Helluva Fast Downgrades (Hellaverse Tier 5 Removal)

[DaReaperMan]

Bro you know a downgrade is bad when rando people who scale Ninjago are here lmfao

 

[DeadlyMonarchChewstheDirt]

Again, by this logic, would that mean a Tier 2 character that creates an explosion that doesn't bomb a Tier 2 structure deserve a rating below Tier 2?

The answer is no, DC in verses is usually very low to keep the setting around. Unless there is a need to destroy it or do so on a minimal level (like the MoL)

 

[DeadlyMonarchChewstheDirt]

Bro you know a downgrade is bad when rando people who scale Ninjago are here lmfao

Prolly cuz ninjago suffers from similer AP/DC issues

 

[Eden_Warlock99]

He immediately dropped tier 7 power on a nobody he'd never heard of in a blimp. He's going to drop that kind of power against someone who was an Overlord at the time.

*After ripping his airship apart and slamming him around it with his tentacles
And guess what happened after? Sir Pentious came back, 19 times.

Like come on.

Finally, a fight with you that might be a challenge! Your screams will make for a satisfying broadcast.

 

[DeadlyMonarchChewstheDirt]

*After ripping his airship apart and slamming him around it with his tentacles
And guess what happened after? Sir Pentious came back, 19 times.

Like come on.

Didn't a bunch of mostly intact sinners get crushed at the bridge? They didnt come back that quick

 

[DaReaperMan]

*After ripping his airship apart and slamming him around it with his tentacles
And guess what happened after? Sir Pentious came back, 19 times.

It's still a Low 7-C blast mate.

Also that did literally kill Pentious lmfao

Like come on.

Seems Husk's screams are good for broadcasts by your logic. Base Vox<Husk?

 

[TheOrangeGuy09]

Reaper giving me any credit is an achievement to be sure

Truth nuke

I meant on the verse page.

Tbf that page is always messy

Could I add it? It's just weird it isn't in the overlords calc section

Yea sure go ahead

I think we discovered new wank for Alastor. Though admittedly, his opponent would need to be badly wounded for him to do it.

Guess what I'm now planning to add to him in my CRT?

He immediately dropped tier 7 power on a nobody he'd never heard of in a blimp. He's going to drop that kind of power against someone who was an Overlord at the time.

Eh, fair enough. I'd say Tier 7 scaling makes sense for Vox since Alastor was hella casual doing it, but not scaling to his actual FP which would downscale from General of Exorcists, in case Overlord downgrades come. This sounds like a good compromise.

 

[Lloydblitzed]

The answer is no, DC in verses is usually very low to keep the setting around. Unless there is a need to destroy it or do so on a minimal level (like the MoL)

Let's debunk Human lvl characters to below average human lvl next (their punches don't vaporize another human with a single blow)

 

[Eden_Warlock99]

Didn't a bunch of mostly intact sinners get crushed at the bridge? They didnt come back that quick

Al and Vox fought there for what, 10 seconds?
How is this relevant tho

 

[DeadlyMonarchChewstheDirt]

Truth nuke

Tbf that page is always messy

Yea sure go ahead

SO! Smol issue, teh accepted calc isnt on his page from what I can see. And this one is the only I've found, which makes hum 2 kt and even closer to Adam lol.
Could you link me the accepted one so I can add it?

 

[DeadlyMonarchChewstheDirt]

Al and Vox fought there for what, 10 seconds?
How is this relevant tho

You implied that pentious died and resurrected 19 times in VERY quick succession, which he didnt. Unless I read it wrong

"*After ripping his airship apart and slamming him around it with his tentacles
And guess what happened after? Sir Pentious came back, 19 times.

Like come on."

Pentious is an average sinner, and this level of regen isn't accepted, we would've seen people coming back in that case

 

[DaReaperMan]

Guess what I'm now planning to add to him in my CRT?

I'll support you on it, for the record.

