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Du Sollst — Dies Irae Comeback! (Shinza Banshō Cosmology Proposal)

Mugen-Kokutosho-Jigoku

Mugen-Kokutosho-Jigoku

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Greetings everyone, and welcome to a new Shinza Banshō thread. After a long time, ever since the verse was formally allowed to come back on the wiki, there hadn't been any news regarding the state of the series on this or how the supporters were handling the pages. Hence, i decided to do it myself, with the consent of the supporters of the series. This will be the first of many threads that will cover every single aspect of the Shinza Banshō series, ranging from its cosmology to its physiology pages, and lastly, profiles for every single (notable) character that deserves to be added on the wiki. As this is the first thread, its focus will be on the cosmology of the series:

Cosmology Explanation

I also want to take a moment to appreciate the effort of the many dozens of people who helped me in this silly project of mine, that fiercely worked together in order to give this beautiful fictional universe what it deserves on this wiki,

@MAUBRUTO @Top_G_Muzan @ProfectusInfinity @Tarang123 @RaikiKurohane99 @ExcelsisBerny @ShinMaximillion @Cipher72 @BoastJr @Mugen_no_Setsuna (and also those on Discord, like for example @despair_junko_ofc)

"Now then, behold this opera of mine, ladies and gentlemen. Its plot may be mundane, but the actors within it are truly fine indeed. I believe it to be of supreme bliss."

Agree:

Neutral

Disagree:
 
Last edited:
Mugen-Kokutosho-Jigoku said:
Greetings everyone, and welcome to a new Shinza Banshō thread. After a long time, ever since the verse was formally allowed to come back on the wiki, there hadn't been any news regarding the state of the series on this or how the supporters were handling the pages. Hence, i decided to do it myself, with the consent of the supporters of the series. This will be the first of many threads that will cover every single aspect of the Shinza Banshō series, ranging from its cosmology to its physiology pages, and lastly, profiles for every single (notable) character that deserves to be added on the wiki. As this is the first thread, its focus will be on the cosmology of the series:

Cosmology Explanation

I also want to take a moment to appreciate the effort of the many dozens of people who helped me in this silly project of mine, that fiercely worked together in order to give this beautiful fictional universe what it deserves on this wiki,

@MAUBRUTO @Top_G_Muzan @ProfectusInfinity @Tarang123 @RaikiKurohane99 @ExcelsisBerny @ShinMaximillion @Cipher72 @BoastJr @Mugen_no_Setsuna (and also those on Discord, like for example @despair_junko_ofc)

"Now then, behold this opera of mine, ladies and gentlemen. Its plot may be mundane, but the actors within it are truly fine indeed. I believe it to be of supreme bliss."

Agree:

Neutral

Disagree:
Click to expand...
Shouldn't T0 be in a separate thread?i still agree just asking
 
Voidnether said:
What's the reason again for the Divine Throne System being H1-A and not H1-A+?
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Tbh, i put it at just High 1-A because i'm not sure if you can be High 1-A+ by just being above all extensions of High 1-A without having statements regarding logically possible worlds and stuff (and also had numerous conflicting opinions on such). However, if it's enough, then i'm more than fine with it.
 
Humanitus_Primevilus888 said:
….welp I mean a 1 taikyoku see a 1 Meta-layer divine throne as a tool and a taikyoku differences between the 2 gods is like a painting and a painter and the fact that Mercurius and Reinhard destroyed the throne during their battle… but hey I might be wrong I haven’t been in tact with the verse for 2 years
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Yeah i'm sorry but this is a complete headcanon. Taiji values in K3 are not meant to be taken as "transcendences" or stuff like that, or even to be taken into account in the first place. The fact that not only the story doesn't mention them, but also actively contradicts those numbers just completely defeats any argument in their favor (Masada also comments on this in the K3 VFB saying that they were subject to many problems during the production). Besides, they don't view the Throne as a tool, that literally contradicts the entire narrative of the series.
 
