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Regarding Warcraft...

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ThePerpetual

ThePerpetual

VS Battles
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Almost every existing Warcraft profile is in rather serious need of revision and clean-up. Where do we even begin...

Archimonde: Is Planet level... solely because of this page.

Look, even when there are multiple statements like these as opposed to just one, all by knowledgeable characters in-verse, people tend to not always take "destroy the world" at face value. This? This isn't even a proper statement; it's a single blurb from... what appears to be a strategy site. Furthermore, the attack isn't something that would be used to planet-bust, logically speaking; it's a series of consecutive meteors that take 12 seconds in total to fall, not a "single" attack. This info isn't even accurate to the game, as A: his whole thing was to corrupt the world, not destroy it, and B: the fight this guide references isn't even ON Draenor, it takes place in the Twisted Nether.

I don't think I'm buying it.

Thrall: Is Multi-Continent level due to scaling from Archimonde, who is... Planet level.

What...?

Grom Hellscream: Is comparable to Thrall. In other words, he makes no sense. Oh, and he becomes Moon level later for one-shotting Mannoroth and it doesn't scale to his Durability because reasons.

Kil'jaede: Really just a sparse profile all around, honestly. The only: and I mean ONLY: power listed is "Warlock Magic". Gee, that helps me understand his capabilities a loooooooootttt.

Jaina Proudmoore: Again, next to nothing for stat justifications.

Deathwing: I actually remember fairly well-explained justifications for him being Multi-Continent a while back. Alas, now we've scaled him to Thrall+, even though the high and low ends of Multi Continent are thousands of times apart and there's no calc to give us a specific number to be found.

Murmur: More destroy the world statements, save that these are still quite vague and don't really help me understand what the context is. I guess the feats section is nice, but a bit of citation checkup would be appreciated nonetheless.

And I might have missed a page or two. I'm not an expert on the series, but I know enough Warcraft to know that someone more knowledgeable than me should have these looked at another time.
 
Should I change AP of all the characters in Warcraft to '''Unknown''' for the time being? It seems like the profiles in Warcraft seem to be a mess atm.
 
That might be a good idea.

Also, is it just me, or are there actually no speed feats whatsoever for the verse? Does no one scale to Arthas's speed somehow...?
 
I also want to bring up the fact that Arthas' speed is apparently via power-scaling... to someone who's not specified, meaning that it's an utterly useless statistic.
 
Just to make sure:

The AP of all characters in Warcraft should be set to Unknow for the time being.

The speed of all the characters in Warcraft should be set to Unknow for the time being.

Would these changes be all right with you guys atm?
 
I say they should be set to Unknown, yeah.

The pages when i saw them last time look like a huge mess to edit on them and needs to be looked at by a second time or so...
 
That would be fine by me, at least.

I think Sargeras looks generally okay, save that his MFTL+ statistic may be questionable...?
 
ThePerpetual said:
That would be fine by me, at least.
I think Sargeras looks generally okay, save that his MFTL+ statistic may be questionable...?
Click to expand...
I was CERTAIN that sargeras would be on this list, but thank god I was wrong. He seems to be fine to me. But yah, that whole speed thing be questionable. However, hey, easier with a portal rather than just poppin there, right? Not to mention that sargeras seems to have a crush on azeroths titan, as heard from the scepter of sargeras artifact knowledge page seen in legion.
 
I guess

Say, you seem to have interest in Warcraft, @Preds43. Can you direct us to any feats that might be quantifiable, so that these pages aren't just left at Unknown forever? 'twould be appreciated.
 
I agree with setting the statistics to Unknown ratings. Did you remember to change the striking strength levels as well?
 
