Skeleton Matchup (Sans vs Sese Kitsugai) (0-1-0)

[Steve1775]

Based on this old gem https://vsbattles.com/threads/sese-kitsugai-vs-sans.16957/

Sans is in his regular key
Sese would be in their EX key
Speed is Equalized
Match is in a wide forest

Distance is 10 meters from each other

OST Below



SANS:
SESE KITSUGAI: Poketmonsrs

INCON:

 

[Steve1775]

Bump

 

[God_of_perversion]

How does their soul absorption work? And are the force fields just a extra layer of defense or does it actually stop every attack and their effects?

 

[Steve1775]

How does their soul absorption work? And are the force fields just a extra layer of defense or does it actually stop every attack and their effects?

1. They see soul, they absorb the soul. It's not really a go to move either.
2. The force fields act like an extra layer of defense.

 

[Steve1775]

This video showcases the danmaku they do there.

 

[God_of_perversion]

1. They see soul, they absorb the soul. It's not really a go to move either.
2. The force fields act like an extra layer of defense.

Well ifit isn't a go to move sans might win because he always goes for the kill first move (gravity manip + dura neg) but if he can't kill Sese on his first attacks he might get tired from dodging like the thousands of bullets Sese would trow at him
Overall Sans would probably win more times because of dura negs and gravity manip would negate his flight and the fact Sese doesn't use his most deadly move in character

 

[Steve1775]

Well ifit isn't a go to move sans might win because he always goes for the kill first move (gravity manip + dura neg) but if he can't kill Sese on his first attacks he might get tired from dodging like the thousands of bullets Sese would trow at him
Overall Sans would probably win more times because of dura negs and gravity manip would negate his flight and the fact Sese doesn't use his most deadly move in character

Nah, Sese should be able to dodge sans danmaku, extremely easily, since their danmaku dodging skills scale to other protagonists that can dodge much harder stuff. Also Sese definitely isn't really locked to starting with the first spell card shown and they can start with any spell card i.e necropotence (one of the hardest spell card in the hole species).

 

[God_of_perversion]

Well Sans doesn't have the stamina to dodge all that and thats why i said Sans wincon is on his first move which Sese doesn't resist (also since Sese doesn't have a lifting strenght rating he would probably be pinned to the ground by blue magic) but if he manages to survive he will probably win after 1-2 minutes

This video showcases the danmaku they do there.

 

[Steve1775]

Well Sans doesn't have the stamina to dodge all that and thats why i said Sans wincon is on his first move which Sese doesn't resist (also since Sese doesn't have a lifting strenght rating he would probably be pinned to the ground by blue magic) but if he manages to survive he will probably win after 1-2 minutes

I watched the fight and you're right, the gravity does screw Sese but it's not like as if the gravity forces Sese down in the first attack, then there's also the fact that it's not impossible for Sese to dodge and attack at the same time as well.

 

[God_of_perversion]

Nah, Sese should be able to dodge sans danmaku, extremely easily, since their danmaku dodging skills scale to other protagonists that can dodge much harder stuff. Also Sese definitely isn't really locked to starting with the first spell card shown and they can start with any spell card i.e necropotence (one of the hardest spell card in the hole species).

I know he can dodge all of sans attacks like nothing the problem is that sans first attacks is the blue soul followed up by a bone zone,because of sans superior Ls Sese would be unable to move and die because of the dura negs

 

[Steve1775]

I know he can dodge all of sans attacks like nothing the problem is that sans first attacks is the blue soul followed up by a bone zone,because of sans superior Ls Sese would be unable to move and die because of the dura negs

Are you sure, that sans does that in the bone zone? I just thought that sans slams the player character down then follows up with the bone spikes but the player still has time to move up from said slamming down before they get impaled. Also, Sese technically has a sort of defense mechanism with Necropotence where they can fire a free flashbombs attack that spreads the entire screen

 

[Steve1775]

This video shows the necropotence stuff in action at 1:00

 

[God_of_perversion]

Are you sure, that sans does that in the bone zone? I just thought that sans slams the player character down then follows up with the bone spikes but the player still has time to move up from said slamming down before they get impaled. Also, Sese technically has a sort of defense mechanism with Necropotence where they can fire a free flashbombs attack that spreads the entire screen

The reason why frisk isn't pinned down by Sans is because they scale to his Ls,i heard flash bomb is AoE powernull so that probably saves him against sans first move and if he pulls out Necropotence Sese wins,overall both of them can win so this might be inconclusive

 

[God_of_perversion]

Also you should post this on the general tread

 

[ShionAH]

Sans danmaku is so powerful that extremely experienced people who can literally reset to MEMORIZE ALL HIS ATTACKS died to him way over a dozen times AT THE VERY LEAST.

If she has no experience with gravity then I doubt she'd adapt to it before she dies.

