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His durability comes from that not his AP, his AP just scales to his durability, he struggled to lift it but he didn’t seem to have taken any damage from lifting it meaning it isn’t an anti feat for durability
I already linked them
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The Revenant Marvel Comics Discussion Thread
- Thread starter The_Impress
- Start date
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- Tags
- marvel comics
Tomfer
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These are some old calcs that, most likely, will need to be re-evaluated, if not completely redone. Especially now that we got an entire new website just for calcs.
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How is writing a comic about doom and having doom do try something that is very in character for doom bias towards doom?
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Thanks, I just skimmed through the calcs you linked. Some of these are very contentious. The Doctor Octopus calc seems be rejected because it used possibly hyperbolic statement to find KE and the standards have changed since then I don't think it works. The SCUD missile calc had an unresolved argument about the proximity of Spider-Man to the detonation. Several of them were accepted already though. This Spider-Man crater impact feat was accepted but needed to be discussed on which end was best. The math of this explosion was accepted, but there was apparently a retcon about the powers being mostly illusions as the blog mentions so it needs more discussion as well. These two calcs have no evaluations yet. The 6-C calc was accepted mathematically, however there are other a few issues about using this to powerscale /Spider-Man's durability. The calc seems to use the art from Sub-Mariner #63 (1973) to calculate it, and a decade later by Marvel Teamup (1982) there had been several retcons with Atlantis, not to mention the writers were different as well.
TLDR: The Ock feat is probably invalid because of the KE feat rules. I also have issues with the Serpent Crown feat [6-C], the city busting feat [7-B+]. The SCUD is contentious, but the distance the explosion and him wasn't resolved, if you include it as well that leaves these four calcs [High 7-C], here [7-C+] here [7-C], here [8-B/Low 7-C], & here [8-B]. The best bet is to get as many of the Spidey calcs together and evaluated, especially the ones where no end was chosen or has no comments. There are more possibly valid Spider-Man calcs than I thought, and any of these would upgrade him. So, if you can gather them together you might have a better shot at low end tier 7, if all of them are accepted.
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there’s another feat in that link then the explosion
The only art that was used was for determining the height of the lava spout in relation to a man and determining that the earthquake knocked over the palace tower, both of those things have more to do with the explosion then Atlantis and wouldn’t be affected by Atlantis being retconed
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Depends on which 1-As, both marvel and dc have multiple 1-As that are different amounts into 1-A
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I'm going to see if I can find the comic then to read it myself for more context. If we assume Spider-Man was hit by full force of the explosion, it also contradicts the calcs you sent me. He was knocked or injured by many of these feats yet in the 6-C feat he is completely unharmed. In one of the highest calcs that you've listed he was knocked out by a 10-megaton explosion but shrugs off a 900x more powerful explosion [9 gigatons]. Anyways, its simplest for now to have the calc ppl looks these over.
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I agree that it’s an outlier, my original list was just answering the question about if spider man has feats higher than high 8-C, my response to your original reasoning for excluding the 6-C feat was just to try to clear up confusion, sorry if I made it seem like I actually intended to scale him to island level
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it's not a bad thing. I'm just saying that Ryan North has been heading the character for a while like how Snyder did for Joker. the bias is them turning said characters into powerscaling fantasies like in OWUD and Death Metal / DC KO
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That is much more consistent and reasonably tiered in relation to the upper limits of his durability, so it can remain. Comparisons to Proxima and She-Hulk are outliers.
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Doom is an absolute piece of shit who has completely abused his entitlements to casually genocidal or even omnicidal clinically narcissistic mememememememe fascist extremes. Going overboard with glorifying him and presenting a walking pile of rotten totalitarian excrement and "might makes right" ultraviolence as a go-to solution to everything as something somehow idealised, cool, laudable, and invincible is typical for USA-centric culture, but it is still ridiculously morally reprehensible.
Excellence616
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Dominions Profile +Other Marvel Additions
Introducing a profile for Dominions. Surtur Changes - Surtur is rated as Low 1-C in his base form, despite his justification explaining that he's equal to Odin without amps, thus assuming for some reason that Odin was at his weakest ebb of power while facing Surtur. This isn't true, it was...
Excellence616
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Consistency =/= Accuracy from what I've seen in comics
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Just let you know that if there's a Spider-Man upgrade thread it should also really scrutinize the scaling of his villains. For example, Kingpin and Tombstone are supposed to be comparable
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Um, Has my list been forgottenI don't think that he has any consistent feat of his own higher than that, but if others here find them, I am willing to be proven wrong.
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He has multiple tier 7 feats that I’ve already linked, rhino has multiple tier 7 feats, carnage has a controversial tier 7 feat, venom might have a tier 7 feat, doctor octopus has a controversial tier 7 feat, I’m sure there’s more tier 7 feats
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Yeah, and there’s like 50000 Tier 9 and 8 feats, a lot of which he’s shown to struggle with. A character with as vast a history as Spiderman either needs a metric **** ton of feats, or a change in the status quo that allows him to scale higher. Even if you had 10 Tier 7 completely valid feats, I’d hesitate to upgrade him completely.
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50000 is dramatic considering the fact that he’s only been in 4850 comics and doesn’t get 10 feats per comic, and unless you have any actual examples of tier 9 to 8 feats that he struggles with then you haven’t really provided any evidence against him being tier 7
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There’s this little known concept called an exaggeration.
Tbh I don’t want to because like…I just don’t care enough, but I know others who probably will and you don’t want that heat. Though if you wanted to try, go for it ig.
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I was like 75% joking 25% serious when I said you were being dramatic
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It's all good, I support gathering as many feats & calcs as possible. Spider-Man is in a bit of a funny spot where he's generally above street level in powerset but not scope which means he probably has more contradictions than many Marvel characters. At minimum it could help smooth out the tier.