ThePerpetual said:
I guess
Say, you seem to have interest in Warcraft, @Preds43. Can you direct us to any feats that might be quantifiable, so that these pages aren't just left at Unknown forever? 'twould be appreciated.
Click to expand...
I have not much to say. But if I were to list my opinion on these chars, here's what i'd do.,

Thrall: 7-A (Cata, without the dragon soul), 6-B/6-A lvl (With the Dragon soul, but at a lucky shot), 8-B in legion (Without Doomhammer)

jaina: 7-B/7-A (Without focusing iris) 6-B/6-A (With focusing iris)

Grommash: 9-A (before WCIII), 8-C (After WCIII), Unknown (WoD)

Deathwing: 6-A/5-B (Able to shake and erupt most of azeroths continents, reforming azeroth forever)

Archimonde/Kil'jaeden: 5-B-4-B (They're sargeras' top commanders, during a wikia somewhere, it was stated that an entire eredar destroyed a planet by himself, this would most likely be kil'jaeden or archimonde, mainly due to their brutish force and power, along with their intelligance). During Legion, DKs get the maw of the dammed, an axe that was wielded by a mo'arg named "Gorlex the Fleshreaper (I think), and this maw was stated to be so power, that was used to destroy worlds (Stated by the artifact description by blizzard), so who knows.

Arthas: 7-A/6-C (Able to raise an entire army of undead the size of a mountain alone using only his dragon). As to everything else, idk much.

Illidan: 7-A/6-A (During WCIII, he was using his full power against arthas, though only lost due to getting cocky, he became WAY more powerful during the times of TBC, and was weakend during our battle against him. If he was using his power however, we'd be fresh meat.

Sargeras stays the same.
 
I'll try to look into it, but citations, links, et cetera would make this considerably easier, just saying.
 
Also, a small mountain was only calculated as 7-C, when Gildarts destroyed one.
 
1.That's enough.Not to mention he is far superior to Malorne who did far better against demons than Cenarius did who is as powerful as Aspects with each being more powerful than Mannoroth who while weakend survived world being teared apart.And the fact that 1 Aspect holded time of entire Universe together,but topic for another day

2.He barely hurt him...though I agree it should be Moon level

3.Why not?Grom is easily on that level.It doesn't scale to durability since Gorehowl>>Grom himself

4.Fair enough

5.She is easily that level,but yes

6.Where is problem?

7.Agreed
 
@Preds43:

So, about the tiering of these characters:

Regarding Thrall, Jaina, Arthas, and Illidan, do you think they are all comparable to each other? I am guessing Arthas is rated 7-A due to him summoning an army the size of a Mountain, but are there any other feats that he did that could scale?

Thrall and Jaina are rated 7-A, but were there any texts or clips where they demonstrate enough power on that level [or destroy a mountain]?

Deathwing should be rated "At least 6-A" for controlling the entire surface of Azeroth and stuff, but 5-B sounds a little much unless Deathwing was show to obliterate a planet.

For Archimonde, going by your descriptions, "5-B" sounds okay as he is described in the text as destroying a planet, but are you sure he did this in a single blow though? Perhaps a rating of "At least High 6-A, possibly 5-B" is possible as Archimonde could only have destroyed a planet's surface instead.
 
Lina Shields said:
@Preds43:
So, about the tiering of these characters:

Regarding Thrall, Jaina, Arthas, and Illidan, do you think they are all comparable to each other? I am guessing Arthas is rated 7-A due to him summoning an army the size of a Mountain, but are there any other feats that he did that could scale?

Thrall and Jaina are rated 7-A, but were there any texts or clips where they demonstrate enough power on that level [or destroy a mountain]?

Deathwing should be rated "At least 6-A" for controlling the entire surface of Azeroth and stuff, but 5-B sounds a little much unless Deathwing was show to obliterate a planet.

For Archimonde, going by your descriptions, "5-B" sounds okay as he is described in the text as destroying a planet, but are you sure he did this in a single blow though? Perhaps a rating of "At least High 6-A, possibly 5-B" is possible as Archimonde could only have destroyed a planet's surface instead.
Click to expand...
Like stated, I know only as much as you. Idk their actual power strengths due to the game being pretty old. But in WoD, drek'thar created a spell that destroyed an entire mountain in order to stop the iron horde from killing the frost wolves.
 
