Mori Dan upgrade - I don't know what I'm doing edition

[Vietthai96]

I will take a look at this thread later after i finish some of my works,

But from the ongoing debate between supporters and oppositions, Berny and MGQ have better reasoning and counterarguments. David was too focus on surface level meaning of word and still not provide the reason to counter the anti-feat where characters can ascend from the suppose non 1-A state to 1-A without external factor

 

[Thermor]

I agree with MGQ btw. I don’t really see enough evidence that indicates a 1-A level.

Claims about abandoning the physical body and becoming abstract existences are quite good, but I don’t find them sufficient in this case.

Also, how did Mori, as a being who isn’t 1-A, manage to ascend to a 1-A plane? It isn’t clearly explained in the OP’s post; I’m assuming it’s due to Karma, but Karma doesn’t seem to be 1-A in itself (in fact, it’s stated explicitly that Karma has no influence on Nirvana). That’s a problem for the scaling. For the character to ascend to a 1-A plane, they need a 1-A system that allows their ascension in the first place.

It could honestly be 5D if those tablets are continuous space-times. Which would be consistent with the statement that Nirvana is a higher dimension.

Could I know about the source where trancending to a 1A plane without help is an antifeat? From learning about the site, only applies to R>F.

 

[Shar122]

Could I know about the source where trancending to a 1A plane without help is an antifeat? From learning about the site, only applies to R>F.

here

 

[DavidTPPM]

I will take a look at this thread later after i finish some of my works,

But from the ongoing debate between supporters and oppositions, Berny and MGQ have better reasoning and counterarguments. David was too focus on surface level meaning of word

Wdym by surface level meaning? MGQs entire argument was to completely dismiss the blatant differentiation between "universes" and "all of existence" and act like they're one and the same.
If anything I'd say all I've been doing is proving a deeper meaning through context and definitions while MGQ was trying to force a very surface level meaning despite all the counter evidence and the grammatical nonsense it would turn the statement into.

and still not provide the reason to counter the anti-feat where characters can ascend from the suppose non 1-A state to 1-A without external factor

I did here.

"This place can only be reachable by those who have attained Nirvana"
"It [paradise] is the place where those who have reached Nirvana arrive"

It's due to Nirvana which itself has an unknown connection to paradise.

It's not an anti feat to begin with as the ascending is only allowed by attaining Nirvana which has some unspecified connection to Paradise as after Mori ascended Paradise basically sucked him up on its own. Meaning bases on what we see the 1-A external factor here should be paradise. I would even say this falls well into what the FAQ says here

This can happen either by a straightforward power boost, or by means of some innate metaphysical potential rooted in something from a higher reality

Mori fulfills his innate metaphysical potential (attain Nirvana) which is in some way rooted in the higher reality (paradise) as it then on its own basically forces him to ascend.

 

[ShroobWasTaken]

That's it. Also, there isn't any reason for Paradise to be 1-A in itself, it is a non physical plane disconnected from the physical plane, no statement of it being more real than the universe or being a void or platonic realm

It doesn't require to be stated as "more real" or "a void" or "platonic" to be considered Outerversal/BDE Type 3. It needs to be beyond physical composition such that it is unreachable by the lower state of existence (as a tl;dr version of it). We outlined that Paradise/Buddha's should possess this and that the realm is unreachable by the lower state of existence and requires one to attain Nirvana for the opportunity to ascend.

 

[ShroobWasTaken]

The current problem had is that Mori needs an external factor to ascend, this has been pointed out by David numerous times as the thing that allows Mori to ascend is Nirvana. There's a direct connection between the two as the attainment of Nirvana is what leads to ascension at all and it's made even more convincing by the fact Mori himself was basically forced into Paradise shortly after reaching Nirvana.

We have the scaling for the higher plane and we have the external force that allows one to reach said higher plane.

 

[CasperSenar]

Other than Mori, who's gonna be outer?

 

[DavidTPPM]

Other than Mori, who's gonna be outer?

Nobody, only post-ascended Mori

 

[Jaynic1]

bump

 

[Black-san112]

BUMP

 

[DavidTPPM]

Sorry I haven't been bumping my thread much recently but Silksong has been kicking my ass and taking up all my the time I'd normally spend here .

That being said I did ask a handful of staff members to give their input so I think it's best we wait for that

 

[PowerToScale]

Basing on the replies, if this is a CRT that involves tier 1 stuff you would need staff approval.

I'm not knowledgeable enough to give a concrete opinion.

Following

 

[ShroobWasTaken]

Bump

 

[Robo432343]

i agree with Low 1-C

 

[Jaynic1]

bump

 

[ShroobWasTaken]

bump

 

[Jaynic1]

bump

 

[ShroobWasTaken]

Bump

 

[ShroobWasTaken]

Bump

 

[ShroobWasTaken]

bump

 

[Saqphire]

Reading the sandbox, scans and thread. I agree with this thread

I don't have much knowledge on GoH itself but I feel like the people opposing this CRT aren't actually comprehending what the supporters are trying to say but here's what I gathered.