Eh, fair enough. I'd say Tier 7 scaling makes sense for Vox since Alastor was hella casual doing it, but not scaling to his actual FP which would downscale from General of Exorcists, in case Overlord downgrades come. This sounds like a good compromise.

Yeah it was going to be At least 9-A, at most/likely Low 7-C.

Unless you want solid Low 7-C-- but 9-A has more matches. Ignore that most people in 9-A are at least a hundred megajoules and the 9-A feat currently has like 20.

Al and Vox fought there for what, 10 seconds?
How is this relevant tho

Eden, I'm going to request you get the feats from Weakened Alastor vs 100% Vox calced before you make your CRT.

 

[Eden_Warlock99]

It's still a Low 7-C blast mate.

Also that did literally kill Pentious lmfao

*A Low 7-C blast he only used AFTER slamming Sir Pentious around for ***** and giggles

And yeah. It did. It might've done so to Vox too. That doesn't matter. Cause they come back!

Seems Husk's screams are good for broadcasts by your logic. Base Vox<Husk?

Husk did call them nobodies

Please look at it from this perspective, you're trying to scale someone from a fight we haven't seen, in which the opponent considers this someone to be a joke compared to him, and was 100% confident on taking on ADAM, the general of the EXORCISTS, WHO ARE INVINCIBLE to the OVERBUMBS that Vox SCALES to.

 

[ShionAH]

You implied that pentious died and resurrected 19 times in VERY quick succession, which he didnt. Unless I read it wrong

"*After ripping his airship apart and slamming him around it with his tentacles
And guess what happened after? Sir Pentious came back, 19 times.

Like come on."

Pentious is an average sinner, and this level of regen isn't accepted, we would've seen people coming back in that case

What? Thats not what they meant lol

 

[DeadlyMonarchChewstheDirt]

Eden, I'm going to request you get the feats from Weakened Alastor vs 100% Vox calced before you make your CRT.

It would literally be so great to at least have more tier 8 consistency for mid tiers

 

[Eden_Warlock99]

You implied that pentious died and resurrected 19 times in VERY quick succession, which he didnt. Unless I read it wrong

Yeah, I meant that the Low 7-C didn't end their conflicts lol

Eden, I'm going to request you get the feats from Weakened Alastor vs 100% Vox calced before you make your CRT.

They're 100% below Shok.wav's feat, but sure.

 

[DeadlyMonarchChewstheDirt]

What? Thats not what they meant lol

uhhhhh, then what DID they mean by saying that Penny came back 19 times????

Edit: oh

Yeah, I meant that the Low 7-C didn't end their conflicts lol

They're 100% below Shok.wav's feat, but sure.

 

[DeadlyMonarchChewstheDirt]

I'm just having fun knowing that AL will still at least be tier 7 by the end of this. (which is where I think he belongs anyway)

 

[TheOrangeGuy09]

SO! Smol issue, teh accepted calc isnt on his page from what I can see. And this one is the only I've found, which makes hum 2 kt and even closer to Adam lol.
Could you link me the accepted one so I can add it?

Nvm I guess I forgor to link it to the calc in Reaper's CRT and instead just linked it to the YT link. Ig StoneKiller is right that it's technically not accepted rn.

I'll support you on it, for the record.

Yeah it was going to be At least 9-A, at most/likely Low 7-C.

You know it's a truly nice feeling when we agree on Hazbin stuff.

Unless you want solid Low 7-C-- but 9-A has more matches.

Yeah I think at most/likely will do.

Ignore that most people in 9-A are at least a hundred megajoules and the 9-A feat currently has like 20.

Can Vox's limited Dura Neg carry?

Please look at it from this perspective, you're trying to scale someone from a fight we haven't seen, in which the opponent considers this someone to be a joke compared to him, and was 100% confident on taking on ADAM, the general of the EXORCISTS, WHO ARE INVINCIBLE to the OVERBUMBS that Vox SCALES to.

I mean, he casually did Low 7-C against Pentious while considering him nobody. Reaper doesn't even want solid scaling, just at most or likely, which I think is more than fine.

