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Touhou - Scan & Ability Additions

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Diabul

Diabul

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This thread will focus on adding scans to existing abilities and adding new abilities. Abilities listed under "Scan Additions" are abilities that are already accepted, but lack proper explanations or justifications.

Names = Power
A few justifications in this thread might seem insufficient for the said ability but as accepted in this CRT, the name of a spell card is equal to its power. In short, name fallacy doesn't exist. If a spell card's name is Light Sign Blossoming Light Orb, then the user of the said spell card has light manipulation.

Scan & Ability Additions​

Nue Houjuu​

Ability Addition:

Hatate Himekaidou​

Hatate has a blank ability called "Spirit Photography" listed in her profile. It should be replaced with this new ability:

Yamame Kurodani​

Ability Additions:
Scan Additions:

Reimu Hakurei​

Ability Addition:

Heida no Akyuu​

Her resurrection should be changed to unconventional:
Akyuu has a blank ability called "cannot forget anything she sees" listed on her profile. It should be attached to this ability:

Remilia Scarlet​

Scan Additions: (Probability Manipulation is a new ability)
Her “Chain Manipulation” should be removed. She can create chains as sourced above, but they are not actual metal chains, just chain-shaped aura.

Aya Shameimaru​

Scan Additions:

Suika Ibuki​

Scan Additions: (Transmutation and Instinctive Action are new abilities)
Note: Mind Manipulation part is a complete rewording, as there isn’t any evidence for the current explanation claimed there. There is not a CRT attached for that explanation in the first place.

Ability Additions:

Rumia​

Scan Additions:

AP Justification Additions - Give Doremy a Break​

Oni​

Should be added to the AP justification of every oni: “Oni are the strongest beings of Gensokyo, and as such, they should be superior to tengu like Aya, as well as to Doremy Sweet who is a relatively weak youkai.

Tengu​

Should be added to the AP justification of every tengu: “Tengu are considered as having "top class" power in Gensokyo and thus they should be superior to Doremy Sweet who is a relatively weak youkai.”

Vampire​

Should be added to the AP justification of every vampire: “Vampires are youkai strong enough to take part in the power balance of Gensokyo, and as such, they should be superior to Doremy Sweet who is a relatively weak youkai.”

Character specific:​

Suika: “Has fought and defeated Tenshi, forcefully taking away land from Heaven in exchange. According to Aya, Suika is more powerful than any other youkai in Gensokyo. Has fought Yukari many times in the past. Stated to be a youkai of the highest class alongside Yukari and Yuyuko. Has defeated Reimu. It's stated that she could easily wreck Youkai Mountain. She is strong enough to effortlessly defeat all of tengu and kappa. She views herself superior to everyone in Gensokyo and has repeatedly stated a lot of top tiers are no match for her, including Reimu, Marisa, Alice, Sakuya, Youmu, Patchouli, and Remilia. Mamizou admits she is not strong enough to make an enemy of Suika.”

Quote Additions​

Nue​

“A bird? No, this voice... it can't be...! This voice of misfortune! It's the mysterious youkai from ancient times… It's the cry of the nue!”

-Reimu Hakurei [Undefined Fantastic Object, Reimu B's Extra]

“More, I want more! With these urban legends, I’ll dye this entire world in the unknown! Me, the unknown youkai!”

-Nue Houjuu [Forbidden Scrollery, Chapter 31]

Suika​

“This boredom didn't just start recently. The strong are always bored. It's probably best to watch these incidents from the sidelines, you know? It's too much trouble to jump in the middle of things. Everyone is too weak anyway. It's not like I wanted to get involved.”

-Suika Ibuki to Tenshi Hinanawi [Scarlet Weather Rhapsody, Suika's Script]

“Quite a while? Look, I've been drinking non-stop for CENTURIES. The last time I was sober is ancient history.”

-Suika [Bohemian Archive in Japanese Red, Suika's Article]

Junko​

“Though she now lives on another heavenly body, and I am unable to meet with her... Even if we are unable to dwell together under Heaven, my hatred alone will be refined. Now, show me! The ruined remains of the impure people of the moon! And behold! Just what lies beyond this pristine impurity!”

-Junko to Reimu [Legacy of Lunatic Kingdom, Reimu's scenario]

“My mortal enemy, Chang'e. Are you watching!? Look at the numerous lives and deaths, the impurities, this poor soul brings!”

-Junko yelling at the moon [Legacy of Lunatic Kingdom, Marisa's scenario]

Image Replacements​

Junko’s current image will be replaced with her official art in Who's Who of Humans & Youkai - Render
Kogasa’s current image will be replaced with her official art in Who's Who of Humans & Youkai - Render
 
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Commas are my greatest enemy.

