The Revenant Marvel Comics Discussion Thread

[Suigetsuhyugs]

Eventually, possibly, but given the Asgardians' extremely long history, longevities, and memories, if it is just suddenly thrown onto them, they will likely fail to acclimatise and be manipulated into electing even worse leaders than previously. A working democracy is dependent on a well-educated critically evaluating and reasonably civilised population.

I think that Al Ewing is going to let Thor undergo a lot of self-reflection and character development in that and other areas though.

As far as I read most Asgardians (not counting the actual gods) are just drunk idiots looking for fights, so.... I think it should take a while to make them "well educated" and "civilized".

Well, I think that 1-A is far too high for almost any regular Marvel Comics heroes. We should probably turn much more careful with our powerscaling chains without personal actual feats of that scale. Hopefully Impress has a good plan for this without going too far into the other direction of excessive downgrades instead, so a reasonable balance can be found.

Ms. Marvel just started actually using her mutation powers so is not like there is a more consistent level of her power, anyways it just started, if she gets a solo run at some point in the future they gonna keep her a normal level as she already is.

 

[Maverick_Zero_X]

Are there other Inhuman/Mutant hybrids or is Ms. Marvel the first?

 

[Suigetsuhyugs]

Are there other Inhuman/Mutant hybrids or is Ms. Marvel the first?

I think Marvel wants people to think it's Ms. Marvel but I read about a clone made by Sinister was also a hybrid mutant and inhuman.

 

[Jimmy.robinson.5099]

I think Marvel wants people to think it's Ms. Marvel but I read about a clone made by Sinister was also a hybrid mutant and inhuman.

Honestly, I wouldn't even be surprised by that twist...

 

[MrKerf]

Where even is Sinister nowadays?

 

[Antvasima]

He recently showed up in "Exceptional X-Men".

 

[Antvasima]

What is your favourite heroic motivation speech? For me the current one that I like best is this one.

 

[AcidSilver]

Are there other Inhuman/Mutant hybrids or is Ms. Marvel the first?

The Beyonder was a Mutant/Inhuman hybrid in Bendis's Illuminati book but how canon those events are now, let alone how real any of that interaction actually was, is up in the air.

 

[Adr10K]

Which one would it be your perfect Avengers line up? I think mine would be this one.

 

[Antvasima]

Can someone recommend Marvel authors who write extensively about these topics?

Besides J.M. DeMatteis.

1. The nature of the collective unconscious and characters like Gods or the physical universe being shaped by it.
2. The nature of dreams or dream worlds, besides anything involving Nightmare and his dimension.
3. Reality-Fiction relationships, the nature of stories/narratives on a meta-fictional level.

@ProfectusInfinity

Just a late warning from extensive personal experiences to mentally and spiritually avoid the collective unconscious like a plague if possible. It is essentially the combined sum totality of all repressed human evil, and as such channelling information from it, like I did when writing my old story, easily turns into an overwhelmingly disgusting and otherwise negative experience that can require many years of work to recover from.

 

[ProfectusInfinity]

@ProfectusInfinity

Just a late warning from extensive personal experiences to mentally and spiritually avoid the collective unconscious like a plague if possible. It is essentially the combined sum totality of all repressed human evil, and as such channelling information from it, like I did when writing my old story, easily turns into an overwhelmingly disgusting and otherwise negative experience that can require many years of work to recover from.

Thanks for the warning, but I should say that my religion doesn't really use a concept of collective unconscious, so I wouldn't explore it on a personal spiritual level, just in literature.

 

[Antvasima]

Well, going by my extensive experiences it definitely exists, and everybody are likely connected to it, so my warning still remains.

 

[Maverick_Zero_X]

Aight so Earth-616 Gwen Stacy was resurrected by the Weapon X Program and received a Healing Factor + Adamantium claws

Tier 1 Spider-Man love interest by technicalities

 

[XSOULOFCINDERX]

Aight so Earth-616 Gwen Stacy was resurrected by the Weapon X Program and received a Healing Factor + Adamantium claws

Tier 1 Spider-Man love interest by technicalities

What the- Why?!

