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Small Dragon Ball Super Goku addition.
- Thread starter CastoriceTheFifth
- Start date
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- Tags
- dragon ball son goku
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I disagree FRA
Kazuma_kuwabara
He/Him- 6,941
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Castorice, this ctr is too low for your standards, where is the tier 1-C for Seele?
Mbpoops
He/Him- 8,886
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Wait till i finish the hi3 seele profile
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Wait? Are we talking about anime, manga or both?
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- Thread starter
- #46
Atp I’m aiming for manga goku the most because blud straight up executed that entire move perfectly and attempted to apply the talisman but grabbed the wrong one in a time crunch.
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Manga Goku getting the talisman is oke, i dom't remember much about anime so i'm neutral toward it
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- Thread starter
- #50
Thank god we’re not actually giving this dude Roshi’s hostess bar coupon over the actual talisman
Anime Goku wise, he was still given the jar and the talisman off screen but left the talisman due to In a rush pretty sure. Difference is he didn’t attempt the Mafuba on Zamasu at all.
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Bruhh, then just let both anime and manga have talisman as well
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- Thread starter
- #52
Does this CRT need 2 or 3 votes
One of the contentions against optional equipment was Goku using the talisman as a tissue and then trying to use a tissue as the seal btw
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- Thread starter
- #54
Strong talismansthose who know yushiro talisman
Yushiro
Yushiro (愈ゆ史し郎ろう, Yushirō?) is a main supporting character of Demon Slayer: Kimetsu No Yaiba. He is the companion of Tamayo and is an ally of Tanjiro Kamado. During the time when we was terminally ill, Tamayo turned him into a demon to save his life. During the Infinity Castle arc, he joined...
vsbattles.fandom.com
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This issue isn't clear cut. He has access to the talisman, but he's never used it properly and has historically lost it before using it.
I think I might vote neutral. I see issues with both outcomes here. I guess a middle ground would be noting his historical lack of competence with the talisman in the weaknesses section.
I think I might vote neutral. I see issues with both outcomes here. I guess a middle ground would be noting his historical lack of competence with the talisman in the weaknesses section.
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- Thread starter
- #56
But he never lost the talisman, he just grabbed the wrong one when he was leaving in a rush from Roshi's house.
Also wouldn't the weakness be redundant? There's nothing special about the talisman's application and usage. It's just sticking it onto the jar or rice cooker.
Which Goku does perfectly fine
So he doesn't have a competence issue with the talisman and he actually knows how to use it correctly.
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He's never used it or taken it into battle.
He has a track record of misplacing it.Also wouldn't the weakness be redundant? There's nothing special about the talisman's application and usage. It's just sticking it onto the jar or rice cooker.
Which Goku does perfectly fine
So he doesn't have a competence issue with the talisman and he actually knows how to use it correctly.
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- Thread starter
- #58
He was still given it off screen, did the entire technique perfectly in battle, and did the talisman application correctly.
Thats a short track record since it only happened once and it was him being in a rush.
This is unrealistic for it to happen in a normal match because he didnt lose the big jar nor the “talisman” he thought he brought. He doesn’t magically ever lose any equipment he has on him like with Potara or Power Pole in OG and Daima. He never misplaced the Zeno Button either. It all just stems off of the one moment he grabbed the wrong one in a rush.
Like how would this weakness be worded
“Goku grabs the wrong talisman in a time crunch, however in matchups SBA forces the item on him at the start”
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This is why I said I was neutral.
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- Thread starter
- #60
Can you ping evaluating staffs @Nierre and @TWILIGHT-OP please (
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Well, we do see him actually use the ability while practicing in the DBS anime. And of course, narratively, we know Goku mastered it in the manga as well. In the manga, Roshi simply handed him a coupon instead or whatever. But my thing is, Goku like never carries this on him. It was only the one time. So how exactly would this work? Would this be added to like a separate key for when Goku actually tried to use it? And Goku doesn't carry a bottle on him either. So I suppose I'm neutral until I get further clarification.
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I would include it as an equipment for Black Saga Goku. For later sagas I'm not so sure, given Goku doesn't normally prep the Mafuba but it is a skill he has access to and he can get talismans from Roshi if granted preptime so Optional for later keys is fine.
As for the whole shopping coupon thing, I don't personally see it as a disqualifier. It isn't even an intelligence antifeat for Goku. He is shown to known how the technique works, knows it requires a specific talisman and his mistake was the result of him rushing due to the context. That isn't a mistake he would make in a normal fight or with standard preptime. In this context Trunks's life was on the line so he needed to get back ASAP.
I don't think it makes sense to disqualify a character from an entire ability they explicitly learned to do correctly because they, due to the tense context, made a mistake. In a standard matchup it just wouldn't happen in the first place. Because Goku isn't worried over someone else's life.
