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Demon king vs zeref

speedster352

speedster352

He/Him
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Base zeref vs demon king all forms who wins?
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Zeref Dragneel

Zeref Dragneel was considered to be the strongest, most evil Mage of all time, who possesses extremely dangerous, and powerful Magic know as the Black Arts. Around 400 years ago, he was cursed by the God Ankhseram with the Curse of Contradiction. After this, Zeref wished to die and created the...
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Demon King (Nanatsu no Taizai)

The Demon King is the ruler of the Demon Clan and the father of Meliodas and Zeldris. He created the Ten Commandments and waged war against the Supreme Deity and the Goddess Clan, eventually resulting in his being sealed in Purgatory. He has remained there ever since, devouring the inhabitants...
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Zeref's Soul Manipulation isn't impressive tbh, but Death Manipulation should be countered by The Ruler given that it based upon the concept of Magic Conversion.
 
LordGinSama said:
Zeref's Soul Manipulation isn't impressive tbh, but Death Manipulation should be countered by The Ruler given that it based upon the concept of Magic Conversion.
Click to expand...
His soul manip is more potent than Larcade's who was going to remove souls of the entire/most of the battlefield back in Alvarez which is in like the 100,000s range.

LIFE_OF_KING said:
I mean, it is said that any magic is irrelevant with The Ruler, and there are spells with this ability among many demons. So I guess?
Click to expand...
This kind of sounds like a NLF tbh. However I'm not entirely aware of the potency of NNT's soul and death hax. However if they aren't even comparable then I find it hard to believe that the ruler can neg something far above anything it's negged before.
 
Zackra1799 said:
His soul manip is more potent than Larcade's who was going to remove souls of the entire/most of the battlefield back in Alvarez which is in like the 100,000s range.
Click to expand...
This is stated nor implied anywhere in the Manga, Zeref doesn't have access to Pleasure Magic and has never displayed the ability to manipulate more than one soul. Not to mention Larcade doesn't Soul Rip directly, the Soul ejection is an indirect consequence of his Pleasure Magic.
Zackra1799 said:
This kind of sounds like a NLF tbh. However I'm not entirely aware of the potency of NNT's soul and death hax. However if they aren't even comparable then I find it hard to believe that the ruler can neg something far above anything it's negged before.
Click to expand...
Read above, it's based upon a literal concept and last I checked we don't treat Death Manipulation in the same way we do with soul and mind hax.
 
LordGinSama said:
This is stated nor implied anywhere in the Manga, Zeref doesn't have access to Pleasure Magic and has never displayed the ability to manipulate more than one soul. Not to mention Larcade doesn't Soul Rip directly, the Soul ejection is an indirect consequence of his Pleasure Magic.
Click to expand...
Larcade can remove 100,000+ souls, he can't remove Mavis and Zeref's souls with pleasure magic, Zeref can remove Mavis's soul with his Soul manip.

Zeref's soul manip > Larcade's Soul Manip.
LordGinSama said:
Read above, it's based upon a literal concept and last I checked we don't treat Death Manipulation in the same way we do with soul and mind hax.
Click to expand...
Scans of it conceptually changing the magic to something else

Edit: Speed isn't equal either here so Zeref Blitz's badly here
 
Zackra1799 said:
Larcade can remove 100,000+ souls, he can't remove Mavis and Zeref's souls with pleasure magic, Zeref can remove Mavis's soul with his Soul manip.
Click to expand...
That doesn't mean their Soul Manipulation is above his own, that means that he couldn't affect them with his own Soul Manipulation, I.E a resistance.

Pleasure Magic needs the make the opponent feel Pleasure before it removes the Soul, it's not as simple as "Yeah he just Soul Rips." if he can't make you feel Pleasure then he can't eject the soul. Stopping the Pleasure makes the soul removal irrelevant.
Zackra1799 said:
Zeref's soul manip > Larcade's Soul Manip.
Click to expand...
Not stated anywhere.
Zackra1799 said:
Scans of it conceptually changing the magic to something else?
Click to expand...
I'm not a fan of NNT, I'm only using what's on the profile.
 
Zackra1799 said:
This kind of sounds like a NLF tbh. However I'm not entirely aware of the potency of NNT's soul and death hax. However if they aren't even comparable then I find it hard to believe that the ruler can neg something far above anything it's negged before.
Click to expand...
The Ruler doesn't nullify, it changes the concept of the spell. If, for example, you use a spell that makes him weaker, the spell will actually make stronger.
 
Damaging the Demon King = Healing him
Healing the Demon King = Hurting him

thats the nature of The Ruler
 
Zeref gets neg my the commandment so hard
  • Faith: Anyone who shows faithlessness before him has their eyes set ablaze. The "faith" concept applies to anything the victim once had faith in, such as love or family.
  • Love: Anyone who has hatred in their heart in his presence will be unable to inflict damage to others. They will not even be able to summon the strength to raise their weapons or activate their powers.
  • Pacifism: Anyone who kills in his presence will have their remaining lifetime stolen from them, aging rapidly to death.
  • Patience: The full effects of Patience are currently unknown.
  • Piety: Anyone who flees from him is forced into mindless obedience to him. He can undo the effects of the commandment at will.
  • Purity: The full effects of Purity are currently unknown.
  • Repose: The full effects of Repose are currently unknown.
  • Reticence: The full effects of Reticence are currently unknown, but it is known that it imposes a penalty on the victim for speaking their true feelings buried in their heart.
  • Selflessness: Anyone with feelings of greed, desire, or selfishness in his presence loses their memories, emotions, and sense of self.
  • Truth: Anyone who knowingly tells a lie in his presence is turned to stone.
Also the demon king can remove immortality and curse for rebirth
 