 

[DeadlyMonarchChewstheDirt]

This is all very entertaining to watch

 

[DaReaperMan]

A Low 7-C blast he only used AFTER slamming Sir Pentious around for **** and giggles

sigh...

And yeah. It did. It might've done so to Vox too. That doesn't matter. Cause they come back!

Remind me what happened to other Overlords Alastor killed?

Husk did call them nobodies

And he's comparable to them. What does that say about Husk's power level?

Please look at it from this perspective, you're trying to scale someone from a fight we haven't seen, in which the opponent considers this someone to be a joke compared to him, and was 100% confident on taking on ADAM, the general of the EXORCISTS, WHO ARE INVINCIBLE to the OVERBUMBS that Vox SCALES to.

Oh, you mean Mr. 7-B bare minimum? Seriously, Eden. If Alastor has shit that scales to Adam, someone who's scaling to Lucifer even if he's downscaling and his casual shit is Low 7-C, he's busting it out. I'm just not going for solid scaling because that question mark is there.

They're 100% below Shok.wav's feat, but sure.

Hey, more consistency the better.

 

[The_Renegade_Slugger]

I disagree.

To be clear, the feat in no way contradicts the kinetic energy requirements, much less the narrative. It's a weapon powered by the energy of a Seraphin capable of shattering a shield made by six other Seraphim, with the beam of this weapon crossing an interplanetary distance, expanding the surrounding air in such a way that it forms clouds larger than the planet itself upon colliding with the shield. Furthermore, just colliding with the shield, which is more than a planet away, generates seismic energy so strong that it shakes the planet itself. And upon destroying the shield, it generates a second, even larger, and even faster cloud expansion.

How so? The planet was nearly pierced by the beam, suffered a major earthquake, and even if it wasn't destroyed, that doesn't invalidate the feat, because Heaven, which is literally the first place of creation, may simply be more resistant than an ordinary planet, especially since its gates survived the beam even though they were catapulted and damaged (which, incidentally, was considered the most impressive thing by viewers, not an interplanetary beam, but the breaking of the gate).

Dude it fragged like three buildings. The feat overall to me just seems to be really wonky, like the beam is so clearly not the same size in every shot.

 

[TheOrangeGuy09]

What does that say about Husk's power level?

That says that this was a mere avatar and Husk's real self is 1-A

 

[TheOrangeGuy09]

Dude it fragged like three buildings.

Yeah, you know, after wasting most of its energy to crush the shield?

 

[DaReaperMan]

Dude it fragged like three buildings. The feat overall to me just seems to be really wonky, like the beam is so clearly not the same size in every shot.

Just say the beam is luminosity and that's why it's visible at different sizes from different perspectives

 

[Eden_Warlock99]

I mean, he casually did Low 7-C against Pentious while considering him nobody. Reaper doesn't even want solid scaling, just at most or likely, which I think is more than fine.

No, it's not fine. Unless you want to give ******* everyone an "At most Low 7-C" since Vox, is not all that. He's still around Val and Velvette's power range, which is pretty ass.

Remind me what happened to other Overlords Alastor killed?

They died, and then they came back.
We've only seen him mess with the souls of people he owns, so take a guess on what happened.

Oh, you mean Mr. 7-B bare minimum? Seriously, Eden. If Alastor has shit that scales to Adam, someone who's scaling to Lucifer even if he's downscaling and his casual shit is Low 7-C, he's busting it out. I'm just not going for solid scaling because that question mark is there.

You definitely missed the point, we have NO IDEA how Vox took said casual Low 7-C, nothing.
Fact Alastor was so confident he thought he could take on people who are straight-up invincible to Vox, kinda shows that Vox is NOWHERE NEAR HIM.

 

[Eden_Warlock99]

Yeah, you know, after wasting most of its energy to crush the shield?

It performed the Tier 5 feat after crushing the shield btw

 

[StoneKillerz12]

Noice, now prove that this means its range/DC reflects its AP.