I forgot to add to the OP, I guess I will just write it here since it should be pretty uncontroversial. Every high tier should be 1-A since Outside World has r>f over Gensokyo since Touhou Project itself is a game in Outside World and characters inside are just a fleeting dream for those outside. Girls from the CDs also said Gensokyo is infinitesimal. There are a bunch of fourth-wall breaks too, Sanae touches a spirit power amulet in UFO for example. So, it’s consistent that they are outerversal.

Doremy can destroy the cosmology, so everyone who upscales from her (every high tier) should be upgraded to 1-A. Thanks. (This was an April Fools' joke)
 
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Responding later as I have errands to run today.

Diabul said:
I forgot to add to the OP, I guess I will just write it here since it should be pretty uncontroversial. Every high tier should be 1-A since Outside World has r>f over Gensokyo since Touhou Project itself is a game in Outside World and characters inside are just a fleeting dream for those outside. Girls from the CDs also said Gensokyo is infinitesimal. There are a bunch of fourth-wall breaks too, Sanae touches a spirit power amulet in UFO for example. So, it’s consistent that they are outerversal.
Click to expand...
If only it were this easy.

Unless you're serious and this isn't a funny 1st day of the month joke, you'll need to make a Tier 1 staff thread for that.
 
This all seems fine from a quick glance. The scan used for Nue's Information Manipulation is pretty crusty for some reason, it'd be an eyestrain for anyone who tried to read it so I uploaded a cleaner one.
 
Shmooply said:
This all seems fine from a quick glance. The scan used for Nue's Information Manipulation is pretty crusty for some reason, it'd be an eyestrain for anyone who tried to read it so I uploaded a cleaner one.
Click to expand...
Yeah, I have no idea why. It looks fine on my account, but it looks distorted when I view it on something else. Replacing it, thanks for pointing it out.
 
Okay time to actually say something got preoccupied for a few days.
According to Aya, Suika is the most powerful youkai of Gensokyo.
Click to expand...
This is not what the scan says.

Aya specifically says in the scan "She's more powerful than any other Youkai". after stating "I haven't seen an Oni's power in forever".

Moreover, Suika isn't a Youkai, she's an Oni. Easy enough to fix though. Just reword it as "According to Aya, Suika is more powerful than any other youkai", or something similar.

Everything else appears good. Great work! (y)
 
Quibster said:
Aya specifically says in the scan "She's more powerful than any other Youkai". after stating "I haven't seen an Oni's power in forever".
Click to expand...
Are you trying to say that Aya is referring to oni as a whole instead of Suika?

Aya could just say so if that was the case, but the statement directly goes to Suika: "She's simply more powerful than any other Youkai"
Quibster said:
Moreover, Suika isn't a Youkai, she's an Oni. Easy enough to fix though. Just reword it as "According to Aya, Suika is more powerful than any other youkai", or something similar.
Click to expand...
I mean, Youkai include Oni. Oni are different from regular youkai, but they are youkai. And If I'm stronger than any other youkai inside the room, then I'm the strongest youkai of the room.
 
Diabul said:
Are you trying to say that Aya is referring to oni as a whole instead of Suika?
Click to expand...
She's clearly referring specifically to Suika - the Oni's - power. Oni are stronger than most Youkai, however.

Y0kzItH.png

Diabul said:
Aya could just say so if that was the case, but the statement directly goes to Suika: "She's simply more powerful than any other Youkai"
Click to expand...
Diabul said:
I mean, Youkai include Oni. Oni are different from regular youkai, but they are youkai. And If I'm stronger than any other youkai inside the room, then I'm the strongest youkai of the room.
Click to expand...
Except Oni are a highly distinct subset of Youkai, much like Tengu. The series even repeatedly goes out of it's way to classify them as such.

Aya deliberately says "An Oni's power" instead of "A Youkai's power." If the distinction were insignificant, she would have just used "Youkai" in the broader sense, as the series typically does. Except Aya doesn't.

Just as you wouldn't say "A Youkai's speed" when referring to a Tengu's speed - because that would be too broad and nonspecific - the same logic applies here.
 
Quibster said:
She's clearly referring specifically to Suika - the Oni's - power. Oni are stronger than most Youkai, however.
Click to expand...
So... we agree?
Quibster said:
Except Oni are a highly distinct subset of Youkai, much like Tengu. The series even repeatedly goes out of it's way to classify them as such.
Click to expand...
Yes, you're right. I still don't see why I can't say "most powerful youkai" instead of "more powerful than any other youkai" though. Between Momiji, Suika, Nitori, and Rumia– All of them are youkai, and the most powerful one is Suika. Their exact species doesn't matter when "youkai" encompass all of them.

"Suika is more powerful than any other youkai" means Suika is more powerful than Momiji, Nitori, Kasen, Remilia, and Kagerou despite each of them being a part of a distinct subset of youkai, correct?
 
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Diabul said:
So... we agree?
Click to expand...
No. As I said, Aya is referring to Suika's power in that scan. Me saying "Oni are stronger than most Youkai" also doesn't refer to that scan. There's a mountainload of evidence of Suika and Oni being on par with high tiers - and while I think this is a piece of that puzzle, I do not agree with the way in which you interpret it specifically, using that scan.