 

[Maverick_Zero_X]

What the- Why?!

Creative Bankruptcy on part of the writers

 

[Jimmy.robinson.5099]

Creative Bankruptcy on part of the writers

Or the editors, depending on who you ask.

 

[Antvasima]

Creative Bankruptcy on part of the writers

To be fair, I think that this is supposed to be a metafictional storyline in which the original Gwenpool (Gwen Poole) is trying to set right continuity that has been wantonly violated by bad storytelling decisions.

That said, turning virtually all the X-Men into thoroughly unlikeable villains during the Krakoa storyline was an even worse creative decision as I see it, as was Spider-Man and Mary Jane making a deal with Mephisto, among plenty of other examples, and Storm-Above-All might rank up there after a few months. Metafictional satire has kind of turned redundant for Marvel Comics at this point given just how bad major story decisions that have been made and never rectified during the years.

 

[AcidSilver]

So does this mean what Pym Particles have some kind of connection to the White Hot Room?

 

[Osemere]

So does this mean what Pym Particles have some kind of connection to the White Hot Room?

Ewing first made this connection two years ago in Wasp #4, isn’t anything new. Kirbons are basically just “do anything” particles which were combined originally with the Cosmic Rays to create the F4 with their unique capacity to change mass and density. Hank found some limited application of Kirbons in manipulating his own body, but the true nature of Kirbons being found in the White Hot Room was probably just Ewing trying to tie back into the Immortal concept of “F4 from God, Hulk from the Devil.” This new issue is just downstream from this and what seems to me to be pretty unnecessary worldbuilding anyways.

 

[AcidSilver]

Ewing first made this connection two years ago in Wasp #4, isn’t anything new. Kirbons are basically just “do anything” particles which were combined originally with the Cosmic Rays to create the F4 with their unique capacity to change mass and density. Hank found some limited application of Kirbons in manipulating his own body, but the true nature of Kirbons being found in the White Hot Room was probably just Ewing trying to tie back into the Immortal concept of “F4 from God, Hulk from the Devil.” This new issue is just downstream from this and what seems to me to be pretty unnecessary worldbuilding anyways.

It does kind of follow the hilarious trend of Mutants being hyped up as doing these amazing things and making big creations just for it to be some shit that humanity had already been doing for years. Hank could've made Mysterium in his lab all this time and the Mutant Resurrection Protocol is just the same stuff that the Jackal had been doing as a hobby.

 

[Eseseso]

It does kind of follow the hilarious trend of Mutants being hyped up as doing these amazing things and making big creations just for it to be some shit that humanity had already been doing for years. Hank could've made Mysterium in his lab all this time and the Mutant Resurrection Protocol is just the same stuff that the Jackal had been doing as a hobby.

Doom was right when he said being born with wings or claws as a mutant does not make you superior to a human

 

[Maverick_Zero_X]

I do find the "Homo Superior" label kind of cringe

 

[Jimmy.robinson.5099]

I do find the "Homo Superior" label kind of cringe

More like "Homo FRAUDSTER", amirite guys?

Yes, I see the door to my left...

 

[Antvasima]

I do find the "Homo Superior" label kind of cringe

At least when it is embraced to extremes as during the Krakoa era.

 

[VeryGoofyToddler2]

'Storm' #10 Preview: The Thunder War Begins

Get your first look at "Thunder War," the three-part arc commencing in 'Storm' #10 this July.

www.marvel.com

 

[SamanPatou]

I've published my latest work, a profile for The Hood, take a gander, if you like.

The Hood (Marvel Comics)

The man who will become known as the Hood was originally a simple thug from the suburbs of New York City. His life was made of small crimes committed alongside his cousin John King, a relationship with a girl waiting their child and the preoccupations for his mentally-ill mother. Parker Robbins...

vsbattles.fandom.com

 

[Eseseso]

I've published my latest work, a profile for The Hood, take a gander, if you like.