I did, several times, actually. You just continue to repeat the same "AP =/= DC" rebuttal no matter how many times I tell you that it isn't applicable in the case of natural explosions, much less when we are talking about a kinetic energy feat where the damage caused by the supposedly 5-B kinetic energy is incongruent with said predicted 5-B result. This is not just a case of "AP =/= DC", this goes against what our guidelines for Kinetic Energy are. If you disagree with this for example and believe the kinetic energy of the hypothetical 200 kg metal ball moving at Mach 300 should be priortized over the damage it causes to that wall, go ahead and make a CRT overturning our KE guidelines.

As for the explosion, for the thousandth time, we estimate the yield of explosions primarily by inputting it's blast radius into the formula used, whether it be for natural explosions or explosions in space. If you could go ahead and provide me one example of an accepted calculation for an explosion in any piece of media in which the value that is accepted is billions of times greater than the actual explosive yield, I will happily concede. Otherwise, I'm sticking with what the formula for calculating explosions would predict specifically in relation to its size, over a kinetic energy showing that violates our guidelines.

Your argument is that explosions cannot possibly be less than AP.

Not what I said. I said that natural explosions, which we calculate via formulae which specifically hinge on inputting the blast radius, exhibit energy outputs which absolutely do hinge upon the size of the explosion. If an explosion is caused by something like a character firing an energy blast at someone that causes an explosion when it hits them, and that someone who gets hit by it is injured, we would simply scale the yield of that blast to that someone's durability, if their durability is consistently known. Otherwise, if the explosion is the feat in question and does cause a sizable amount of damage, then we would prioritize the yield of the explosion...which we would calculate, by measuring it's size.

But if you claim it's specifically due to overheating... I still don't see the point why would it make DC = AP? Because you said so?

Uh, no. The episode clearly implies the result of the overheating would be an explosion:

Carmilla: You idiot! if it overloads, it will blow, taking you, us, and half of the pentagram with it.

Please tell me what other interpretation the phrase "it will blow" implies other than it exploding.

Hell, as I said above, we have 8-A angry Alastor vs. Low 7-C casual Alastor explosion.

And as I said above, the reason those explosions are even that tier at all is specifically due to its size. The only reason those explosions are 8-A and Low 7-C respectively is specifically because of us measuring their size and inputting that radius into an explosive formula. Your basis is that the yield of those explosions can be multiple times higher than the radius of destruction they extend to, yet you don't scale these explosions any higher than what is specifically derived from their size. Also, the latter "Low 7-C" explosion was rejected like, several months ago lmao.

Noice, but do you have proof for that?

I've proved it multiple times, you simply just continue to repeat the exact same argument I addressed over and over and over again. We calculate explosions by measuring their blast radius, if the radius is smaller, the yield is smaller. If you disagree, go ahead and make a CRT for the formulae we use for those explosions to get removed.

Nukes are real life working on physics. MoL has supernatural entity as its source. This is blatant false equivalence.

Cool, so surely you can show me an example of an accepted calculation on this wiki where the energy produced by an explosion is scaled billions of times higher than the yield the explosion itself was calculated at, yes? You should also be telling this to every single accepted explosion feat for verses with supernatural power systems, as they use formulae they are derived from calculating real world nuclear blasts.

By your logic, it destroyed no buildings whatsoever, only gate.

No, not "my logic" whatsoever. I told you already multiple times that it did destroy Buildings, just not any major ones let alone most of them. The MoL pierces through the gate and then destroys a couple of buildings behind it at the entrance. The point is that Heaven largely remains in-tact by a supposedly 5-B level of Kinetic Energy, which violates KE guidelines. If a laser blast with that much kinetic energy hit a planet like Earth, a lot more than just a few buildings are getting destroyed to say the least.

So Vox was planning to attack them with something that doesn't even destroy buildings or any surrounding...