 

[Steve1775]

The reason why frisk isn't pinned down by Sans is because they scale to his Ls,i heard flash bomb is AoE powernull so that probably saves him against sans first move and if he pulls out Necropotence Sese wins,overall both of them can win so this might be inconclusive

Not really AoE, just only Sese that has one that spreads the entire screen

 

[Steve1775]

Also you should post this on the general tread

Wdym by that

 

[Steve1775]

Sans danmaku is so powerful that extremely experienced people who can literally reset to MEMORIZE ALL HIS ATTACKS died to him way over a dozen times AT THE VERY LEAST.

If she has no experience with gravity then I doubt she'd adapt to it before she dies.

Idk man, I kinda just think that undertale characters are just not really experienced with bullshit danmaku. It's also worth noting that even characters like Suzumi who also can time travel as well, can also die to Sese as well.

 

[God_of_perversion]

post the match on the general discussion tread

Wdym by that

 

[ShionAH]

Idk man, I kinda just think that undertale characters are just not really experienced with bullshit danmaku.

I mean thats kinda how they fight in basically every fight, wdym though??

It's also worth noting that even characters like Suzumi who also can time travel as well, can also die to Sese as well.

How many times? Sans has Frisk dying over a dozen of times and Flowey dies so much he is traumatized by the battle.

 

[God_of_perversion]

Sans danmaku is so powerful that extremely experienced people who can literally reset to MEMORIZE ALL HIS ATTACKS died to him way over a dozen times AT THE VERY LEAST.

If she has no experience with gravity then I doubt she'd adapt to it before she dies.

Sans is very skilled don't get me wrong but his danmaku can't be compared to those from bullet hell games

 

[ShionAH]

Sans is very skilled don't get me wrong but his danmaku can't be compared to those from bullet hell games

Idk if thats how we... compare stuff I mean yeah those do seem harder to us but that doesn't mean they are harder in like a canonical power scaling argument? Even then Sans fight is easily in the Top 10 videogame bosses just by the virtue of how it doesnt allow any mistake and has so many surprise at first playthrough

 

[StrymULTRA]

Even then Sans fight is easily in the Top 10 videogame bosses just by the virtue of how it doesnt allow any mistake and has so many surprise at first playthrough

Get the Sans fight get past any of the LOLK levels before saying this.

 

[StrymULTRA]

I mean thats kinda how they fight in basically every fight, wdym though??

Undertale/Deltarune Danmaku is generally mid, though.

The only ones who are "hard" are Sans, Undyne the Undying, Omega Flowey, Asriel GoHD, (maybe) Asgore, and then the DR secret bosses.

Anyone else is just objectively mid and was never something I struggled with even when I sucked at the game, and comparing them to actual Bullet Hell games like Len'en or Touhou is going to make you laughed at no matter what in any videogame discussion, especially given that Undertale/Deltarune's difficulty is definitely more tampered from being able to use healing items, something you can't really do there.

(Trust me to clear EoSD with no continues for the first time it took me 6 months of attempts, Sans took me just a weekend)

Sans danmaku is so powerful that extremely experienced people who can literally reset to MEMORIZE ALL HIS ATTACKS died to him way over a dozen times AT THE VERY LEAST.

Wasn't this debunked in the Susie matchup tho-

 

[Steve1775]

Also, its worth noting that Sese in this state has absorbed more than 1000 souls, so they can likely use that as a sort of defense against sans attacks

 

[Steve1775]

Undertale/Deltarune Danmaku is generally mid, though.

The only ones who are "hard" are Sans, Undyne the Undying, Omega Flowey, Asriel GoHD, (maybe) Asgore, and then the DR secret bosses.

Anyone else is just objectively mid and was never something I struggled with even when I sucked at the game, and comparing them to actual Bullet Hell games like Len'en or Touhou is going to make you laughed at no matter what in any videogame discussion, especially given that Undertale/Deltarune's difficulty is definitely more tampered from being able to use healing items, something you can't really do there.

(Trust me to clear EoSD with no continues for the first time it took me 6 months of attempts, Sans took me just a weekend)

Wasn't this debunked in the Susie matchup tho-

Fun fact about Len'en is that you can actually heal your health there, it's just the blatant bullshit that occurs at ABeX means you have to always max out the entire game to play that mode

 

[ShionAH]

The only ones who are "hard" are Sans, Undyne the Undying, Omega Flowey, Asriel GoHD, (maybe) Asgore, and then the DR secret bosses.

I mean you basically count every single relevant top tier in the verse so my point does stand as Undertale having hard danmaku. That’s like 9 characters…

(Trust me to clear EoSD with no continues for the first time it took me 6 months of attempts, Sans took me just a weekend)

Skill issue ngl

Wasn't this debunked in the Susie matchup tho-

No it wasn’t? You just said it’s not canon because there are lines of no hitting as if thats the consistent event when its clear it’s not. Besides if DR verse can use statements like the Knight one to say Susie is a combat god (complete bs btw) then I can very certainly say Sans is just a hard boss LIKE HOW HE IS ALWAYS POTRAYED LIKE…

For the souls thing, Idk if that would make them like resistant to KARMA

 

[StrymULTRA]

Also, its worth noting that Sese in this state has absorbed more than 1000 souls, so they can likely use that as a sort of defense against sans attacks

Not really, Sans' KR affected the soulless Flowey and this allowed him to circumvent resistances to SOUL hax. KR affects both body and soul equally.