1. Paradise is a realm that sees space and time in general as nothing more than flat screens, seeing it as superior to it + it's beyond physical limitations (thus beyond material composition). This means Paradise itself cannot simply be 5D as that not only contradicts the premise that it is considered superior to space-time in general, it would also contradict the statement of being free of physical limits
2. To reach it, you must reach Nirvana, which is admittedly not explained in detail in GoH but is heavily implied to be something with a 1-A property like innate potential or power
3. Everything mentioned in point 1 and 2 would grant BDE type 3 via following it's prerequisites to a tee

Also, I feel like the people bringing up Sanzang as an anti-feat for the CRT are making a weak argument, cause it seems pretty clear from the way Mori reached Nirvana, she too, reached Nirvana. That is what is brought up as a justification for her own profile even.

 

[ThyNotAskQuestions]

Reading the sandbox, scans and thread. I agree with this thread

I don't have much knowledge on GoH itself but I feel like the people opposing this CRT aren't actually comprehending what the supporters are trying to say but here's what I gathered.

1. Paradise is a realm that sees space and time in general as nothing more than flat screens, seeing it as superior to it + it's beyond physical limitations (thus beyond material composition). This means Paradise itself cannot simply be 5D as that not only contradicts the premise that it is considered superior to space-time in general, it would also contradict the statement of being free of physical limits
2. To reach it, you must reach Nirvana, which is admittedly not explained in detail in GoH but is heavily implied to be something with a 1-A property like innate potential or power
3. Everything mentioned in point 1 and 2 would grant BDE type 3 via following it's prerequisites to a tee

Also, I feel like the people bringing up Sanzang as an anti-feat for the CRT are making a weak argument, cause it seems pretty clear from the way Mori reached Nirvana, she too, reached Nirvana. That is what is brought up as a justification for her own profile even.

Yeah, after reading the CRT and arguments, I'm leaning towards agreeing that Mori Jin is 1-A. It could also be Possibly 1-A, since the series itself didn't really provide more explanations as to how Nirvana works, which made this discussion go back in circles to proving why Nirvana is 1-A, but it has always been stated in the series that Nirvana is the factor to achieving it.

 

[Balancefr]

Nirvana has always been a pretty hard topic to address so I made a sandbox which explains it. While making it I realized that it seems like Mori might qualify for BDE type 3 and so I discussed it with few people and went on to write it all down here:

DavidTPPM/brainrotbox

vsbattles.fandom.com

Please make sure to read all the notes as well since they help clear out any potential vagueness and uncertainty.
Now I will note that my understanding of the topic is relatively surface level so I'm definitely open towards constructive criticism as the chance I missed some crucial evidence or misunderstood it is slightly higher than with most of my CRTs. That being said, as far as I understand the arguments should be pretty straightforward and direct.

So what happens now? When (if) the upgrade is accepted I will separate Mori's keys, one for before he ascended beyond nirvana and one afterwards. Plus I will turn the sandbox into a blog and link it on the verse page for easy access.
Also big thanks to @ShroobWasTaken for helping out with the scaling implications and @Yeolban for help with translations.

Agree(W rizz): @ShroobWasTaken (shocking ik), Re5yh
Disagree(stinky pooper):

I agree with this

 

[ShroobWasTaken]

bump

 

[Yeolban]

bump

 

[Black-san112]

bump

 

[ShroobWasTaken]

Bump

 

[Robo432343]

I agree with Low 1-C

 

[Jaynic1]

bump

 

[Jaynic1]

bump

 

[Jaynic1]

bump

 

[Jaynic1]

bump

 

[DavidTPPM]

After 2 months the only thing that changed is that I went from 1 GoH thread with 0 staff attention to how having 2 open GoH threads with 0 staff attention

 

[Black-san112]

After 2 months the only thing that changed is that I went from 1 GoH thread with 0 staff attention to how having 2 open GoH threads with 0 staff attention

is GOH finally washed everyone

 

[DavidTPPM]

is GOH finally washed everyone

Yes
I feel like it's just a bad timing ngl.
Ovens just recently retired and he was the only actual GoH mod/admin, FinePoint who's one of the few people that actually read every CRT sent to them was on vacation, and everyone else who could potentially be willing is busy.

I assume I'll get someone in the Satan thread in less than a week (hope I'm not jinxing it) but it's just a worse time that like, last year or something

 

[Black-san112]

Yes
I feel like it's just a bad timing ngl.
Ovens just recently retired and he was the only actual GoH mod/admin, FinePoint who's one of the few people that actually read every CRT sent to them was on vacation, and everyone else who could potentially be willing is busy.

I assume I'll get someone in the Satan thread in less than a week (hope I'm not jinxing it) but it's just a worse time that like, last year or something

what makes this funnier is i tried to ask ant for help just to see he is in vacation like the next day lmfao

 

[DavidTPPM]

what makes this funnier is i tried to ask ant for help just to see he is in vacation like the next day lmfao

That's almost exactly what happened when I went to message FinePoint 2 months ago lmao

 

[Black-san112]

bump
we need some help here holy
also i just relaized i didnt even vote, i agree with 1-A

 

[Black-san112]

bump

 

[ShroobWasTaken]

Bump of acceptance