Mirio Togata (Lemillion) Vs Ken Kaneki (My Hero Academia Vs Tokyo Ghoul) [9-7-0]

[CastoriceTheFifth]

Love how this fight shows how strong the permeation quirk is

because in this fight he was practically half nerfed by how everything Toji does bypasses permeation

Mirio Togata (Lemillion) Vs Toji Fushiguro (MHA Vs Jujutsu Kaisen) [8-8-2] GRACE

Mirio Togata Vs Toji Fushiguro Shie Hassaikai Arc Lemillion will be used Attack Potency: 711.97 Tons of TNT Durability: 711.97 Tons of TNT Lifting Strength: Class K Toji Fushiguro Attack Potency: Multi City Block (Can someone verify his value) Durability: Multi City Block Lifting Strength...

vsbattles.com

 

[Arkenis]

Love how this fight shows how strong the permeation quirk is

because in this fight he was practically half nerfed by how everything Toji does bypasses permeation

Mirio Togata (Lemillion) Vs Toji Fushiguro (MHA Vs Jujutsu Kaisen) [8-8-2] GRACE

Mirio Togata Vs Toji Fushiguro Shie Hassaikai Arc Lemillion will be used Attack Potency: 711.97 Tons of TNT Durability: 711.97 Tons of TNT Lifting Strength: Class K Toji Fushiguro Attack Potency: Multi City Block (Can someone verify his value) Durability: Multi City Block Lifting Strength...

vsbattles.com

How that went incon is mind blowing, did people just ignore the SSK hitting the soul?

 

[CastoriceTheFifth]

How that went incon is mind blowing, did people just ignore the SSK hitting the soul?

Oh no we all knew SSK hits the soul. The match was peak though.

 

[LaserPrecision]

Kaneki's profile is kind of hard to understand. I think it's just lacking information (outdated), so correct me if my assumptions are wrong. But Kaneki should have perception amplification when activating his Kagune, allowing him to slow down time from his perspective giving him more time to think and strategize. In addition to analytical prediction of his own.

I think after taking a beating from Mirio for an extended period of time (Which he has the stamina, regeneration, and Durability advantage to perform), he will start understanding Mirio's hit and run tactics, and instead take a more defensive approach. Instead of trying to land strikes on Mirio, he will try defending, and evading Mirio, and once he lets his guard down, and is very close and in range to strike Kaneki, he will use his kagune in the brief period he is tangible to grievously wound Mirio with a stab. From there he's on a timer since he doesn't have regeneration, and even if he did, Ghoul's poison prevent regeneration. Kaneki can repeat this plan and wait until Mirio is tangible and too close to evade to strike, but really after the first time he'd be good since Lemillion would be critically injured and start running low on gas quickly.

Again, correct me if I'm wrong on anything, because both profiles seem pretty bare and outdated.

 

[Arkenis]

But Kaneki should have perception amplification when activating his Kagune, allowing him to slow down time from his perspective giving him more time to think and strategize.

Looking at the full context, Kaya ends up losing even with it. I doubt it'll be useful here.

In addition to analytical prediction of his own.

This was against someone he already fought prior, and he can predict wrong considering he's never fought Mirio and Mirio has his own prediction where Overhaul couldn't touch him for 5mins.

he will start understanding Mirio's hit and run tactics, and instead take a more defensive approach. Instead of trying to land strikes on Mirio, he will try defending, and evading Mirio, and once he lets his guard down, and is very close and in range to strike Kaneki, he will use his kagune in the brief period he is tangible to grievously wound Mirio with a stab.

I see this being unlikely but possible since Mirio would also anticipate something like this.

Again, correct me if I'm wrong on anything, because both profiles seem pretty bare and outdated.

Yeah they are. At least ik this is outdated for Mirio, permeation movements make it seem like he's warping around but he's just being repelled really fast. This should be a speed amp I believe.

 

[CastoriceTheFifth]

Yeah they are. At least ik this is outdated for Mirio, permeation movements make it seem like he's warping around but he's just being repelled really fast. This should be a speed amp I believe.

Permeation is treated as a speed amp already pretty sure

High Hypersonic with Permeation (With the use of this Quirk, Lemillion is able to launch himself from walls and the ground at high speeds, which allowed him to outpace the majority of Class 1-A in 6 seconds, including 8% Deku and Ingenium)

 

[Arkenis]

But that should probably say higher no? idk but still it's something I don't think was brought up here?

 

[CastoriceTheFifth]

These mha characters giving Kaneki the work damn.

 

[LaserPrecision]

Looking at the full context, Kaya ends up losing even with it. I doubt it'll be useful here.

Link doesn't work. But I don't know how some other completely different character losing with it against a completely different opponent means it won't be useful against any opponent. I don't think it makes a huge difference, but it should make precise timing easier, such as striking at the "perfect" moment when Lemillion is vulnerable to harm.