I mean...yeah? Well, that specific shot at least. Vox fired off that one shot only for the purpose of destroying the barrier and intimidating Heaven. I'm pretty sure if a bunch of aliens invaded Earth and fired off a weapon which destroyed a city block or two, before giving us an ultimatum about surrending control of our planet to them, that would be a pretty effective scare tactic.

So basically "my words >>>> actual definitions", noice.

Yes, in the case of definitions on Google, which can absolutely be wrong. And again, whether it's called a "strawman" or not, you are still consistently misrepresenting my arguments whether you intend to or not. That's still fallacious.

Fair enough, since none of fiction follows Einstein's relativity or basic principle that you must have light in order to see (for FTL characters) or sound to speak in space, we must nuke all calculations!

Yes! This is exactly what my point is. If real world physics shouldn't matter when it comes to talking about feats in fiction, then it should not matter when we try to calculate them either. Again, you can't have your cake and eat it too. Either the physics should be taken into account or they shouldn't. If they shouldn't, then you can't use those physics that apparently "don't matter" to calculate the feats you're claiming don't need to abide by those laws.

I'll tell ya more: none of the authors intend any KE feat. I'll go further: none of the authors intend ANY feat to be calced to precisely any value any of our fan calculations yield.

Not what my point was. The point is that authors would only be "stupid" under the objectively fan-made assumption that the blast was 5-B, meaning the only way they would be "stupid" by animating it in a way which contradicts what the actual scale of the feat was according to the narrative would be if that "actual scale" is what you currently assume it to be. There's a very real possibility that the blast just isn't 5-B despite its size, something I thought you understood very well given that AP and DC are different.

Not really the case here.

It is. You're rejecting the idea that an explosion cannot produce billions of times greater energy than what the size of it predicts its yield to be by stating that "This is fiction, who cares what physics has to say!", yet you are using those very same physics that you think shouldn't be taken into account to calculate the feat to 5-B in the first place. If you don't think physics should be in this discussion, then you have no basis for the feat being 5-B other than what physics would predict it would be.

Or what?

Nothing, just a personal pet peeve of mine.

Brotacho, city, half a city, one million cities do not compare in any way to 5-A, which is like Jupiter level of destruction. You can even say Moon for the matter - your arg wouldn't be affected.

Um, yeah, that is precisely what my point is. The explosion, one that you agree is stronger than the supposedly 5-B blast, only destroying half of Pentagram City is not even close whatsoever to being anywhere near Tier 5.

Wait... so you were using intent of real-life authors... only now to say that their intentions are unprovable? What?

And yes, if the animators were stupid to make incoherent scene, such as the one we are talking about, we can ignore it all together. Once again, if we go by your interpretation, Vox was going to attack them with something that barely destroyed a gate.

Nope, again, read what I just wrote above to see what my actual statement was. The writers would only be "stupid" assuming your premise is true, not if the yield of the blast wasn't actually 5-B.

Or maybe...the blast just wasn't 5-B? Did you stop to think about that? No, I at no point claimed it "barely" destroyed a gate, it definitely did much more than "barely" and better yet, the blast does indeed likely destroy a few buildings behind the gate. That was not the point. Destroying a city block or two in one-shot is absolutely an effefctive means of a threat, again, read my Alien invasion analogy above.

Sure, except it's not what's happening here.

No, it is. The story tells us the machine overload and exploding would not have fully destroyed Pentagram City, ergo its explosive yield being much greater than that is inconsistent with what the story shows us, just as the initial blast being 5-B inconsistent is inconsistent with the visuals and also the story, too. If the story contradicts the powerscaling, the scaling is flawed, it's as simple as that.

I know nothing of the former except for memes.

According to Robert Kirkman and Ryan Ottley, Invincible and Omni-Man would "destroy" Superman. This goes against what the story for those characters presents for their established and consistent power levels, just as the MoL being 5-B goes against what the story shows and tells us what its yield would actually be.