The Hood (Marvel Comics)

The man who will become known as the Hood was originally a simple thug from the suburbs of New York City. His life was made of small crimes committed alongside his cousin John King, a relationship with a girl waiting their child and the preoccupations for his mentally-ill mother. Parker Robbins...

vsbattles.fandom.com

Dude you did not have to go this hard, but you did.

Excellent work!

 

[SamanPatou]

Thank you!
It's been an interesting, albeit frustrating read, because the character is very interesting, especially when handled well, but way too often the writers didn't seem to know what to do with him, so they pulled him back and forth into plotlines that didn't lead anywhere.

 

[Antvasima]

Your draft seems good to me, with the exception that several of the header images are far too large and need to be resized.

 

[The_Unknown_Warrior1]

You know I've been seeing comments on this thread talking about the screw up of legacy characters like the X-Men or Spider-Man over the years, but I wanted to throw my hat in the ring and say Deadpool has also gotten the short end of the stick in the past.

For context: back in 2016, under the writing of Nick Spencer, Marvel released a comic called Secret Empire which had the plot twist of Captain America being a sleeper agent for Hydra (which retroactively was revealed to have been caused by Red Skull using fragments of a Cosmic Cube to rewrite parts of Steve's past). And while he was this sleeper agent for Hydra, Captain America used Deadpool, who's a big fan boy of the captain, to commit crimes that include killing a bunch of innocent people IIRC.

But what really pissed me off was that even after Captain America was no longer a sleeper agent for Hydra, Deadpool was still blamed for the shit he was unknowingly manipulated into doing under Captain America and was branded as a villain and hunted by everyone for awhile. So even though Deadpool was manipulated into doing terrible things because of his admiration and respect for his hero (that he didn't know was a sleeper agent), he was still punished for it.

 

[Antvasima]

Deadpool has a long history of being a casually thrill-killing sadistic villain and still has a responsibility for his own actions of murdering innocent people even if somebody else manipulated him into it though. If anything, the really sick and twisted anti-morality of his longterm character arc is that he never truly has to pay in full proportion for all of his very extreme crimes.

 

[Eseseso]

Just read the last Chapter of Doom Academy , it was honestly nice to see Doom being affable to the protagonists. He was upset at Doctor Voodoo for not being there to help them, gave Zelma a warning, and complemented the skills of the students.

 

[The_Unknown_Warrior1]

Deadpool has a history of being a casually thrill-killing sadistic villain and still has a responsibility for his own actions of murdering innocent people even if somebody else manipulated him into it though

While this is objectively true, especially in Deadpool's earlier days when he first debuted, I also have to respectfully disagree with this assessment as I feel like it takes away from the nuance and complexity of Deadpool's character. What makes Deadpool an interesting case study for me is, behind the quips and over the top violence that he brings to the table, lies someone who struggles with things like depression, self hatred, and other traits that I think make Wade a genuinely tragic figure.

As someone who's personally struggled with mental health and coming to terms with my past actions, I can relate and empathize with Deadpool's desire to be a better person for himself and others, but having a really hard time with it because of his past as an assassin and the world kicking him down to the ground whenever he tries to getting up. Yet he still tries regardless, and in the process has gained friends and family over the years that bring out the best in Deadpool and demonstrate that he's not some irredeemable monster or psychopathic murderer. That in spite of the blood and death on his hands, he can be a genuine hero like his idol Captain America.

And that's what truly bothers me about Secret Empire: Captain America has always been one of Deadpool's inspirations and one of the reasons why he tries to be a better person, but because of his blind trust (I can't blame him, how was he suppose to know that Steve was secretly a Hydra agent) it caused him to unknowingly commit terrible things which labeled him a villain in the eyes of those who once trusted and cared about while Steve pretty much got off scott free. It felt like Nick Spencer was ******** all over a character with hundreds of fans for no reason other than to be an asshole seemingly.