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Bendis has almost consistently gone out of his way to depower and/or humiliate She-Hulk and to wank Luke Cage as much as possible. She-Hulk is officially far more powerful than Luke.
If the whole thing is biased then it shouldn't be featured in his profile period.
Hell, one of the scans in his profile also shows him taking hits from Proxima Midnight (written by Al Ewing)
Is it fine if we remove comparisons to Proxima Midnight and She-Hulk from Luke Cage's page in our wiki? They are clearly misleading outliers.Yes, we should probably stick to his own feats rather than comparisons. Proxima was once able to nearly pin the Hulk to the ground.
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The Proxima midnight fight’s not used for scaling it’s used for P&A,Is it fine if we remove comparisons to Proxima Midnight and She-Hulk from Luke Cage's page in our wiki? They are clearly misleading outliers.
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MrKerf
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Okay. Never mind then. However, shouldn't Luke be scaled above "Large Building level+", such as "At least City Block level", if he can easily knock out The Rhino?
How consistent is it? Being able to beat Goblin and early Venom is one thing, but Rhino can damage Iron Man.
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Rhino is large building level+, our tiering system page says “being far more powerful than a character in one tier does not necessarily qualify one for a higher rating”, also our attack potency page says “Tiers between 9-A and 3-B, even those which do correspond with their namesakes, should not be assigned unless there are accepted calculations, multipliers, and/or reliably stated precise Joule values that correspond with those ratings” and one shotting rhino is neither an accepted calculation nor a multiplier nor a reliably stated precise joule valueOkay. Never mind then. However, shouldn't Luke be scaled above "Large Building level+", such as "At least City Block level", if he can easily knock out The Rhino?
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Well, Luke seems consistently considerably above Spider-Man level characters, and The Rhino is far stronger than Spider-Man, so I think that he should be rated higher than High 8-C+ to start with.
Regardless, somebody who is just twice as strong as High 8-C+ automatically qualifies for 8-B.
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Once again, our tiering system page says “being far more powerful than a character in one tier does not necessarily qualify one for a higher rating”, also our attack potency page says “Tiers between 9-A and 3-B, even those which do correspond with their namesakes, should not be assigned unless there are accepted calculations, multipliers, and/or reliably stated precise Joule values that correspond with those ratings” and being far stronger than spider man is neither an accepted calculation nor a multiplier nor a reliably stated precise joule value
There’s nothing that confirms Luke cage to be twice as strong as rhinoRegardless, somebody who is just twice as strong as High 8-C+ automatically qualifies for 8-B.
MrKerf
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Who would you consider "Spider-Man level characters" though? The examples on Luke's page are nothing that Pete wouldn't be capable of doing, for example, he chooses not to.Well, Luke seems consistently considerably above Spider-Man level characters, and The Rhino is far stronger than Spider-Man, so I think that he should be rated higher than High 8-C+ to start with.
Regardless, somebody who is just twice as strong as High 8-C+ automatically qualifies for 8-B.
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His profile doesn't say "comparable to She-Hulk", I'm just giving the full context of the feat, though it agree it should be removed so people don't bring up that really dumb argument againIs it fine if we remove comparisons to Proxima Midnight and She-Hulk from Luke Cage's page in our wiki? They are clearly misleading outliers.
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Rhino was going to be upgraded to Town level but whoever was in charge of that got cold feetOkay. Never mind then. However, shouldn't Luke be scaled above "Large Building level+", such as "At least City Block level", if he can easily knock out The Rhino?
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There is a problem with using upscaling for this, because it makes everything circular. High 8-C+ comes from Mettle who Rhino scales to [7.98], but 8-B starts at 11 tons, which is a 1.378x difference. If there is an explicit statement that says Luke = 2x Rhino that's one thing, but I can't find anything saying that on their pages. Knocking someone out with one hit does not quantify the degree of strength difference. Another problem is that the Rhino was knocked out by Luke Cage, yet we mention Rhino fighting the 8-B Mark 8 Iron Man suit, which is City Block because of a 2x statement comparing it to the Mark IV armor which scales to Luke Cage. I found this which might place Rhino somewhere in Town level, but we should get more people to discuss this.
As I was looking for Mettle's feats more glaring issue with Mettle's being High 8-C+from surviving this explosion. My issue isn't from the math, but when looking for the feat I found the full panels on imgur and the explosion was caused by Skirn during a Fear Itself tie in. However, Skirn is supposed to be an amped Titania, which makes it unusable for scaling as the calc itself notes. I know Ant is strongly against Rhino & Luke Cage scaling to Titania and sees it as an outlier. If that's the case it doesn't make sense to use it at all.
As I was looking for Mettle's feats more glaring issue with Mettle's being High 8-C+from surviving this explosion. My issue isn't from the math, but when looking for the feat I found the full panels on imgur and the explosion was caused by Skirn during a Fear Itself tie in. However, Skirn is supposed to be an amped Titania, which makes it unusable for scaling as the calc itself notes. I know Ant is strongly against Rhino & Luke Cage scaling to Titania and sees it as an outlier. If that's the case it doesn't make sense to use it at all.
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The Green Goblin and similarly powerful characters, with Cage, Rhino, and Sandman being a bit above that level.
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Rhino was going to be upgraded to Town level but whoever was in charge of that got cold feet
I personally find it reasonable for Cage, Rhino, and Sandman to be Town level, or at least City Block level, with Spider-Man defeating the last two, despite that they are repeatedly stated to be far more powerful, being perceived as plot convenience.
However, scaling them to a Fear Itself-amplified Titania seems too inconsistent.
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