-
This forum is strictly intended to be used by members of the VS Battles wiki. Please only register if you have an autoconfirmed account there, as otherwise your registration will be rejected. If you have already registered once, do not do so again, and contact Antvasima if you encounter any problems.
For instructions regarding the exact procedure to sign up to this forum, please click here. -
We need Patreon donations for this forum to have all of its running costs financially secured.
Community members who help us out will receive badges that give them several different benefits, including the removal of all advertisements in this forum, but donations from non-members are also extremely appreciated.
Please click here for further information, or here to directly visit our Patreon donations page. -
Please click here for information about a large petition to help children in need.
The Desert Spada and Ground Death calcs
- 31,197
- 27,393
Having re-examined the profiles, no ratings will need to be changed at this moment with the calcs being removed. Crocodile's AP section would just go from this:
To this:
Since two Admins have approved this, the thread's been open for a week, and only a single profile would need to be changed because of this, I think we can wait for a day following this post to see if anything else comes up, and then make the changes if not.
To this:
Since two Admins have approved this, the thread's been open for a week, and only a single profile would need to be changed because of this, I think we can wait for a day following this post to see if anything else comes up, and then make the changes if not.
- 42,569
- 36,862
Replace the value they're scaling to, since Guesswork Statistics is deletion-worthy. Just saying "Baseline" isn't good either, since 7-C is well info the tiers that you require a calc to be in.
Professionals have standards, I'm holding you, as an administrator, to just the bare minimum of them.
Last edited:
- 18,722
- 13,751
did he buy vsb or something?
- 8,790
- 4,099
Who does bro think he is
did he buy vsb or something?
- 31,197
- 27,393
What are you talking about? There is no baseline statistic, and no guesswork either.
Sorry, but it's obvious you didn't read the new justification on my post at all judging by your response.
Reread my post then confirm whether or not you think I'm upholding the standards.
- 13,108
- 20,826
I still don't care about HST threads but I stumbled upon this and just had to ask: Why is this an Admin thing? This is about the validity of a calc, so it should be a Calc Group Thread, no?
- 42,569
- 36,862
Well, with no presence of a link to a profile or any other scaling in the justification the first response will be to think the profile is baseline with no calc!
"Attack Potency: Town level (Harmed Nico Robin)"
The bare minimum should be to say what he's done and link the calc. Preferably In a Statistics Value note.
If you want to shut me up, put more then the bare minimum of effort into this. If I can't barebones rework a profile without getting yelled at, I'm not about to let an admin, someone who is supposed to be in the gold standard for CRTs and their application, degrade the quality of an already pretty shit profile with a justification made of a singular pearly white bone!
- 31,197
- 27,393
Obviously I just wrote the barebones here because this is just the thread, not the profile itself which obviously would have the link on it. Did you forget that Nico Robin has a profile? How about you do some work yourself instead of ranting at me? Because right now I don't see you contributing anything of value.
- 42,569
- 36,862
Damage. My problem was not that Nico Robin didn't have a link.
My problem is that the justification tells you almost none of the information you need to know. Like how much did he harm Nico Robin, did he just lay a scratch her or did he borderline one-shot her? Was he casual or serious during that? How about anything he did to Luffy?
I'm not even telling you to rework the profile, I'm telling you to write the justification to be good as far as a minimal or no scan justification goes-- Supporters can scan and reference it when they rework the profile and probably won't have to rewrite the justification if it's done right unless 7-C changes to a different tier. Tell people what Crocodile has done in regards to scaling, and give an idea of any upscaling or doenscaling at play. Don't tell double digit IQ Timmy who just turned 13 that he has to watch the anime or read the manga to get how Crocodile scales to Robin.
- 31,197
- 27,393
And you didn't think I might have included a scan on the justification when I actually updated the profile?
It looks to me like you just made an assumption and gave me some unnecessary criticism. Nobody mentioned baseline statistics or guesswork for this; just you.
Luffy gets his durability scaling from Crocodile, so mentioning Luffy would be circular.
- 220
- 161
- Thread starter
- #55
Did you forget what you said 24 minutes ago already?
You do realize that he will link the panels that show the amount of damage Crocodile dealt, right?
Last edited:
- 42,569
- 36,862
And from there you've done one part of it, Damage.
I know my standards are basically "if they breathe wrong at X it's on the profile" but I'm asking for a justification that, assuming it has scans as you've said it'll have(and references, if you're actually going to go that far) can still be used competently ten years down the line assuming 7-C first key Crocodile never changes.
- 31,197
- 27,393
@DaReaperMan; okay; message recieved.
In future you don't take a rough draft on the thread to be the finished product on the profile, and I'll do my best to uphold the standards of VSBW.
Sounds good?
In future you don't take a rough draft on the thread to be the finished product on the profile, and I'll do my best to uphold the standards of VSBW.
Sounds good?
