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The Lich vs Kenshi

I... dunno. If Kenshi kills Lich, then Lich just lolrez. It seems his TK does give him possible win cons but it also seems it is extremely in-character for him to kill. Meaning his wincons are far less likely than Lich just overwhelming him with Danmaku.
 
It being in character to kill doesn't help when he can killing with a push repeatedly until he realizes that won't work and tries something different

He's also got better lifting strength and is so far above in AP that deflecting said Danmaku is easy
 
He won't realize unless he's acausal, tho, and Lich has better Lifting Strength. Class M to Kenshi's Class K.
 
What do you mean?

If killing him doesn't do the job he tries something different

Oh yeah Lich does nvm, grabted tat doesn't affect his projectiles
 
I mean, how would he realize "that isn't working" when he doesn't realize timehax is occurring. He isn't acausal, he won't retain knowledge of what happened before. So he'd kill him and time would be reset and he'd have no knowledge.

And... I guess, but Lich's projectiles are gonna hit him at some point due to sheer overwhelming numbers (literally filling a room with them), and of course Lich could just... hit him.
 
So I guess he keeps thinking Lich dead forever while Licj fails to really do anything

Hit him and do zero form of damage since Kenshi is almost 8x stronger
 
He could do damage through that. It's hard, it really is, but 8x isn't so big a gap he cannot be harmed, especially considering bullets are piercing.
 
So I guess Lich does an ever so slight amount of damage after Kenshi redirects all of his bullets back at him with a thought?

Because Lich literally cannot hit him with Danmaku, his only chance is BFR
 
Schnee One said:
So I guess Lich does an ever so slight amount of damage after Kenshi redirects all of his bullets back at him with a thought?
Because Lich literally cannot hit him with Danmaku, his only chance is BFR
Click to expand...
Kenshi has that good Attack Reflection? The bullets literally fill the room.
 
It's not attack reflection. It's telikinesis and yes, it's very good also really easy to use as he needs a though to put the bullets off course.

The bullets also cover the room in a 360 degree angle meaning he has to deal with far less then that.

Assuming Lich can even shoot enough bullets to be an issue when he dies with a thought (He can't) and that Kenshi stands there instead of just thinking the bullets away (He Won't) and that even if neither of these two were possible which they are Lich would somehow be able to deal some form of damage.

His only wincon is BFR, Danmaku is a terrible move against Ken.

But he has BFR and Ken will just keep killing him over and over so either Incon or he wins
 
I mean.

Lich's own regen could probably save him from his own bullets.

Though I am leaning Incon. I don't think it is as clear cut as you make it, but with such an AP advantage, Lich would just be constantly regenning or getting timehaxed back.
 
It's not that they hurt Lich, it's just they don't do shit to Kenshi

Can't Lich BFR though?
 
Schnee One said:
It's not that they hurt Lich, it's just they don't do shit to Kenshi
Can't Lich BFR though?
Click to expand...
Lich could BFR, but it'd really only put Kenshi somewhere in Bullet Hell. It probably wouldn't take enough time to get out of that to the Lich.

And they absolutely can harm Kenshi, if they can get to him.
 
Si

Not being able to get near your opponent is textbook not doing shit kek
 
Schnee One said:
Si
Not being able to get near your opponent is textbook not doing shit kek
Click to expand...
He himself can get near though, Kenshi's TK isn't worth much compared to strength of Lich. If his bullets have similar strength through acceleration, Kenshi doesn't have much of a hope there, either.

That said, Lich can just point blank it.
 
Why would his TK not be worth much compared to his strength? Especially since Kenshi is much stronger

Here's how that goes

Lich attempts to run forwards

He slams into a wall and gets his skeleton ripped out

GG
 
Schnee One said:
Why would his TK not be worth much compared to his strength? Especially since Kenshi is much stronger
Here's how that goes

Lich attempts to run forwards

He slams into a wall and gets his skeleton ripped out

GG
Click to expand...
Lich's superior Lifting Strength negs TK.

And he is a skeleton. The hell are you ripping out in this scenario.
 
I mean

Telekinesis is essentially just an exertion of one's force. If you're grappling with someone who can push a lot harder than you, Lich can easily resist that due to having a much higher lifting strength.
 