Starting on the fourth day, is it already baseline High 1A? Did cosmology ultimately come to rest at meta-meta-meta-meta‑High 1A?
Anyway, I’m all for Dies coming back; I’ve even been planning to pick up this game again lately.
So.I agree
 
Mugen-Kokutosho-Jigoku said:
Tbh, i put it at just High 1-A because i'm not sure if you can be High 1-A+ by just being above all extensions of High 1-A without having statements regarding logically possible worlds and stuff (and also had numerous conflicting opinions on such). However, if it's enough, then i'm more than fine with it.
Click to expand...
If anyone could elucidate on this, since i'm not exactly very knowledgable about High 1-A+, i'd appreciate it a lot.
 
Mugen-Kokutosho-Jigoku said:
If anyone could elucidate on this, since i'm not exactly very knowledgable about High 1-A+, i'd appreciate it a lot.
Click to expand...
Those who can control realms beyond every logical possibility (Modal Realism: every possible possibility, possible impossibility, impossible possibility, impossible impossibility) are High 1-A Type 1. Anyone who generates or is the totality of all logically possible worlds is High 1-A Type 2. Normally, Tier 0 is the only rank above High 1-A, though you have to fulfill Tier 0’s prerequisites first.
 
Mugen-Kokutosho-Jigoku said:
If anyone could elucidate on this, since i'm not exactly very knowledgable about High 1-A+, i'd appreciate it a lot.
Click to expand...
I am pretty sure you should be more knowledgeable about H1-A+ than most users who think it is just "all logically possible worlds" since I have yapped about it many many times in general by which I assume you have read, you being too humble about yourself here

I mean like this is one of the many instances where I explain these stuff and it is the currently one of the few summarize that comes up to my head.

Anyway, I remember back then I had voiced a disagreement over H1-A+ Divine System, because um, reading the scans I could not understand how it exactly follows for H1-A+, even now checking things again, there is stuff like