- 42,569
- 36,862
Sounds good
I'll also try to put my posts through a couple more drafts so there's less aggression
- 13,108
- 20,826
- 31,197
- 27,393
@CloverDragon03 You're likely right about that; I personally trust DDM's judgement but an evaluation by a Calc Group Member would be what is properly needed here.
While you're here on the thread, could you take a quick look over the opening post to help us progress with this? I promise not to pester you for future HST threads.
While you're here on the thread, could you take a quick look over the opening post to help us progress with this? I promise not to pester you for future HST threads.
- 10,905
- 18,967
- 31,197
- 27,393
@TheRustyOne In case Clover isn't able to help, would you be able to lend your view on the OP?
- 13,108
- 20,826
I'll take a look when I can, which should hopefully be soon-ish. I'll be heading out soon enough
I'm never escaping ong
- 11,247
- 13,132
I'm far too focused on future CRTs and Revisions for other verses, along with some personal issues that are getting in my way.
I cannot take a look at this.
- 31,197
- 27,393
No problem.
- 13,108
- 20,826
Before I go, I'll say the one thing I really take issue with is the fact that this is a clear, intentional representation of the stated 5 km blast. That alone makes me iffy about scrapping these
(Also this should be moved to Calc Group Discussion tbh)
(Also this should be moved to Calc Group Discussion tbh)
- 31,197
- 27,393
I've moved it to Calc Group Discussion. I'll check in on the thread tomorrow.
- 220
- 161
- Thread starter
- #68
Being a representation of the blast does not mean the buildings are meant-to-scale. We've already discussed this here, with many reasons for why it's clearly not meant-to-scale being given, along with other things.
- 13,108
- 20,826
That doesn't necessarily mean I agree, though. It's clear the intent is that the explosion will encompass a good part of the elevated area, and I would much rather take that over the fan interpretation that it might extend well past it. We take statements over fan interpretations
- 220
- 161
- Thread starter
- #70
How far the explosion would extend is not of relevance if the buildings are not-meant-to-scale. Once again, what you brought up has already been discussed. I use no fan-interpretations in my CTR. I use direct, seen-with-our-eyes panels from the manga that directly go against the calculation, a calculation which ironically enough is purely based on fan-interpretation. Along with other flaws in the calculation independent of size.
- 31,197
- 27,393
I assume Clover will address the other points; he just left his initial thoughts before he had to go. Let's wait and see.
- 13,108
- 20,826
My contentions are primarily with the size, and I didn't have much time to go through the rest as thoroughly. I know you've talked about it with someone else before, but I'm still allowed to raise contentions. For example, if I'm not convinced by the rebuttal.
But yeah, Damage got it right. This will be my last reply for at least a few hours if not for the rest of the day because I have a Guilty Gear Strive tournament to get to. Wish me luck
- 220
- 161
- Thread starter
- #73
I am not trying to take that away from you. I am however allowed to inform you that the contention in question has been addressed, as to both inform you if where to look and to not keep the thread circular and degrading.
- 17,143
- 26,846
Was asked to speak here can I get a tdlr for both sides for why the calc either does or does not work
- 220
- 161
- Thread starter
- #75
I think you should read the entire thread and review the scans as opposed to basing your vote on TLDRs. It's not that big a thread.
- 220
- 161
- Thread starter
- #76
But if I had to give you a TLDR: The castle is consistently seen being much smaller than assumed in the calculation. And again, consistently. These are direct panels from the manga.
Ignoring how the assumed sizes are wrong, the amount of rock Desert Spada cut through is wrong as it assumes that there were no empty spaces containing only solid rock when in reality there were rooms ( as seen by the presence of windows ) and therefore lots of empty spaces.
The assumption that Ground Death pulverized the lawn's floor is wrong as Luffy fell back on the same floor after jumping to avoid the attack, as it's noted Crocodile was simply vaporizing the things on the floor ( Such as tiles and statues ) not the entire floor itself.
- 31,197
- 27,393
- 13,108
- 20,826
I still disagree with the size allegedly being wrong. It's clear that a 5 km diameter explosion will not go past this elevated space. That is what's shown to us, whereas using a fan calc will make the explosion go way past said space. And I will always prefer using things given to us by the manga itself over fan calculations.
As for the non-size related issues:
Also I got 5th in the Guilty Gear Strive tournament, I'm gaming
As for the non-size related issues:
- For the Desert Spada issue, you could simply fix this by removing 80% of the volume to account for the hollowness. This is how we handle such cases involving the volumes of buildings
- For the Ground Death issue, I agree with what you're saying. I think the way this could be fixed is by finding the height of the tiles and using that as the depth, and then doing fragmentation.
- 31,197
- 27,393
Wouldn't 80% only be used if it was for the entire building? The small cross-section of the building that the Desert Spada would go through doesn't mean that only 80% of what is being hit would be hollow.
- 13,108
- 20,826
It's a reasonable approximation based on what we typically do for building stuff, I feel. Admittedly, it's also pretty hard for me to make heads or tails of what's going on with these specific issues, given that I don't consider the linked calc to be formatted that well at all
Similar threads