This was against someone he already fought prior, and he can predict wrong considering he's never fought Mirio and Mirio has his own prediction where Overhaul couldn't touch him for 5mins.

Yes. This is why I mentioned after taking a beating for a while, he will come to learn Mirio's style. Not instantly know how he fights. He has the durability, endurance, stamina, and regeneration to last long enough to start understanding methinks.

I see this being unlikely but possible since Mirio would also anticipate something like this.

This seems like something distinct from what I described. Izuku predicted where Mirio would pop up, and struck in advance (and failed). I'm not suggesting he does that, but rather wait until Mirio's fist is within an inch of striking Kaneki (Which he should be able to time due to his increased perception of time), and then strike him with his Kagune then. He may be hit himself, but that won't matter since it allows Kaneki to land a devastating single attack. Which is really all he needs. Deku didn't wait for Mirio to get in close for a strike like I suggested.

I don't think Kaneki wins this due to each of these individual traits, but the culmination of all of them. The stamina to persist for a long time, his ability to learn and predict Mirio, his enhanced perception of time allowing for precision timing and judgement, and his Kagune which can make precise movements and adjustments and be ejected from Kaneki's body at any moment. Plus his general combat intelligence.

If Kaneki didn't have the endurance to last, I would give it to Mirio, but all Kaneki needs is a single strike and he's won. From there he can just play keep away, and pressure Mirio to take riskier moves as he bleeds out and slowly succumbs to his injury. Which would only open up more wiggle room for Kaneki to land more strikes (Not that he'd need to, but it would accelerate his win).

 

[Arkenis]

Link doesn't work. But I don't know how some other completely different character losing with it against a completely different opponent means it won't be useful against any opponent. I don't think it makes a huge difference, but it should make precise timing easier, such as striking at the "perfect" moment when Lemillion is vulnerable to harm.

That's not it, its because she lost through them still reacting to her movements, movements which should be better.

This seems like something distinct from what I described. Izuku predicted where Mirio would pop up, and struck in advance (and failed). I'm not suggesting he does that, but rather wait until Mirio's fist is within an inch of striking Kaneki (Which he should be able to time due to his increased perception of time), and then strike him with his Kagune then. He may be hit himself, but that won't matter since it allows Kaneki to land a devastating single attack. Which is really all he needs. Deku didn't wait for Mirio to get in close for a strike like I suggested.

It's not different in concept. It's Mirio setting up a counter to Deku's counter the same thing you're describing Kaneki attempting by waiting for Mirio to be close and countering with an attack, something Mirio predicts people to do when figuring out his permeation.

If Kaneki didn't have the endurance to last, I would give it to Mirio, but all Kaneki needs is a single strike and he's won. From there he can just play keep away, and pressure Mirio to take riskier moves as he bleeds out and slowly succumbs to his injury. Which would only open up more wiggle room for Kaneki to land more strikes (Not that he'd need to, but it would accelerate his win).

That sounds impossible given most of the characters in MHA can't do this and the guy positions himself while deaf and blind in combat all the time.

 

[LaserPrecision]

That's not it, its because she lost through them still reacting to her movements, movements which should be better.

Well yeah, it increases her perception speed. Not her movement speed. The profile lists it as perception amplification, not statistic amplification.

It's not different in concept. It's Mirio setting up a counter to Deku's counter the same thing you're describing Kaneki attempting by waiting for Mirio to be close and countering with an attack, something Mirio predicts people to do when figuring out his permeation.

The difference is that Mirio would have significantly less room, and thus time to react when he's an inch away from Kaneki, and about to land a hit, and is struck at nearly exactly the same time he lands his own blow. Versus against Deku where he had plenty of distance to react, and thus turn intangible, and wasn't already in the middle of (committed to) an attack. It's not impossible Mirio can react, but I doubt he can do it flawlessly forever against Kaneki.

That sounds impossible given most of the characters in MHA can't do this and the guy positions himself while deaf and blind in combat all the time.

It's not hard to position himself when he can see where the enemy is before going intangible and falling into the ground. He would need to account for movement, sure, but it's not something insane or impossible to do. It also doesn't have anything to do with his evasive skill, in fact, it bolsters his offensive skill.

I think Mirio can evade a lot (most) of Kaneki's attacks. Just not convinced he won't be hit a single time. Kaneki has a lot going for him that should enable him to eventually land the strike he needs to win against Mirio in a prolonged fight. Mirio has had close calls and actually been tagged in canon even if it's a rare occurrence. It's not like he has some crazy precog or anything where he can see into the future to aid his intangibility. He just makes good predictions. But if he's physically too close and doesn't have the time to see or react to the attack coming, he will be hit. Any attack Kaneki throws at a distance Mirio will be able to react, I agree. But once Ken learns Mirio's style, he'll switch things up to where he doesn't have the time to react and strike him when he's at his most vulnerable in a tight time frame thanks to his enhanced perception speed.