Right, this guy is so natural:

The power source is irrelevant, it's still ultimately a machine exploding. If you have a different proposal on how we should calculate an explosion that isn't caused by natural means like explosions in real life, go ahead and make a CRT proposing that. Plus, this would also directly go against what we literally just saw Lucifer's range extend to in the first place. In one scene his power can reach another planet, yet in another it only extends to half of a city?

What occam's razor? She never clarifies how it will be destroyed.

Which means we assume the most logical explanation with the least amonut of assumptions. Which would be that an explosion destroys it, just as her words imply. You're trying to claim that because she never specifies "how" half of PC would be destroyed, that means there's a possibility for subatomic destruction or whatever, which you would need to actually prove rather than just assuming. Also, there's literally a rule against using subatomic destruction unless specifically stated.

Even then, that's still not enough to take on the place that is bigger than Hell with its 100B inhabitants, so... Vox is still stupid either way.

Nothing says it isn't enough to intimidate them either, though. And if that "population" isn't actually 5-B like you claim or capable of surviving whatever yield the MoL is in the first place, the population and size is irrelevant. The entire point of the scene of him firing the first blast was primarily to intimidate Heaven by destroying the barrier, of which the aftermath leaving city blocks destroyed would be an effective tactic. Again, alien invasion analogy I talked about earlier.

Says who lmao? His Demon Form literally indicates his anger:

Again, being angry =/= bloodlusted, and these are two entirely different scenes. Vox had just mocked Lucifer about his wife leaving him as well as with the reminder that he can't do anything about his plans, something far more personal and skin-deep for Lucifer than Adam just being an asshole who messed with his daughter, having literally an entire musical number about it beforehand. Lucifer in his fight with Adam was grinning, making fun of Adam, and even in his demon form during that fight was still laughing and slapping around Adam while beating him up, not fully trying to instantly kill him, as is evident by Charlie saying "he's had enough", which implies Lucifer was only trying to beat Adam into unconsciousness at best.

We saw a large ahhh scar from Alastor that was still there throughout Season 2.

You mean the guy who supposedly scales equivalently to the person who made that scar, the guy who everyone tells Alastor he was no match for?

Those do not compare remotely.

Both Alastor and Adam, despite both being conscious and getting back up, were very seriously injured by Adam and Lucifer respectively in ways which would not make sense whatsoever if there was any form of comparability in strength between the two. It absolutely is comparable.

Staff never evaluated it tbf.

I find that hard to believe.

Thanks for proving my point!

I know this is sarcastic, but yeah, that was a typo. Being mad =/= not holding back. That was my point.

Except here General of Exorcists didn't merely survive, he endured MULTIPLE BLOODLUSTED PUNCHES. There is a bloody difference right there!

This count as "enduring" now?



Yeah man, and I guess Mark also scales to Omni-Man in this scene because he didn't die and was still talking after getting that beatdown.

 

[DaReaperMan]

No, it's not fine. Unless you want to give ******* everyone an "At most Low 7-C" since Vox, is not all that, he's still around Val and Velvette's power range, which is pretty ass.

You say this like from what you've said, you're gonna put them at 8-B. There's not even a 20x difference between the Low 7-C feat, which by the way is basically baseline, and 8-B+.

They died, and then they came back.

No. They didn't. He overthrew them, nobody saw them ever again, and only heard their screams in his broadcasts.

You definitely missed the point, we have NO IDEA how Vox took said casual Low 7-C, nothing.
Fact Alastor was so confident he thought he could take on people who are straight-up invincible to Vox, kinda shows that Vox is NOWHERE NEAR HIM.

The Low 7-C was a casual, effortless thing from Alastor he busted out on someone he didn't even know the name or details of.

If he died to it, see above. Alastor 100% radio broadcasts people who peeve him if they don't flee. And Vox was on the attack there.

 

[DaReaperMan]

In fact, there is a 13.57x difference between baseline Low 7-C and the 8-B+ Shok.wav calc.