Diabul said:
Yes, you're right. I still don't see why I can't say "most powerful youkai" instead of "more powerful than any other youkai" though.
Click to expand...
Because you've stretched Aya's words into something she never actually says - verbatim - in that scan.

The original phrasing is “more powerful than any other youkai,” which is textually not equivalent to saying “the most powerful youkai of Gensokyo.” The former reads as a merit-based observation from Aya’s perspective. Your rewording, however, implies an objective, definitive ranking of all youkai in Gensokyo - which I don’t believe was Aya’s intent at all. By reframing it that way, you're extending the comparison to the entirety of Gensokyo’s youkai population, including figures like the Youkai Sages, which clearly wasn't the scope of the statement.

Even if you were to accept that broader interpretation, I don’t think it stands up to scrutiny. For example, Yuugi is canonically recognized as the strongest among the four Mountain Devas - a group that includes Suika herself - and Kasen, another member, who is a Youkai Sage (i.e, participated in the creation of Gensokyo tier). More recently, we’ve been introduced to Zanmu, yet another powerful Oni with ambiguous but credibly high-level standing. Given all of this, I think your proposed framing of that scan - that Suika stands unchallenged at the top of the hierarchy - doesn't stand up to scrutiny. That's the primary grievance I have with this.

Words matter. And I think your rewording risks creating a misleading impression of Suika’s standing in the verse to members on-site and can give us problems in the future. Tangetially, I generally disagree with the idea that she’s at the absolute top - it just contradicts what we’ve seen and know about the power structure in Gensokyo. It's constantly changing. Hence, why I urge you to use what Aya actually says instead.

I have nothing further to add, so. I hope that my thoughts and intentions are made clear.
 
Quibster said:
No. As I said, Aya is referring to Suika's power in that scan. Me saying "Oni are stronger than most Youkai" also doesn't refer to that scan. There's a mountainload of evidence of Suika and Oni being on par with high tiers - and while I think this is a piece of that puzzle, I do not agree with the way in which you interpret it specifically, using that scan.
Click to expand...
I don't think I said anything against this. I thought you were saying otherwise in my initial reply.

So, we agree, Aya is referring to Suika in the scan and oni, as a species, doesn't have anything to do with this.
Quibster said:
The original phrasing is “more powerful than any other youkai,” which is textually not equivalent to saying “the most powerful youkai of Gensokyo.” The former reads as a merit-based observation from Aya’s perspective. Your rewording, however, implies an objective, definitive ranking of all youkai in Gensokyo - which I don’t believe was Aya’s intent at all.
Click to expand...
Alright, now I understand. I don't think it's that different though, since both of them are based on Aya's observations ("According to Aya...") of youkai inside Gensokyo, so both of them would hold the same value. Aya makes this comment at the very end of StB where she fought and observed almost every named youkai up to date.
Quibster said:
Even if you were to accept that broader interpretation, I don’t think it stands up to scrutiny. For example, Yuugi is canonically recognized as the strongest among the four Mountain Devas - a group that includes Suika herself - and Kasen, another member, who is a Youkai Sage (i.e, participated in the creation of Gensokyo tier). More recently, we’ve been introduced to Zanmu, yet another powerful Oni with ambiguous but credibly high-level standing. Given all of this, I think your proposed framing of that scan - that Suika stands unchallenged at the top of the hierarchy - doesn't stand up to scrutiny. That's the primary grievance I have with this.
Click to expand...
Eh, none of these are definitive proofs. Yuugi being physically stronger doesn't contradict Suika being more powerful overall, just as Kasen and Zanmu being high-ranking oni doesn't. It would just mean Suika is stronger than them, which is fine because there wouldn't be any evidence saying otherwise. Suika being at the top makes so much sense to me

Either way, Yuugi and Zanmu aren't in Gensokyo, thus they are not included in Aya's statement. Kasen always hides her power to not blow her cover, so it's safe to assume Aya wouldn't have an exact idea. Like, even if they lived inside Gensokyo and showed their powers unrestrained, "more powerful than any other youkai" would include them, since Aya would know about them, but I digress.
Quibster said:
Words matter. And I think your rewording risks creating a misleading impression of Suika’s standing in the verse to members on-site and can give us problems in the future.
Click to expand...
Neither seems too different to me anyway, so, sure, if you say so. I'm changing it.
 
Everything here looks good. Though I think the AP justification for vampires has more arguments and scans that can be used for it such as Remilia's omake.txt profile stating that other youkai fear vampires. Dont have the scan saved at the moment though.
 
I missed that, yeah. But eh, I think this explanation is enough. Speaking of which, two fifths of the claims in Remilia's AP section are wrong. That's for another thread though.

bump
 
I guess I'm forced to kindly pester staff at this point.

bump
 
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