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LMK Primordial Chaos

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Arency

Arency

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The Chaos Realm (along with scroll for embodying it) should have AE1 Concept type 1 as it’s a realm that's endlessly larger than the universe here and here. And also predates it as all creation was molded within the Chaos stated by Sun Wukong and it governs reality as it affects the universe here and here. Even stated that removing chaos in the world is impossible as the only way to get rid of it, was by destroying everything beyond heaven which includes the Chaos Realm with the Samadhi Fire here, here and here

As for the Pillar of Heaven and the mystical stones wielders, it should have conceptual manipulation type 1 as it’s a mystical energy that helps Destiny/Order itself (the polar opposite to Chaos) to hold back the Primordial Chaos from drowning the universe with chaos here, here and here. Even to make the world being the world stated by Wukong and affects reality itself. While the Chaos at first was effected by the Pillar, it managed to overcome it completely after some time which should grant resistance to CM1 but later was stopped again after Nuwa the Goddess of Destiny amplify the pillar with the mystical stones which should grant layered CM1 for the mystical stones wielders. Since the Samadhi Fire was stated could truly eradicate Chaos, it should have layered conceptual type 1 for it. Same for chaos physiology as it can destroy/absorb everything in the universe which includes the scroll’s entire existence
 
Finally, an answer... (thanks for your reply btw)

So how would you tackle the statements that removing chaos in the world is impossible unless you destroy all of reality including the chaos realm? Also Chaos realm should be a concept at least since it governs reality's chaos aspect.
 
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ActuallySpaceMan42 said:
Video about removing chaos doesn't work.
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Damn it LEGO 💀

- Alright, here where LBD mentions that in order to stop countless wars and gain perfection for the world, is to start a clean slate.

- Here where she mentions chaos is the very thing she depises and wants to eradicate it by using the Samadhi Fire.

- Here was stated that the Samadhi Fire is the one thing that can cleanse the mortal realm but also the celestial realm and everything beyond it which includes the Chaos Realm.

- Also, here might be important as it was stated that the Samadhi Fire can burn through the very fabric of reality.

These shows that you would need something that effects reality itself just remove chaos influence in the universe which fits to the conceptual manip definition as it mentioned concepts shapes all of reality (which the Chaos Realm qualifies).
 
Technically chaos or void type things can be something that's equivalent without being a concept just an FYI

vsbattles.fandom.com

Metaphysical Aspects

The term Metaphysical Aspects refers to aspects of existence which are not part of the physical world, or spiritual aspects like mind or soul, but define or govern the world from the background. Examples include laws, causality, information, concepts, plot and also things our wiki does not list...
vsbattles.fandom.com vsbattles.fandom.com
 
ActuallySpaceMan42 said:
This is Chaos, but not the Concept of Chaos. Just like time can exist, and be manipulated, encompassing everything, yet still not being a concept.
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So chaos can without being a concept despite reality is tied to its existence?

If yes, how would you rate the samadhi fire ability regarding that can create a reality of complete perfection by removing all instances of chaos in the world so any wars or conflict will never happen again?
 
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Arency said:
So chaos can without being a concept despite reality is tied to its existence?
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Yes. Chaos is the disorder of things; it's also entropy, technically speaking. If you removed Chaos, naturally, reality would need to be remade. However, concepts are the source of what they are a concept of. You would need to prove something to be the source of all chaos, and chaos would disappear if it were removed.
Arency said:
If yes, how would you rate the samadhi fire ability regarding that can create a reality of complete perfection by removing all instances of chaos in the world so any wars or conflict will never happen again?
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It would Existence Erasure on the scale of however big the verse is.
 
ActuallySpaceMan42 said:
Yes. Chaos is the disorder of things; it's also entropy, technically speaking. If you removed Chaos, naturally, reality would need to be remade. However, concepts are the source of what they are a concept of. You would need to prove something to be the source of all chaos, and chaos would disappear if it were removed.
Click to expand...
About something being the source of all chaos, I think the Sun qualifies here. We also know it's a living entity as shown that there is a giant hand surrounding the universe when Sun Wukong telling stories about the Chaos Beyond here. Also stated that the Sun is a "He" here.
 
