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Sonic flying across fourth dimension space, a separate multiverse, in less than a day (Sonic Shuffle, post-Riot Train)

Sonic flying to a rift between universes in minutes (Exception in Sonic Rush)

Master Core spinning galaxies with the power of gravity and Sonic being able to control himself while under the influence of that same gravity acceleration (Sonic Riders 2 Mobius Strip)
In Sonic Rush we don't know where was Blazes planet to the end of her universe, also we don't know her universe's size. That's why we can't give him any speed beyond sub-light.

Being able to control in this situation doesn't give speed(I can control my movements while I'm in the plane, am I transonic in speed now?).

Can you sent this feat for Sonic Shufle? I can't remember this one. I remember only when he was flying in gameplay(or it was another game), but it doesn't a thing because it's gameplay, also I remember when he was flying, but that wasn't his speed and he wasn't dodging a thing while flying, so it's useless.
 
You didn't get what I said about gameplay. It was about pure game mechanics, involving the player in actions and other things, without focusing on the universe itself. Additionally, "all at the speed of light" and similar phrases can be used as metaphors for high speed. In the same old Batman comics, where he couldn't even react to bullets, it was mentioned that his actions occurred at the speed of light, which is clearly not the case with feats and other aspects. I'm using the most official and up-to-date information from Sega's official website, which includes unique official stories and other information about Sonic. However, when you use just advertisements that have nothing to do with the canon, as well as simple character quotes, it's not accurate.
This your own interpretation of those statement. That doesn't make those statements not indicative of lightspeed just because you see it as a metaphor. That isn't going to win you any debates. Using whataboutism also won't win you any debates lol.
Sonic in Sonic Generations does not have an unmeasurable speed, and it's pointless to mention a speed that can fix time, as it won't give him any speed and you won't be able to prove that it's truly unmeasurable (except for your own garbage fantasies). Also I sent statements that Werehog was at max transonic at speed, so I already won.
This is just denial like what?? All you said was "He isn't this because he isn't.". Literally just an argument from belief fallacy. The bare MINIMUM for accelerating through time is light speed using real world physics. Sonic is said to be doing JUST that. Not only is he accelerating through time, but he is moving within a place where space and time no longer exist (White Space) as the Time Eater nuked the entire cosmology, space-time and all. Moving in a place where no space or time exist is an Infinite speed feat. Accelerating through time is an immeasurable speed feat. The Flash does the same thing sometimes, so you're going to say that when he does it, it's not Immeasurable?

Also, those werehog statements are useless. They are not relevant to current scaling and statements aren't the only determining factor for scaling. Feats are a big part and we know that Base Unleashed Sonic upscales everything before, which includes stated and shown beyond light speed feats. Werehog Sonic is significantly slower, but even if he was 50% slower or more, he'd still be much faster than light at this point.
Dispo is stated to be FASTER than light(which is any speed faster than light with bigger feats and statements), but Super Sonic is stated to be SLOWER than light. This is the difference
You missed the point and it went over your head lol.
 
In Sonic Rush we don't know where was Blazes planet to the end of her universe, also we don't know her universe's size. That's why we can't give him any speed beyond sub-light.

Being able to control in this situation doesn't give speed(I can control my movements while I'm in the plane, am I transonic in speed now?).

Can you sent this feat for Sonic Shufle? I can't remember this one. I remember only when he was flying in gameplay(or it was another game), but it doesn't a thing because it's gameplay, also I remember when he was flying, but that wasn't his speed and he wasn't dodging a thing while flying, so it's useless.
Also doesn't matter. Even moving slightly across the universe from the planet to its end would make Super Forms go at lightyears of speed at least. Unless you're trying to argue that her planet is so close to the edge of the universe that one could get there by sublight speeds lol. Her planet would LITERALLY have to be practically touching the edge of the expanding universe constantly for that to even be a viable argument.

Also, the difference between using a plane and using a skateboard was that he directly reacted to it using his body's actual movements, which isn't the same as using a plane with subtle movements within the safety of a metal cage. Another difference is that a plane is, if you haven't noticed, significantly slower than Extreme Gear. So at the very least his reactions would be in the ballpark of lightspeed if not higher. Spinning galaxies at that speed requires many many times the speed of light in feats as lightyears is the distance light travels and spinning a galaxy to the point where it is noticeable makes it faster in the lightspeed ranges. This is simple logic.
 
This your own interpretation of those statement. That doesn't make those statements not indicative of lightspeed just because you see it as a metaphor. That isn't going to win you any debates. Using whataboutism also won't win you any debates lol.