 

[DeadlyMonarchChewstheDirt]

In fact, there is a 13.57x difference between baseline Low 7-C and the 8-B+ Shok.wav calc.

I'm confused, what are you arguing abt now?

 

[DaReaperMan]

I'm confused, what are you arguing abt now?

Don't worry about it!

 

[DeadlyMonarchChewstheDirt]

Don't worry about it!

AL still gonna be tier 7 anyway so IDRC about this crt. Aside from trying to downscale Lucifer, which is unfair as hell

 

[TheOrangeGuy09]

Just get staff here already, this is about to go 11+ pages again

 

[DeadlyMonarchChewstheDirt]

Just get staff here already, this is about to go 11+ pages again

Really hope they say nah, it would be REALLY funny

 

[Phsccarvalho]

Darksiders > Hellaverse

 

[DaReaperMan]

Just get staff here already, this is about to go 11+ pages again

Keep arguing until there's 40 pages

 

[Eden_Warlock99]

You say this like from what you've said, you're gonna put them at 8-B. There's not even a 20x difference between the Low 7-C feat, which by the way is basically baseline, and 8-B+.

That's for 100% Demon Form Vox. There's quite a MASSIVE difference between that and S1 Vox. Gigantic even.

No. They didn't. He overthrew them, nobody saw them ever again, and only heard their screams in his broadcasts.

Yeah, by ripping their souls or whatever, which he can't do to people he don't own.
That's why Alastor doesn't have Soul Manip on his page?

The Low 7-C was a casual, effortless thing from Alastor he busted out on someone he didn't even know the name or details of.

If he died to it, see above. Alastor 100% radio broadcasts people who peeve him if they don't flee. And Vox was on the attack there.

Like almost EVERYTHING Alastor does, even the tentacle that Sir Pentious survived. Weird, ain't it?

Also as much as Alastor denies it, they've been friends for years. Kinda a huge difference doing that to a rando and to someone like that.

Like please, the Overlords thought LUCIFER beat Alastor when they heard the news, they were surprised it was Vox, this is not someone who has gone toe-to-toe with Al lol

 

[StoneKillerz12]

Again, by your logic, would that mean a Tier 2 character that creates an explosion that doesn't bomb a Tier 2 structure deserve a rating far below Tier 2?

Like what I said to OrangeGuy, no, because the basis of that Tier 2's scaling is not based off of that explosion. In the case of that Tier 2, the explosion would be scaled to that level specifically because we have other pieces of evidence to scale that Tier 2 to Tier 2. It could also just not be a full power feat for the Tier 2 either. If you could prove it was, and someone survived it while also fighting that Tier 2, then that's just how scaling works.

It's not the same here because the basis for the Tier 5 scaling is specifically hingent upon itself; the kinetic energy of the blast being fired. If the Might of Lilith had previous concrete scaling outside of its biggest feat that provided evidence for it being Tier 5, then we wouldn't need to be talking about the visual contradictions. But when the scaling is specifically hingent upon something which violates KE guidelines (not simply AP =/= DC), it's very much safe to bring up that what we use to scale the blast is inconsistent with we measure its yield to be.

A good example would be Toei Imperfect Cell's self-destruct move, which is rated at High 3-A despite his normal AP being rated at 3-C. This is despite the fact that his self-destruction was only going to destroy Earth according to his own words. If the feat which most of Toei Dragon Ball hinged upon was that very self-destruction, then its yield being High 3-A would indeed go against what the scale of that specific feat is. But the reason it's rated at High 3-A is quite simple; it killed Goku. If we already had Tier 5 feats for Hazbin Hotel outside of the MoL, then the blast could be scaled there regardless because of it being able to kill characters who scale to those hypothetical previous Tier 5 feats.

 

[DeadlyMonarchChewstheDirt]

Keep arguing until there's 40 pages

I don't like cheese.

And Alastor is a Muppet who owns 149 sonic the hedged hogs in his basement that he keeps in his staff that acts as a plug when not in his hand