 

[Arkenis]

Well yeah, it increases her perception speed. Not her movement speed. The profile lists it as perception amplification, not statistic amplification.

Movements being better as in better time to make them not faster.

The difference is that Mirio would have significantly less room, and thus time to react when he's an inch away from Kaneki, and about to land a hit, and is struck at nearly exactly the same time he lands his own blow. Versus against Deku where he had plenty of distance to react, and thus turn intangible, and wasn't already in the middle of (committed to) an attack. It's not impossible Mirio can react, but I doubt he can do it flawlessly forever against Kaneki.

Don't see why not if he can essentially teleport around the place.

It's not hard to position himself when he can see where the enemy is before going intangible and falling into the ground. He would need to account for movement, sure, but it's not something insane or impossible to do. It also doesn't have anything to do with his evasive skill, in fact, it bolsters his offensive skill.

People move in combat and are making their own decisions yet he's moving almost flawlessly around them. It definitely is insane, no human can lose all their senses and maneuver themselves around other superhumans at high speed who are predicting your moves as well. His ability is highly recognized for its evasive ability in the manga, unless I'm missing something that says otherwise.

 

[LaserPrecision]

Movements being better as in better time to make them not faster.

Ah, mb. Either way, I didn't see the enhanced perception as some infallible boost. Just something complementary to their win-con.

Don't see why not if he can essentially teleport around the place.

Except he can't actually teleport. He can phase if he has time to notice and react to an attack.

People move in combat and are making their own decisions yet he's moving almost flawlessly around them. It definitely is insane, no human can lose all their senses and maneuver themselves around other superhumans at high speed who are predicting your moves as well. His ability is highly recognized for its evasive ability in the manga, unless I'm missing something that says otherwise.

Saying high-speed is disingenuous when they're all relative to one another. He's not doing it against people several times or many times faster than him. For him, everyone is moving at normal human speed. On its own it's not impressive, as a whole, sure. You can maneuver as well without sight or hearing. I can cover my eyes and plug my ears and navigate my house quite well because I'm familiar with the layout. It's called memorization. Something Mirio does, and it's only for brief moments btw. The process is; He sees his opponent, sinks underground, and angles himself to shoot out where the person was standing before he fell. He's just good at reliably memorizing and ejecting himself out where the opponent was when he COULD see them.

Again, I think he evades most of Kaneki's attacks. I think he does get tagged at least once throughout what will be a very prolonged fight, which is all Kaneki needs to win.

 

[CastoriceTheFifth]

This match is basically extreme diff for both sides or an incon match

 

[NikHelton]

Looking at the full context, Kaya ends up losing even with it. I doubt it'll be useful here.

Let's not overlook the investigators' dynamic vision, which they develop specifically against ghouls. And let's not ignore the fact that she was wounded and exhausted.

This was against someone he already fought prior, and he can predict wrong considering he's never fought Mirio and Mirio has his own prediction where Overhaul couldn't touch him for 5mins.

If the fight drags on for a while, Kaneki simply begins to adapt and read Lemillion's movements right during the fight.

Да, так и есть. По крайней мере, для Мирио это устарело: проникающие движения создают впечатление, будто он искажается, но на самом деле он просто очень быстро отталкивается. Думаю, это должно быть усилителем скорости.

Kakuja's speed increases significantly. Also consider AD.

 

[CastoriceTheFifth]

Let's not overlook the investigators' dynamic vision, which they develop specifically against ghouls. And let's not ignore the fact that she was wounded and exhausted.

If the fight drags on for a while, Kaneki simply begins to adapt and read Lemillion's movements right during the fight.

Kakuja's speed increases significantly. Also consider AD.

How does AD work if anything higher than 8-A is restricted? I did that because all Lemillion could really do is punch and kick.

 

[LaserPrecision]

How does AD work if anything higher than 8-A is restricted? I did that because all Lemillion could really do is punch and kick.

IIRC AD can still be used to boost them to any value within the same tier. They just can't go a tier up if it's restricted. Could be misremembering, but I believe that's how it works.

 

[NikHelton]

How does AD work if anything higher than 8-A is restricted? I did that because all Lemillion could really do is punch and kick.

Scaling within the same tier.

If both characters scale to 999 tons, but one does so directly through their own feat, while the other receives a long scaling chain from one-shots of 999 tons characters, the second character will have a significant AP advantage, even though they seem to have reached the 8-A cap.

 

[Doggo]

This is so close holyyyy

Personally voting Ken. Laser's arguments are very strong imo

 

[Foriaa]

Voting Kaneki as well.