Shattering a small mountain is usually just a tier 7-C feat though.
 
Well, it depends on the size of the mountain. It is usually better to get calculations for these types of feats.
 
Coming back to this after a while, now that I have some free time to tackle it, who is it that cracked apart a smallish mountain? I recently figured that at Small City on average, if you can link something you could do something like "Possibly Small City level" until a more precise calc is made (if one is even possible.)

What about Deathwing razing the planet's surface? Link to that? You could scale a lot of the top-tiers (I.e. Thrall, Archimonde) to that.
 
He wasn't anywhere near his full power when we fought him. "Too soon, Executus. You have awakened me too soon."

He's weak outside of the Firelands iirc
 
Kil'Jaeden is superior to Archimonde. So you can count him as possible MultiPlanet Level.

Jaina is around the same level as Thrall.

Malfurion is far superior than Jaina or Thrall, so above MultiContinental Level.

Deathwing is MultiContinental Level with absolutely no effort. He is around the same power as Kil'Jaeden and Archimonde.

Murmur destroyed a planet with a whisper. I don't know the size or density of the planet, but that's makes him at least Small Planet level.

Ragnaros destroyed mountains the same way Deathwing ****** up continents. No effort. So thats something. He is clearly above Thrall and company.

Additions:

Illidan is around the same level as Malfurion, possibly weaker.

Death Knight Arthas is superior by a decent margin in comparison to Illidan who is Malfurion level.

Lich King Arthas is a beast and was made to kill Kil'Jaeden.

Sargeras is so powerful he could pimpslap Kil'Jaeden, Deathwing and Archimonde to oblivion if he had a physical hand.

Gul'Dan is incredibly powerful with Warlock magic and is far above Malfurion.

Garrosh is around the same level as Grom, but he was defeated by Thrall.

Y'Shaarj was the most powerful of the Old Gods, creatures inferior to the Titans. That's still hard to measure, but for now, Archimonde level as well.

Kael'Thas is one of the greatest mages in Azeroth, rivaled only by Jaina. Around the same level as her.
 
It is usually better to start a new content revision thread, rather than revive an old one, in order to get more input.
 
How are Murmur's feats vague? It flat out states that he destroys Planets: http://wow.gamepedia.com/Murmur

Deathwing is possibly Planetary with his final Cataclysm ending Azeroth. " Without his armor, his molten form begins to mutate, granting him a form far more terrifying than before (somewhat resembling creatures like Iso'rath). The final battle for Azeroth began in earnest, as Deathwing continuously attempted to finish the job he started by bringing forth a second Cataclysm that would end the world. Each time, the Aspects step in and use their power to stop him until one final blow from the Demon Soul completely obliterates the corrupted Aspect, leaving only the remnants of his shattered armor." - http://wow.gamepedia.com/Deathwing

Then if we really want to go further we could scale from the Void Gods: "They are evil creatures of the Void and capable of destroying entire planets if left unchecked"- http://wow.gamepedia.com/Void_god

Who the heroes of Azeroth fought and defeated, through each expansion the heroes have gotten stronger, this is the progression of WoW, and who's right after a world eater? Kil'Jaeden who has been said to repeatedly destroy planets: "For millennia, Kil'jaeden's scouts searched the Nether for the Draenei, finding and destroying the worlds they (Draenei) had settled on, but they always managed to escape."

Archimonde has world breaking feats:"The colossal demon wielded limitless fel magics and primal strength to lay waste to any who would oppose his fiery will, and had destroyed countless worlds."

And with new lore, we know Archimonde was vastly weaker than kil'jaeden as Archimonde wasn't even on the Council until he betrayed Thal'kiel into getting a seat and the council was there for the brightest, smartest and most powerful.
 
@Udlmaster

I'm sorry, but could you please take your explanations to another thread?

This thread is almost a year old, and it's best to start over if possible.

I'm closing this.
 
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