 

[Suigetsuhyugs]

Just read the last Chapter of Doom Academy , it was honestly nice to see Doom being affable to the protagonists. He was upset at Doctor Voodoo for not being there to help them, gave Zelma a warning, and complemented the skills of the students.

I read it yes.
You know, considering the amount of times I saw doombots becoming good, I'm starting to question if Doom is actually a good guy really deep down, in the new Runaways series they made it an whole thing that Doom sent a bunch of Doombots to catch all the Doombots that quit their job and started living normal lives.

 

[The_Unknown_Warrior1]

Just read the last Chapter of Doom Academy , it was honestly nice to see Doom being affable to the protagonists. He was upset at Doctor Voodoo for not being there to help them, gave Zelma a warning, and complemented the skills of the students.

Doom is when he's chill and cordial with the heroes are my favorite stories involving Doom, to be honest.

Like yeah, he's a villain that wants to rule over the world and is opposed by the heroes, but I think Doom is at his best when he's more down to earth and offering help to his enemies instead of plotting some take over the world scheme.

 

[Antvasima]

Unless you have gone around casually murdering thousands of people for kicks while making jokes about it and trying to look cool in scenes of absolute carnage, I do not think that Deadpool and yourself really have almost anything in common, and it is very mentally unhealthy for you, me, or others to emotionally imprint on these types of thoroughly morally repugnant, shallow, and immature characters to the point of identifying with them. It is a very common problem for highly empathic people with limited mental filters though.

Nick Spencer inexplicably let Thor become a follower of Hydra Cap as well though, likely just because of the completely illogical myth that Vikings were Nazis, even though Nazism completely bastardised and distorted symbols and concepts from lots of different cultures and religions from all over this planet into a satanically evil and completely irrational jumble.

 

[Jimmy.robinson.5099]

I read it yes.
You know, considering the amount of times I saw doombots becoming good, I'm starting to question if Doom is actually a good guy really deep down, in the new Runaways series they made it an whole thing that Doom sent a bunch of Doombots to catch all the Doombots that quit their job and started living normal lives.

I wouldn't say he's GOOD good (this is the same guy who destroyed an entire reality just because his counterpart there was friends with Reed), but he definitely has his moments of goodness, his relationship with Valerie is proof enough of that.

 

[Eseseso]

Unless you have gone around casually murdering thousands of people for kicks while making jokes about it and trying to look cool in scenes of absolute carnage, I do not think that Deadpool and yourself really have almost anything in common, and it is very mentally unhealthy for you, me, or others to emotionally imprint on these types of thoroughly morally repugnant, shallow, and immature characters to the point of identifying with them. It is a very common problem for highly empathic people with limited mental filters though.

Nick Spencer inexplicably let Thor become a follower of Hydra Cap as well though, likely just because of the completely illogical myth that Vikings were Nazis, even though Nazism completely bastardised and distorted symbols and concepts from lots of different cultures and religions from all over this planet into a satanically evil and completely irrational jumble.

Deadpool has done heroic personal things, like murdering a guy for ruining an innocent girl's life back in highschool and killing a pedophile psychiatrist to avenge his victim who took her own life.

 

[Antvasima]

Yes, but the Deadpool character's whole fundamental concept of taking extreme pleasure in systematic murder and mutilation as some kind of performance art doesn't sit at all right with me. The karmic scales have to be balanced and evil has to be stopped from wreaking further pain and suffering on innocents, preferably permanently. Beyond that things easily turn extremely morbid in my view.

 

[Antvasima]

I wouldn't say he's GOOD good (this is the same guy who destroyed an entire reality just because his counterpart there was friends with Reed), but he definitely has his moments of goodness, his relationship with Valerie is proof enough of that.

If somebody is 99.999999999% evil and 0.000000001% good, the second part isn't particularly relevant in comparison, and not intended to be the main focus.