Q: 観測者について、その起源など諸々、詳しく教えてください。
A: 極限まで進んだテクノロジーが神座システムを生み出し、それを巡って大戦争が起きた時代。後の第一天となる女性と共に戦った男が観測者の原型です。名前はナラカ。二人はその戦いを通じて恋人同士となり、最終的に第一天の座が完成したときにナラカはシステムの中枢へ入り込み、そこと融合します。 彼はその際、こういうプラグラムを発生させました。「このシステムは永劫に残す。 俺はそれを守る。ゆえに今後、総ての興亡期に俺の分身を選り出せ。ただし、俺にとって女はあいつだけでいい」第一天の女性は独善的な性格であり、 自分を守って正当化するために敵を求めました。 そしてその結果、多くの人が死にました。 彼女を愛していたナラカは、神座システムが無くなれば彼女の戦い、すなわち正義が無意味になると思っています。このあたりは結構歪んだ愛情で、ナラカは第一天の思想を廟笑いながらも愛でていた。馬鹿だから可愛い。愚かだから守る価値がある。とまあそうした理由で、システムそのものが消えてしまわないよう、 円滑に代替わりさせるために動くのがナラカの分身である観測者。本体はシステムと融合しているので、 後に出てくるジューダスや司狼などは彼の触覚です。これら分身にそういった知識はなく、無意識のうちにナラカの意志を実行する言わば操り人形。その因子を持つ者(つまりルネ山ボイス)は興亡期のみならずいつの時代にもいるのですが、観測者として覚醒するときに性的な不能者と化します。 すなわち、ただのルネ山なら問題ないけどインポのルネ山が出たらやばいということ。これでお分かりでしょうが、ナラカは今や神座システムそのものと化しているため、 歴代の覇道神より格としては上位にあります。 座の交代はソフトウェアの変更であり、ナラカというハードがあってこそ機能する。ゆえに、もしも神座システムを消そうというのであれば、ナラカを倒さなければいけません。こいつは強いとかそういうのじゃなく、極端にタチが悪い類です。おそらくは自分の作品中でもっとも策謀に長け、うざったかった水銀さえも、実際はナラカの手玉にすぎなかった。そのあたりからも、彼の面倒な性質は察せられるのではないでしょうか。実際、歴代の覇道神で、ナラカの存在に無意識的にでも気付けていたのは波旬のみ。彼くらい超深度に潜ることで、ようやくナラカの本質に掠ることが出来たという程度です。
Q: Could you explain in detail the origin of the Observers?
A: In an era where technology pushed to its limit gave rise to the Divine Throne System, a great war was waged around it. The man who fought alongside the woman who would later become the First Heaven is the prototype of the Observers. His name was Naraka. The two became lovers during this war and, when the Throne of the First Heaven was finally completed, Naraka entered the core of the system and fused with it. At that moment, he generated the following program: “This system shall remain eternally. I will protect it. Therefore, in the rise and fall of all eras, i will select my avatars. However, for me, that woman alone is already enough.” The woman of the First Heaven possessed an extremely egocentric personality. To protect and justify herself, she sought out enemies, and as a result, many people died. Naraka, who loved her, believed that if the Divine Throne System were to disappear, then her struggle—her justice—would lose its meaning completely. This is a quite distorted love. Naraka mocked the ideology of the First Heaven, but at the same time loved her: “She is cute because she is an idiot. She is worth protecting because she is foolish.” For this reason, to prevent the system from disappearing, the Observers, who are avatars of Naraka, act to ensure that the succession of the Throne occurs in a stable manner. Naraka's main body is fused with the system, and characters who appear later, such as Judas and Shirou, are essentially his sensories. These avatars do not possess this knowledge. They unconsciously execute Naraka's will; they are, so to speak, puppets. People who possess this factor exist in every era, but when they awaken as Observers, they become sexually impotent. In other words: a normal Rene-yama is not a problem, but if an impotent Rene-yama appears, then the situation becomes dangerous. As you may have realized, Naraka has now become the Divine Throne System itself, and because of this, he is hierarchically above all the Hegemony (Hadō) Gods in history. The changing of the Throne is merely a software update, and it only works because the hardware called Naraka exists. Therefore, if someone wants to destroy the Divine Throne System, they will have to defeat Naraka. He is not simply strong; he is an extremely problematic type. He is likely the greatest conspirator of the entire work. Even Mercurius, famous for his annoying intrigues, was actually just a piece in Naraka's hands. And this already demonstrates well just how complicated he is. In fact, among all the hegemony (Hadō) Gods in history, the only one who managed to perceive the existence of Naraka, even if unconsciously, was Hajun. Only by diving into an extreme depth like his was it possible to even perceive Naraka's true nature.
Click to expand...

It seems like Divine System at one point created within the Age of Zero… which… eh…? And is sustained by some means to function eternally (as Naraka fused with its core). Putting that aside, it is basically a big system with continuous software updates within it, combined with "beyond values such as strong or weak", it completely flatten it by the fact that it is a undifferentiated point.

Though, it is also acknowledged that "destroying" the System is like… nigh impossible or outright impossible by the order of its sheer existence which obviously I do not question its eternity, so it is fine, only the fact that it temporally has a point that it came to be…?

So it is… at very least… oh god I hate this term… it is at very least… Supra Qualitative superiority since it grounds all extensions of meta qualitative superiority without being exhausted by it.

Ugh, can't believe I used that stupid, ridiculous term. I don't even wish for that be indexed like that, man.

Anyway, I like flagging the fact that I am fundamentally and ultimately a larper of the verse so all my concerns might have all answers contextually (though I do not know how they can be resolved), or that it nevertheless qualify for how VSBW posit for it, shrug, so currently I only see that high for it yeah, but if pushing that away, it would be H1-A+ I guess.

Also, tf it means "they become sexually impotent" how tf it even correlate is Masada deadazz serious here
 
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