Just found this on Glynda vs Kenshi

"WeeklyBattles wrote: Having stronger TK = resisting all other weaker sources of TK. This is a staple rule in all TK vs TK matches on this site.

Kaltias: That makes absolutely no sense. It's like saying that you can't toss a 60 kg character with class Y lifting strength unless you can toss around planets

21:29, October 4, 2018


Antoniofer I also highly doubt that having higher LS in tk would make you more resistent to tk with less LS; meanwhile the tk lifting strength is higher than the weight of the target it will work. One can always resist, but is not an automatic effect to nullify completely the other attack."


Judging by this and responses from Kaltias and Dargoo etc it seems having stronger lifting strength does not counter TK, I would like to know where this rule is from


I say incon, nothing Lich can really do can let him kill Kenshi as he gets thrown back or his projectiles get reflected with a thought or he has his projectiles get dodged or blocked
 
Huh. That's... a strange way of looking at it, that one being able to push harder doesn't mean they can push... against TK. Hm. If there weren't tons of highlighted threads up nowadays (whaddup Sera if you're reading this) then I'd make a general thing about it. Guess standards changed again.

Regardless. Kenshi being in character won't manage to put down Lich in an acceptable way. Classic incon because people over estimate Lich. Oof.

Also, depending on the form of Lich, Kenshi's TK might not be enough. Lich can grow to be stories tall made of bone which, if you don't know, is hyper-dense. So there is that.
 
It seems rather simple to me but eh

Not sure what you mean by people overestimating Lich when you were arguing over him winning the entire thread until now
 
No I wasn't. I was arguing Incon, I had voted a while back. And I mean people seem to expect Lich to win in relatively unwinnable scenarios (in most people's opinions). I don't know what blind debater suggested Lich for strongest 8-B but that essentially put a person with tons of weaknesses and no hax of his own against one of the most haxed verses on site.

Lich's only arguable point is outlasting an opponent via timehax and his own regen. It's just a weird thing where people are like "yeah this guy he is the strongest". Because he isn't. I just find it weird.

Anyhoo, as I said earlier (vote wasn't counted), I'm leaning incon.
 
Kenshi isn't that haxed dude lol, no where near the most broken 8B, he's just got solid TK and AP.

Not really sure how you saying "He can just point blank" or "Kemshi gets hit" or "Kenshi can't Reflect because Having higher TK apparently raises your weight but whatever really
 
Mr. Bambu said:
Huh. That's... a strange way of looking at it, that one being able to push harder doesn't mean they can push... against TK.
Click to expand...
Well I mean, it's not like TK gives you anything to shove against save the air. And if it's TK, grappling the air to stop your movements won't help. Best way to resist TK would be to just hook your feet into the ground, but, Lich doesn't have that. Not many have that. Usually you just resist with your own TK Lifting Strength
 
Kenshi is haxed tho.

And Kenshi can just do other abilities. I'm making a case for both having potential win cons. If you read my posts at all you'd see I voted Incon a long while back lol. Not sure why this is such a big deal for you. Not sure about much about you, tbh. Anyhoo. Cheers, I guess. More "Lich in bad situations".
 
Also to be clear, the "most haxed verses on site" referred to Medaka Box. Not Mortal Kombat. Like I find that match fair because Lich did in theory have a way to kill (just shooting a bunch since everyone ignores the fact that this guy has no hax) but I don't understand who walked up and said "ey this guy has no good abilities clearly the strongest 10/10 dis makes sense to me boss"
 
Wait wait wait

What

"it's not like TK gives you anything to shove against save the air"

What do you mean

This would be like saying no matter how strong you are, a strong wind is gonna push you over, you don't have to interact with the wind at all to resist being pushed back

You don't have to push Kenshi back, just resist getting pushed back, which Lich should be able to do

That's why the rule is weird, it just doesn't make sense to me at all
 
Speaking of which, do you think Ken can neg durability with TK? Like, it should be stated in his AP in his page.
 
I mean

Can he? Is there like a specific method he uses to do this?
 
Ah. Then it isn't applicable here, I think.

Don't get me wrong, I believe this is Incon under current rules, but the reasoning for said rules is sorta bunk.
 
Obviously, Ken can't rip a skeleton out of a skeleton but it seems like dura negging.

I'll count your vote though
 
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