Bernkastelll said:
Damaging the Demon King = Healing him
Healing the Demon King = Hurting him

thats the nature of The Ruler
Click to expand...
Yeah but abilities are also inverted like ban's snatch and even grey demon Hendrickson has death hax and others can resist it. Or are you saying everyone is weaker than grey demon Hendrickson or hendrickson=zeref in death hax?
 
speedster352 said:
Yeah but abilities are also inverted like ban's snatch and even grey demon Hendrickson has death hax and others can resist it. Or are you saying everyone is weaker than grey demon Hendrickson or hendrickson=zeref in death hax?
Click to expand...
What? I never mentioned Zeref or others characters, I just gave the example of how The Ruler works
 
The thread starter should remains neutral in his vs thread
 
Bernkastelll said:
What? I never mentioned Zeref or others characters, I just gave the example of how The Ruler works
Click to expand...
Oh sorry it's just that everyone says that zeref one shots people because of his death hax and yes in some cases yes but it can be dodged or resisted even with magical items like igneels scarf.
 
speedster352 said:
Oh sorry it's just that everyone says that zeref one shots people because of his death hax and yes in some cases yes but it can be dodged or resisted even with magical items like igneels scarf.
Click to expand...
Plus his best death-hax requires him to value his opponent's life

How exactly do the Ten Commandments work?
 
FinePoint said:
How exactly do the Ten Commandments work?
Click to expand...
  • Faith: Anyone who shows faithlessness before him has their eyes set ablaze. The "faith" concept applies to anything the victim once had faith in, such as love or family.
  • Love: Anyone who has hatred in their heart in his presence will be unable to inflict damage to others. They will not even be able to summon the strength to raise their weapons or activate their powers.
  • Pacifism: Anyone who kills in his presence will have their remaining lifetime stolen from them, aging rapidly to death.
  • Patience: The full effects of Patience are currently unknown.
  • Piety: Anyone who flees from him is forced into mindless obedience to him. He can undo the effects of the commandment at will.
  • Purity: The full effects of Purity are currently unknown.
  • Repose: The full effects of Repose are currently unknown.
  • Reticence: The full effects of Reticence are currently unknown, but it is known that it imposes a penalty on the victim for speaking their true feelings buried in their heart.
  • Selflessness: Anyone with feelings of greed, desire, or selfishness in his presence loses their memories, emotions, and sense of self.
  • Truth: Anyone who knowingly tells a lie in his presence is turned to stone.
 
Bernkastelll said:
Does Zeref fights with hate in his heart? if he doesnt, the commandment of love wont work
Click to expand...
It's a little complicated. He used to love life, but Fairy Tail Manga: Chapter 340, Page 15 reveals that he's changed his mind since, and now hates the world for what it's done to him. In his final battle with Natsu he literally uses his negative emotions to power up, in Chapter 535: "Then I will turn my darkness into power! My curse! My rage! My sorrow!"
 
FinePoint said:
It's a little complicated. He used to love life, but Fairy Tail Manga: Chapter 340, Page 15 reveals that he's changed his mind since, and now hates the world for what it's done to him. In his final battle with Natsu he literally uses his negative emotions to power up, in Chapter 535: "Then I will turn my darkness into power! My curse! My rage! My sorrow!"
Click to expand...
So he get stopped by love
 
FinePoint said:
It's a little complicated. He used to love life, but Fairy Tail Manga: Chapter 340, Page 15 reveals that he's changed his mind since, and now hates the world for what it's done to him. In his final battle with Natsu he literally uses his negative emotions to power up, in Chapter 535: "Then I will turn my darkness into power! My curse! My rage! My sorrow!"
Click to expand...
Isn't that when he has the fairy heart? or nah?
 
AnosVoldigoad314 said:
Isn't that when he has the fairy heart? or nah?
Click to expand...
The second time, but it's also a well-known fact that wizards use their emotions to strengthen their magic, and Zeref certainly doesn't have many positive emotions since they activate his passive death-hax, which doesn't happen anymore.

While I personally find it hard to believe that mind-hax would work on Zeref, since a number of other controlling spells don't, based on the Wiki standards we can't assume that: so for lack of evidence I think it's fair to say Love would work.
 
FinePoint said:
The second time, but it's also a well-known fact that wizards use their emotions to strengthen their magic, and Zeref certainly doesn't have many positive emotions since they activate his passive death-hax, which doesn't happen anymore.

While I personally find it hard to believe that mind-hax would work on Zeref, since a number of other controlling spells don't, based on the Wiki standards we can't assume that: so for lack of evidence I think it's fair to say Love would work.
Click to expand...
Love its not mind hax, but paralysis and power null at once
 
By the way
All the Commandments are already revealed

•Piety: Anyone who shows their back to the wielder becomes a
servant of the Demon King.
•Love: Anyone who feels hatred becomes unable to fight
•Retience : Anyone who expresses hidden feelings or emotions is
rendered unable to speak
•Purity: Anyone who commits impur acts suffers from disease
•Patience: Anyone who shows intolerance to pain is inflicted with
additional pain
•Repose: Anyone who fights without rest sees his magic sealed
•Pacifism: Anyone who kills has his time stolen and ages
instantly until the age of his death
•Faith: Anyone who betray their beliefs have burnt eyes
•Truth: Anyone who lies turns intoa stone statue. Only conscious
lies are subject to the curse
•Selflessness: Anyone who desires a person loses his memories and
emotions
 
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