To put it another way. We know how the ability works. We know the character can do it. We know they can do it correctly. The only reason the character failed it is because of a contextual time constraint causing them to make a basic mistake, which logically does not apply in matchups. The character also has an in-universe in-character method of gaining talismans if granted preptime. This isn't a 'hypothetical power'. It's just something the character can do. And it is shown they can procure the equipment to do it.
So overall I see no issue with Goku having it as Optional Equipment.
As for the whole shopping coupon thing, I don't personally see it as a disqualifier. It isn't even an intelligence antifeat for Goku. He is shown to known how the technique works, knows it requires a specific talisman and his mistake was the result of him rushing due to the context. That isn't a mistake he would make in a normal fight or with standard preptime. In this context Trunks's life was on the line so he needed to get back ASAP.
I don't think it makes sense to disqualify a character from an entire ability they explicitly learned to do correctly because they, due to the tense context, made a mistake. In a standard matchup it just wouldn't happen in the first place. Because Goku isn't worried over someone else's life.
To put it another way. We know how the ability works. We know the character can do it. We know they can do it correctly. The only reason the character failed it is because of a contextual time constraint causing them to make a basic mistake, which logically does not apply in matchups. The character also has an in-universe in-character method of gaining talismans if granted preptime. This isn't a 'hypothetical power'. It's just something the character can do. And it is shown they can procure the equipment to do it.
So overall I see no issue with Goku having it as Optional Equipment.
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To me, this comes across as a situation where we have to consider the spirit of the rules rather than the specific wording.
It's not a case of extending a piece of equipment to a character that has no connection to it, like trying to say that Piccolo should have access to the Dragon Radar since he's friends with Bulma and can grab it off her whenever he wants.
Goku can use the technique that the talisman is a part of, has knowledge of the talisman, and would have grabbed it if he had not made a mistake. In the absence of Plot-Induced Stupdity, Goku would have used the talisman. And our profiles and battles don't hinge on Plot-Induced Stupidty factoring in for them.
Now, personally I would actually say that Goku and the others such as Krillin or Piccolo shouldn't get Dragon Balls as an optional item. It is not part of their skillsets; they're items in the world that anyone can use and aren't associated with specifically any of the Z Fighters individually even if yes, they have technically laid their hands on them. We might as well give Android 17 the Super Dragon Balls as optional equipment if we did that since he has used them for a wish.
It's not a case of extending a piece of equipment to a character that has no connection to it, like trying to say that Piccolo should have access to the Dragon Radar since he's friends with Bulma and can grab it off her whenever he wants.
Goku can use the technique that the talisman is a part of, has knowledge of the talisman, and would have grabbed it if he had not made a mistake. In the absence of Plot-Induced Stupdity, Goku would have used the talisman. And our profiles and battles don't hinge on Plot-Induced Stupidty factoring in for them.
Now, personally I would actually say that Goku and the others such as Krillin or Piccolo shouldn't get Dragon Balls as an optional item. It is not part of their skillsets; they're items in the world that anyone can use and aren't associated with specifically any of the Z Fighters individually even if yes, they have technically laid their hands on them. We might as well give Android 17 the Super Dragon Balls as optional equipment if we did that since he has used them for a wish.
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- Thread starter
- #65
Roshi in the manga gave him the talisman. Goku just grabbed the wrong one in a rush.
To clarify, optional equipment don’t require characters to carry the item on them 24/7. For example, the Hashiras from Demon Slayer have a Blood Demon Art talisman as their optional equipment despite never having that item on them outside a single situational moment that they didn’t plan on.
Tohru from Dragon Maid has the Holy Sword as her optional equipment despite her never carrying it on her due to Holy Manipulation being lethal to her.
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- Thread starter
- #66
Would you say this is an agreement for him having it as optional equipment?
Looking back on it. Compared to all of those characters,
Goku did technically gather all the Dragon Balls alone without anyone's help (besides radar)
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Seems alright as Optional Equipment
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Yeah.
Mm-hmm. I think if anyone should have Dragon Balls as optional equipment then, it should be Kami, Goku, Dende and Bulma.
Others like Gohan, Krillin, etc. should have them removed.
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- Thread starter
- #69
Yeah nuking them is fair. Wait do we actually have a Dende profile? I thought that got nuked.
Also thank you all for the eval, I'll apply it soon.
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Ah, just listing viable characters. Doesn't seem like Dende has a profile.
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when I’ve done similar stuff for other profiles (Obito for example who has different weapons depending on the point in the story) I just add it to optional equipment for the whatever versions of the character demonstrate an in character willingness to use the ability (and in this case did the prep in advance to use it in this setting)
TLDR, I’m fine giving a talisman and Rice Cooker to Future Trunks Arc Goku’s Key.
TLDR, I’m fine giving a talisman and Rice Cooker to Future Trunks Arc Goku’s Key.
ProudLearner
She/Her- 1,362
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I agree FRA
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