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Ban Midou Vs Hircine
- Thread starter Overlord775
- Start date
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- #3
Indeed, but it's necessary
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Im sorry but, does this dude literally like resist nothing?
Also Ban is either n^Infinity (where n is an ungiven number depending on the number of choices there are) or Infinity! both of which are above Infinity^2. We are not sure yet so you guys are gonna have to give me some time. Doubt it's gonna come to it doe.
On a side note, im not one to talk about quality profiles, but is there only 1 key on his "powers and abilities" or am i just missing the line separating the 2 keys.
Also Ban is either n^Infinity (where n is an ungiven number depending on the number of choices there are) or Infinity! both of which are above Infinity^2. We are not sure yet so you guys are gonna have to give me some time. Doubt it's gonna come to it doe.
On a side note, im not one to talk about quality profiles, but is there only 1 key on his "powers and abilities" or am i just missing the line separating the 2 keys.
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Firephoenixearl, His powers remain the same:
Also, this is basically GOd Tier resistance and Ban is not bypassing Tier 1-A immortality:
Regenerationn (True-Godly. Comparable to other Daedric Princes such as Asura, who could was still able to restore herself despite being totally erased by Vivec when he entered CHIM), Resurrection(As a God, Hircine is unbound by time and can freely resurrect himself should he remain in existence in even a single point in time. As shown with Mehrunes Dagon, Gods can return even after being completely erased from all of Time simultaneously), Acausality (Type 5. Gods and Daedra are eternal and immutable entities who only seem to be linear and bound by cause and consequence because they choose to appear as so)
Also, this is basically GOd Tier resistance and Ban is not bypassing Tier 1-A immortality:
Regenerationn (True-Godly. Comparable to other Daedric Princes such as Asura, who could was still able to restore herself despite being totally erased by Vivec when he entered CHIM), Resurrection(As a God, Hircine is unbound by time and can freely resurrect himself should he remain in existence in even a single point in time. As shown with Mehrunes Dagon, Gods can return even after being completely erased from all of Time simultaneously), Acausality (Type 5. Gods and Daedra are eternal and immutable entities who only seem to be linear and bound by cause and consequence because they choose to appear as so)
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@Nedge
None of them will help vs ban tbh. Without resistances Ban stomps here. His law just passively says "hah i win" and calls it a day.
None of them will help vs ban tbh. Without resistances Ban stomps here. His law just passively says "hah i win" and calls it a day.
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1. Wdy,m?DMB 1 said:
2. That sounds terribly sexual. xD
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Hircine also has law hax, so can't he just respond "No"?Firephoenixearl said:
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If I am being fair, Elder Scrolls gods/Daedra on Hircine's level can't really kill each other and have roughly the same abilities. So, Hircine would have resistance to all of his abilities.
You can contact Matthew Schroeder about this opinion since he is a primary expert.
You can contact Matthew Schroeder about this opinion since he is a primary expert.
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1) It works by saying "ban wins no matter what". Yes it can because it doesn't need to kill.DMB 1 said:
2) Almost the same anyway xD
@Overlord
Nah, since it's Passive (Ban) vs Active (Hiricne) so Ban's law wins, no matter how potent Hiricne's law is, it being active makes it useless in this match.
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Passive law says "no, Ban wins", true godly means jack if it's vs something that doesn't induce destruction or kill.Crabwhale said:
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Killing is not our only means of win conditions. True Godly and resurrection only take care of "killing", BFR, incap, surrendering etc, all are win conditions. Under the effect of the law, Hiricne just does something that gives Ban the win. True Godly can only do so much, if Hiricine just decides to go home and watch Barney & Friends since they are pretty famous rn in the wiki xD.DMB 1 said:
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That's an NLF.
Also, you seem to have ignored my point about incap. Again, as I said, even if you do something that disables his avatar, he can instantly spawn another. Unless you have a way to permanently disconnect them (spoilers: you can't do that), then this is just Inconclusive.
Also, you seem to have ignored my point about incap. Again, as I said, even if you do something that disables his avatar, he can instantly spawn another. Unless you have a way to permanently disconnect them (spoilers: you can't do that), then this is just Inconclusive.
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Unknown methods.DMB 1 said:
"The speed of light cannot be surpassed"
Try to find the "how" in that sentence. Or "Jill haxes her fate so that she wins", it doesn't matter how, when or why, she just will because it is already set in stone that she will. Same case here, Law says "Ban will be the victor" how that's going to be acomplished is unknown to us and everyone else.
But this is a passive hax, there are only 1 way around this: Resistance to this hax. That's just how fate, law etc hax works, don't look at me.
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The avatar just sits and does nothing causing a win for Ban, because Law says "no you can't". Im serious this is how law hax works. If there is a law that states that something cannot happen then unless you resist this law or have a greater law of your own then there is nothing you can do about it.Crabwhale said:
It's not NLF. Anything 5D and above just B-Slaps Ban's law, though anything 4D and below that doesn't have anyway to resist it gets owned. Hax needs resistance.
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Yes, but Hircine's avatar is connected to Hircine himself, which would notice his incap and just respawn or simply say "no u" and negate. It's essentially a 4-D being protected by a 6-D (and likely far above) being.