This is just denial like what?? All you said was "He isn't this because he isn't.". Literally just an argument from belief fallacy. The bare MINIMUM for accelerating through time is light speed using real world physics. Sonic is said to be doing JUST that. Not only is he accelerating through time, but he is moving within a place where space and time no longer exist (White Space) as the Time Eater nuked the entire cosmology, space-time and all. Moving in a place where no space or time exist is an Infinite speed feat. Accelerating through time is an immeasurable speed feat. The Flash does the same thing sometimes, so you're going to say that when he does it, it's not Immeasurable?

Also, those werehog statements are useless. They are not relevant to current scaling and statements aren't the only determining factor for scaling. Feats are a big part and we know that Base Unleashed Sonic upscales everything before, which includes stated and shown beyond light speed feats. Werehog Sonic is significantly slower, but even if he was 50% slower or more, he'd still be much faster than light at this point.

You missed the point and it went over your head lol.
All those words are just metaphors and can't be used because they don't have a basis or clear instructions. You just don't like the fact that they're metaphors.
Sonic didn't travel though time, on stages it was already exist and he was fixing space via speed. Show me prove that fixing space with speed gives you a thing. Also moving in white space gives nothing, because even Maria could move easily in it and she isn't even human+ in speed, so cap. And Time Eater didn't nuke it he warped it and created White space(it doesn't give him or anyone stats). And it's funny how you use Flash, because he doesn't accelerate thought time but time travel(it's not the same) via ftl speed(if he doesn't go into Speed Force while speed up to speed to light).
It's funny how you're saying that statements aren't the only thing in scaling while using resources that are not fresh or reliable, or even advertising and not showing any feat for atleast hypersonic speed. Sonic in Unleashed isn't even hypersonic in speed and Werehog doesn't even feats for faster than sound, prove otherwise.

 
Also doesn't matter. Even moving slightly across the universe from the planet to its end would make Super Forms go at lightyears of speed at least. Unless you're trying to argue that her planet is so close to the edge of the universe that one could get there by sublight speeds lol. Her planet would LITERALLY have to be practically touching the edge of the expanding universe constantly for that to even be a viable argument.

Also, the difference between using a plane and using a skateboard was that he directly reacted to it using his body's actual movements, which isn't the same as using a plane with subtle movements within the safety of a metal cage. Another difference is that a plane is, if you haven't noticed, significantly slower than Extreme Gear. So at the very least his reactions would be in the ballpark of lightspeed if not higher. Spinning galaxies at that speed requires many many times the speed of light in feats as lightyears is the distance light travels and spinning a galaxy to the point where it is noticeable makes it faster in the lightspeed ranges. This is simple logic.
We don't know her universe and planet sizes. There are no statements, so they can be very small.

It wouldn't still give him any speed, because I can do practically the same thing with the car, but I'm not as fast as the car, so we can't use it for scaling, especially when he was in space. He didn't reacted to anything outside of gameplay, which we don't use in scaling(otherwise wall level sonic).
 
All those words are just metaphors and can't be used because they don't have a basis or clear instructions. You just don't like the fact that they're metaphors.
Sonic didn't travel though time, on stages it was already exist and he was fixing space via speed. Show me prove that fixing space with speed gives you a thing. Also moving in white space gives nothing, because even Maria could move easily in it and she isn't even human+ in speed, so cap. And Time Eater didn't nuke it he warped it and created White space(it doesn't give him or anyone stats). And it's funny how you use Flash, because he doesn't accelerate thought time but time travel(it's not the same) via ftl speed(if he doesn't go into Speed Force while speed up to speed to light).
It's funny how you're saying that statements aren't the only thing in scaling while using resources that are not fresh or reliable, or even advertising and not showing any feat for atleast hypersonic speed. Sonic in Unleashed isn't even hypersonic in speed and Werehog doesn't even feats for faster than sound, prove otherwise.


Trying school me on metaphors is a testament that you're reaching so hard for this to be a metaphor. I'm not buying whatever that is supposed to be, buddy.

Also, accelerating through time and time travel is the same thing. Accelerating through time is just a form of time travel. If you go fast enough to end up in the future, is that or is that not time travel? The Flash can also go in traverse as well to go to the past. The same thing Sonic has done. Accelerating through the past AND present. Also, again you miss the point. The point isn't him FIXING time with speed makes him immeasurable, it's the fact that he is moving forward and backwards through time that makes him immeasurable. Him fixing time with his speed is simply an aftereffect. It isn't relevant to speed scaling, only the first part. The Flash time traveling via the Speed Force doesn't make it just an ability Flash can use to travel to the future or past. It's literally called the SPEED FORCE. The embodiment of all speed in the DC Multiverse. This would imply that he is using his actual speed to time travel, not simply using it like a time machine.