Arency said:
You can check the replies for the videos that did not load.
Click to expand...
Thank you.

I'm fine with Existence Erasure.
I'm not entirely sure about it being a concept since chaos is a measurable part of any given universe and a real part of the real universe, and I didn't really see much evidence that it governs reality, more-so that reality was made from it, which would just make it a normal universal or higher object.

That is to say, 'chaos' and 'the concept of chaos' are inherently different things, unlike, say, 'good' or 'evil' which are abstract by default.
I would want more proof it's entirely abstract in this context, as multiple points of the videos seem to hint towards it being some variety of physical thing.
 
FinePoint said:
I'm fine with Existence Erasure.
I'm not entirely sure about it being a concept since chaos is a measurable part of any given universe and a real part of the real universe, and I didn't really see much evidence that it governs reality, more-so that reality was made from it, which would just make it a normal universal or higher object.

That is to say, 'chaos' and 'the concept of chaos' are inherently different things, unlike, say, 'good' or 'evil' which are abstract by default.
I would want more proof it's entirely abstract in this context, as multiple points of the videos seem to hint towards it being some variety of physical thing.
Click to expand...
Shouldn't chaos be governing reality since it's the main cause of the existence of wars and conflicts? You need something like the SF, a weapon capable of burning through the fabric of reality to remove chaos. Also what do you think about destroying chaos would lead to the universe's destruction?
 
Arency said:
Shouldn't chaos be governing reality since it's the main cause of the existence of wars and conflicts? You need something like the SF, a weapon capable of burning through the fabric of reality to remove chaos. Also what do you think about destroying chaos would lead to the universe's destruction?
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Well it's more complicated because removing chaos would 'destroy' the universe in real life, and you could argue it's the main cause of wars and conflicts too. As for needing the SF, it seemed like she really needs it because she intends to destroy literally everything, including chaos, for her "clean slate", and destroying all chaos would be nigh-impossible without some kind of absolute destruction like that since it's like a fundamental part of how the universe operates, whether that be abstractly or otherwise.
 
FinePoint said:
Well it's more complicated because removing chaos would 'destroy' the universe in real life, and you could argue it's the main cause of wars and conflicts too. As for needing the SF, it seemed like she really needs it because she intends to destroy literally everything, including chaos, for her "clean slate", and destroying all chaos would be nigh-impossible without some kind of absolute destruction like that since it's like a fundamental part of how the universe operates, whether that be abstractly or otherwise.
Click to expand...
Well do you think a "possibly" rating can be achieved at least, since you agree that chaos is fundamental to how the universe operates (which fits to the conceptual manip description) ?
 
Arency said:
Well do you think a "possibly" rating can be achieved at least, since you agree that chaos is fundamental to how the universe operates (which fits to the conceptual manip description) ?
Click to expand...
I wouldn't be entirely opposed, but I'm particularly lax in regards to that kind of thing.
I'd want to hear what other staff think about it.
 
What does chaos "govern?" Does changes to "chaos" affect the objects and things to governs?

If yiu can answer those its more than like something abstract like a concept
 
TheUnshakableOne said:
What does chaos "govern?" Does changes to "chaos" affect the objects and things to governs?

If yiu can answer those its more than like something abstract like a concept
Click to expand...
Well, I already mentioned in the op and replies regarding the things it governed, and destroying chaos would lead to all wars, famine and conflicts be gone as LBD stated.
 
ActuallySpaceMan42 said:
I still disagree with conceptual manipulation; it's just Chaos Manipulation.
Click to expand...
What about pillar of heaven? Since they govern reality as destroying them, results in the universe's destruction. Also restoring them results in restoring reality as Sun Wukong mentioned they made world as the world.
 