 

[MyriadOfHeartsSpiritualFlowerGarden]

Voting lemillion fellas

 

[NikHelton]

IIRC AD can still be used to boost them to any value within the same tier. They just can't go a tier up if it's restricted. Could be misremembering, but I believe that's how it works.

Are you voting for Ken?

 

[NikHelton]

I'm changing my voice to Kaneki. Laser convinced me.

 

[LegendariumOfLies]

Voting Kaneki FRA, but someone should do a Tokyo Ghoul skill page. Really getting annoying with people saying TG Chars have no skill

 

[Arkansalter2]

Theres a weakness that is often overlooked.
Lemillion cannot spam it as he cannot breathe while intangible. And well... Lemillion is just gonna be butt-ass naked.

 

[NikHelton]

Voting Kaneki FRA, but someone should do a Tokyo Ghoul skill page. Really getting annoying with people saying TG Chars have no skill

Arkenis is just tired of Kaneki. I can't remember the last time he voted for him, lol.

 

[CastoriceTheFifth]

Theres a weakness that is often overlooked.
Lemillion cannot spam it as he cannot breathe while intangible. And well... Lemillion is just gonna be butt-ass naked.

Lemillion being unable to breathe while intangible isn’t overlooked. He never gets pushed into a situation where he’s pulling a guldo gasping for air. He always breathes when he’s not in permeation, which is basically to attack.

Arkenis is just tired of Kaneki. I can't remember the last time he voted for him, lol.

Did Arkenis vote?

 

[Kavopaco]

Number One hero fra

 

[NikHelton]

These mha characters giving Kaneki the work damn.

Change my vote for Kaneki

 

[NikHelton]

Link doesn't work. But I don't know how some other completely different character losing with it against a completely different opponent means it won't be useful against any opponent. I don't think it makes a huge difference, but it should make precise timing easier, such as striking at the "perfect" moment when Lemillion is vulnerable to harm.

Yes. This is why I mentioned after taking a beating for a while, he will come to learn Mirio's style. Not instantly know how he fights. He has the durability, endurance, stamina, and regeneration to last long enough to start understanding methinks.

This seems like something distinct from what I described. Izuku predicted where Mirio would pop up, and struck in advance (and failed). I'm not suggesting he does that, but rather wait until Mirio's fist is within an inch of striking Kaneki (Which he should be able to time due to his increased perception of time), and then strike him with his Kagune then. He may be hit himself, but that won't matter since it allows Kaneki to land a devastating single attack. Which is really all he needs. Deku didn't wait for Mirio to get in close for a strike like I suggested.

I don't think Kaneki wins this due to each of these individual traits, but the culmination of all of them. The stamina to persist for a long time, his ability to learn and predict Mirio, his enhanced perception of time allowing for precision timing and judgement, and his Kagune which can make precise movements and adjustments and be ejected from Kaneki's body at any moment. Plus his general combat intelligence.

If Kaneki didn't have the endurance to last, I would give it to Mirio, but all Kaneki needs is a single strike and he's won. From there he can just play keep away, and pressure Mirio to take riskier moves as he bleeds out and slowly succumbs to his injury. Which would only open up more wiggle room for Kaneki to land more strikes (Not that he'd need to, but it would accelerate his win).

Incidentally, Kaneki's jaw is powerful enough to eat kagune, and he has an insane pain threshold. He can essentially bite off an opponent's fist during a punch.

 

[DarthSorox]

Theres a weakness that is often overlooked.
Lemillion cannot spam it as he cannot breathe while intangible. And well... Lemillion is just gonna be butt-ass naked.

Kaneki, in turn, has excellent instinctive reactions and, thanks to accelerated perception and regeneration, will be able to guess the right moment to strike

 

[Delusionaltx2]

Lemillion has no way to get around regen

Does he even have wincons?

 

[NikHelton]

Lemillion has no way to get around regen

Does he even have wincons?

Fight for hours until Kaneki gets tired. However, Kaneki simply adapts to his fighting style and catches him.

 

[Delusionaltx2]

Fight for hours until Kaneki gets tired. However, Kaneki simply adapts to his fighting style and catches him.

hmm, alright

kaneki FRA

 

[Epiccheev]

Eyepatch Ghoul FRA

 

[Arkansalter2]

How is Kaneki able to hit Lemillion again? No NPI?

 

[NikHelton]

How is Kaneki able to hit Lemillion again? No NPI?

He adapts to his fighting style and strikes Lemillion with his kagune when he least expects it. His superior reaction and acceleration from AD will allow him to seize the initiative. He might even bite off his arm when he takes the blow to his face.

 

[JoeDM021]

Mirio FRA

 

[Arkansalter2]

He adapts to his fighting style and strikes Lemillion with his kagune when he least expects it

Ok but how is he supposed to hit lemillion. My question wasn't answered.

 

[NikHelton]

Mirko FRA

She's not even participating in this match