Also, moving in White Space IS an actual feat as characters were otherwise frozen as white statues incapable of moving. Moving in a place where no time or space exist simply gives Infinite speed scaling. End of story. However, we do know that certain triggers such as Sonic's speed is capable of restoring their movement, so the same could be inferred for characters who aren't already frozen by White Space.

Also, you're the guy using outdated scaling in spite of pre-determined data to try to derail, detract, and downplay Sonic speed scaling. You asked for official sources stating Sonic is light speed. Also, if you want to get into numbers, Sonic's Light Speed Dash, which has been stated multiple times to go at light speed, goes at around 300+ SPD in Unleashed. However, Sonic's maximum speed in Unleashed can clock in at multiple times over the speed at which Light Speed Dash allows Sonic to travel, making him multiple times light speed.
We don't know her universe and planet sizes. There are no statements, so they can be very small.

It wouldn't still give him any speed, because I can do practically the same thing with the car, but I'm not as fast as the car, so we can't use it for scaling, especially when he was in space. He didn't reacted to anything outside of gameplay, which we don't use in scaling(otherwise wall level sonic).
So we're going to be headcanoning that Blaze's universe is planet-sized and Blaze's world is moon-sized? Is that the kind of thing we're going to be doing? You're going into unfounded theoreticals. Sometimes the easiest answer is the one that's outright said. There doesn't NEED to be statements for the size of her planet and universe. It doesn't need to be spoonfed to you. Simply assume that her universe is at LEAST the size of our observable universe and her planet is comparable to Earth, since Blaze's world is a direct counterpart to Sonic's own, which is Earth.

Also, you still miss the point. Reacting to the visible rotation of galaxies via gravitation dwarfs the comparison you're trying to make. This isn't a car. This a celestial mass visibly spinning much faster than the amount of lightyears it would typically travel and Sonic reacting to this. Your comparison is useless.

Anyway, this isn't the thread for this kind of talk. Make your CRT and get out and stop trying to argue on a debate post with stats that are already on the wiki. You're completely derailing the debate and this kind of thing is not welcome. Please leave.
 
It's not stated that he was moving forward or backward though time and accelerating though time can mean anything.
I won't argue about Flash, because we're not talking about him here, and he's not necessary.
The characters couldn't move because of the Time Eater's effect on them, not because they were in that space. It's not mentioned anywhere that Sonic gives them anything to move in that space, so it's just a fantasy. And you can't prove that moving in a place where there is no space and time gives you infinite speed because there is no time for you to say that they were moving in 0 time. This is exemplified by the Afterlife from Dragon Ball, which has no concept of space and time (as stated in the data books, manga, and anime), but characters can still move without infinite speed.
As for Sonic Unleashed, it's just gameplay junk that is never used or mentioned. I don't use outdated information; instead, I use the latest and most direct stataments from the most trusted, official, and reliable sources. Unlike you and other Sonic wankers that use outdated gameplay junk, metaphor statements, and useless feats.
About Blaze dimension, if you think that her dimension is bigger than I say, then prove it with statements in lightyears or parsecs. I say that it's small because Super Sonic officially stated to be sub-light in speed, so if he traveled to the end of this dimension, then this dimension is small. I can give you examples of universes with planets, stars, and galaxies, but they were no larger than the planet Earth, so it's silly to use them as an argument without explicitly stating their size.
He didn't reacted or dodged them, btw they were smaller than planet in the gameplay when Sonic was nearby, so cap gameplay.
Okay, I'll create a CRT about it when I'll have time. Good luck!
 
@TaoPaiPaiRUS00 Make a content revision thread instead of derailing a random versus thread.


Versus threads go by the stats on the profile pages and as it stands Sonic is far beyond the speed of light.
 
Sonic doens't even have the LS arg anymore. Goku is now Class G
Class M in the profile tho?

But also... i don't really see how LS matters much here

Also Shadow got Upgraded to Class G a while ago, no idea why it is taking so long to apply to the other chars
 
Class M in the profile tho?

But also... i don't really see how LS matters much here

Also Shadow got Upgraded to Class G a while ago, no idea why it is taking so long to apply to the other chars
Speaking of LS, if Werehog's LS is based on the planetary fragment feat caused by a Chaos Emerald, then shouldn't it apply to Chaos too? It would matter since characters can overcome Chaos 6's vacuum breath.
 
This is a massive stomp. Sonic in base officially is just supersonic in speed and Super Sonic is sub-light. Sonic in base is mountain level objectively and Super Sonic is planet level(Villains are using haxes not stats). Even Kid Goku is enough for him.
Lol

Edit: Oh wait we're past this point, uhhhhh... Yeah, looking at both profiles again I think Sonic got this
 
Huh, never thought I see chi arguing in vs battle Wikipedia in 2026, what a view.

Edit: or maybe that's one his goons?, either way it's so entertaining, to see the chaos they making.
 
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