 

[Steve1775]

How many times? Sans has Frisk dying over a dozen of times and Flowey dies so much he is traumatized by the battle.

Not really much since Suzumi is already skilled in the context of the series

 

[Steve1775]

Not really, Sans' KR affected the soulless Flowey and this allowed him to circumvent resistances to SOUL hax. KR affects both body and soul equally.

Huh, that's interesting. Well, Sese best option is danmaku spam and necropotence

 

[StrymULTRA]

Skill issue ngl

Ok lil Shion, send me RIGHT NOW a replay of any Touhou in Lunatic difficulty with YOUR NAME and with ways we know you didn't use any TAS.

No it wasn’t? You just said it’s not canon because there are lines of no hitting as if thats the consistent event when its clear it’s not. Besides if DR verse can use statements like the Knight one to say Susie is a combat god (complete bs btw) then I can very certainly say Sans is just a hard boss LIKE HOW HE IS ALWAYS POTRAYED LIKE…

Considering that Frisk can also clear the game without dying once, as everything relies on Player's skill, why are you

And yeah, portrayal does not matter considering that Undertale has not a real canon, Frisk can clear the game without SAVEs just like they can die over and over to Napstablook just like they can always drop the genocide at Papyrus. It's all up to you, there's no reinforced "shit must have done this way" like you're making it to be.

 

[StrymULTRA]

Huh, that's interesting. Well, Sese best option is danmaku spam and necropotence

It depends, what stops Sans from teleporting here?

 

[ShionAH]

Ok lil Shion, send me RIGHT NOW a replay of any Touhou in Lunatic difficulty with YOUR NAME and with ways we know you didn't use any TAS.

Ez

Considering that Frisk can also clear the game without dying once, as everything relies on Player's skill, why are you

And yeah, portrayal does not matter considering that Undertale has not a real canon, Frisk can clear the game without SAVEs just like they can die over and over to Napstablook just like they can always drop the genocide at Papyrus. It's all up to you, there's no reinforced "shit must have done this way" like you're making it to be.

You can't say that bullshit to Flowey who happens to find Sans EXTREMELY TROUBLESOME. So tell me Strym whats more consistent? Sans being hard (killed someone as skilled as Frisk enough to traumatize them) or Frisk being a combat god that no hits everything (there are SO many lines that happen when you save and reset AND Sans sees the timelines jumping and stopping meaning saves and resets ARE used)

You got ANY canonical proof that Frisk would be able to no hit Sans? I have a potrayal of him absolutely whooping someone comparable to Frisk AND a dozen of statements that happen with EACH RESET!

 

[StrymULTRA]

Ez

Bro used time stop and then time traveled I'm dead.

You can't say that bullshit to Flowey who happens to find Sans EXTREMELY TROUBLESOME.

Flowey isn't us.

So tell me Strym whats more consistent? Sans being hard (killed someone as skilled as Frisk enough to traumatize them) or Frisk being a combat god that no hits everything (there are SO many lines that happen when you save and reset AND Sans sees the timelines jumping and stopping meaning saves and resets ARE used)

Definitely the latter, it's in their possible feats so why not using it? It all depends on the Player's skill, who is someone canon after all.

You got ANY canonical proof that Frisk would be able to no hit Sans?

The Player's existence.

I have a potrayal of him absolutely whooping someone comparable to Frisk

Prove me that Flowey is comparable to Frisk.

AND a dozen of statements that happen with EACH RESET!

Omega Flowey has also dialogues if you die, yet the Neutral route has dialogues if you never die or use SAVEs, so I don't think these statements matter much.

 

[Poketmonsrs]

I’ll vote Sese on account of their danmaku, and that Sans has lost to a having a ridiculous amount of thing thrown at him before

 

[StrymULTRA]

I’ll vote Sese on account of their danmaku, and that Sans has lost to a having a ridiculous amount of thing thrown at him before

Sans also lost to DBZ Broly due to AoE spam too...

 

[God_of_perversion]

Thinking about it Sans can teleport and has combat applicable 4th wall break (which used to be law manip but it was removed,it should be lowkey re added again because rouxls kinda proves that the battle system is a law) so he probably wins most times

 

[Poketmonsrs]

Sans also lost to DBZ Broly due to AoE spam too...

Damn. Sans can’t handle spam, be it Broly, Annoying Orange, Jevil or even Sese

 

[StrymULTRA]

Damn. Sans can’t handle spam, be it Broly, Annoying Orange, Jevil or even Sese

Ness also stomped Sans back then thanks to AoE too lol.

 

[Poketmonsrs]

Ness also stomped Sans back then thanks to AoE too lol.

It is not looking good for the man