That's why I say unless you somehow can bypass higher dimensional intervention (which, you can't), you can't do nothing against the avatar that incaps him for long enough.
That's why I say unless you somehow can bypass higher dimensional intervention (which, you can't), you can't do nothing against the avatar that incaps him for long enough.
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Also the GB world is basically a video game (virtual reality) and that's exactly how it works.DMB 1 said:
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1) The 6D cannot come to fight himself. This is just the avatars fighting so it's a null point.Crabwhale said:
2) The 4D avatars are still subdued to the law hax as they are weaker than it and don't resist its effects.
The avatars just stand there unwilling to do anything or unwilling to win or just continuously commit die or something like that, because Law says they cannot win.
Im serious here i've discussed this and "Passive law/fate/probability hax > Active any hax of any level even above the passive hax when no resistances are present". Im not talking randomly here.
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Yes, but the 6-D is tied to the nature of the avatars in a way that can't be separated.
It's like putting your finger in a tiny aquarium. All the fish can see is this godlike mound of flesh, but it's still connected to the rest of your body, and you can retract and put it back there whenever and however you like. That's how Hircine's avatars operate, meaning you're essentially fighting a 4-D that can be instantly recuperated by a 6-D every time.
It's like putting your finger in a tiny aquarium. All the fish can see is this godlike mound of flesh, but it's still connected to the rest of your body, and you can retract and put it back there whenever and however you like. That's how Hircine's avatars operate, meaning you're essentially fighting a 4-D that can be instantly recuperated by a 6-D every time.
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Don't Deadric princes resist each other's law hax ?
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That would only scale to their true selves either way.Overlord775 said:
@CrabWhale
Think of this. You're a child in between Muhammad Ali and Chuck Norris. Both casually stomp you. Chuck tells you to do sth, Ali tells you "don't" you can't defy neither, as you are incapable of doing so. Unless Chuck actually goes and beats Ali himself, you, a mere child cannot do anything but just stand in the middle. His true self is 6D, true, it has literally nothing to do with his 4D avatars resisting a much stronger Law.
Long story short, you need resistance to beat hax dude, you need resistance or something much stronger to beat the resistance and not tell you to do sth. A ball of paper thrown by Goku won't pierce rock, even though Goku is MUCH stronger than a rock, the ball of paper isn't, even when having goku's powers, it's still inately too weak.
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I feel like we're both debating completely different things here tbh. I'm not saying his Law wouldn't work, I'm saying it doesn't matter.
Even if his Hircine's avatar is incap-ed, he will notice, and just spawn another avatar, or reform the current one, or whatever. Hircine's avatar needs to be incap-ed for at least a day before SBA kick in and Ban wins, whereas there is absolutely nothing to prove that Hircine himself can't just instantly un-incap his avatar.
This battle literally has no end. Ban incaps, true Hircine resets and it goes on ad infinitum.
Even if his Hircine's avatar is incap-ed, he will notice, and just spawn another avatar, or reform the current one, or whatever. Hircine's avatar needs to be incap-ed for at least a day before SBA kick in and Ban wins, whereas there is absolutely nothing to prove that Hircine himself can't just instantly un-incap his avatar.
This battle literally has no end. Ban incaps, true Hircine resets and it goes on ad infinitum.
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@Crabwhale
Overlord775 said:
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Except that's a win for Ban, cus Ban is literally in a state where Hicine's avatar cannot harm him. Ban just stands there and Hircine is getting passively incaped (assumin that happens, cus law can also just make them not move because it hinders Ban's way to victory and there is not much to "un-incap" if he's unable to move due to passive Law continuously saying "don't move"), while Hircine is stuck reviving and coming back or unincaping or stuck and not being able to move.
It's a win condition either way.
It's a win condition either way.
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Just saying "'He can't win' Law GG" is not enough.
What does the law do to incap or kill?
Does it weaken the opponent? Does it physically impale him, what?
What does the law do to incap or kill?
Does it weaken the opponent? Does it physically impale him, what?
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Law just makes it impossible for anything to win vs Ban. It's literally just a law that makes a certain even true or impossible. That's just how law hax works. It's not an attack. Think of someone reducing the probability of you winning to 0. It won't happen no matter what, the ways that the other party is going to win are meaningless as you have no chance to win. Or fate haxing your victory. Unless you resist this hax however it's impossible for you to win, they are not physical or direct attacks, they are indirect ways to win.
An example i already gave is. The avatars just sit there and can't do anything because the law is saying they can't. Like this there are tons of ways the law will accomplish it's goal, though the important and decisive part is that it will as long as the avatars don't resist the law.
An example i already gave is. The avatars just sit there and can't do anything because the law is saying they can't. Like this there are tons of ways the law will accomplish it's goal, though the important and decisive part is that it will as long as the avatars don't resist the law.
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Hircine has his own law hax, and IIRC, it's tied with his Low 1-C form which would overpower Ban's law would it not?
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If it were passive yes, it would causing a stomp in the other direction. In our case, no, because Ban's Law is passive while Hircine has to do his own laws.Warren Valion said:
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I'm pretty sure that HIrcine has ways to circumvent that, but I don't really know the Elder Scrolls, get Matt and/or Ultima.
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Ban sounds like the most seriously wanked character on all the Getbackers profiles.
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Getbackers looks wanked in general
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