed near her up until Chapter 130

That's what I said. What I'm arguing is that FD's fluctuations are random spots in the world, these two instances are direct control of gravity though. So using them as examples for timeframes doesn't work. Her mere presence is what tells us.

across the whole arc the background varies from gray to black, even in chapter 124 the background was already black, and also with no stars nor the moon to be seen like in actual nightime

Yeah I posted that 124 panel. Yeah I think she deserves darkness manip although Fujimoto isn't one to draw night sky, stars could also be missing in the verse.

either it was already night, just inconsistent background colors across the chapter (also that page you shared is an extra, doesnt has to follow the ´´consistency´´ of the background of the rest of the chapter´´, or falling devil also makes the background black

Which page is an extra?

 

[Arkenis]

Boiling it down to only affecting people in terms of "feeling it" isn't really right, considering entire nations and countries became poorer as a result of its effects.

I'm saying Yoru says different places felt it and suffered damage. This means the entire world in general didn't feel it, different places did. So instead saying the whole of USA was effected or Japan, we should go smaller and say a state or just a city. We can just use big cities since that's where the economy would've suffered most like Yoru implied.

 

[GunshyFever]

I'm saying Yoru says different places felt it and suffered damage. This means the entire world in general didn't feel it, different places did. So instead saying the whole of USA was effected or Japan, we should go smaller and say a state or just a city. We can just use big cities since that's where the economy would've suffered most like Yoru implied.

The gravity was reversed world wide, and we already are using 10% of earths land for a feat that affected, all countries. This is better than a singular city, considering every country went into economic ruin from the Falling Devil's presence.

 

[Breadbear83]

I'm saying Yoru says different places felt it and suffered damage. This means the entire world in general didn't feel it, different places did. So instead saying the whole of USA was effected or Japan, we should go smaller and say a state or just a city. We can just use big cities since that's where the economy would've suffered most like Yoru implied.

i shared a translation from raiki that Yoru actually says ´´every place around the world´´

even death battle translated it as ´´every place´´

so actual translation from japanese seems to be all over the world, which makes sense with the all countries becoming poorer, which would come from those ´´caveins. landslides and collapses´´

Which page is an extra?

i mean its not a volume extra, the cover of chapter 123, but its not a panel thats following another panel/the end of another chapter

and as pointed out ealier, it may had already been night or Falling Devil made the background dark

 

[Arkenis]

The gravity was reversed world wide, and we already are using 10% of earths land for a feat that affected, all countries. This is better than a singular city, considering every country went into economic ruin from the Falling Devil's presence.

Yes and the way a country would suffer is from its major cities being destroyed. I never said a single city. I literally said New York or the Middle East in my examples.

 

[Arkenis]

i shared a translation from raiki that Yoru actually says ´´every place around the world´´

Yeah... Guys I don't disagree with it being world wide. I disagree with the size being used.

 

[GunshyFever]

I guess that's reasonable, we can try an end for it.

 

[Arkenis]

I'd say just use the Kanto region, New York, Shanghai, and maybe Egypt.

 

[Bruh]

Agree with 30m 7-B+ end

 

[Naito-desu]

@KLOL506 @Dalesean027 your input would be appreciated

 

[GunshyFever]

Bumping this for more input

 

[Breadbear83]

@KLOL506 @Dalesean027 your input would be appreciated

They seem busy, maybe you know someone else to call?

Eljoaki5 knows about Chainsaw Man, as for example

 

[ElJoaki5]

idea that CGM Eljoaki5

Dude that was one year ago i dont even remember it

Ill try to look through this soon

 

[GunshyFever]

Bumping this once more

 

[ElJoaki5]

Yeah id prefer the second method too and with 30 minutes of time.
I dont like using 150 m tho, i mean the whole premise of this method was using heights that shes been shown lifting objects to, pixelscaling some scene and getting a proper height would seem better.

The 10% is something im not fully sure about but going off of the translation itd seem fine.

 

[Breadbear83]

Yeah id prefer the second method too and with 30 minutes of time.
I dont like using 150 m tho, i mean the whole premise of this method was using heights that shes been shown lifting objects to, pixelscaling some scene and getting a proper height would seem better.

The 10% is something im not fully sure about but going off of the translation itd seem fine.

what about this another Value of the buildings flying? id use it over she lifting a Building at a lower height, cuz that building was just lifted to then go down to Denji and Asa, in the new one the building actively aims at Sky, an within the 30 minutes timeframe of falling devil feat, is likely everything that has been lifted from the ground would continuely keep going higher and higher, so better going at her peak shown levitation

the method 2 value would change like this: 4.26726e17*9.81*108.4250= 4.53886e20 Joules (108.4815 Gigatons of TNT)

then divided by the 30 minutes timeframe: 60.26752 Megatons of TNT (her Class T LS doesnt change as the amount of land shes lifting hasnt changed, just how far its lifted)

im gonna be moving what you and naitodesu agreed here to a calc blog, maybe you could evaluate it as you already read the whole methodica? so another CGM doesnt have to read the whole thing

EDIT: i edited the calc blog with the new values, if you want to evaluate it, thanks you very much for the help in this thread tho

 

[Breadbear83]

Bump

 

[ElJoaki5]

Well dalesean evaled it so i guess thats it

 

[GunshyFever]

I guess we can wrap this up then. Thanks to all who participated.