Arency said:
What about pillar of heaven? Since they govern reality as destroying them, results in the universe's destruction. Also restoring them results in restoring reality as Sun Wukong mentioned they made world as the world.
Click to expand...
The pillar of Heaven can be broken and repaired without the world immediately being destroyed, so no.
 
Antvasima said:
@ActuallySpaceMan42 @FinePoint

I was given a request to help out here. Are you willing to try to reach conclusions for this thread please? 🙏
Click to expand...
I still think Chaos Manipulation is more fitting than Concept Manipulation here, since there's not adequate proof it's referring to chaos as an abstraction as opposed to the more traditional definition (as a real observable phenomenon).
 
ActuallySpaceMan42 said:
The pillar of Heaven can be broken and repaired without the world immediately being destroyed, so no.
Click to expand...
The thing is, the pillar was never completely destroyed. When it was cracking, the entire universe was getting destroyed as well as we see in season 5.
 
Arency said:
The thing is, the pillar was never completely destroyed. When it was cracking, the entire universe was getting destroyed as well as we see in season 5.
Click to expand...
It was getting destroyed by Chaos, though, not just because of the pillar.
 
ActuallySpaceMan42 said:
Not sure, I suppose it would have Space-Time Manipulation since it fixed the universe.
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Well, it also restored realms made of information type 2, souls of the underworld, abstract mind/thoughts and etc... It's still just space-time manip?
 
Arency said:
Well, it also restored realms made of information type 2, souls of the underworld, abstract mind/thoughts and etc... It's still just space-time manip?
Click to expand...
Yes it just part of Space-time Manipulation. All of this are not directly, it needs more than this
 
ActuallySpaceMan42 said:
Could be summed up with Creation instead.
Click to expand...
Since you think the primodial chaos governing the entire universe which includes souls, info 2 and etc is only chaos manip, how about I change it to chaos manip with the additions of the things I mentioned? Like chaos manip + info 2 manip and etc...
 
Arency said:
Since you think the primodial chaos governing the entire universe which includes souls, info 2 and etc is only chaos manip, how about I change it to chaos manip with the additions of the things I mentioned? Like chaos manip + info 2 manip and etc...
Click to expand...
You don't get manipulation for stuff in the universe just for creating the universe. It's tedious and can just be summed up with Creation.
 
ActuallySpaceMan42 said:
You don't get manipulation for stuff in the universe just for creating the universe. It's tedious and can just be summed up with Creation.
Click to expand...
Pretty sure he mentioned governing, not creation since everything in world like wars, conflict, diseases and etc is only possible because of the primodial chaos. It was Nuwa who created the universe, not chaos
 
CasperSenar said:
Pretty sure he mentioned governing, not creation since everything in world like wars, conflict, diseases and etc is only possible because of the primodial chaos. It was Nuwa who created the universe, not chaos
Click to expand...
It would be too vague, unless it's specified how it governs it. If it's just about causing wars, conflict, etc, and there are direct statements, I suppose Empathic Manipulation, Disease Manipulation would be fine.
 
ActuallySpaceMan42 said:
It would be too vague, unless it's specified how it governs it. If it's just about causing wars, conflict, etc, and there are direct statements, I suppose Empathic Manipulation, Disease Manipulation would be fine.
Click to expand...
Alright, I'll change the proposed CM ability to empathic and disease manip since that's what you agree with.
Also might be unrelated but what ability should I give to Primordial Chaos since it's existence is needed for the universe to remain exist?
 
i agree with the evaluation of Spaceman, Chaos here is only Chaos Manipulation,
 
Vietthai96 said:
i agree with the evaluation of Spaceman, Chaos here is only Chaos Manipulation,
Click to expand...
So you agree with spaceman about giving chaos empathic and disease manip? Also what ability should I give to Primordial Chaos since it's existence is needed for the universe to remain exist?
 
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